Request Royal to stop negative Covid test to board

[not-enough-cruising]

1 hour ago, jerseygirl629 said:

There is a major difference between cruising and the other activities you listed. On a cruise, you’re confined to a ship in the middle of the ocean for 3-8+ Days with the same people. All of the other activities you listed are places where people should still be wearing masks and even if they aren’t, you can control who you are standing next to and for how long. I doubt you’re standing next to the same person at the grocery store for your entire trip. Same with airports, amusement parks, or other hotels. They are very smart to keep the testing and vaccine mandate.
 

What they should be doing is requiring PCR tests, not rapids, to board. Broadway in NYC is still testing their actors every other day and it has worked for them in the sense that they have been successfully preventing major outbreaks, with the exception of Winter 2021-2022 where Omicron was rampant.

 

Much like Broadway, the cruise industry has also avoided any major outbreaks. 
 

The notion that the atmosphere on a

ship is any different than that of an amusement park or other gathering area is rubbish. Even on a ship, you are not spending any more continuous time in the presence of any one individual than in any other phase of your life. There is constant movement of people indoors and outdoors, and even leaving the ship for hours at a time. Cruise ship life creates no greater (statistically significant) risk than any other group activity. 

Edited July 10, 2022 by not-enough-cruising

[Project-College]

2 minutes ago, not-enough-cruising said:

Vaccine cards “backed digitally”? 

Meaning, my understanding from the CDC notice... each State is REQUIRED now to report and have a central data repository, or access thereof, of vaccinated individuals.  NJ Docket has access.

If the Vaccine Card is not backed in any way... hell Photoshop would be the new norm.

[not-enough-cruising]

4 minutes ago, Project-College said:

Meaning, my understanding from the CDC notice... each State is REQUIRED now to report and have a central data repository, or access thereof, of vaccinated individuals.  NJ Docket has access.

If the Vaccine Card is not backed in any way... hell Photoshop would be the new norm.

Vaccine registration is 100% voluntary, there is no federal requirement. 

Different states handle it differently. Some states (TX included) have an “opt in” registry, meaning you have to request to have your vaccines cataloged. Other states’ registries are “opt out” meaning you are enrolled by default and must request to be removed. 
 

Regardless, a cruise line does not have access to these registries. 

[CruisingHogFan]

44 minutes ago, not-enough-cruising said:

Much like Broadway, the cruise industry has also avoided any major outbreaks. 
 

The notion that the atmosphere on a

ship is any different than that of an amusement park or other gathering area is rubbish. Even on a ship, you are not spending any more continuous time in the presence of any one individual than in any other phase of your life. There is constant movement of people indoors and outdoors, and even leaving the ship for hours at a time. Cruise ship life creates no greater (statistically significant) risk than any other group activity. 

 

Have you sailed in the last few months? Our last two cruises, especially the one a couple weeks ago had a lot of people test positive around day 4. The medial center had a long wait and know of several people moved to the quarantine deck.
 

Take away the current protocols and a mass outbreak would occur on the first sailing. 

 

 

[not-enough-cruising]

21 minutes ago, CruisingHogFan said:

 

Have you sailed in the last few months? Our last two cruises, especially the one a couple weeks ago had a lot of people test positive around day 4. The medial center had a long wait and know of several people moved to the quarantine deck.
 

Take away the current protocols and a mass outbreak would occur on the first sailing. 

 

 

Yes, I have cruises 28 days since November (departing one week from today for another 7) 

 

The scenario you describe is far from a “major” outbreak so I stand by my statement. In the last 7 days there have been around 120,000 positive tests reported nationwide (0.03% of entire population). Hospitalizations remain at a very low manageable level, mortality at a very low level. This is NOT the Covid of 2020. IF we knew the total number testing positive on your ships, I doubt the percentage would be much different. 

 

You can’t say with any certainty that changing protocols would have any significant effect.  Europe is dropping the protocols, so we should know soon. 

Edited July 10, 2022 by not-enough-cruising

[pyrateslife4me84]

16 minutes ago, not-enough-cruising said:

Yes, I have cruises 28 days since November (departing one week from today for another 7) 

 

The scenario you describe is far from a “major” outbreak so I stand by my statement. In the last 7 days there have been around 120,000 positive tests reported nationwide (0.03% of entire population). Hospitalizations remain at a very low manageable level, mortality at a very low level. This is NOT the Covid of 2020. IF we knew the total number testing positive on your ships, I doubt the percentage would be much different. 

 

You can’t say with any certainty that changing protocols would have any significant effect.  Europe is dropping the protocols, so we should know soon. 

We know that since cruises resumed, 2 RCCL passengers have caught CV-19 and died. That’s rather low. 

[ace2542]

2 hours ago, pyrateslife4me84 said:

You know, neither communicable disease nor pandemics are a new thing, right?

There weren't fleets of cruise ships during the 1918 outbreak where there?

