JULY AND AUGUST ONLY: Unvaccinated ages 2 and up - mandatory covid test ($150 each)

[Prismism]

1 hour ago, Jasonsterling said:

I feel safe on the cruise because I'm vaccinated. I could sail with a ship full of unvaccinated people and so what, I have the same chance of catching it as at home at Walmart, which is slim to none. That's why I got vaccinated, so I don't have to worry about what other people do. 

 

This is the best post I have ever read on this forum. Thank you for your logical posts. This forum could use more of this common sense and practical thinking.

[BrotherCraig]

13 hours ago, eclue said:

So everyone should just get VACCINATED and put an end to this nonsense/

 

Not everyone can.  A big chunk of the Carnival customers can't.

[bigrednole]

I am 100% for this. Test and price the unvaxxed to choose not to cruise. If there is a family of 4 and 1 is unvaxxed, all 4 must be tested at cost of $600. Add in the other cost like covid insurance and make them decide if it is financially worth it.

[tiffy0428]

13 hours ago, Prismism said:

 

This is the best post I have ever read on this forum. Thank you for your logical posts. This forum could use more of this common sense and practical thinking.

I love this post. I wish everyone thought like you

[tiffy0428]

1 hour ago, bigrednole said:

I am 100% for this. Test and price the unvaxxed to choose not to cruise. If there is a family of 4 and 1 is unvaxxed, all 4 must be tested at cost of $600. Add in the other cost like covid insurance and make them decide if it is financially worth it.

I don't think that's fair for someone who has a one year old. The chances of that one year old being in someone face or even catching covid is not as high as an adult. Well at least that's what the doctors are saying

[tiffy0428]

1 hour ago, BrotherCraig said:

Not everyone can.  A big chunk of the Carnival customers can't.

Exactly, a lot of families choose carnival because it's great for kids. 

[bigrednole]

11 minutes ago, tiffy0428 said:

I don't think that's fair for someone who has a one year old. The chances of that one year old being in someone face or even catching covid is not as high as an adult. Well at least that's what the doctors are saying

Is it fair for the shareholders that had 5,000 shares of Carnival stock at $50? Sorry, life isn't fair. Cruising is a luxury. If you must cruise so badly and be unvaccinated, you have to be willing to accept the financial burden. The other decision is to vacation elsewhere until the protocols can be changed. 

[ProgRockCruiser]

15 minutes ago, tiffy0428 said:

I don't think that's fair for someone who has a one year old. The chances of that one year old being in someone face or even catching covid is not as high as an adult. Well at least that's what the doctors are saying

One-year-olds are exempt from testing.  But to your point, a 3-year-old.  

 

AFAIK, Carnival would only test the 3YO.  But still, $150 out of pocket will hurt some folks.

[tiffy0428]

Just now, ProgRockCruiser said:

One-year-olds are exempt from testing.  But to your point, a 3-year-old.  

 

AFAIK, Carnival would only test the 3YO.  But still, $150 out of pocket will hurt some folks.

$150 would hurt me. My whole family vaccinated however we do have a one year old

[tiffy0428]

6 minutes ago, bigrednole said:

Is it fair for the shareholders that had 5,000 shares of Carnival stock at $50? Sorry, life isn't fair. Cruising is a luxury. If you must cruise so badly and be unvaccinated, you have to be willing to accept the financial burden. The other decision is to vacation elsewhere until the protocols can be changed. 

I have shares as well a lot more then that and I want to be able to cruise with my one year old

[BrotherCraig]

23 minutes ago, bigrednole said:

Is it fair for the shareholders that had 5,000 shares of Carnival stock at $50? Sorry, life isn't fair. Cruising is a luxury. If you must cruise so badly and be unvaccinated, you have to be willing to accept the financial burden. The other decision is to vacation elsewhere until the protocols can be changed. 

 

Families don't have a choice to vaccinate or not. 

You act like it is easy to switch a cruise or cancel.  It isn't.  Might be for you but it isn't for most families.  You are asking families to postpone cruising for another couple of years in reality.  

Edited July 14, 2021 by BrotherCraig

[bigrednole]

Just now, BrotherCraig said:

 

Families don't have a choice to vaccinate or not. 

