Not to pile on, but it’s bad…

[NutsAboutGolf]

3 minutes ago, jules27556 said:

Agree!  Who knows if the "chef" or others aren't using this tactic to avoid low marks?

"Honesty is the best policy." 

Totally agree and the premise a waiter gets dinged on food quality makes zero sense.  Would a chef get in a trouble if one marked the service as bad (rhetorical)?  Bad food quality really isn’t  the chefs fault either

[Hlitner]

38 minutes ago, jaapie said:

On the Reflection last week our waiter asked us to please not give the food quality a low score because even though he is not the chef he gets dinged for food complaints. If this is true, it is totally wrong, he should be dinged for poor service but not food quality or options. Because of this I am not completing the post-cruise survey because I don't want to say anything that would harm the waiter because in all honesty I couldn't give the food a 10. So X is not getting feedback from me even though I would like to tell them the truth.

This is an old RCI tactic that had been eliminated many decades ago.  Back in the 70s and early 80s, those cruising on RCCL were routinely faced with a lecture from their waiter (in those days everyone had fixed dining) asking them to please give the highest marks for all things having to do with the waiter and food.  They would say that anything less than outstanding (for the food) would reflect on the individual waiters.  This practice was finally stopped when many passengers complained, and the company proactively put an end to the lectures.

 

What you are saying is that the practice has now returned.  If I ever had another waiter give me that kind of lecture, I would blast the waiter (in the evaluation) for the arm twisting and actively promoting dishonesty.  I would also give the lowest marks to management for trying to rig their own evaluation system.

 

Hank

 

 

[Keys Kathy]

4 minutes ago, NutsAboutGolf said:

Totally agree and the premise a waiter gets dinged on food quality makes zero sense.  Would a chef get in a trouble if one marked the service as bad (rhetorical)?  Bad food quality really isn’t  the chefs fault either

The Chef is responsible for the food. The buck stops there! If they don't like what there are given to cook, they should choose a better way to cook the food, such as sous vide to tenderize meat or slow cooking. We all have used different cooking methods to make less expensive cuts moist and tasty. 

[NutsAboutGolf]

10 minutes ago, Keys Kathy said:

The Chef is responsible for the food. The buck stops there! If they don't like what there are given to cook, they should choose a better way to cook the food, such as sous vide to tenderize meat or slow cooking. We all have used different cooking methods to make less expensive cuts moist and tasty. 

The buck does NOT stop there.  You can buy a steak for a buck (terrible pun) at the dollar tree, if there’s a way to make it amazing, why spend $100+ at a steakhouse? Totally agree there are ways to make things better and I started a thread years ago championing ships using sous vide.  Yet the chefs who are actually cooking your food have to follow a strict recipe.  Therefore the buck never stops until it reaches the very top

[Keys Kathy]

4 minutes ago, NutsAboutGolf said:

The buck does NOT stop there.  You can buy a steak for a buck (terrible pun) at the dollar tree, if there’s a way to make it amazing, why spend $100+ at a steakhouse? Totally agree there are ways to make things better and I started a thread years ago championing ships using sous vide.  Yet the chefs who are actually cooking your food have to follow a strict recipe.  Therefore the buck never stops until it reaches the very top

Yeah, and that is Lisa Lutoff-Perlo. 

 

I may have to get one of those $1. steaks and see what we can do with it.

[NutsAboutGolf]

5 minutes ago, Keys Kathy said:

Yeah, and that is Lisa Lutoff-Perlo. 

 

I may have to get one of those $1. steaks and see what we can do with it.

She’s part of the top, she isn’t a dictator, there’s the X board she answers to and the X board answers to the parent company of RCG.  Anyways, on YouTube check out guga foods, he has a second channel of sous vide everything; he mostly does recipe/cooking experiments on steaks and has done many on the buck steak, Kobe and everything in between

[Chardonnay Char]

41 minutes ago, Keys Kathy said:

The Chef is responsible for the food. The buck stops there! If they don't like what there are given to cook, they should choose a better way to cook the food, such as sous vide to tenderize meat or slow cooking. We all have used different cooking methods to make less expensive cuts moist and tasty. 

I disagree.  A chef can't turn tilapia into turbot or sirloin into filet

[Keys Kathy]

3 minutes ago, NutsAboutGolf said:

She’s part of the top, she isn’t a dictator, there’s the X board she answers to and the X board answers to the parent company of RCG.  Anyways, on YouTube check out guga foods, he has a second channel of sous vide everything; he mostly does recipe/cooking experiments on steaks and has done many on the buck steak, Kobe and everything in between

Guga is DH's hero! He is where I go to figure out what to get Hubby for Christmas.