[ace2542]

1 hour ago, jerseygirl3 said:

My husband contracted Influenza A on our last cruise before the pandemic started (Feb 2020). As did 80 other passengers. All were quarantined. He was allowed to stay in our cabin and irder room service. No cabin attendant seevice. The medical center did not quarantine me, but they did put me on Tamiflu prophylactically. I stayed in the cabin fir the most part anyway because i didnt want to leave my husband alone I know for sure my husband didnt board the ship with flu, as we were already 9 days into a 12 day cruise when he first felt ill and stayed in our cabin that evening and in the morning went to the Medical Center, where they tested him for flu. 

Someone must have boarded with Flu at some point?

[not-enough-cruising]

10 minutes ago, pyrateslife4me84 said:

We know that since cruises resumed, 2 RCCL passengers have caught CV-19 and died. That’s rather low. 

Even at that, we have no idea if the cruise experience was causal or not; the outcome may well have been exactly the same sans cruise vacation.

[pyrateslife4me84]

32 minutes ago, ace2542 said:

There weren't fleets of cruise ships during the 1918 outbreak where there?

Have you ever heard of the RMS Titanic?

 

There were cruise ships in the 1910s. 

[pyrateslife4me84]

25 minutes ago, not-enough-cruising said:

Even at that, we have no idea if the cruise experience was causal or not; the outcome may well have been exactly the same sans cruise vacation.

Yes. My point was, no more than 2 deaths out of hundreds of thousands of passengers. Meanwhile, 100s of thousands of Americans have died of CV-19 on land since summer 2021. 
 

The fact that Broadway has no COVID restrictions as of 7/1 tells me cruises should move on, as well. 

Edited July 10, 2022 by pyrateslife4me84

[S.A.M.J.R.]

3 hours ago, jerseygirl629 said:

I doubt you’re standing next to the same person at the grocery store for your entire trip. Same with airports, amusement parks, or other hotels. They are very smart to keep the testing and vaccine mandate.

I doubt you're standing next to the same person on the cruise ship for a significant amount of time.  

[jerseygirl629]

7 minutes ago, S.A.M.J.R. said:

I doubt you're standing next to the same person on the cruise ship for a significant amount of time.  

I guess you have never eaten dinner next to the same people? Or go to any of the shows where you’re packed in like sardines for at least 30 minutes? Or at the indoor spa? At the casino?  Etc…

[kccrzr]

1 hour ago, not-enough-cruising said:

 

 

 In the last 7 days there have been around 120,000 positive tests reported nationwide (0.03% of entire population). Hospitalizations remain at a very low manageable level, mortality at a very low level. This is NOT the Covid of 2020. IF we knew the total number testing positive on your ships, I doubt the percentage would be much different. 

 

You can’t say with any certainty that changing protocols would have any significant effect.  Europe is dropping the protocols, so we should know soon. 

 

Are you sure you're quoting a weekly figure?  CDC says as of July 6, 2022, the current 7-day moving average of daily new cases is 106,549.  Here we are being told the actual number is likely much higher than reported cases from testing.

[S.A.M.J.R.]

8 minutes ago, jerseygirl629 said:

I guess you have never eaten dinner next to the same people? Or go to any of the shows where you’re packed in like sardines for at least 30 minutes? Or at the indoor spa? At the casino?  Etc…

And that's different than going to a sporting event/concert? A restaurant?  An airplane?  The movies? Please explain how the cruise is that different.  People are travel on busses and subways presumably also.  

Edited July 10, 2022 by S.A.M.J.R.

[not-enough-cruising]

13 minutes ago, jerseygirl629 said:

I guess you have never eaten dinner next to the same people? Or go to any of the shows where you’re packed in like sardines for at least 30 minutes? Or at the indoor spa? At the casino?  Etc…

I went to about 50 NBA games this year, 10-12 NFL and NCAA football games in the fall, 6-8 concerts (indoor and outdoor) this year, church every week, Vegas for a 4 day weekend in April...............ALL with NO masks, and NO testing

[Project-College]

1 hour ago, not-enough-cruising said:

Yes, I have cruises 28 days since November (departing one week from today for another 7) 

 

The scenario you describe is far from a “major” outbreak so I stand by my statement. In the last 7 days there have been around 120,000 positive tests reported nationwide (0.03% of entire population). Hospitalizations remain at a very low manageable level, mortality at a very low level. This is NOT the Covid of 2020. IF we knew the total number testing positive on your ships, I doubt the percentage would be much different. 

 

You can’t say with any certainty that changing protocols would have any significant effect.  Europe is dropping the protocols, so we should know soon. 

I guess for me is that term 'REPORTED'.  Since at home tests are so prevalent,  and since so many people do NOT report results... how accurate are the numbers?  Plus, there was a poster on that other site of a person who felt they had COVID on Carnival (and they did) but said there was no way he would let the Ship know since he was vaccinated  and the symptoms were mild (I think his comment was "I'll be damned if I am staying in my room and eating tuna sandwiches, I am on vacation".  Yes this is very self-centered but considering the cost of cruises for most... probably not uncommon! 

