Raising Our Fare (four threads combined into one)

hammybee · September 16, 2006

I am glad to hear that you are making the best of this unfortunate situation. The sooner you shake this experience off, the greater the likelihood that fares might even drop some, between now and when you make final payment. It's a KARMA thing.

I used to live in NJ and like AAAmerican, know that better lodging can be had at a better price.

If you prefer to be in the city, I would book lodging now at a good price. ( Be aware that the price of lodging is a commodity and can vary from day to day. So if the cost is important to you , it makes sense to play hotel roulette and check at least weekly for potential price changes. Typically, you will have until 6:00 PM on the day of arrival to cancel although policies vary from hotel to hotel, season to season. Then I would hit Priceline, a few days before you leave home and try to do better.

Taking the NY subway is very much a part of the NYC experience, much like London, Paris and Stockholm. It's relatively cheap and always faster than travel above ground. Avoid rush hour, especially if you have small kids. Because it is the preferred method of travel, it is safe at all times of the day and I dare say, all night too. Given the number of riders per day,the risk of a problem is probably only slightly greater than encountering SNAKES ON A PLANE.:) :) :)

happy cruzer · September 16, 2006

Banker, I am very sorry this happened to you. We have all learned from this unfortunate experience. Hindsight tells us that we should all do our travel reservations is a precise order.

We should book our cruise, make our deposit, verify that it was charged to the cruise line (not to a third party, like a TA), obtain an complete invoice that includes all payments, remaining balance and due date. All cancellation policies.

Then we should start reserving dependent carriers like air, hotels, and excursions. these reservations should be made a time when it is likely that the cruiseline will not make changes, i.e. as late as reasonably possible based on their cancellation/change policies.

I will add a very unpopular point at this time. I think HAL is almost blameless because you never really had a reservation because a deposit was never made i.e. from your posts your FIL credit card was never charged. I think they could even release the booking totally for lack of deposit. That would have been a bad customer service. But it might be a good business practice to release all bookings if the deposit doesn't show up. I think the TA is very much at fault.

Anyway, I am truely sorry that this happened to your gift. and I did learn alot from you and your bad experience.

dakrewser · September 16, 2006

To paraphrase Sy Syms: "An informed cruiser is the best cruiser." Just as you wouldn't buy a house or a car without doing basic research, don't make what's probably your most expensive leisure purchase without knowing exactly what you're getting in to. Don't expect that your "common sense" is correct without verifying.

The meaning of "guarantee," in particular, is not what most people believe it to be.

To the OP - don't waste your money on lawyers, don't waste your time on "consumer affairs" agencies. Instead, spend that time and money researching the trip you'd like to take - compare cruise lines, itineraries, departure/arrival ports (some offer better opportunities to save on airfare, for example). Fares will vary widely on the same line for different sailing dates, compare those. Decide which category of cabin works best for you.

INSURE THE TRIP. Things happen, ships get damaged, airlines suffer strikes, weather can upset everything. Don't be left holding the bag.

Most importantly, don't run around blaming others for things beyond their control, conserve that energy for

helping yourself to discover the best value for you when spending vacation dollars.

newmexicoNita · September 16, 2006

To paraphrase Sy Syms: "An informed cruiser is the best cruiser." Just as you wouldn't buy a house or a car without doing basic research, don't make what's probably your most expensive leisure purchase without knowing exactly what you're getting in to. Don't expect that your "common sense" is correct without verifying.

The meaning of "guarantee," in particular, is not what most people believe it to be.

To the OP - don't waste your money on lawyers, don't waste your time on "consumer affairs" agencies. Instead, spend that time and money researching the trip you'd like to take - compare cruise lines, itineraries, departure/arrival ports (some offer better opportunities to save on airfare, for example). Fares will vary widely on the same line for different sailing dates, compare those. Decide which category of cabin works best for you.

INSURE THE TRIP. Things happen, ships get damaged, airlines suffer strikes, weather can upset everything. Don't be left holding the bag.

