The Real Scoop on Dressing Down

[2Oldpeopleinlove]

Honestly, I don’t understand the drive toward minimalism by so many. Our first cruise was on NCL. Sitting in their most luxe restaurant with guys in ball caps, tshirts and cargo pants drove us quickly to Cunard. We’re not going back, and an important factor in that decision is the atmosphere based partly on fellow passengers’ dress. 
 

It’s certainly not up to me how someone else dresses, but I just don’t understand the point of refusing to dress in accordance with the lovely surroundings. 
 

*end of rant. Thanks for listening.*
 

 

[bitob]

1 hour ago, ballroom-cruisers said:

 

There word 'casual' is not in the dress code, so why is it brought back so many times in posts?

Whatever it is called it is not formal

Formal is easy

i think most folks want to comply — there will always be some exceptions 

it’s easier to comply when the rules are crystal clear. I don’t think they are 

 

[NE John]

3 minutes ago, bitob said:

Whatever it is called it is not formal

Formal is easy

i think most folks want to comply — there will always be some exceptions 

it’s easier to comply when the rules are crystal clear. I don’t think they are 

 

And less than crystal clear rules make it harder for staff to enforce the dress code guidelines so that leads to too much variation in dress for both men and women. 
A dress code should have minimal variation. 

[ballroom-cruisers]

What's so difficult understanding the phrase 'smart attire'?

[bitob]

8 minutes ago, ballroom-cruisers said:

What's so difficult understanding the phrase 'smart attire'?

Open to interpretation

what you think as “smart” I may not think is smart

 

very fungible. Not universally understood the same way by everyone 

[Poole Boy]

6 minutes ago, ballroom-cruisers said:

What's so difficult understanding the phrase 'smart attire'?

the problem with the generic "Smart Attire" is it is open to interpretation, some one may believe $500 jeans and a expensive brand of Polo shirt is smart attire, others will have the opposite view. Who is right and how do Cunard police and enforce it.

 

in the days of the QE2 it was a lot easier, dress code was Formal ( black tie) or semi Formal (Suit and tie), no vagaries like casual or smart, easy to enforce, no tie =  no entry to the MDR, simpler times.

[bitob]

I just googled “smart attire”

 

try it

 

 

many interpretations

[Windsurfboy]

No need to Google it just read the Cunard web site.

 

For men it's a dress shirt, ie a collared long sleeved shirt and trousers , no jeans

 

Can't get any simpler.

 

Some may say it too casual,  but that is a different question

[NE John]

From the US Cunard site. There’s a ton of ambiguity in this paragraph. 

Evenings on board a Cunard Queen exude a sense of occasion, but they’re also as relaxed as you want them to be. There’s no need to dress to the nines each night if you don’t want to, and you’ll find many areas on board where casual dress is welcome.

Then it shows this picture on the next page:

 

Really??!

We gladly comply but a new passenger can’t get much guidance here. BTW, we don’t look like these models. 

[PORT ROYAL]

5 minutes ago, bitob said:

I just googled “smart attire”

 

try it

 

 

many interpretations

In addition to this, there are many pax with their own individual variants of their interpretations of a multitude of dictionary interpretations.

A minefield which will never be solved.

Best to revert back to the days of simple dress codes

1. Jacket/Blazer, with/without tie, trousers (Casual/Relaxed)

2. Suit with tie (Semi-Formal)

3 Tux (Formal)

Or Formal every evening.

Easy to remember and enforce.

 

 

[Pushpit]

1 hour ago, bitob said:

many interpretations

Yes, but fortunately Cunard have given us a clear interpretation, plus a test:

 

 "Smart attire simply means a dress shirt and trousers, skirt and a top, or a cocktail dress. Essentially, choose something along the same vein as you’d wear to a stylish restaurant or the theatre on a special occasion."

 

I actually think it is telling that a well used phrase - smart casual - is not used. That would have been a decision made somewhere down the line, I feel and the point for intercept here is that "smart casual" may not work at a stylish restaurant as clearly as "smart attire". But regardless, there is a point in giving emphasis to Cunard's exact words, for the purpose of accuracy. One can add an interpretation about this (so personally I don't think jeans = trousers, for example) but it's probably important to be clear that it is our own interpretation.

[Windsurfboy]

1 hour ago, PORT ROYAL said:

In addition to this, there are many pax with their own individual variants of their interpretations of a multitude of dictionary interpretations.

A minefield which will never be solved.

Best to revert back to the days of simple dress codes

1. Jacket/Blazer, with/without tie, trousers (Casual/Relaxed)

2. Suit with tie (Semi-Formal)

3 Tux (Formal)

Or Formal every evening.

Easy to remember and enforce.

 

 

 

That is not the Cunard dress code.

 

Advocating ones own dress code is what causes confusion.

 

Cunards dress code for non formal nights is simple. A dress shirt , that is collared long sleeved shirt therefore no polo shirts, and trousers,  no jeans .

 

It is very simple not a minefield . No need for dictionary or Google,  just read Cunard definition. 

