Holland america vs Princess Cruise lines

[BermudaBound2014]

3 hours ago, stevenr597 said:

You do make a point, but I stand by my classification of these lines.

There are the mass market cruise lines such as NCL, Carnival and RCCL.  

 

13 hours ago, stevenr597 said:

....  In the case of Holland vs Princess or Princess vs Holland, both are upscale cruise lines to be differentiated from mass market lines such as RCCL and Carnival.

 

Respectfully disagree. Marketing aside; how do you believe that HAL differentiates itself from RCCL, NCL, or Carnival?? Not trying to be argumentative, but I would enjoy a friendly discussion.  Please point me to some objective differences that put HAL in a class above?

 

I did three cruises in a row last year. Carnival Celebration and NCL Encore side to side in January,  followed up with Koningsdam in February. I feel like I have a pretty good comparison on what those three ships in particular offer post covid, since the passage of time wasn't a factor. I also sail RCL and Celebrity pretty frequently as I have zero brand loyalty. 

 

I found nothing on HAL that would make it more 'upscale' than Carnival (excel class) or NCL (away plus class).  I mention the ship classes because when making comparisons, class of ship matters.  Sure there are things each line does best, but overall, I don't believe that HAL offers anymore upscale experience than any of the mass market lines. Perhaps this was the case a decade ago, but not anymore. 

 

I'll try to provide objective examples where NCL and Carnival (excel class) provided a more 'upscale' product when compared to the Koningdsam based on my recent experience:

 

1) Both the Encore and Celebration blew away Koningsdam when it comes to entertainment options. In this category, HAL is simply miles behind. Not just the real production shows, I'm talking the arts/crafts, dancing lessons, active games, etc... Both Carnival and Encore had an entertainment crew front facing that had about a dozen 'playmakers'. Kdam has three. Three people just can't offer the same level of activities as an entire team. OH.... When Carnival's live musicians aren't putting on a production show, they offer different sets around the ship. The violin trio was in the same category as the classical sets on Kdam. Not the same obviously, but there were 6-7 music venues to choose from each night and my understanding is that HAL is scaling down to just two venues on most ships.

 

 

 

 

 

2) Carnival Serenity was significantly nicer than the cabanas on HAL. Both Adult only but serenity provided much nicer furniture, a pool, a Lunch buffet, etc... Just No comparison (and it's complimentary which is a huge bonus in my world). NCL has Vibe (pay like Cabanas) but again, nicer furniture, hot tubs, more comprehensive dining options.

 

 

 

 

3) Koningsdam's crows nest pales in comparison to Encores Observation room. While K'dam did have 2-3 items in the coffee area (cookie, brownie, etc..), the Encore had a much larger buffet with hot entries and tapas running all day. The furniture in observation room was also much higher quality. 

 

 

 

4) In terms of both food options and food availability, again K'dam is in the dust. Food is subjective so I won't discuss quality, but here are a few things that are concrete: The new food truck style outdoor dining on Celebration greatly reduces any lines in the lido and offers many more choices. And while this doesn't matter to me, lobster is still complimentary on Carnival during the gala evenings. The district brew house on NCL offers 21 beers on tap and several craft cocktail lounges with much more inventive drinks (I couldn't get a jalapeno Margarita on K'dam anywhere).  Lido hours are much more extensive and food in the evening is replaced along the way (on Kdam, when it was gone it was gone for the night). Here's a list of the 21 different dining menus  offered to give you a feel for what other lines are doing in terms of food options: : https://freestyletravelers.com/blog/carnival-celebration-restaurant-guide

 

 

 

 

5) For those of you that love HAL's promenade, the Away class has been very innovative in using this space. They call it the waterfront. Again, the furniture is super comfy. There are several bars on the waterfront (mojito bar is excellent and of course brewhouse with the 21 beers on tap). Outdoor service.  If you elect to eat at specialty restaurants, you can eat outside on the waterfront (I personally love this option and it doesn't exist on any HAL ship that I'm aware of). 

 

 

 

I could go on, but those are a few of the differences that immediately come to mind. I'm not saying that everything is roses on other lines. Each line has things they do best and HAL still offers some things that surpass the others. HAL still offers complimentary room service and other lines now charge a nominal fee. HAL's overall service was the best of the three hands down, no comparison. I suspect that HAL does much better with those that need physical assistance. HAL's entertainment includes lectures which are absent on Carnival/Ncl. Nothing on the other lines brought the energy of BBKings for dancing (but both did offer bands that were much better than what I experienced in rolling stones rock room and billboards).