Most importantly, don't run around blaming others for things beyond their control, conserve that energy for

helping yourself to discover the best value for you when spending vacation dollars.

Good advise and I will add one more thing: none of knows who is to blame, but if the agent did enter the reservation and the deposit when she said she did, then the glitch showed up I wouldn't be too hard on her. She is probably telling you the truth but not what you want to hear: there is nothing more she can do. I had a similar experience last year. Acutally not similar, but a situation where I couldn't do another thing for my cliants. They booked 3 balcony cabins for Thanksgiving. Along comes katrina, we all know what happened there. They were sailing out of NOLA> Givin the opportunity to cancel they decided to keep their reservation in tact and cruise out of Texas instead. Then along come Rita and the gulf ports took a beating. By then it was too close to sailing to cancel without a penalty. I did all I could to reason with the cruise line even though I knew it would make no difference. I finally had to inform my cliant there was absolutely nothing that could be done. Of course the cruise was a disaster for them, I lost a good cliant and I felt bad but again, I came to a point where I really had to level with them. NMnita

PerculaClown · September 16, 2006

Hm... I also booked at the time of great price reduction. No one has contacted me of any price increase. If they do claim that it's a system wide problem, wouldn't they be contacting everyone affected No?

Or do we only find out at the time of final payment, that we need to pay more? or even worst at the time of pier?

Is it their obligation to inform the many reservations that there was a price mistake ASAP? well they haven't contacted me.

I do hope HAL will make good on all of this.

Karen112999 · September 16, 2006

Time will only tell the extent of the mistake. HAL may not even know at this point but I would hope that someone is doing OT trying to figure out - what happened - whose affected - whose to blame - and what options they are going to give their clients.

My best guess is that it was one of the few 3rd party TA systems that are purchased or subscribed to by various TA's. But I would think there is some kind of contractual agreement both with the cruise lines and the Ta's.

I think I benefited a few years ago on a celebrity cruise where I was just pricing out different cruises... I travel solo - and 1 fare out of all of the cruises checked had a very unusual solo rate - NO Supplement at all. It was too early to be trying to sell of cabins and it was only one category of Balcony cabins - and I must say it was one of the higher ones. And if I changed dates, the fare doubled.

Because this was SO limited. That particular cruise with only 1 cabin category and only for solos..I think I was just lucky that it did stick.

And the OP's fiasco is even hindered more with the situation with the TA. I hope we all are aware of the final outcome of this mess and a sensible solution is reached with anyone who has been effected.

In my opinion, a more proactive role by HAL & the TA could have and should have been taken. They do need a work together usually without these problems. So when a problem occurs, they should work together for a resolution - not blame each other.

I love cruising and I love cruisin on HAL...My 1/17 Noordam cruise was not affected although I did call my TA when I saw the other post - but I think this particular TA had the proper fare software because my rate really did not change. And I believe I called in the window that others did.

Bankerbabe - do whatever is right for you and pursue the matter at your own pace without getting distressed about it. Hope it works out.

Karen

hammybee · September 16, 2006

Most importantly, don't run around blaming others for things beyond their control, conserve that energy for

helping yourself to discover the best value for you when spending vacation dollars.

This is the best advice I have read in a long, long time.

Shelli · September 16, 2006

If you prefer to be in the city, I would book lodging now at a good price. ( Be aware that the price of lodging is a commodity and can vary from day to day. So if the cost is important to you , it makes sense to play hotel roulette and check at least weekly for potential price changes. Typically, you will have until 6:00 PM on the day of arrival to cancel although policies vary from hotel to hotel, season to season. Then I would hit Priceline, a few days before you leave home and try to do better.

While this is good advice, I just want to ad that if you book a hotel using one of the discount booking sites (i.e. hotels.com or the like), there is usually a cancellation penalty *whenever* you cancel, even if it's 5 minutes after booking. Check it all out so there are no nasty surprises. You sure don't need any more of those!

bankerbabe · September 16, 2006

I appreciate all of your comments, and in my own defense I should say that I really did do my homework and ask questions. It's just that they weren't answered properly. I insisted that my FIL call the travel agency to make sure that we were indeed booked and it was a go before I booked the air. Otherwise I wouldn't have booked it.

