What I learned about trip insurance

[ARandomTraveler]

20 hours ago, okeytaco said:

Joseph,  I don't think it's the same thing.  To me the difference is that the health insurance would have been in effect even though I might not have needed the coverage just like our auto insurance that we've had for 50 years and never had a claim.  Trip insurance is not in effect until the start date of the  insurance so since it had not started yet I thought it could be cancelled.  It's not a problem since we have a land based trip through Italy and I will transfer the policy.

Depends on the type of insurance you bought. If you only bought insurance that covers you during the trip that may be true (though I’ve never seen a policy that allows you to get the money back for the insurance policy itself, that seems like it would defeat the purpose).

 

There are a lot of policies that give you coverage before the trip starts; giving you the ability to cancel the trip and get your money back, covering you in the event you lose your job or get sick before the vacation starts and can’t go anymore, covers natural disasters etc. You must have purchased a very basic policy that only covered the trip itself.

Edited February 21, 2020 by ARandomTraveler

[ARandomTraveler]

8 hours ago, Balsam12 said:

Just one question to the OP....

 

If you had a refundable deposit, why did you even bother taking out travel insurance until you made final payment? You were at zero risk of suffering any loss, so insurance seems to be redundant.

 

We have booked a cruise for October 2021, with a $1 deposit. I won't be getting travel insurance until the next payment is due in February 2021. If we have to cancel before then, I'm not overly concerned about losing our $2.00.

 

Edit: Just reread the OP , and saw the pre-existing conditions bit. I didn't pick up on that as it works differently in Australia. Here, if you want cover for pre-existing conditions, they simply charge you extra (if they will provide cover at all).

 

The scenario where this might hurt you is if you decided you wanted to buy “cancel for any reason insurance.” By waiting until the next payment is due, you’ve now eliminated your ability to buy that type of insurance, as it has to be purchased within 14 days of making the first deposit on a vacation you want to cover. 

 

I understand your logic about not wanting to pay hundreds of dollars to insure $1, but you are looking at it the wrong way. What you would have been doing is locking in your right to “cancel for any reason” down the road. You now cannot purchase that type of insurance. 

 

Cancel for any reason insurance is very different from regular trip insurance as it allows you to “cancel for any reason” and get your money back, without having to prove you had a valid reason to cancel (like a hospital stay or jury duty). There are a lot of people who want to cancel their cruises out of Asia right now because of coronavirus, but regular insurance doesn’t cover that. Only cancel for any reason insurance works in that scenario. Same with hurricanes- if a hurricane damages your ports of call before your trip, but your cruise can still dock there, the cruise won’t be cancelled even though you may not want to go anymore because there’s nothing to do at your port and/or the beach is ruined, but guess what- you can’t get any money back in that scenario unless you have cancel for any reason insurance. 

 

Because you chose not to buy insurance with your $1 deposit, you’ve now lost your right to buy cancel for any reason insurance. 

[The Scurvy Pirate]

Not to hijack the thread, but if you re-book for a better rate or room upgrade, does that give you 14 days (a second chance) to get the "cancel for any reason" policy?

[Marilyn Johannes]

I need to clarify my question in post #9. Do you think travel insurance will reimburse policy cost due to the airlines and cruise line cancellations? Had a cruise booked to China in March, airlines and Royal have now canceled both the flight and cruise. Hotels and tours have refunded money. Since there is nothing left to insure would they reimburse the cost?  I bought trip insurance before final payment because I had refundable deposits. In a sense there was insurance for approximately 6 weeks from purchase date to cancellations. 

[MindyJohn]

My late husband and I travelled a lot for several years when his health was declining.  Any travel insurance we bought needed to cover pre-existing conditions.  My habit was to re-evaluate our plans at the time of final payment.  If things looked good for his health for the next few months, we would make final payment.  For trips when a fair amount of money was at risk I found a couple of insurance companies which would cover pre-existing as long as the policy was bought within 24 hours of final payment.  I had several claims and they went smoothly (except for one).

[FLConnie]

1 hour ago, Marilyn Johannes said:

I need to clarify my question in post #9. Do you think travel insurance will reimburse policy cost due to the airlines and cruise line cancellations? Had a cruise booked to China in March, airlines and Royal have now canceled both the flight and cruise. Hotels and tours have refunded money. Since there is nothing left to insure would they reimburse the cost?  I bought trip insurance before final payment because I had refundable deposits. In a sense there was insurance for approximately 6 weeks from purchase date to cancellations. 

NCL cancelled our Asia cruise that was scheduled for April and we got 100% of trip refunded from NCL and 100% of the trip insurance that was booked separately through Allianz. Our TA thought we may have to put the travel insurance toward another trip, but we didn’t. 

[3CatsInMA]

Many policies will now waive pre existing conditions if the coverage is purchased on or before the final payment date.

Edited February 21, 2020 by 3CatsInMA

[sparks1093]

1 hour ago, ARandomTraveler said:

The scenario where this might hurt you is if you decided you wanted to buy “cancel for any reason insurance.” By waiting until the next payment is due, you’ve now eliminated your ability to buy that type of insurance, as it has to be purchased within 14 days of making the first deposit on a vacation you want to cover. 