 

 

Plenty of people are very loyal to the HAL product, and I respect that. Some have even tried other lines and found them not to their liking. But in order to put to put HAL in a class above Carnival or NCL I respectfully ask for specifics.  Other than service, I didn't experience anything on the K'dam that would make it more 'upscale' compared to all the other mainstream lines. Currently HAL is one of the least expensive choices for the seven day 'bus runs' so they aren't charging upscale pricing. 

 

Other than service, the one thing that HAL does best is offer long interesting itineraries at main stream pricing. In this area they hold a very solid niche in the market. For that reason alone, I will continue to sail HAL.

 

Oh: Both the carnival and ncl website worked flawlessly last year. So there's that.

 

 

 

Edited July 7 by BermudaBound2014

[jeh10641]

6 hours ago, Bobpell54 said:

Two differences we noticed after 22 cruises on HAL and 4 cruises on Grand class ships of Princess were the main Stage shows and the length of cruises in the Caribbean.

HAL's shows deteriorated since 2010 into repetitive and projected on the wall episodes versus various live artists on Princess.

There were many cruises on HAL spent sitting in FLL on the seventh day of a 14 day cruise wishing we were at a Caribbean island instead watching more food, people and fuel being loaded. Princess does offer an occasional true 2 week sojourn around the warm seas south of Florida.

We started on ships of 1900 sobs and have no desire to sail on the new behemoths being launched now.

Bob

 

Although we have many friends and family living in Florida, I will never book a 14-day cruise (or two back-to-back 7-day cruises) that has a day in Fort Lauderdale in the middle of a trip. Similarly, we will not book a cruise that includes one or more days at a private island. To me, those are Sea Days.

 

We are not beach sitters or thrill ride seekers. That is why HAL is our preferred cruise line.

 

I have heard good things about Princess (part of Carnival as is HAL). My parents did a couple of Princess cruises back in the "Love Boat" days and enjoyed them.

 

Jim

[jeh10641]

I have heard that HAL's World Stage productions are repetitive. They probably are but that is not necessarily a bad thing. I was on Anthem OTS in October for 15 nights.  We saw "We Will Rock You" once on that trip. It was excellent. Would I go see it again on another Anthem cruise? Absolutely! Apparently on our cruise, there were people who had seen it multiple times as there was a lot of audience participation that I did not "get".

 

We saw a British singing group called The Boulevard, twice. They sang music from the 50s and 60s. I would have gone a third or fourth time as well but they left after two shows. Thus, I repeat, repetition is not a bad thing.

 

Jim

[jeh10641]

Here is another way to define "mass market", numbers of cruisers per ship. HAL's largest ships hold 2660 (or so) people. For most of the "mass market" lines, that would be a small ship. Anthem OTS had 4,000 plus in October. Icon OTS holds around 6,500 to 7,000. That is "MASS" market. Even though its prices are "premium".

 

Jim

[Kay S]

Isn't there some sort of "official" definition for these things?  I agree that both Princess and HAL are mass market, but where is the line between them and "premium"?

[LAFFNVEGAS]

@BermudaBound2014 I agree with you 1000% Sadly HAL has become in the lower end of the Mass Market, only because we have so much time invested with HAL do we continue to return. It is not a bad product but it has continued to decline over the years where other cruise lines have improved their product. I think it has been closer to 2 decades since it was a premium cruise line.