I will enjoy my cruise, and I certainly hope that I did not leave the impression that I would take out my frustration on the folks working on the ship. Lord knows it's not their fault. If anything they deserve extra tips for putting up with a corporate headquarters like that.

But I will admit to thoughts of sneaking extra food off the ship to donate to the underfed or homeless on the islands that we visit - just to spite HAL:)

I will also admit to thoughts of eating everything possible to get my money's worth, since we have to pay a higher rate. But then I'd pay for it again when I have to buy a whole new wardrobe.

This is still very much a work in progress. And it has been an interesting venture into cruise line policies. It's amazing the lack of protections that we as consumers really do have. But then again, there is always the other side of the coin - litterally - HAL is not a non-profit corporation, they have a bottom line. Maybe they should have invested more of that bottom line in their computer systems. Microsoft is on their back door step, practically, maybe they should call up old Mr. Gates. I'm sure his genius brain could come up with something better.

Now I'm off to research New Jersey hotels. And to watch every movie made in New York that I can find, so that I can convince myself that public transportation is a good thing (we don't have much of that in Oregon, it's only the weirdos that ride the buses around here).

mfanderso · September 16, 2006

We rebooked our cruise during this time period. When we called to rebook, our TA put us on hold and called HAL to book the cruise. Nothing was said to our TA about the price not being any good. We called our TA today and requested that they send us an e-mail with the price of our cruise and the amount owed at final payment. She is still quoting us the reduced price. I guess we will see what happens when final payment is made. Seems they would have been notified by HAL by now that we would have to pay a higher ratef that was the case.

AAAAmerican · September 16, 2006

Well have fun with the NY movies but Movies actually were started in NJ here..

My mentor Thomas A. Edison did the start and had Black Maria which was a bulding on a turntable so he was able to use the sun for lighting. Thats in West Orange, Essex County, NJ.

The first moving picture westerns too were shot on the Pallisades..which are along the Hudson River in NJ.. they are reall the bottoms of mountains so your seeing the rock bottom LOL...:eek: :D

Due dilligence is always need in any purchase.

I so agree with you about consumer protection as not enough is in place yet ...

:cool: :cool:

hammybee · September 16, 2006

We rebooked our cruise during this time period. When we called to rebook, our TA put us on hold and called HAL to book the cruise. Nothing was said to our TA about the price not being any good. We called our TA today and requested that they send us an e-mail with the price of our cruise and the amount owed at final payment. She is still quoting us the reduced price. I guess we will see what happens when final payment is made. Seems they would have been notified by HAL by now that we would have to pay a higher ratef that was the case.

I do not think it is clear, the source or extent of the problem, some ships? all ships? some cabin catagories? all cabins catagories? some TAs? All TAs, some TA blocks, all TA blocks, HAL or not. And we never will.

If your price is deeply discounted to current fares, be suspicious.

rps2004 · September 16, 2006

So, I have been reading about the "glitch" and got nervous, because we booked last week at a great rate.

We deposited and have a booking # and an email invoice from the TA (large, well known, online TA), as well as a thank you email from HAL. Our booking shows on the HAL site.

Called HAL - the rep said that while she couldn't talk price since I'm booked through a TA, that as long as I was deposited at the lower rate, the glitch would not affect me.

Called TA - they said that they were obviously aware of the issue but that they were told that if HAL took the deposit that they would honor the price. I think I'm OK, but I asked them to double check. They will probably not get back to me before Monday.

Has anyone with a deposit through HAL and a booking # been officially told that HAL wouldn't honor the price?

hammybee · September 16, 2006

Has anyone with a deposit through HAL and a booking # been officially told that HAL wouldn't honor the price?

RPS,

What catagory cabin did you book and what is your ship/sailing date?

My sense is that the problem did not impact all sailings.

