Pre-set Tables in World Cafe Is Creeping Me Out

[Richard2]

The World Cafe is a difficult environment for the servers. Tables are occupied when no one is sitting at them because we are up at the buffet, multiple servers may interact with one table, and turnover can be quick. Sometimes, it is not clear whether a guest has left or is simply away from the table, and another guest is asking if they can take the table. The upside down glass is one of the signals the staff uses to know whether the table is available. If one server has seen guests leave and sets the table, and another server is asked if the table is available, they would know based on whether the glasses are down or up. When you sit down, they turn the glasses over. But this is an explanation, not a justification. It is a poor policy. I have never been in a restaurant where the glass was upside down, much less on a placemat that was used by the previous guest.

I don't think anyone is denying that the World Cafe is clean and that the staff work very hard. They are generally wonderful. This is an issue of management. That the placemat is used in "hundreds of restaurants all over the world" is entirely irrelevant. I don't care about those restaurants. I care about the one I am in. The problem with placemats is that they are reused after being lightly brushed off. As I mentioned earlier, I've had spaghetti sauce stains from someone else's fork on my placement.

Edited April 9, 2019 by Richard2
Typo

[zitsky]

42 minutes ago, Paulchili said:

The placemats are just a part of the problem.

The way I see it is that the main issue is that the placemats are not properly cleaned between each user AND the glasses are placed upside down on them. There is no good reason why a clean glass should not be placed upright so that the drinking surface of the glass is not placed on the unclean placemat.

Also, while " hundreds of restaurants all over the world that use the same type of placemats", the question is how they are cleaned between each user in these restaurants vs VO.

 

I agree.  Guess it is "whatever doesn't kill you makes you stronger".  Maybe some exposure to germs is a good thing.

 

Do they use plastic cups in the restaurant? 

Edited April 9, 2019 by zitsky

[Paulchili]

4 minutes ago, zitsky said:

Maybe some exposure to germs is a good thing.

Maybe better for you than me - my endless generosity makes me give up this “experience” and leave it to you 

Edited April 9, 2019 by Paulchili

[TrulyBlonde]

5 minutes ago, Paulchili said:

Maybe better for you than me - my endless generosity makes me give up this “experience” and leave it to you 

Paul,

I have cruised once with Viking Ocean for British Isles. My main issue with our cruise was the inconsistency with the staff training. Most noticed in the World Cafe when they would walk by our table which clearly needed to be cleared and I had to flag them down to take away dirty dishes. It did improve later in the cruise. This was a management issue due to lack of training.

Also, when 1st meeting our room attendant we specified to him that we are early risers and early to bed. We told him we dine around 6pm and would like our room tended to during our dining time.  A few times, nobody arrived to turn down, clean up etc.  Management issue with training, again.

 

When dining in a place with placemats or a more casual atmosphere, I always take an extra napkin and place our utensils on it. I do not want anything touching those breeding grounds of bacteria. Yuck.

 

Most likely, we will never return. I always value your opinions and look forward to reading something positive and wishing you a wonderful cruise. The ships are gorgeous. Hope they have fixed the staff training issues.

[Paulchili]

5 minutes ago, TrulyBlonde said:

wishing you a wonderful cruise. The ships are gorgeous. Hope they have fixed the staff training issues.

Thank you for your good wishes.

It’s been a bit bumpy pre-cruise experience so far (beyond this particular issue) but I will try to go with an open mind (as much as possible).

Happy sailings to you as well.

Edited April 9, 2019 by Paulchili

[Clay Clayton]

18 hours ago, zitsky said:

 

Do they use plastic cups in the restaurant? 

Yes

[lackcreativity]

Can anyone tell me what is the best way to handle this situation? There are a number of competing factors here, with some more important than others. Sanitation, staffing, economics, ecology, aesthetics, and quick access for the guest are all at play. We need sterile dining surfaces that don't appear barren, a limit to laundry and trash, a way to tell occupied tables from empty ones, and want no waiting for tables in a quick turnover environment. How should Viking maximize the most important side of things with a minimum of unfortunate side effects?

[zitsky]

2 hours ago, Clay Clayton said:

Yes

 

I'm pretty sure they use glasses on river.  What about coffee, wine?  Plastic also?