I can honestly say with no hesitation that Norwegian Cruise line has been our favorite cruise line for several years. I know food is subjective but we just find the food on NCL to be so much better. On HAL evens most nights we are back in our stateroom by 8 or 8:30 on NCL we frequently do not get back to our stateroom till midnight or later. We end up bar hopping to go watch the various bands and shows. We have an early dinner and often enjoy dining outside on the Waterfront. We were recently on the Joy in Bermuda and loved dining outside in the evening. We have several favorite dining venues on NCL. Yes, we do continue to return to HAL but mainly because we are 5 star over 300 days and often I can get a better price with HAL if I book more than a year out with the HIA Plus. But if pricing was exactly the same I would go with NCL. I actually consider NCL to be a more premium cruise especially when sailing the Breakaway plus Class. We have sailed Bliss numerous times as well as Encore(they are sister ships much like Nieuw Statendam and Rotterdam). After our Westerdam cruise in 7 weeks we have two cruises coming up on the NCL Bliss one will be our first Trans Atlantic with a pre 3 night Land Tour in London that is combined with the cruise. This is something HAL does not really offer with the exception of Alaska. NCL is adding these to many of their itineraries and at a price that is not crazy high. We will be seeing many sights in the city of London as well as one day trip to Dover and seeing Stonehenge. We have 3 nights at Radisson Blue. The pricing for the land portion and all transfers are coming out the same as what HAL offers in Europe for hotel only.

We will most likely always return to HAL for one or two cruises a year but NCL for us is what we look at first.

[LAFFNVEGAS]

5 minutes ago, Kay S said:

Isn't there some sort of "official" definition for these things?  I agree that both Princess and HAL are mass market, but where is the line between them and "premium"?

To define the difference it use to be Pricing, Amenities, Service and Passenger to Crew ratio. But in this new world of cruising Post Covid and pricing as it currently is that has gone out the window.

You can find a Royal Caribbean Cruise for 7 days to be as expensive as a Seabourn or Crystal cruise depending on the itinerary.

[stevenr597]

2 hours ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

 

 

Respectfully disagree. Marketing aside; how do you believe that HAL differentiates itself from RCCL, NCL, or Carnival?? Not trying to be argumentative, but I would enjoy a friendly discussion.  Please point me to some objective differences that put HAL in a class above?

 

I did three cruises in a row last year. Carnival Celebration and NCL Encore side to side in January,  followed up with Koningsdam in February. I feel like I have a pretty good comparison on what those three ships in particular offer post covid, since the passage of time wasn't a factor. I also sail RCL and Celebrity pretty frequently as I have zero brand loyalty. 

 

I found nothing on HAL that would make it more 'upscale' than Carnival (excel class) or NCL (away plus class).  I mention the ship classes because when making comparisons, class of ship matters.  Sure there are things each line does best, but overall, I don't believe that HAL offers anymore upscale experience than any of the mass market lines. Perhaps this was the case a decade ago, but not anymore. 

 

I'll try to provide objective examples where NCL and Carnival (excel class) provided a more 'upscale' product when compared to the Koningdsam based on my recent experience:

 

1) Both the Encore and Celebration blew away Koningsdam when it comes to entertainment options. In this category, HAL is simply miles behind. Not just the real production shows, I'm talking the arts/crafts, dancing lessons, active games, etc... Both Carnival and Encore had an entertainment crew front facing that had about a dozen 'playmakers'. Kdam has three. Three people just can't offer the same level of activities as an entire team. OH.... When Carnival's live musicians aren't putting on a production show, they offer different sets around the ship. The violin trio was in the same category as the classical sets on Kdam. Not the same obviously, but there were 6-7 music venues to choose from each night and my understanding is that HAL is scaling down to just two venues on most ships.

 

 

 

 

 

2) Carnival Serenity was significantly nicer than the cabanas on HAL. Both Adult only but serenity provided much nicer furniture, a pool, a Lunch buffet, etc... Just No comparison (and it's complimentary which is a huge bonus in my world). NCL has Vibe (pay like Cabanas) but again, nicer furniture, hot tubs, more comprehensive dining options.

 

 

 

 

3) Koningsdam's crows nest pales in comparison to Encores Observation room. While K'dam did have 2-3 items in the coffee area (cookie, brownie, etc..), the Encore had a much larger buffet with hot entries and tapas running all day. The furniture in observation room was also much higher quality. 