They have a choice to vacation on a cruise or a cabin in the mountains or Disney World or 100s of other things. This is a specific want. I understand they can't be vaccinated. Carnival also has a responsibility to their shareholders and debt holders to generate revenue. Even as John Heald stated in his coffee video that Carnival needs to start generating serious revenue. He even stated that they could sail at 100% capacity with unvaccinated passengers the demand is so high. They don't want to go that route because they are known as the family ships.

 

Its unfortunate. People with families should look to alternative options and plan for cruising next Summer. Unvaxxed want all the benefits but none of the consequences. Even the two idiots from RCL's  first cruise had a massive rant about being escorted off the ships. If families just "have" to cruise that bad, then accept the $150pp test fee, the extra $200+ for covid insurance, and all other restrictions.

[BrotherCraig]

5 minutes ago, bigrednole said:

They have a choice to vacation on a cruise or a cabin in the mountains or Disney World or 100s of other things. This is a specific want. I understand they can't be vaccinated. Carnival also has a responsibility to their shareholders and debt holders to generate revenue. Even as John Heald stated in his coffee video that Carnival needs to start generating serious revenue. He even stated that they could sail at 100% capacity with unvaccinated passengers the demand is so high. They don't want to go that route because they are known as the family ships.

 

Its unfortunate. People with families should look to alternative options and plan for cruising next Summer. Unvaxxed want all the benefits but none of the consequences. Even the two idiots from RCL's  first cruise had a massive rant about being escorted off the ships. If families just "have" to cruise that bad, then accept the $150pp test fee, the extra $200+ for covid insurance, and all other restrictions.

 

 

Well, the unvax children doesn't need travel insurance so there is that.  People had these cruises booked for a long time in most cases.  Again, not as easy as you make it out to be.  Families will have to pay thousands more to switch their cruises to a later time in most cases.  Not every family can afford that.  Maybe you can but I doubt most can.  

[bigrednole]

1 hour ago, BrotherCraig said:

 

 

Well, the unvax children doesn't need travel insurance so there is that.  People had these cruises booked for a long time in most cases.  Again, not as easy as you make it out to be.  Families will have to pay thousands more to switch their cruises to a later time in most cases.  Not every family can afford that.  Maybe you can but I doubt most can.  

I've had 7 cruises canceled as well as many more people had theirs canceled. Everyone had to make adjustments, changes, and adapt. The cancelation policy was still in place for a while and everyone could have canceled and taken other vacations. Unfortunately, everything is going up in price in the US.

 

The real issue is that people think they are owed cruising. That simply is not the case, but the complete opposite. The cruise lines owe its shareholders and debt holders cruising and revenue growth, nothing else. Carnival flat out stated it that they could have 100% capacity on all cruises for vaccinated only. The demand is completely there. They are still trying to appease families which I don't agree with until there is more control of the virus. You may think it unfair, but life isn't fair. Take the family to the mountains, a national park, some resort somewhere. 

 

People have to understand that there are consequences, even if beyond their control. The consequence is cruising while not being vaccinated. Its unfortunate, but oh well.

[Old Fart Cruisers]

14 minutes ago, bigrednole said:

I've had 7 cruises canceled as well as many more people had theirs canceled. Everyone had to make adjustments, changes, and adapt. The cancelation policy was still in place for a while and everyone could have canceled and taken other vacations. Unfortunately, everything is going up in price in the US.

 

The real issue is that people think they are owed cruising. That simply is not the case, but the complete opposite. The cruise lines owe its shareholders and debt holders cruising and revenue growth, nothing else. Carnival flat out stated it that they could have 100% capacity on all cruises for vaccinated only. The demand is completely there. They are still trying to appease families which I don't agree with until there is more control of the virus. You may think it unfair, but life isn't fair. Take the family to the mountains, a national park, some resort somewhere. 

 

People have to understand that there are consequences, even if beyond their control. The consequence is cruising while not being vaccinated. Its unfortunate, but oh well.

 

This is the best post I have ever read on this forum.  Thank you for your logical posts.  This forum could use more of this common sense and practical thinking.

[JEANMR1]

Hey I’m all for vaccines but my son is 10 and can’t get it yet. I understand there are some inconveniences and accept them. None of that is the problem. I have an email from Carnival saying my son is exempted for our July cruise and that he will need to be tested there. The cost is $50 but waived for July and August. I have received nothing from carnival stating otherwise. I expect to not be charged when I get there. If there is I’m going to try and fight it. It’s not like this is a change in protocol - but a change in price. It increases the cost of my cruise by 7.5% (cost of cruise not including gratuities). 

