Do not sail list

[BlerkOne]

2 minutes ago, Eli_6 said:

fraud, get together everything you can from your cc company involving the charge back and specifically anything that shows the charge back didn't come from you and then present all the information to Carnival's customer service to either get your money back or go on the cruise. 

 

 

The fraud was "about 7 years ago" and wasn't with a credit card, but Zelle, which I would never use. I think the statute of limitations might be a factor. That Zelle didn't exist before June 2017 might also be a factor.

[TiredTrucker]

9 minutes ago, staceyglow said:

Blast who? Carnival?  

 

Yes, if OP feels like no one is listening to them that is sadly one of the few ways to make them notice you these days.  Some companies are more responsive to this tactic than others, Carnival I feel rather less so.  Obviously if they have made it beyond the "call center" and have a knowledgeable point of contact this isn't necessary.  Honestly, I found OP's experience as presented somewhat hard to follow. 

[Eli_6]

Just now, BlerkOne said:

The fraud was "about 7 years ago" and wasn't with a credit card, but Zelle, which I would never use. I think the statute of limitations might be a factor. That Zelle didn't exist before June 2017 might also be a factor.

If the claim is outside of the SOL, then Carnival has no right to hold on to his refund.

As for Zelle, then contact Zelle or his bank. I have to go through my bank to use Zelle so that would be even more support than a cc company.  When I had my fraud situation, my bank was the only entity that actually gave me back some money. I was up a creek with cc companies because I had authorized the charges...even though I ultimately never received the services the charges were for. 

[ARcruisin2]

1 minute ago, Eli_6 said:

If the claim is outside of the SOL, then Carnival has no right to hold on to his refund.

as note: they are not looking for a refund - they cruised, enjoyed themselves and were trying to book another cruise, when all this from 7yrs ago came to light. 

[Eli_6]

1 minute ago, ARcruisin2 said:

as note: they are not looking for a refund - they cruised, enjoyed themselves and were trying to book another cruise, when all this from 7yrs ago came to light. 

CCL is refusing to REFUND his deposit after canceling his cruise. Hence, they are holding on to his REFUND. 

 

If the SOL has passed on the claim, they have no right to do this because they have no claim even if they believed he was the fraudster.  

Edited January 16 by Eli_6

[BIGBANG22]

Im sorry! There are so many moving parts... But you all def understand...

 

@Eli_6 the new cruise I booked is from Oct 2023. I believe it should be within statue of limitation. But I am going to followup on that tomorrow. My brain is fried after this mess!! I will figure that part out as that cruise doesn't sail until Aug 2024

[BlerkOne]

6 minutes ago, Eli_6 said:

If the claim is outside of the SOL, then Carnival has no right to hold on to his refund.

As for Zelle, then contact Zelle or his bank. I have to go through my bank to use Zelle so that would be even more support than a cc company.  When I had my fraud situation, my bank was the only entity that actually gave me back some money. I was up a creek with cc companies because I had authorized the charges...even though I ultimately never received the services the charges were for. 

Zelle is owned by a group of large banks.

 

The person apparently went on the cruise years ago, so received what they paid for. It is Carnival who is out the money.

[staceyglow]

16 minutes ago, TiredTrucker said:

 

Yes, if OP feels like no one is listening to them that is sadly one of the few ways to make them notice you these days.  Some companies are more responsive to this tactic than others, Carnival I feel rather less so.  Obviously if they have made it beyond the "call center" and have a knowledgeable point of contact this isn't necessary.  Honestly, I found OP's experience as presented somewhat hard to follow. 

 

 

 

 

I don't think most people (even if they can follow the story) are going to care.

Edited January 16 by staceyglow

[staceyglow]

Just now, staceyglow said:

 

 

[BIGBANG22]

4 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

Zelle is owned by a group of large banks.

 

The person apparently went on the cruise years ago, so received what they paid for. It is Carnival who is out the money.

Yes and I understand why they are doing what they are doing. What i don't understand is why i was never notified! This would have been alot easier for to remedy when it 1st happened. I would have never known about this issue had i not booked another cruise! But yes, I undersand why carnival did it... But i was defrauded too! 

Edited January 16 by BIGBANG22
error

[Haljo1935]

57 minutes ago, BIGBANG22 said:

...This has not been easy and even more difficult since the booking # was archived with carnival 

Very unfortunate situation - sorry you're stuck in it.

I'm confused as to why the booking number would be archived. We're able to see past cruises from many years ago. While you may not have the booking number, the cruise should still show.

[Eli_6]

4 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

Zelle is owned by a group of large banks.

 

The person apparently went on the cruise years ago, so received what they paid for. It is Carnival who is out the money.