 

 

 

4) In terms of both food options and food availability, again K'dam is in the dust. Food is subjective so I won't discuss quality, but here are a few things that are concrete: The new food truck style outdoor dining on Celebration greatly reduces any lines in the lido and offers many more choices. And while this doesn't matter to me, lobster is still complimentary on Carnival during the gala evenings. The district brew house on NCL offers 21 beers on tap and several craft cocktail lounges with much more inventive drinks (I couldn't get a jalapeno Margarita on K'dam anywhere).  Lido hours are much more extensive and food in the evening is replaced along the way (on Kdam, when it was gone it was gone for the night). Here's a list of the 21 different dining menus  offered to give you a feel for what other lines are doing in terms of food options: : https://freestyletravelers.com/blog/carnival-celebration-restaurant-guide

 

 

 

 

5) For those of you that love HAL's promenade, the Away class has been very innovative in using this space. They call it the waterfront. Again, the furniture is super comfy. There are several bars on the waterfront (mojito bar is excellent and of course brewhouse with the 21 beers on tap). Outdoor service.  If you elect to eat at specialty restaurants, you can eat outside on the waterfront (I personally love this option and it doesn't exist on any HAL ship that I'm aware of). 

 

 

 

I could go on, but those are a few of the differences that immediately come to mind. I'm not saying that everything is roses on other lines. Each line has things they do best and HAL still offers some things that surpass the others. HAL still offers complimentary room service and other lines now charge a nominal fee. HAL's overall service was the best of the three hands down, no comparison. I suspect that HAL does much better with those that need physical assistance. HAL's entertainment includes lectures which are absent on Carnival/Ncl. Nothing on the other lines brought the energy of BBKings for dancing (but both did offer bands that were much better than what I experienced in rolling stones rock room and billboards).

 

 

Plenty of people are very loyal to the HAL product, and I respect that. Some have even tried other lines and found them not to their liking. But in order to put to put HAL in a class above Carnival or NCL I respectfully ask for specifics.  Other than service, I didn't experience anything on the K'dam that would make it more 'upscale' compared to all the other mainstream lines. Currently HAL is one of the least expensive choices for the seven day 'bus runs' so they aren't charging upscale pricing. 

 

Other than service, the one thing that HAL does best is offer long interesting itineraries at main stream pricing. In this area they hold a very solid niche in the market. For that reason alone, I will continue to sail HAL.

 

Oh: Both the carnival and ncl website worked flawlessly last year. So there's that.

 

 

 

In no way does Carnival, NCR, and RCCL appeal to the same market as Princess, Celebrity and Holland America.

In the old days, when these lines were all independent.  a case could be made that lines like Carnival was trying to change their image and appeal to a more upscale ground.   Carnival Pride was such as ship.

But Carnival acquired Holland America and Princess, while RCCL acquired Celebrity and for a time Azamara.

By doing this they created separate niches and were able to avoid trying to be all things to all people, but concentrate on a select group of cruisers.  

My children literally grew up on Carnival.  We are “elite class” on RCCL and Carnival.  But Carnival is more of a mass market, budget conscious line.  There ships are generally more crowded, food is of a lesser quality, and more of a party ship.

Princess, H.A., and Celebrity try to cater to a more refined crowd.  There ships try to be less crowded, entertainment is better as well as food.  There is some debate that Princess and Celebrity are trying to appeal to a more younger, but affluent crowd.  But that is a subject for a different post. 

I never would say that one line is better or superior.  They are just different, catering to different groups. 

[BermudaBound2014]

6 hours ago, stevenr597 said:

Lines such as Holland America, Princess, Cunard, and Celebrity fall into this category.  Certainly one can use another term, but generally these lines are thought to be better than mass market, but  not at the level of a true premium.

 

 

16 hours ago, stevenr597 said:

....., both are upscale cruise lines to be differentiated from mass market lines such as RCCL and Carnival.  

 

So

58 minutes ago, stevenr597 said:

I

Princess, H.A., and Celebrity try to cater to a more refined crowd.  There ships try to be less crowded, entertainment is better as well as food. 

 

Still respectfully disagree.

 

You claimed that HAL is thought to be 'better' (your words not mine) and differentiated from mass market lines but I'm only seeing three examples you provided  of what makes HAL more upscale (refined crowds, less crowded, better entertainment and food).

 

Food is way too subjective (but again, lobster is still complimentary on Carnival lol). Personally, I didn't find HAL's food significantly better than any cruise line I've sailed but I have the palette of a toddler. 