[jfunk138]

I've been shifting my CCL shares to DIS shares.  Disney Parks are wide open with no restrictions, and if Covid heats up again it has the content empire to fall back on.   Meanwhile the cruiselines are busy alienating the ~51% of the US population not currently "fully vaccinated".  What kind of business thrives when they exclude over half their potential customers?  Not the kind I invest in, and if the price action in CCL over the past month (-25%) is any indication, I am not alone.  This comes despite all the apparent "good news" over that same time period. 

 

They are not building loyalty, they are building backlash and animosity.  Not Good.

 

It's easy for "fully vaccinated" folks here to forget, that as of July 14, 2021, they remain a minority (49%).

 

Meanwhile, policies that attempt to "penalize" (as this "test fee" is clearly trying to do) willing customers are not in the interest of future business success.  There's been a huge economic reorganization associated with this pandemic and putting a bad taste in people's mouths with customer unfriendly business practices will result in people choosing other vacations not just now, but well into the future.

[bigrednole]

8 minutes ago, jfunk138 said:

 What kind of business thrives when they exclude over half their potential customers? 

Over 75% of the country does not cruise. Nothing like hand picking random information to try to back up a claim. They have stated they can sail with 100% vaccinated cruises based on demand. Another shutdown of the cruise industry would break them. 

 

As for your investment strategy, that is sound and reasonable. 

[jfunk138]

1 minute ago, bigrednole said:

Over 75% of the country does not cruise. Nothing like hand picking random information to try to back up a claim. They have stated they can sail with 100% vaccinated cruises based on demand. Another shutdown of the cruise industry would break them. 

 

As for your investment strategy, that is sound and reasonable. 

Hand picking?  It's the SINGLE most readily available vaccine statistic that is reported everywhere:  by Fauci, on TV news, in social media.  If you have a stat that more accurately represents the vaccination rate of Carnival's customers, please share.

 

I have to assume that Carnival's customer base cuts across a broad swath of the entire population.  Indeed, Carnival's base (younger, more "party" oriented) might even trend less vaccinated that the national average.  But we don't have any data on that.

 

I don't doubt they can fill the few ships sailing to 100% capacity right now, but that demand is transitory.  There's a backlog of people that "will do anything" to get on a ship.  Eventually that demand dries up.  Meanwhile you have families that are putting their deposits on other vacations well into the future.

 

Cruising has been happening without being shut down in Europe, without vaccinations, and without punitive fees.  I don't buy the argument that a few cases is going to "shutdown the industry", when we have plenty of evidence to the contrary.

 

 

[bigrednole]

Just now, jfunk138 said:

Hand picking?  It's the SINGLE most readily available vaccine statistic that is reported everywhere:  by Fauci, on TV news, in social media.  If you have a stat that more accurately represents the vaccination rate of Carnival's customers, please share.

 

I have to assume that Carnival's customer base cuts across a broad swath of the entire population.  Indeed, Carnival's base (younger, more "party" oriented) might even trend less vaccinated that the national average.  But we don't have any data on that.

 

I don't doubt they can fill the few ships sailing to 100% capacity right now, but that demand is transitory.  There's a backlog of people that "will do anything" to get on a ship.  Eventually that demand dries up.  Meanwhile you have families that are putting their deposits on other vacations well into the future.

 

Cruising has been happening without being shut down in Europe, without vaccinations, and without punitive fees.  I don't buy the argument that a few cases is going to "shutdown the industry", when we have plenty of evidence to the contrary.

 

 

I am glad 100% of the US population is booking cruises. This stock should hit $8,000 soon. I take that back, investing in Disney is wrong. I need to call my FA for a 400x gain.

[babygrljaz]

I understand not everyone had prior cruises cancelled, but there are many that did and have a lot of OBC.  Many have mentioned or asked how to cash out because it is so much.  If the the testing fees are going to be added to s&s then it can come out of that, if they have all that free obc....just a thought.  I don't know who has it & who doesn't, it was just a thought

[BrotherCraig]

46 minutes ago, bigrednole said:

I've had 7 cruises canceled as well as many more people had theirs canceled. Everyone had to make adjustments, changes, and adapt. The cancelation policy was still in place for a while and everyone could have canceled and taken other vacations. Unfortunately, everything is going up in price in the US.