[not-enough-cruising]

3 minutes ago, Project-College said:

I guess for me is that term 'REPORTED'.  Since at home tests are so prevalent,  and since so many people do NOT report results... how accurate are the numbers?  Plus, there was a poster on that other site of a person who felt they had COVID on Carnival (and they did) but said there was no way he would let the Ship know since he was vaccinated  and the symptoms were mild (I think his comment was "I'll be damned if I am staying in my room and eating tuna sandwiches, I am on vacation".  Yes this is very self-centered but considering the cost of cruises for most... probably not uncommon! 

Not uncommon at all, and judging by the minuscule numbers, not a point of concern either

 

Medicine is my profession, has been for longer than i care to remember.  Staff at our hospital are expected to work with a positive test as long as they are not febrile.  Why would we expect a relatively asymptomatic individual to self report.

Edited July 10, 2022 by not-enough-cruising

[latserrof]

2 hours ago, Tree_skier said:

It makes no sense to me that cruise ship living is demonstrably different than any other kind of living with respect to the transmission of an airborne virus.

For me, cruising is very different than my everyday life. On a cruise, I am a LOT closer to a LOT more people for a LOT more time.  At home, I don't eat in crowded restaurants, eight times a day, for days, sometimes weeks, at a time. I don't do buffets. I don't  go to crowded bars, casinos, theatre and/or musical or comedy performances, wine tastings, loyalty parties, lectures etc.,  every day or throughout the day. I don't wait in lines to do those things, or to check-in, board, tender, re-board, disembark, complain,  etc.. I don't ride crowded tenders, tour buses or elevators. And so forth.  In fact, one reason I cruise is because it is so different than my everyday, somewhat-solitary life. For me, cruising necessarily involves a lot more people. And since people spread Covid...

 

I know some can't-live-in-fear wag will say "then, just stay home."  But that's not my point. (I've been on four cruises this year). My point is that cruising IS different. If I did all of the above activities at home at the rate I do them on a cruise, I would not be surprised if I got Covid.  But I don't.  But if I did get Covid on land,  at least I would be confident that there is plenty of adequate medical care readily available nearby if needed. Unlike a a cruise ship - - another difference.

[Suncoastsailors]

10 minutes ago, Project-College said:

I guess for me is that term 'REPORTED'.  Since at home tests are so prevalent,  and since so many people do NOT report results... how accurate are the numbers?  Plus, there was a poster on that other site of a person who felt they had COVID on Carnival (and they did) but said there was no way he would let the Ship know since he was vaccinated  and the symptoms were mild (I think his comment was "I'll be damned if I am staying in my room and eating tuna sandwiches, I am on vacation".  Yes this is very self-centered but considering the cost of cruises for most... probably not uncommon! 

There is a middle ground with this argument. If you test positive in your room with your home test. You have mild symptoms. You could choose to wear a mask, eat in the Lido away from other guest, sit in the Showroom away from other guest. Stay out of elevators and away from crowded areas. Not reporting does not mean you need to go on as if nothing happened. Be responsible. 

[latserrof]

35 minutes ago, not-enough-cruising said:

Why would we expect a relatively asymptomatic individual to self report.

If that's supposed to be a question, I have an answer: Because he/she is on a cruise ship (not in a hospital).

[time4u2go]

2 hours ago, ace2542 said:

There weren't fleets of cruise ships during the 1918 outbreak where there?

No. They were called ocean liners back then.

[not-enough-cruising]

7 minutes ago, latserrof said:

If that's supposed to be a question, I have an answer: Because he/she is on a cruise ship (not in a hospital).

You seem to have missed the whole point.  If people can WORK in a hospital with a positive Covid test, they certainly do not need a negative test to cruise.

We have proven on land that everything will be just fine.

 

Agree, disagree, but the facts are the facts.

[joeyancho]

On 7/6/2022 at 10:52 PM, BirdTravels said:

Nope. Much more than feel good. The testing prevents people with active covid from boarding. Based on the number of denied boarding every week, the testing is doing it's job by keeping active covid off the ships.

 

Yes, raw data from the CDC show that there is still a steady stream of covid positive passengers and crew members each week on every ship. By stopping the known covid positive people, it is that much less onboard. 

 

At the end of the day, the cruise line doesn't care if passengers get covid during the cruise and end up locked up. Very little impact, if any, on bottom line revenue.  They do care about the crew. Unlike the sniffles, a crew member that tests positive is out of commission for a week or more. So, keeping covid off the ship and away from the crew is a priority. 

Excellent response.    Or course nothing is foolproof.   It's all about the numbers.  Less people boarding without covid equals less covid on board.  It's amazing how some people cannot grasp the concept.   Of course the test is a pain and no one wants to take it, but it is for the common good and in the long it benefits everyone.   Some people don't want to comfort to anything.  

.

[not-enough-cruising]

8 minutes ago, joeyancho said:

Excellent response.    Or course nothing is foolproof.   It's all about the numbers.  Less people boarding without covid equals less covid on board.  It's amazing how some people cannot grasp the concept.   Of course the test is a pain and no one wants to take it, but it is for the common good and in the long it benefits everyone.   Some people don't want to comfort to anything.  

.

It will be interesting to see what happens with European embarkations in the next month or so, as they are dropping all testing protocols.