 

You said that HAL tends to be less crowded. Some truth to that with HAL's smaller ships, but HAL's space ratio for the Pinnacle is not significantly lower. I would say that the K'dam 'felt' more crowded than either Carnival or NCL ship I was on, largely because it does not disperse crowds well. Example; there are only 5 places available for lunch compared to 12 options on Celebration. So, yes the Carnival Celebration has a slightly lower space ratio, but it moves people into different areas of the ship much better. Same with evening entertainment. HAL offers 3 lounges with entertainment (two on non-pinnacle) compared to 6-10 on other mainstream lines; thus forcing more people into less venues simply due to lack of choices. Ironically, the Oasis class (largest in the inventory) feels the least crowded of any ship I have ever sailed (and I have been sailing since 1987).

 

I firmly disagree that HAL's entertainment is better than any mass market line. I think HAL entertainment offerings are bottom of the barrel.  It's clear to me that HAL's entertainment budget is significantly lower and it shows in both quality and quantity of entertainment choices. 

 

Is the predominant basis for your entire claim that HAL is more upscale is because HAL's passengers are "more refined" and somehow that makes HAL more upscale? I'm just not following. 

 

 

 

Edited July 7 by BermudaBound2014

[BermudaBound2014]

1 hour ago, LAFFNVEGAS said:

@BermudaBound2014 I agree with you 1000% Sadly HAL has become in the lower end of the Mass Market, only because we have so much time invested with HAL do we continue to return. It is not a bad product but it has continued to decline over the years where other cruise lines have improved their product. I think it has been closer to 2 decades since it was a premium cruise line.

I can honestly say with no hesitation that Norwegian Cruise line has been our favorite cruise line for several years. I know food is subjective but we just find the food on NCL to be so much better. On HAL evens most nights we are back in our stateroom by 8 or 8:30 on NCL we frequently do not get back to our stateroom till midnight or later. We end up bar hopping to go watch the various bands and shows. We have an early dinner and often enjoy dining outside on the Waterfront. We were recently on the Joy in Bermuda and loved dining outside in the evening. We have several favorite dining venues on NCL. Yes, we do continue to return to HAL but mainly because we are 5 star over 300 days and often I can get a better price with HAL if I book more than a year out with the HIA Plus. But if pricing was exactly the same I would go with NCL. I actually consider NCL to be a more premium cruise especially when sailing the Breakaway plus Class. We have sailed Bliss numerous times as well as Encore(they are sister ships much like Nieuw Statendam and Rotterdam). After our Westerdam cruise in 7 weeks we have two cruises coming up on the NCL Bliss one will be our first Trans Atlantic with a pre 3 night Land Tour in London that is combined with the cruise. This is something HAL does not really offer with the exception of Alaska. NCL is adding these to many of their itineraries and at a price that is not crazy high. We will be seeing many sights in the city of London as well as one day trip to Dover and seeing Stonehenge. We have 3 nights at Radisson Blue. The pricing for the land portion and all transfers are coming out the same as what HAL offers in Europe for hotel only.

We will most likely always return to HAL for one or two cruises a year but NCL for us is what we look at first.

 

 

NCL is hubby's favorite line too for much of the reasons you stated above (and the 21 beers on tap haha). I was shocked at how impressed I was with the new innovations on the Celebration. I hadn't sailed Carnival since 1996 but I'm here to say it's a totally different product now. If you like NCL, you may be very pleasantly surprised. 

 

I will continue to sail HAL for the long itineraries at extremely competitive pricing. But for a typical 7 or 14 day bus run, it's very unlikely HAL will be my line of choice. 

 

 

[Gail & Marty sailing away]

I think it's up to the individual. What is important to you, size, food, staff, entertainment, price, and how often you cruise, how many days at a time. Cabin size, and more.

Ps we use to sail Princess 10- 20 day cruises. We feel we have stepped up to Holland and found the type of travel/ Cruises we like. 

[BermudaBound2014]

8 minutes ago, Gail & Marty sailing away said:

I think it's up to the individual. What is important to you, size, food, staff, entertainment, price, and how often you cruise, how many days at a time. Cabin size, and more.

Ps we use to sail Princess 10- 20 day cruises. We feel we have stepped up to Holland and found the type of travel/ Cruises we like. 

 

Absolutely agree, for many HAL is a great choice. While I never understand brand loyalty, I am a bit jealous of those who have it, if only because your research is much easier :).

 

[stevenr597]

47 minutes ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

 

 

 

So

 

Still respectfully disagree.

 

You claimed that HAL is thought to be 'better' (your words not mine) and differentiated from mass market lines but I'm only seeing three examples you provided  of what makes HAL more upscale (refined crowds, less crowded, better entertainment and food).