 

The real issue is that people think they are owed cruising. That simply is not the case, but the complete opposite. The cruise lines owe its shareholders and debt holders cruising and revenue growth, nothing else. Carnival flat out stated it that they could have 100% capacity on all cruises for vaccinated only. The demand is completely there. They are still trying to appease families which I don't agree with until there is more control of the virus. You may think it unfair, but life isn't fair. Take the family to the mountains, a national park, some resort somewhere. 

 

People have to understand that there are consequences, even if beyond their control. The consequence is cruising while not being vaccinated. Its unfortunate, but oh well.

I 100% understand all of that.  That isn't my point.  I don't care that I have to move our cruise again since our small children CANNOT be vaccinated.  Carnival should be able to roll over people's cruises without a huge additional cost.  Some families moved their $4000 cruise to another week on the same ship and it ended up costing them $8000.  NOBODY is owed a cruise and nobody here in this thread believes they are so saying that is just way out there in left field -- in the dark.    Big difference between unvaccinated children and unvaccinated adults here.  Big difference.  

 

I postponed numerous times as well -- keep moving the cruise later and later.  Postponing once again.  Again, point is - it's getting dang expensive.  Our kids are kids for only so long and their number one love for a vacation are cruising.  But yeah -- there are choices and families have to make a different choice if they have to.  That is a given.  The virus is dwindling down to the sniffles and more and more people are being vaccinated.  Small kids won't have to be vaccinated anytime in the near future unless they have health conditions.  There is light at the end of the tunnel.  We are cruising again.    Carnival just needs to be honest and tell all of the families out there to EFF OFF and they are going to be an adult cruise line until 2023  Enough of the BS.  

 

[BrotherCraig]

2 hours ago, bigrednole said:

Even the two idiots from RCL's  first cruise had a massive rant about being escorted off the ships. If families just "have" to cruise that bad, then accept the $150pp test fee, the extra $200+ for covid insurance, and all other restrictions.

 

 

That comment was bad timing.  The RCL guests were tested right before the cruise and was negative.  They were tested twice right after they were booted - negative.  They already had COVID in March and had the antibody test and the medical report to prove it.  They had the paperwork showing they tested negative right before the cruise.  They also submitted proof they tested negative right after they were booted -- twice tested.  RCL made a mistake and gave them wristband that said they were vaccinated. They found their mistake - tested them - and booted them off.  RCL failed in many ways there.

 

But again - we are talking about Carnival ships that are 12 and up - fully vaccinated - along with unvaccinated small children.  

[BrotherCraig]

17 minutes ago, babygrljaz said:

I understand not everyone had prior cruises cancelled, but there are many that did and have a lot of OBC.  Many have mentioned or asked how to cash out because it is so much.  If the the testing fees are going to be added to s&s then it can come out of that, if they have all that free obc....just a thought.  I don't know who has it & who doesn't, it was just a thought

 

 

Very true.  What parent would want to do that to their small children twice just to cruise?  Sounds selfish to me.  Big reason we moved our cruise to March and will be waving goodbye to the MG on 11/20 from the sidelines since we already have flights booked and hotel.  Will make the best of it.  Glad we can afford the extra few thousand to move the cruise to a later date - even though we had to downgrade our cabin.  Never thought I would pay $7000 for an interior and one balcony on the upper section of a ship.  BRUTAL!  lol  Paid more for an interior than I did the balcony.

Edited July 14, 2021 by BrotherCraig

[TNcruising02]

8 minutes ago, BrotherCraig said:

 

 

Very true.  What parent would want to do that to their small children twice just to cruise?  Sounds selfish to me.  Big reason we moved our cruise to March and will be waving goodbye to the MG on 11/20 from the sidelines since we already have flights booked and hotel.  Will make the best of it.  Glad we can afford the extra few thousand to move the cruise to a later date - even though we had to downgrade our cabin.  Never thought I would pay $7000 for an interior and one balcony on the upper section of a ship.  BRUTAL!  lol  Paid more for an interior than I did the balcony.

The good thing is that there is plenty to do in Florida.  We had already decided to keep our flights if our cruise ended up being cancelled and just enjoy a Florida vacation.