 

FYI, I am a stockhold, so in a way she answers to me too.

[BPCW]

4 hours ago, Keys Kathy said:

We were also on the Millie. Everyone has talked about the food, one lunch was Chicken Pot Pie, Beef pot pie, and seafood (canned mussel) pot pie. The next night at dinner, they had the same  pot pies and added Sheppards pie to the list. There was so much turkey and chicken I was starting to grow feathers just walking by them. The best thing at dinner was the stir fry and pasta stations.

 

I felt bad for those who got on the ship late in St Thomas and missed their MDR meal. Upstairs was laughable, but when you have waited for a table for an hour and a half, you tend to get hungry and go upstairs. 

 

I don't know if it was just us, but we had to ask for a bar of soap, we never had qtips or cotton balls and there wasn't an ice bucket in sight. We had two towels, period. No extra towel for my hair. 

 

I bought a future cruise, but I am expecting it will not be used. I did it just in case they fix this mess. BTW, instead of having 12 months to pick out your next cruise, you now have 6 months.

 

There were not any speakers or any other educational activities, heck, I would have gone to towel folding!

 

Not the X we have sailed with 60 times.

I’m glad I wasn’t crazy and others had similar experiences.  My wife and I joked to each other several times during the cruise “did we accidentally get on a NCL ship?”, haha.  
 

I am not sure why there are so many Celebrity defenders or doom and gloomers in this thread (many who haven’t experienced these changes yet). Many of us are just trying to give people honest assessments of our real experience onboard.  Like I said in my long winded review, I had a good time and these complaints didn’t severely detract from my enjoyment outside of some missed evening activities due to super long MDR dinners and some wait time annoyances. I would book X again in a heartbeat. But I’m going to shop around again and test the waters (really haven’t done so in 6 years) because I didn’t see the value of paying more for sub-par “typical” Celebrity service that I have come to expect from the premium we are paying and our other 5 previous Celebrity cruises. 

 

My goal was to let people know that if you haven’t been on X in a while, you will likely notice the changes (at least on the smaller ships in non-suites) and to be prepared to lower expectations so you aren’t disappointed on your trip. It’s certainly not to talk people out of booking because it was still a great 8 nights.  But the common complaints about poor service, not enough crew, lower food quality, nickel and diming, etc that I read here before our trip almost 100% was reflected on our 8 nights even though I went into it thinking “these message board people are probably a lot pickier than me” - I was wrong, they were right. 

[Hlitner]

1 hour ago, NutsAboutGolf said:

The buck does NOT stop there.  You can buy a steak for a buck (terrible pun) at the dollar tree, if there’s a way to make it amazing, why spend $100+ at a steakhouse? Totally agree there are ways to make things better and I started a thread years ago championing ships using sous vide.  Yet the chefs who are actually cooking your food have to follow a strict recipe.  Therefore the buck never stops until it reaches the very top

Even the best Chefs can only do so much with lower quality products and smaller amounts.  A think "Select" cut of sirloin is not going to be mistaken for a prime cut of ribeye.  And a tasteless small farmed tiliapia filet is not going to be confused with decent wild trout.  Here in Mexico (we live in Puerto Vallarta for part of the year) we get the most amazing shrimp (extra large will cost us about $6(US) a pound.  You taste these shrimp and you will quickly realize that the quality of shrimp you get in many places (including most cruise ships) is not very good.  It is the same with scallops which vary greatly in quality.  Cruise lines primarily buy tasteless farmed seafood and serve portions not big enough for most baby cats.

 

Hank

[Keys Kathy]

16 minutes ago, Hlitner said:

Even the best Chefs can only do so much with lower quality products and smaller amounts.  A think "Select" cut of sirloin is not going to be mistaken for a prime cut of ribeye.  And a tasteless small farmed tiliapia filet is not going to be confused with decent wild trout.  Here in Mexico (we live in Puerto Vallarta for part of the year) we get the most amazing shrimp (extra large will cost us about $6(US) a pound.  You taste these shrimp and you will quickly realize that the quality of shrimp you get in many places (including most cruise ships) is not very good.  It is the same with scallops which vary greatly in quality.  Cruise lines primarily buy tasteless farmed seafood and serve portions not big enough for most baby cats.

 

Hank

Here we have Key West Pinks. We buy 16-21's for about $19. a lb. I have to say how surprised I am when people order the shrimp cocktail. That is tiny farmed shrimp that has probably been eating chicken poop from above their pen. 

 

We don't buy farm raised seafood. Yuck. But I guess it is exotica to some. 