 

Food is way too subjective (but again, lobster is still complimentary on Carnival lol). Personally, I didn't find HAL's food significantly better than any cruise line I've sailed but I have the palette of a toddler. 

 

You said that HAL tends to be less crowded. Some truth to that with HAL's smaller ships, but HAL's space ratio for the Pinnacle is not significantly lower. I would say that the K'dam 'felt' more crowded than either Carnival or NCL ship I was on, largely because it does not disperse crowds well. Example; there are only 5 places available for lunch compared to 12 options on Celebration. So, yes the Carnival Celebration has a slightly lower space ratio, but it moves people into different areas of the ship much better. Same with evening entertainment. HAL offers 3 lounges with entertainment (two on non-pinnacle) compared to 6-10 on other mainstream lines; thus forcing more people into less venues simply due to lack of choices. Ironically, the Oasis class (largest in the inventory) feels the least crowded of any ship I have ever sailed (and I have been sailing since 1987).

 

I firmly disagree that HAL's entertainment is better than any mass market line. I think HAL entertainment offerings are bottom of the barrel.  It's clear to me that HAL's entertainment budget is significantly lower and it shows in both quality and quantity of entertainment choices. 

 

Is the predominant basis for your entire claim that HAL is more upscale is because HAL's passengers are "more refined" and somehow that makes HAL more upscale? I'm just not following. 

 

 

 

I would still classify Holland America, Princess, Celebrity and I forgot and should not leave out, Cunard as being upscale or as other would say "Near Premium" as compared to mass market lines such as RCCL, NCL, and Carnival. For individuals who want an even more refined experience, but do not want to pay the prices of a true premium, I would go with Azamara and Oceania.  

That is not see that these mass market lines do not offer a good product for the money.

But to get back to the original post, I would like to reiterate that Holland America and Princess are different lines which have taken a different path as to how to attract this class of passengers.  Interestingly they are both owned by Carnival Corporation. 

 

[BermudaBound2014]

1 minute ago, stevenr597 said:

I would still classify Holland America, Princess, Celebrity and I forgot and should not leave out, Cunard as being upscale or as other would say "Near Premium" as compared to mass market lines such as RCCL, NCL, and Carnival. For individuals who want an even more refined experience, but do not want to pay the prices of a true premium, I would go with Azamara and Oceania.  

That is not see that these mass market lines do not offer a good product for the money.

But to get back to the original post, I would like to reiterate that Holland America and Princess are different lines which have taken a different path as to how to attract this class of passengers.  Interestingly they are both owned by Carnival Corporation. 

 

 

So it's your personal opinion that HAL, Princess, Celebrity, and Cunard are 'better' or "more upscale' than NCL, Carnival or RCL.

 

Everyone is entitled to an opinion.

 

I can respect that.

 

 

 

[TRLD]

5 hours ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

 

 

Respectfully disagree. Marketing aside; how do you believe that HAL differentiates itself from RCCL, NCL, or Carnival?? Not trying to be argumentative, but I would enjoy a friendly discussion.  Please point me to some objective differences that put HAL in a class above?

 

I did three cruises in a row last year. Carnival Celebration and NCL Encore side to side in January,  followed up with Koningsdam in February. I feel like I have a pretty good comparison on what those three ships in particular offer post covid, since the passage of time wasn't a factor. I also sail RCL and Celebrity pretty frequently as I have zero brand loyalty. 

 

I found nothing on HAL that would make it more 'upscale' than Carnival (excel class) or NCL (away plus class).  I mention the ship classes because when making comparisons, class of ship matters.  Sure there are things each line does best, but overall, I don't believe that HAL offers anymore upscale experience than any of the mass market lines. Perhaps this was the case a decade ago, but not anymore. 

 

I'll try to provide objective examples where NCL and Carnival (excel class) provided a more 'upscale' product when compared to the Koningdsam based on my recent experience:

 

1) Both the Encore and Celebration blew away Koningsdam when it comes to entertainment options. In this category, HAL is simply miles behind. Not just the real production shows, I'm talking the arts/crafts, dancing lessons, active games, etc... Both Carnival and Encore had an entertainment crew front facing that had about a dozen 'playmakers'. Kdam has three. Three people just can't offer the same level of activities as an entire team. OH.... When Carnival's live musicians aren't putting on a production show, they offer different sets around the ship. The violin trio was in the same category as the classical sets on Kdam. Not the same obviously, but there were 6-7 music venues to choose from each night and my understanding is that HAL is scaling down to just two venues on most ships.