 

I understand your logic about not wanting to pay hundreds of dollars to insure $1, but you are looking at it the wrong way. What you would have been doing is locking in your right to “cancel for any reason” down the road. You now cannot purchase that type of insurance. 

 

Cancel for any reason insurance is very different from regular trip insurance as it allows you to “cancel for any reason” and get your money back, without having to prove you had a valid reason to cancel (like a hospital stay or jury duty). There are a lot of people who want to cancel their cruises out of Asia right now because of coronavirus, but regular insurance doesn’t cover that. Only cancel for any reason insurance works in that scenario. Same with hurricanes- if a hurricane damages your ports of call before your trip, but your cruise can still dock there, the cruise won’t be cancelled even though you may not want to go anymore because there’s nothing to do at your port and/or the beach is ruined, but guess what- you can’t get any money back in that scenario unless you have cancel for any reason insurance. 

 

Because you chose not to buy insurance with your $1 deposit, you’ve now lost your right to buy cancel for any reason insurance. 

Not necessarily. I just priced out CFAR plans on www.insuremytrip.com for a 7 day trip to Bermuda in July of this year, $2500 total cost. Some plans required purchase within 24 hours of booking the trip and some required purchase within 21 days of booking a trip and there were a few where you could buy the plan by the final payment date of the cruise. Many plans paid 75% of your insured cost while some allowed you to choose 50% or 75% depending on what you wanted to pay. And they all expected a fee on top of the regular insurance price. The key is to shop around.

[Marilyn Johannes]

Thanks FL Connie for your reply. I need to make sure Royal refunds everything and then the travel insurance company will let me know if they will refund policy premium  since I’m not rebooking another cruise at this time. 

[Baron Barracuda]

A number of cc posters purchase 3rd party insurance at time of booking  but only take coverage for amount of initial cruise deposit.  This eliminates pre-existing condition risk while keeping insurance cost low.  After making final payment they contact insurer and increase coverage to total trip cost.

[Baron Barracuda]

1 hour ago, sparks1093 said:

Not necessarily. I just priced out CFAR plans on www.insuremytrip.com for a 7 day trip to Bermuda in July of this year, $2500 total cost. Some plans required purchase within 24 hours of booking the trip and some required purchase within 21 days of booking a trip and there were a few where you could buy the plan by the final payment date of the cruise. Many plans paid 75% of your insured cost while some allowed you to choose 50% or 75% depending on what you wanted to pay. And they all expected a fee on top of the regular insurance price. The key is to shop around.

 

How did pricing for 50% and 75% CFAR plans compare to policy without that provision?  Any time I've looked at travel insurance the additional cost of CFAR didn't seem worth it, especially as I'd still be at risk for remaining 25% - 50%.

[sparks1093]

6 minutes ago, Baron Barracuda said:

 

How did pricing for 50% and 75% CFAR plans compare to policy without that provision?  Any time I've looked at travel insurance the additional cost of CFAR didn't seem worth it, especially as I'd still be at risk for remaining 25% - 50%.

I didn't look at that, I was just looking at what it took to buy it to begin with and it was something that I noticed with a few policies. 

[ARandomTraveler]

3 hours ago, Baron Barracuda said:

 

How did pricing for 50% and 75% CFAR plans compare to policy without that provision?  Any time I've looked at travel insurance the additional cost of CFAR didn't seem worth it, especially as I'd still be at risk for remaining 25% - 50%.

My CFAR was about $60 more per person than the policy without the CFAR portion. I paid a total of $251 for 2 people to cover about $4500 of non refundable expenses. I think that’s cheap, but some people think it’s too much because it’s a high percentage of the trip cost. I think the cost depends a lot on age, health, where you’re traveling and how high the dollar amount is that you’re covering. 

Edited February 21, 2020 by ARandomTraveler

[Baron Barracuda]

When I looked at insurance for our upcoming river cruise adding 75% CFAR increased premium from $660 to $2100 (64 and 28 year old NJ residents with $14k cruise cost).  To me that was excessive.   Insuremytrip also told me my 31 year old daughter who lives in NYC cannot obtain CFAR as it is apparently illegal in NY.

[cured]

4 hours ago, Baron Barracuda said:

 

How did pricing for 50% and 75% CFAR plans compare to policy without that provision?  Any time I've looked at travel insurance the additional cost of CFAR didn't seem worth it, especially as I'd still be at risk for remaining 25% - 50%.

On the policy I am looking at, adding 75% CFAR for 6 people, ($15,000 insured,) is $419. Premium needs to be paid before final payment.  Also has pre-existing condition waiver with only a 60 day lookback.

 

Travelers range in age from early 60's to early 20's

 

Total premium with CFAR is $1,257.58

Edited February 21, 2020 by cured
lowered insured costs to only reflect nonrefundable items

[Balsam12]

9 hours ago, ARandomTraveler said:

The scenario where this might hurt you is if you decided you wanted to buy “cancel for any reason insurance.”

Another huge difference between Australia and  the US... Cancel for any reason insurance simply doesn't exist here.