I understand that, but OP said they are holding on to his deposit and refusing to give it back to him on the canceled cruise.  Carnival has no right to do that because any claim CCL could have brought against him for the charge back would be outside of the SOL.  So, they can cancel his cruise but they need to give him his money back for the cruise they are canceling. If your claim for fraud is outside of the SOL it is NO CLAIM AT ALL.  So, CCL may have been out money years ago but by not asserting their rights and pursuing their claim they lost any right to pursue him for that money or hold on to his money he paid for a different deposit on a cruise.  One reason statutes of limitation are put in place is to prevent this EXACT sort of situation where so much time has passed that no one can now get documents or evidence or track down the real offending party. 

 

 

[BlerkOne]

16 minutes ago, Eli_6 said:

If the claim is outside of the SOL, then Carnival has no right to hold on to his refund.
 

I think they might be able to get the deposit back, but would still be on the do not sail list until someone makes Carnival whole. And no guarantees that would get them off the list.

[Eli_6]

1 minute ago, BlerkOne said:

I think they might be able to get the deposit back, but would still be on the do not sail list until someone makes Carnival whole. And no guarantees that would get them off the list.

Yes, I agree. Or prove to CCL's satisfaction that he wasn't the fraudfeasor.

 

But if he gets his entire deposit back for all the rooms, he can theoretically book another cruise on another line.

[BIGBANG22]

7 minutes ago, Haljo1935 said:

Very unfortunate situation - sorry you're stuck in it.

I'm confused as to why the booking number would be archived. We're able to see past cruises from many years ago. While you may not have the booking number, the cruise should still show.

Yes it shows online app, but it doesn't give me any details. Carnival rep today have used that term "archived" they can't pull it up cause of how old it is. I was told to call accounting or collections and that is when i found the information about the chargback fraud

[BIGBANG22]

10 minutes ago, Eli_6 said:

I understand that, but OP said they are holding on to his deposit and refusing to give it back to him on the canceled cruise.  Carnival has no right to do that because any claim CCL could have brought against him for the charge back would be outside of the SOL.  So, they can cancel his cruise but they need to give him his money back for the cruise they are canceling. If your claim for fraud is outside of the SOL it is NO CLAIM AT ALL.  So, CCL may have been out money years ago but by not asserting their rights and pursuing their claim they lost any right to pursue him for that money or hold on to his money he paid for a different deposit on a cruise.  One reason statutes of limitation are put in place is to prevent this EXACT sort of situation where so much time has passed that no one can now get documents or evidence or track down the real offending party. 

 

 

Thank you! I will see how that works. Especially since they canceled my booking and kept my children! Im going to call them again tomorrow and see if i can talk to a manager 

[Eli_6]

8 minutes ago, BIGBANG22 said:

Thank you! I will see how that works. Especially since they canceled my booking and kept my children! Im going to call them again tomorrow and see if i can talk to a manager 

I would get together all of your info and possibly do a signed, notarized affidavit and submit your info to carnival guest care rather than messing around with calling them.

[FTLCruiseGal]

37 minutes ago, BIGBANG22 said:

Yes and I understand why they are doing what they are doing. What i don't understand is why i was never notified! This would have been alot easier for to remedy when it 1st happened. I would have never known about this issue had i not booked another cruise! But yes, I undersand why carnival did it... But i was defrauded too! 

Most likely because you used a travel agent.  Carnival will have no contact with you if you use a TA — they probably notified them.

[Drazil65]

It definitely sucks especially being caught off guard with no notice that this had happened.  Unfortunately, it is kind of like when someone steals your identity or uses your credit card and charges a whole bunch of items, you are left holding the bag and trying to fix it.  No one really helps you and it can take months to get everything back to good. 

 

Not fair for sure, this person frauded you and CCL and as already mentioned, they probably have done this more than once.   CCL lost out and I think they will only be looking to be made whole at this point (I doubt they care how or who as they have already settled it on their end as far as they are concerned with the chargeback and their reaction to it).  If your brother referred you and a friend, do they know anything about where this person may be if you need to contact?  Although, I agree probably will cost you much more than the $2600 to pursue.  

 

I do not use a TA or a PVP, I handle everything when it comes to travel myself (but we travel often and I am very comfortable booking all kinds of travel) and I agree always use a CC for transactions. 

 

Wondering if this collection showed at all on your credit report at some point?  Being that its been several years and you were connected to collections just wondering if they reported it and maybe it still showed on report.  A good reason to regularly check your credit report for things like this, cant help now of course.  Good luck, I think your options are obvious and may not seem fair but you did take the cruise (and paid) but you did not pay CCL directly so the onus ends up on you since you ultimately received the goods.   Hopefully you can get the deposit back on this most recent cruise.