 

 

 

 

 

2) Carnival Serenity was significantly nicer than the cabanas on HAL. Both Adult only but serenity provided much nicer furniture, a pool, a Lunch buffet, etc... Just No comparison (and it's complimentary which is a huge bonus in my world). NCL has Vibe (pay like Cabanas) but again, nicer furniture, hot tubs, more comprehensive dining options.

 

 

 

 

3) Koningsdam's crows nest pales in comparison to Encores Observation room. While K'dam did have 2-3 items in the coffee area (cookie, brownie, etc..), the Encore had a much larger buffet with hot entries and tapas running all day. The furniture in observation room was also much higher quality. 

 

 

 

4) In terms of both food options and food availability, again K'dam is in the dust. Food is subjective so I won't discuss quality, but here are a few things that are concrete: The new food truck style outdoor dining on Celebration greatly reduces any lines in the lido and offers many more choices. And while this doesn't matter to me, lobster is still complimentary on Carnival during the gala evenings. The district brew house on NCL offers 21 beers on tap and several craft cocktail lounges with much more inventive drinks (I couldn't get a jalapeno Margarita on K'dam anywhere).  Lido hours are much more extensive and food in the evening is replaced along the way (on Kdam, when it was gone it was gone for the night). Here's a list of the 21 different dining menus  offered to give you a feel for what other lines are doing in terms of food options: : https://freestyletravelers.com/blog/carnival-celebration-restaurant-guide

 

 

 

 

5) For those of you that love HAL's promenade, the Away class has been very innovative in using this space. They call it the waterfront. Again, the furniture is super comfy. There are several bars on the waterfront (mojito bar is excellent and of course brewhouse with the 21 beers on tap). Outdoor service.  If you elect to eat at specialty restaurants, you can eat outside on the waterfront (I personally love this option and it doesn't exist on any HAL ship that I'm aware of). 

 

 

 

I could go on, but those are a few of the differences that immediately come to mind. I'm not saying that everything is roses on other lines. Each line has things they do best and HAL still offers some things that surpass the others. HAL still offers complimentary room service and other lines now charge a nominal fee. HAL's overall service was the best of the three hands down, no comparison. I suspect that HAL does much better with those that need physical assistance. HAL's entertainment includes lectures which are absent on Carnival/Ncl. Nothing on the other lines brought the energy of BBKings for dancing (but both did offer bands that were much better than what I experienced in rolling stones rock room and billboards).

 

 

Plenty of people are very loyal to the HAL product, and I respect that. Some have even tried other lines and found them not to their liking. But in order to put to put HAL in a class above Carnival or NCL I respectfully ask for specifics.  Other than service, I didn't experience anything on the K'dam that would make it more 'upscale' compared to all the other mainstream lines. Currently HAL is one of the least expensive choices for the seven day 'bus runs' so they aren't charging upscale pricing. 

 

Other than service, the one thing that HAL does best is offer long interesting itineraries at main stream pricing. In this area they hold a very solid niche in the market. For that reason alone, I will continue to sail HAL.

 

Oh: Both the carnival and ncl website worked flawlessly last year. So there's that.

 

 

 

HAL has its niche in the adult focused North American mass market lines with the smallest ships of its competition (Celebrity and Princess) with the longest average itineraries and most unique port stops of the 3.

[Pizzaboy55]

We have taken many cruises over 45 years. The changes in most cases are not good. We loved HAL…. But never again. They have cut back severely on entertainment & food. In last 4 months we have been on 2 of the new ships, one in Europe and one in the Caribbean. In Europe the food was just okay but in the Caribbean the main dining room was just not good, on top of that the service was terrible. Our group gave up and ate in the buffet, the food was better but repetitious.

 We are sad that they have decided to change but we will use other cruise lines. Princess has much better entertainment and food. The food is not like it was before but still edible. This year we are trying more higher end cruises. We pay more if the cruise lines would bring back better food and entertainment. I guess they don’t care about the people who cruise 5 to 8 times a year.