Edited June 1, 2023 by Windsurfboy

[D&N]

1 hour ago, NE John said:

BTW, we don’t look like these models. 

Perhaps 25 years ago, but my wife has always been blonde, my hair has been much shorter than that for over 40 years, and I've always been clean shaven. 🤣

[ballroom-cruisers]

18 minutes ago, D&N said:

Perhaps 25 years ago, but my wife has always been blonde, my hair has been much shorter than that for over 40 years, and I've always been clean shaven. 🤣

 

I thought most of us look just as good as those models in the picture - at least in our own eyes!

[Windsurfboy]

Cunard dress code

 

"Smart attire simply means a dress shirt and trousers".

 

simple

[NE John]

3 minutes ago, Windsurfboy said:

Cunard dress code

 

"Smart attire simply means a dress shirt and trousers".

 

simple

You are correct, that definition is simple and very clear. The rest of Cunard’s excess wordiness and pictures on the site make it “unsimple” to newbies. 

[PORT ROYAL]

42 minutes ago, Windsurfboy said:

 

1. That is not the Cunard dress code.

 

2. Advocating ones own dress code is what causes confusion.

 

1. One did not say it was.

2. If one chooses to dress Formally every evening, except the first night, this is not confusing.

[exlondoner]

9 hours ago, Windsurfboy said:

Cunard dress code

 

"Smart attire simply means a dress shirt and trousers".

 

simple

Is dress shirt simple? In the UK, the only place I have ever seen that expression is on Cunard. Is it an American thing?

[Pushpit]

3 hours ago, exlondoner said:

Is dress shirt simple? In the UK, the only place I have ever seen that expression is on Cunard. Is it an American thing?

I think it's a reasonably well known phrase in the UK, I would certainly use it. It separates certain sorts of other shirts, such as polo shirts, t-shirts, sports shirt.

 

If you go to the Marks and Spencer website, which must still be one of the biggest retailers in this space, "dress shirt" is both a named section in the Men's Shirt area, as well as a Style type that can be selected in the Shirt Search area. This is an extract me using Dress Shirt as a search, see tag on the top line. It's interesting what it throws up (ignore the shorts!) which goes from Dinner Jacket shirts to much more relaxed shirt types, but none are polo or t-shirts. 23 shirts in all.

 

 

[exlondoner]

10 minutes ago, Pushpit said:

I think it's a reasonably well known phrase in the UK, I would certainly use it. It separates certain sorts of other shirts, such as polo shirts, t-shirts, sports shirt.

 

If you go to the Marks and Spencer website, which must still be one of the biggest retailers in this space, "dress shirt" is both a named section in the Men's Shirt area, as well as a Style type that can be selected in the Shirt Search area. This is an extract me using Dress Shirt as a search, see tag on the top line. It's interesting what it throws up (ignore the shorts!) which goes from Dinner Jacket shirts to much more relaxed shirt types, but none are polo or t-shirts. 23 shirts in all.

 

 

So what do you call a shirt you wear with a Dinner Jacket? That’s what I think of when I hear the term.

[Windsurfboy]

13 hours ago, PORT ROYAL said:

1. One did not say it was.

2. If one chooses to dress Formally every evening, except the first night, this is not confusing.

 

You are perfectly entitled to wear formal gear every night you choose, just as anyone else is entitled to wear just a well tailored dress shirt and trousers on smart nights. 

 

As an keen dresser I hope when you wear formal you are amongst the 10% who tie their own bow tie , rather than a ready made. I am always surprised after all the fuss that is made about dressing up on Cunard formal nights , that the vast majority,  90% of men don't wear proper bow ties. A self tied one adds to the character.

[Victoria2]

I attribute the term ' dress' to a formal shirt. The term 'dress shirt' does not stand out on the m& s website and I’ve never noticed it used and I’m sure I won’t be the only one who would not know it’s just a regular long sleeved/ business shirt if I had not seen it described on this board.

So yes, a potentially confusing term. 🙂

[PORT ROYAL]

48 minutes ago, Windsurfboy said:

 

You are perfectly entitled to wear formal gear every night you choose, just as anyone else is entitled to wear just a well tailored dress shirt and trousers on smart nights. 

 

As an keen dresser I hope when you wear formal you are amongst the 10% who tie their own bow tie , rather than a ready made. I am always surprised after all the fuss that is made about dressing up on Cunard formal nights , that the vast majority,  90% of men don't wear proper bow ties. A self tied one adds to the character.

Agree on the self tie (4 off), but not forgetting the selection of Cufflinks (some with matching studs), Formal shoes (3 pairs - one for each Tux) and Formal dress watches.  All add to the character.

[North West Newbie]

26 minutes ago, PORT ROYAL said:

Agree on the self tie (4 off), but not forgetting the selection of Cufflinks (some with matching studs), Formal shoes (3 pairs - one for each Tux) and Formal dress watches.  All add to the character.

 

Don't forget the detachable collars. 😏

[PORT ROYAL]

22 minutes ago, North West Newbie said:

 

Don't forget the detachable collars. 😏

😊 For one that’s White Tie…..