[NutsAboutGolf]

28 minutes ago, Hlitner said:

Even the best Chefs can only do so much with lower quality products and smaller amounts.  A think "Select" cut of sirloin is not going to be mistaken for a prime cut of ribeye.  And a tasteless small farmed tiliapia filet is not going to be confused with decent wild trout.  Here in Mexico (we live in Puerto Vallarta for part of the year) we get the most amazing shrimp (extra large will cost us about $6(US) a pound.  You taste these shrimp and you will quickly realize that the quality of shrimp you get in many places (including most cruise ships) is not very good.  It is the same with scallops which vary greatly in quality.  Cruise lines primarily buy tasteless farmed seafood and serve portions not big enough for most baby cats.

 

Hank

Not sure if you even meant to quote me as I 100% agree with this.  There’s only so much Gordon Ramsey can do with a can of spam and a buck for additional ingredients 

[Keys Kathy]

31 minutes ago, BPCW said:

I’m glad I wasn’t crazy and others had similar experiences.  My wife and I joked to each other several times during the cruise “did we accidentally get on a NCL ship?”, haha.  
 

I am not sure why there are so many Celebrity defenders or doom and gloomers in this thread (many who haven’t experienced these changes yet). Many of us are just trying to give people honest assessments of our real experience onboard.  Like I said in my long winded review, I had a good time and these complaints didn’t severely detract from my enjoyment outside of some missed evening activities due to super long MDR dinners and some wait time annoyances. I would book X again in a heartbeat. But I’m going to shop around again and test the waters (really haven’t done so in 6 years) because I didn’t see the value of paying more for sub-par “typical” Celebrity service that I have come to expect from the premium we are paying and our other 5 previous Celebrity cruises. 

 

My goal was to let people know that if you haven’t been on X in a while, you will likely notice the changes (at least on the smaller ships in non-suites) and to be prepared to lower expectations so you aren’t disappointed on your trip. It’s certainly not to talk people out of booking because it was still a great 8 nights.  But the common complaints about poor service, not enough crew, lower food quality, nickel and diming, etc that I read here before our trip almost 100% was reflected on our 8 nights even though I went into it thinking “these message board people are probably a lot pickier than me” - I was wrong, they were right. 

Nice to know I am not loosing my mind. We ended up dining in OV 3 times, twice because we couldn't get seated with Select in under an hour and a half.

I was depressed after purchasing a FC. The only hope there is that they will change things before my "6 months" is up, but I am not counting on it, nor are the friends we traveled with. 

 

We are looking at Yacht Club on MSC. I would rather be in their interior cabin in Yacht Club than a veranda on X. 

 

I have to say, the MSC shows are amazing and they treat you like Royalty, not a celebrity, in Yacht Club. I have to erase that before everyone goes there. 🙂

 

Drop off your bags at a special place, they take you right to the lounge, your luggage is in your room NOW, they give you anything you want. They will GET HOT FRESH PIZZA for you. 

Please disregard this before THEIR prices to up because of my big mouth!

[Keys Kathy]

1 minute ago, NutsAboutGolf said:

Not sure if you even meant to quote me as I 100% agree with this.  There’s only so much Gordon Ramsey can do with a can of spam and a buck for additional ingredients 

LOL! We had spam mac & cheese for dinner tonight with a nice green salad! Of course it was 25% less sodium.

[Happy Cruiser 6143]

7 minutes ago, Keys Kathy said:

We are looking at Yacht Club on MSC. I would rather be in their interior cabin in Yacht Club than a veranda on X. 

 

I have to say, the MSC shows are amazing and they treat you like Royalty, not a celebrity, in Yacht Club. I have to erase that before everyone goes there. 🙂

 

Drop off your bags at a special place, they take you right to the lounge, your luggage is in your room NOW, they give you anything you want. They will GET HOT FRESH PIZZA for you. 

Please disregard this before THEIR prices to up because of my big mouth!

 

Kathy, that ship has sailed, so to speak.  YC prices have drastically increased.  I haven't sailed with them since the pandemic, but I'm not liking the pricing I'm seeing.  And their food and service in the YC was never as good as Celebrity's used to be.

 

And I agree with your comment re farmed seafood--yuck!  I never order that stuff on the ship.

[NMTraveller]

8 hours ago, Hlitner said:

This is an issue that we have spoken about for many years (not just in terms of HAL).  DW and I have spent far more than 1200 days on various cruise ships and have always struggled with the real worth of a suite.  Although we can afford a suite, we traditionally opted for a normal balcony cabin.  Why?  I once calculated that we spent no more than 3 waking hours, a day, in our cabin.  And about half that time was simply showering and getting dressed.  The first time we booked a large suite (it was a terrific deal) was on the old Prinsendam and the suite was large, the bathroom was actually 2 rooms, and it all looked good.  But during that cruise (over 50 days) we hardly ever used the large sofa, never dined in our suite (we prefer to share dinner tables with others for socialization).  On HAL, there was nothing special that came with that Signature Suite...no special dining,  no special lounge,,,,no special anything.  The extra money for that suite simply bought us more cabin space that we only partially used 2-3 hour a day.