[BermudaBound2014]

4 minutes ago, TRLD said:

HAL has its niche in the adult focused North American mass market lines with the smallest ships of its competition (Celebrity and Princess) with the longest average itineraries and most unique port stops of the 3.

 

That's what I said up there ^^^^ 😄 .... HAL"s niche is longer itineraries at competitive pricing.

 

I very much enjoy the HAL product and have a 22 night Antarctica booked in January to be immediately followed by a 35 night Tahiti cruise. I have made HAL my cruise line of choice for longer itineraries.

 

Even so, I don't consider it "upscale' when compared to the competition.

 

 

[Kay S]

I chuckle at the idea of a "more refined crowd."  Do I become less refined when I cruise on Carnival (which I have done many times) and will I become more refined when I take my first Oceania cruise this year?  I've been on more than 20 Princess cruises, and I'm working on the same for HAL.  I guess when I'm on one of those, I am just "medium refined."  😄

[Crashe]

Elite on Princess trying HAL because of destination (ABC islands in February).  Not a lot of expectations, will definitely miss Medallion, been years since we signed receipts. Don’t usually go to shows, looking forward to boring World Stage talks (👍), love day time group games.  Group of 10.  Keeping an open mind.

[Mary229]

28 minutes ago, Crashe said:

Elite on Princess trying HAL because of destination (ABC islands in February).  Not a lot of expectations, will definitely miss Medallion, been years since we signed receipts. Don’t usually go to shows, looking forward to boring World Stage talks (👍), love day time group games.  Group of 10.  Keeping an open mind.

Destinations is the best reason to travel on HAL.  The ambience is low key which in my book is nice. 

[LSegars]

7 hours ago, Kay S said:

will I become more refined when I take my first Oceania cruise this year?

On an Oceania cruise shortly after COVID. One woman on my trivia group grew up in NY city and went to school with Caroline Kennidy after her father's death. She now has a summer house next door to Mitt Romney. Another couple we met ran a puzzle company. I read that later that summer they boght a castle in Europe. Nice people and we had a great time but not like most people I know.

[Mary229]

4 hours ago, LSegars said:

On an Oceania cruise shortly after COVID. One woman on my trivia group grew up in NY city and went to school with Caroline Kennidy after her father's death. She now has a summer house next door to Mitt Romney. Another couple we met ran a puzzle company. I read that later that summer they boght a castle in Europe. Nice people and we had a great time but not like most people I know.

I think how people spend their money is not really a mark of refinement.  I once remarked to my young niece how wealthy someone appeared and she said “they are good at going to the bank to asking for loans”.  That always sticks in my mind.  Anyway I have met some truly exceptional people on HAL.
 

 Everyone has their own criteria of what they want in a cruise.  I have met people who struggle to go on HAL and I have met those who could buy the entire upper floor of cabins. 

[PROCRUISE]

16 hours ago, Crashe said:

Elite on Princess trying HAL because of destination (ABC islands in February).  Not a lot of expectations, will definitely miss Medallion, been years since we signed receipts. Don’t usually go to shows, looking forward to boring World Stage talks (👍), love day time group games.  Group of 10.  Keeping an open mind.

Well, the good thing is, the ABC port stops are some of my favorite, so I know you'll enjoy them! We all have different expectations, likes and dislikes. I personally don't like the Princess Medallion system at all and found the HAL Club Orange very much to my liking.

Hope you have a most enjoyable time in February, Will be back on the Rotterdam to the ABC ports on 3/7/25 myself.

[TRLD]

19 hours ago, Kay S said:

I chuckle at the idea of a "more refined crowd."  Do I become less refined when I cruise on Carnival (which I have done many times) and will I become more refined when I take my first Oceania cruise this year?  I've been on more than 20 Princess cruises, and I'm working on the same for HAL.  I guess when I'm on one of those, I am just "medium refined."  😄

I think on Oceania you may not become more refined, but probably more sedate instead.

[stevenr597]

4 minutes ago, TRLD said:

I think on Oceania you may not become more refined, but probably more sedate instead.

Certainly not meant to be insulting.  But generally, one finds more partying, and yes, more drinking on lines such as Carnival.

More hairy chest contests on one line, as compared to more string quartets in the Atrium on another.

Hope that helps. 



 

Edited July 8 by stevenr597
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