 

Out of interest, it would be good to compare the cost of insurance between the two countries. US, where you can get cover for pre-existing conditions and cancel for any reason, vs Australia, where you get neither.

 

Our insurance, for two people on an 11 night cruise from Sydney to New Zealand with zero excess, cost AUD 146.

 

Can anyone say what a similar policy with CFAR and pre-existing conditions would cost in the US?

[sparks1093]

14 hours ago, ARandomTraveler said:

My CFAR was about $60 more per person than the policy without the CFAR portion. I paid a total of $251 for 2 people to cover about $4500 of non refundable expenses. I think that’s cheap, but some people think it’s too much because it’s a high percentage of the trip cost. I think the cost depends a lot on age, health, where you’re traveling and how high the dollar amount is that you’re covering. 

I don't think $60 is that much more but we don't have a need for CFAR. If we end up not going on a cruise it would be for a covered reason or the cruise line will have cancelled the cruise.

[sparks1093]

10 hours ago, Balsam12 said:

Another huge difference between Australia and  the US... Cancel for any reason insurance simply doesn't exist here.

 

Out of interest, it would be good to compare the cost of insurance between the two countries. US, where you can get cover for pre-existing conditions and cancel for any reason, vs Australia, where you get neither.

 

Our insurance, for two people on an 11 night cruise from Sydney to New Zealand with zero excess, cost AUD 146.

 

Can anyone say what a similar policy with CFAR and pre-existing conditions would cost in the US?

Ok, it took a little leg work but I found an 11 night cruise on Royal out of Sydney and priced a balcony cabin at $3200. Insuring just the cruise a regular plan ranged from $161 usd to $435 usd ($243 aud to 656 aud). Then I had the website show me plans that included CFAR and pre-existing condition waivers and the plans ranged from $296 usd to $634 usd ($447 aud to $957 aud). 

[Balsam12]

13 hours ago, sparks1093 said:

Ok, it took a little leg work but I found an 11 night cruise on Royal out of Sydney and priced a balcony cabin at $3200. Insuring just the cruise a regular plan ranged from $161 usd to $435 usd ($243 aud to 656 aud). Then I had the website show me plans that included CFAR and pre-existing condition waivers and the plans ranged from $296 usd to $634 usd ($447 aud to $957 aud). 

Nice work, thanks for that.

 

Pretty much at least 3 times my cost. The policy we took was neither the cheapest nor the most expensive available, but closer to the lower end. I probably could have done it for about AUD 100 with less cover and a large excess.

 

Anyway, in Australia, taking out a policy before you make any payment greater than the cost of the policy has no advantage.

 

Even with a $200 non refundable deposit, unless we have paid for airfares or other such things, we wouldn't bother until final payment.

 

Thanks again.

Edited February 23, 2020 by Balsam12

[2InfinityNBeyond]

Generali has a policy that provides pre-existing coverage if paid when you make final payment for the cruise. The good thing is that insurance is cheaper then because there's less a chance of cancellation than there is a year ahead of time. You just have to pick the plan that includes it.

[cured]

1 hour ago, 2InfinityNBeyond said:

Generali has a policy that provides pre-existing coverage if paid when you make final payment for the cruise. The good thing is that insurance is cheaper then because there's less a chance of cancellation than there is a year ahead of time. You just have to pick the plan that includes it.

Nationwide's Choice and Luxury Cruise policies also waive pre-existing coverage.  And offer the option of adding CFAR. We are cruising during hurricane season and a lot of policies' fine print state they don't cover named storms, so the guy I talked to recommended a CFAR policy.

[sparks1093]

7 hours ago, cured said:

Nationwide's Choice and Luxury Cruise policies also waive pre-existing coverage.  And offer the option of adding CFAR. We are cruising during hurricane season and a lot of policies' fine print state they don't cover named storms, so the guy I talked to recommended a CFAR policy.

They don't cover named storms that are in existence when the policy is purchased but they should cover those that crop up after the policy is in effect (that's my understanding anyway).

[cured]

4 hours ago, sparks1093 said:

They don't cover named storms that are in existence when the policy is purchased but they should cover those that crop up after the policy is in effect (that's my understanding anyway).

Interesting, thank you. I will have to call back. The guy told me I should either purchase a policy that had NOAA protections in it or a CFAR.  I must have misunderstood. Thank you again, you may have just saved me $400.

[sparks1093]

2 hours ago, cured said:

Interesting, thank you. I will have to call back. The guy told me I should either purchase a policy that had NOAA protections in it or a CFAR.  I must have misunderstood. Thank you again, you may have just saved me $400.

As I said, it's my understanding that's how it works. I would expect someone selling the insurance would know. In any event it is important to fully understand the fine print of any policy that one buys.

[Joebucks]

I think the biggest takeaway here is that insurance isn't a plan that grants all of your wishes when you have a problem. There are terms and fine prints.

 

Remember, for CFAR, you generally only get back 50-75% The real number of what you would get back would surprise many people becaus the cruise line would refund you your taxes and port fees anyway. CFAR is largely a waste. Protection against a medical condition, especially with a pre-existing condition, is something of value.