 

[ropomo]

As I recall, which is getting to be more and more of a stretch with each birthday, the restaurant uses glassware and the World Café uses plastic tumblers (not disposable) for water/juice only.  Coffee, wine, soft drinks, bar orders in ceramic/glass everywhere.

[Dauntless]

3 minutes ago, ropomo said:

As I recall, which is getting to be more and more of a stretch with each birthday, the restaurant uses glassware and the World Café uses plastic tumblers (not disposable) for water/juice only.  Coffee, wine, soft drinks, bar orders in ceramic/glass everywhere.

 

I thought the same thing and I'm sure the poster was talking about WC when they spoke of the restaurant but Viking is partly the blame since they couldn't come up with another name.  I had heard, early on that they were thinking of changing it to the Dining room to go along with The Living Room.  Guess that didn't happen.  Except for breakfast, we always had wine so I wasn't sure about those other glasses.

[SargassoPirate]

On the cruise we are on, the World Cafe uses plastic tumblers and ceramic coffee cups. In The Restaurant (the MDR) glass tumblers are used for water and ceramic cups are used for coffee.  

 

According to the cruise director's afternoon announcement yesterday, no new cases of noro have been reported, so they will start relaxing some of the restrictions.  Last evening, we could push the button on the coffee machines ourselves.😃 Prior to that, there was a staff member stationed there to operate the machine for me.

 

It will be interesting to see if the placemats reappear in the World Cafe on this cruise and if so, how the tables will be cleaned between guests. I'll have to wear a disguise since the restaurants manager knows me on sight and practices will be tightened if they see me lingering in the cafe.😁

 

They have been jumping through hoops with extra staff on duty and extra cleaning practices, all of which likely could have been avoided had they been following good sanitation practices to start with.

 

 

[Paulchili]

2 hours ago, SargassoPirate said:

Prior to that, there was a staff member stationed there to operate the machine for me.

 

This presumes that staff are automatically and always immune from Noro and cannot be "carriers" - a false assumption. Ditto for them serving and setting up tables.

Edited April 10, 2019 by Paulchili

[SargassoPirate]

Well, they haven't learned from the noro cases. The World Cafe tables were pre-set with placemats, the silverware was placed on the placemat, but the tumblers and coffee cups were right side up (still inverted in the pool cafe area). We grabbed some silverware "burritos" from the pool deck cafe so as not to use the silverware laying on the mat in the World Cafe and found a table.

 

The waiter removed our tumblers after we declined juice and returned them to the stack of "clean " tumblers for reuse. After our breakfast and we vacated the table, I lingered several feet away and watched as the server knocked some crumbs off the mats with my used napkin and lay fresh silverware on the mats we had just used. He left our apparently unused coffee cups on the table and set some "clean" tumblers on the mats - rightside up. For all he knew, I blew my nose in my napkin, sneezed on the table and drank a little water from my coffee cup. No santizing of anything and several opportunities for cross contamination. (I did advise the folks who sat down after us about the coffee cups before I left)

 

The cruise is almost over, and I've already raised a fuss to no apparent avail  while on board, so I think my next course will be a letter to corporate.

 

Not sure if we'll ever book VO again.

[lextrvlr]

Sargasso Pirate, I was hopeful until I just read your latest post. Damn! Come on Viking, do the right thing.  Get your hotel management folks together with a good sanitarian and solve this obvious shortcoming. Paper placemats changed with each cover, no placemats, wipe downs between covers with chlorine solution, training, whatever it takes. Do it.

[Richard2]

5 minutes ago, lextrvlr said:

Sargasso Pirate, I was hopeful until I just read your latest post. Damn! Come on Viking, do the right thing.  Get your hotel management folks together with a good sanitarian and solve this obvious shortcoming. Paper placemats changed with each cover, no placemats, wipe downs between covers with chlorine solution, training, whatever it takes. Do it.

You've got my vote.

Until things change, I'll set it up myself. Move the placemat aside. Get a large clean napkin and use it as my placemat. Get another napkin to use as a napkin. If silverware in rolled up inside, I've wasted a set of silverware. I don't like that, but I like the current situation even less. Can't envision what I'll do about glassware but I'll figure it out when I am there. Maybe bring my own coffee mug (or drink only wine and beer). 