 

But times have changed on some ships/lines.  On MSC we alwasy book a Deluxe Yacht Club Suite.  That gets us access to a special dedicated secton of the ship which includes its own dining room. pool deck, lido buffet, and beautiful expansive lounge.  There are also other benefits such as butlers, reserved seating at the main shows, unlimited premium drinks, unlimited Internet, electronic elevator priority, Butler escorts off the ship bypassing lines, etc.  Having the suite is not very meaningful to us, but all the associated perks are fantastic and essentially gives us a "luxury ship within a ship."

 

Our attitude about suites has changed on some ships.  For example, when on the Grand or Royal Class ships of Princess we often book the lowest category mini-suite!  Why?  Because the regular balcony cabins do not even have 2 chairs!  The mini suite at least gives us a place to sit :).  

 

That brings us to Celebrity and their Retreat Suites.  We have absolutely no desire to be in an Infinity Balcony cabin (which is not even a real balcony) but still prefer a real balcony.  We also like the perks that come with a Retreat Suite.  But when we do a simple value analysis, it makes absolutely zero sense to book even a basic Sky Suite.  Celebrity has simply priced the Retreat Suites at such a high price point, that they are not only a terrible value, but they are not even competitive with several luxury cruise lines.  For example, we can cruise on some Seabourn Voyages for less than $500 per person day!  With Seabourn that includes everything except shore excursions.  Seabourn is a true luxury line (in every way).  We could also book a suite in MSC's Yacht Club for less than $400 per person day!  That price is also all-inclusive except for tips (covered by the OBC given by our cruise agency).  

 

We are not "piling on" but simply saying that there are many other cruise lines (both mass market and luxury) that offer a far better overall value than is to be found by booking even the lowest priced Retreat Suites.  

 

Hank

Hank,

 

As always a very informative post.   You are one of my favorite posters on this board and a multitude of others.

 

My main issue was with the poster claiming that "The fraction of the time I spent in non-suite public areas on my cruise was probably over 90%."  I do not think that this is mathematically plausible unless they were sleeping on the pool deck, sick bay, or in another non-suite plus going through the Luminae drive through.  I am rolling around laughing at this claim.  I suppose that they meant some other more reasonable number.

 

My secondary issue is with suite posters claiming that their experience in non-suite venues is indicative of other non-suite cruisers.  They go to the Martini Bar and as soon as they pull out their room key the bartender and servers notice that they are suite guests and give them appropriate service.  The same for the theater and other venues where a room card is required.  My point is that a suite guest saying that their service in the Martini Bar, theater, etc.,etc.  was great is totally irrelevant to non-suite cruisers.

 

Also people staying in suites "reviewing" the non-suite areas are missing about 80% of the non-suite cruise experience.

 

How was room service in the non-suites?

How was cleaning service in the non-suites?

How was the MDR on multiple nights?

How was the OVC?

How was the pool bar service?

How was disembarkation at the ports.

The list goes on and on.

 

The only thing that I can think of that is more ridiculous and laugh worthy than a suite guest reviewing the non -suite areas would be a non-suite guest reviewing the suite areas.  Just does not make much sense. 🙂 🙂🙂🙂 

 

Rant over.

 

 

Edited February 15, 2023 by NMTraveller

[letsgogogo]

On 2/11/2023 at 7:25 PM, buckeye8810 said:

All in all, there’s no reason to pay premium prices for Celebrity anymore, because it’s no longer a premium brand. With the changes they’ve made, it’s not any different than NCL… but there’s no chance I would pay current prices. We felt ripped off, considering when we booked this cruise we were expecting the level of service from years past.

Sorry to break it to you, but NCL these days won’t be like you remember. The global labor shortage, especially in service industries, is not settling down and not anytime soon. Answer this the fact that all cruise lines are recruiting from similar countries abroad, many of which still have delays and restrictions in providing work authorization abroad. No doubt there have been down grades to the level of service and amenities provided on Celebrity. But it’s not that I feel like NCL and celebrity are the same should you cruise on NCL. Take whatever you recall about NCL and downgrade it the same percentage. They are both decidedly worse, but they are still not the same.