Edited January 17 by Drazil65

[BIGBANG22]

52 minutes ago, Drazil65 said:

It definitely sucks especially being caught off guard with no notice that this had happened.  Unfortunately, it is kind of like when someone steals your identity or uses your credit card and charges a whole bunch of items, you are left holding the bag and trying to fix it.  No one really helps you and it can take months to get everything back to good. 

 

Not fair for sure, this person frauded you and CCL and as already mentioned, they probably have done this more than once.   CCL lost out and I think they will only be looking to be made whole at this point (I doubt they care how or who as they have already settled it on their end as far as they are concerned with the chargeback and their reaction to it).  If your brother referred you and a friend, do they know anything about where this person may be if you need to contact?  Although, I agree probably will cost you much more than the $2600 to pursue.  

 

I do not use a TA or a PVP, I handle everything when it comes to travel myself (but we travel often and I am very comfortable booking all kinds of travel) and I agree always use a CC for transactions. 

 

Wondering if this collection showed at all on your credit report at some point?  Being that its been several years and you were connected to collections just wondering if they reported it and maybe it still showed on report.  A good reason to regularly check your credit report for things like this, cant help now of course.  Good luck, I think your options are obvious and may not seem fair but you did take the cruise (and paid) but you did not pay CCL directly so the onus ends up on you since you ultimately received the goods.   Hopefully you can get the deposit back on this most recent cruise.

No, not on credit report! Literally no notice! If i had rcvd notice, i may have been able to dispute the zelle! I'm really not sure... But yea, i will work on booking everything direct! This is really scary situation and i feel helpless... My brother says he didn't know the "agent" either. It was a referral from his friend. His friend brag about the deal and so he tried the agent out. in fact, he Used him multiple times he said. (different cruise lines) so i have my brother and his friend calling the cruise lines tomorrow to make sure they haven't been scammed.  For me, i  have a text from the agent in 2018 ( i sailed dec 2017) asking if knew anyone that wanted to cruise cause he needed to meet a quota for a reward!  & I too referred people over to him that booked. I feel horrible this is happening and can't even imagine how many people he has scammed. I am certain the people i referred, referred others.. the difficulty is, none of my immediate family have traveled or even been in contact with the agent since covid... so yea! my heart drops every time i think about this!

Edited January 17 by BIGBANG22
error

[BlerkOne]

4 minutes ago, BIGBANG22 said:

 referral from his friend. His friend brag about the deal and so he tried the agent out. in fact, he 

This is what I was suspecting when I was thinking sketchy. Reminds me of a scammer in England years ago that was giving amazing deals until he wasn't and left a lot of people with no cruises or deposits. They did catch up to him, but he didn't have sufficient assets to pay everyone back.

 

Someone offering great deals is a red flag.

 

[BIGBANG22]

7 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

This is what I was suspecting when I was thinking sketchy. Reminds me of a scammer in England years ago that was giving amazing deals until he wasn't and left a lot of people with no cruises or deposits. They did catch up to him, but he didn't have sufficient assets to pay everyone back.

 

Someone offering great deals is a red flag.

 

I have never heard of anything like this! I booked a flight with a travel agent maybe 10 years ago with my family and the rate for the group booking was significally less than booking direct. so i booked. I think it was via united... but im not 100% sure. i guess if it seems to goo to be true, it probably is! 

But i always told you get a better rate with travel agent! So i have never really tried to book anything direct. 

[ZoeyVictoria]

I don’t understand how or why the OP is even involved. If the payment was made by the TA after receiving the money through Zelle from the OP, the charge must have been made on the TA’s credit card. The TA is the one who did the chargeback.  Why would Carnival go after the person who took the cruise rather than the owner of the credit card who did the chargeback?

[Elaine5715]

1 minute ago, ZoeyVictoria said:

I don’t understand how or why the OP is even involved. If the payment was made by the TA after receiving the money through Zelle from the OP, the charge must have been made on the TA’s credit card. The TA is the one who did the chargeback.  Why would Carnival go after the person who took the cruise rather than the owner of the credit card who did the chargeback?

Does sound like some information is missing.

[BIGBANG22]

2 minutes ago, Elaine5715 said:

Does sound like some information is missing.

I am sure information is missing! but What i am starting to believe is "agent" that booked my trip was not an actually agent... It sounds like he was a scammer! I just don't exactly know how i was scammed yet.... i can only assume the card that was used was not his card or if it was he lied to carnival about something to get the chargeback! IDK...im still tryna figure it out