[SargassoPirate]

We are bringing water bottles from our mini bar and using silverware "burritos" in the World Cafe. We are usually able to find some in the pool deck area.

 

I am still flabbergasted at the lack of sanitation practices after a noro incident on this cruise.  We are taking every extra precaution we can to protect ourselves, as should anyone who plans to cruise with VO.

 

 

[zitsky]

I believe it was mentioned that other locations use the same place mats?  Are we over reacting???  How likely is it for noro to come from a place mat?

[SargassoPirate]

1 hour ago, zitsky said:

I believe it was mentioned that other locations use the same place mats?  Are we over reacting???  How likely is it for noro to come from a place mat?

According to the CDC, norovirus can live on surfaces for several days, even weeks. I'd say highly likely placemats are an ideal host.

[zitsky]

Yes I've seen that graphic previously.

[Clay Clayton]

On 4/9/2019 at 11:18 AM, zitsky said:

 

I'm pretty sure they use glasses on river.  What about coffee, wine?  Plastic also?

 

At the World Cafe, the water glasses are short plastic ribbed plastic. You can see them in the photo below. The glasses for wine and soda are in glass as long as you are sitting inside. If you dine alfresco, then all barware is plastic (but good quality that looks basically the same as the real thing). 

 

Also note in the picture below that the glasses and coffee cups are now set drinking side up so the only potential contamination is the small spoon set directly on the mat above the plate. do I asked a waiter about it and he said it was a recent change in procedure. I thought, “well looks like someone was ready CruiseCritic”.  Unfortunately when I walked through after boarding this afternoon after our daybin Valencia, the glasses were upside down 😢

 

I did like that they also changed coffee procedure, there is now a room size thermos on each table full of hot coffee!

[Paulchili]

34 minutes ago, Clay Clayton said:

there is now a room size thermos on each table full of hot coffee!

That sounds wasteful to me. What if you don’t drink coffee or have just one cup - what happens to the rest of the thermos?

Edited April 10, 2019 by Paulchili

[Clay Clayton]

6 hours ago, Paulchili said:

That sounds wasteful to me. What if you don’t drink coffee or have just one cup - what happens to the rest of the thermos?

Just like what happened before, it gets refilled and served to another guest. But rather than having to wait for them to brin you coffee it’s there when you sit down.  I guess if some awful person with Nofo wanted to spit in it and make everyone else sick that could happen...but the same thing could happen if that same person used the spoon to dip some potatoes from the buffet and happened to spit on their hands first.  

 

I’m hoping (or gullable enough) that neither will be the case. 

Edited April 10, 2019 by Clay Clayton

[Paulchili]

13 minutes ago, Clay Clayton said:

 I guess if some awful person with Nofo wanted to spit in it and make everyone else sick that could happen...

They don’t have to spit in it - all they have to do is hold the thermos with their hands while pouring their cup of coffee and then you will hold it to help yourself (and then use your hands to eat with after having washed them before sitting down).....

This is not to mention that I would prefer a freshly brewed coffee from a machine rather than a thermos that has been traveling from table to table. That is how it’s done on cruise lines I usually cruise on.

Edited April 10, 2019 by Paulchili

[Clay Clayton]

6 hours ago, Paulchili said:

They don’t have to spit in it - all they have to do is hold the thermos with their hands while pouring their cup of coffee and then you will hold it to help yourself (and then use your hands to eat with after having washed them before sitting down).....

So do you take your own utensils to the buffet to serve yourself?  A slotted spoon for veggies, tongs for sushi, spatula for fish, etc?   I suspect not.  

 

I have several friends who do not eat at buffets due to concerns about germ transfer or due to cross contamination concerns related to their allergies.  I’m lucky I don’t have either concerns  but I’d suggest based on your posts that you might want to consider taking their stance about buffets.  Given the number of people who will be touching a serving spoon I don’t think there is a way for anyone to make a buffet completely safe.  

[zitsky]

Maybe all pax should be required to wear bio-hazard suits 24/7.  That will make the germaphobes happy.

 

People touch chairs when they sit down.  Yuck.

Edited April 10, 2019 by zitsky