 

I was on summit in October on a ship that was beyond packed. Yes, the staff were somewhat overstretched. But it was by no means bad. In fact, it was actually pretty good considering the circumstances. Your experience may also be just what happened on your particular sailing. 

[RichYak]

6 minutes ago, NMTraveller said:

Rant over.

With all due respect, I think you are grossly overestimating the power of a “suite guest” sea pass card. It gets one access to the Retreat Lounge, Sundeck, and not much else. TBH, you just sound petty at this point. 

[ILgirl]

On 2/12/2023 at 6:05 PM, weregoingcruising said:

The older Celebrity ships are staffed with a high percentage of first contract crew members. There just learning their duties.

I’m not sure this is the case.  On my Millenium cruise last week I had the best cabin steward I have ever had in 15 Celebrity cruises.  He was very experienced.  He told me that when he leaves the Millenium his next post will be on the Summit as he prefers M class ships and always requests to work on them.

[NMTraveller]

10 minutes ago, RichYak said:

With all due respect, I think you are grossly overestimating the power of a “suite guest” sea pass card. It gets one access to the Retreat Lounge, Sundeck, and not much else. TBH, you just sound petty at this point. 

It is all data science.  The room cards are coded and the servers and bartenders know whom is most likely to give the largest additional tips.  Service is rendered accordingly.

 

When you roll up to a casino in Las Vegas they know whom the big spenders are before they come in through the door.

 

 

 

Edited February 15, 2023 by NMTraveller

[markeb]

11 minutes ago, NMTraveller said:

The only thing that I can think of that is more ridiculous and laugh worthy than a suite guest reviewing the non -suite areas would be a non-suite guest reviewing the suite areas.  Just does not make much sense.

 

I think you should try this and then people might take you seriously. 

 

There are roughly two nights on a 7-day cruise where there's any priority in the theater. And it's way upstairs.

 

The Equinox (where Rick was cruising) does not have a separate retreat area. You would spend 90% of your non-sleeping time outside the retreat. The Retreat lounge is nice, but it's going to get boring in a hurry. We've always spent more time at the WCB or one of the other bars. And there's live entertainment outside the Retreat. Rarely inside.

 

There is priority disembarkation, but not at all ports, and it may or may not matter. The primary advantage is hanging around in the Retreat lounge on the last morning if you have a late flight. They won't rush you before all clear.

 

The Equinox doesn't have a Retreat pool, or even a hot tub. It has a "hot" sunny deck, and it "may" have better bar service, but the bar is two flights down so it takes just as long to get a drink as it does in the Solarium.

 

One of primary draws to the Retreat is Luminae, so no, I can't tell you about the MDR. Nor likely can anyone staying in Aqua. I'll give you that one.

2 minutes ago, NMTraveller said:

It is all data science.  The room cards are coded and the servers and bartenders know whom is most likely to give the largest additional tips.  Service is rendered accordingly.

 

When you roll up to a casino in Las Vegas they know whom the big spenders are before they come in through the door.

 

You really have never done this on a ship, have you? Yeah, it's data science, but they remember who tipped them, not what color their card was. If they even have time for that. And honestly, despite all the tipping threads around here, I've rarely seen anyone slip extra to the bartenders. I know it happens, and I've done it on rare occasions, but the ship is cash free, and they're already getting the tip (20%) I would have given them anyway. 

11 minutes ago, RichYak said:

TBH, you just sound petty at this point. 

Completely agree. Ignore button used.

[NMTraveller]

7 minutes ago, markeb said:

You really have never done this on a ship, have you? Yeah, it's data science, but they remember who tipped them, not what color their card was. If they even have time for that. And honestly, despite all the tipping threads around here, I've rarely seen anyone slip extra to the bartenders. I know it happens, and I've done it on rare occasions, but the ship is cash free, and they're already getting the tip (20%) I would have given them anyway. 

Completely agree. Ignore button used.

LOL.  Wrong again.  Yes I have done this on a ship.  Yes my drink is over the allowance,  I am given a piece of paper,  and then I add in the additional tip.

 

[morfred]

This is not Vegas. We sail mostly suites and I can honestly say that I have never noticed special treatment. I have never sailed in a Penthouse/Royal but I find your attitude about special treatment to just be wrong. 

[SusieAV8R]

3 minutes ago, NMTraveller said:

LOL.  Wrong again.  Yes I have done this on a ship.  Yes my drink is over the allowance,  I am given a piece of paper,  and then I add in the additional tip.

 

DH and I have tipped a dood bartender with the cash we bring on board for years; and as recent as our January cruise:) 

[SusieAV8R]

1 minute ago, SusieAV8R said:

DH and I have tipped a dood bartender with the cash we bring on board for years; and as recent as our January cruise:) 

good