I get a kick out of the discrepency within HAL. I s/w 6 different reps yesterday and none had a clue about a pricing problem. Maybe I should have made a 7th call:) Oh yeah, I have no reservations and am simply curious.

kryos · September 16, 2006

Paul Noble & Hammybee...Sorry you were both posting at the same time that I was composing (I'm slow)...

I agree with you both! It's a shame for those who thought they had a good deal, but understandable why HAL cannot honor the wrong price..

Yeah, but the issue here is that HAL probably would have honored it if the TA had made the deposit promptly. True, HAL doesn't have to ... but I think they would have.

Of course, if someone sees a price on the website like $100.00 for a 7-day cruise in a balcony suite, and books it, HAL is probably not going to honor that ... simply because it was obvious there was an error on the website. Any idiot would know that you don't get a seven-day cruise for $100.00 in a balcony suite. You wouldn't even get that cruise for $100.00 PER DAY. That's just common sense. HAL would have no obligation, nor would even be expected to, give the passenger that $100.00 rate. But in this case, the price seemed low ... but probably not extraordinarily so, and one could find a lot of good reasons why that particular sailing could be priced lower than others ... weather issues, perhaps a large group on the sailing with only a smattering of cabins left, etc. I think if the OP's TA had jumped on the booking ... got everything squared away with HAL promptly, the OP would be sailing on her cruise at the agreed upon price.

That's why I blame this whole fiasco on the TA. It's really not HAL's problem. The OP's beef is with the TA.

I agree with others' advice on this thread ... don't get yourself sick over this lost deal, but I also wouldn't just let it drop either. Sounds to me like the TA, either through incompetence or clear negligence, dropped the ball bigtime on this one. For that reason, I think the TA owes the OP a cruise, at the original agreed-upon price. I wouldn't just let it drop. Maybe hiring a lawyer to fight this won't be worth it ... and I can't honestly say I would do that if I were in the OP's shoes. But I'd sure at least drop by the TA's office (if they were local ... call them if they are not) and make my displeasure very clearly known. I'd refuse to speak to anyone but the manager of the office ... or even the owner of the agency ... and let them know that I won't hesitate to contact the local media's consumer reporter about this. Who knows? The agency may come through for her just to avoid possible negative publicity that could impact the sales of her agency for a very long time.

Blue skies ...

--rita

kryos · September 16, 2006

My TA is now saying that it's not their problem that it is between us and HAL, that it's not their problem and they are done working with HAL; it's the new price or nothing. This is absurd.

LOL ... horse hockey. It IS their problem because they acted as your agent in this transaction. She's just trying to get rid of you and hoping you will go away quietly.

The Seattle times is one option. But my favorite has always been television. Much more exposure there. So, I'd also contact the local television stations as well. Most of them have a consumer reporter and this is just the kind of story that draws viewers. And, there is just something "shocking" for a business owner when one of those big TV vans pulls up outside of their place of business and starts raising that big antenna. Scares away the other customers that may be in the office at the time too ... possibly resulting in additional lost bookings for the agency, not to mention bad publicity for their business. That stuff all translates into lost revenue ... possibly lots of it. Believe me, if you threaten this agency owner with going to the media, she might just "see the light" and realize that it would be a lot cheaper to make you happy by giving you your cruise, than to risk all the lost revenue some bad media exposure could cost her. And the best thing of all? Going to the media, and hopefully getting them involved in your fight, costs you absolutely nothing.

Good luck ... and let us know what happens.

Blue skies ...

--rita

newmexicoNita · September 16, 2006

As I have already put my 2 cents worth in about not coming down to hard on the TA if indeed she processed the reservation when she should have I will also add: I don't believe her for one second, "they are done working with HAL." NMNita

YYC F/A · September 17, 2006

As a former T/A,

A 'Reservation' number rather than a 'Booking' number is common - the Agency will process the booking in their internal system, take your C/C and then give you a 'Reservation' number. However, until that agent then books in the HAL (or other cruise line/airline system etc.), then you in actual fact don't have a booking with the cruise line.

When the agent then books with the cruiseline, they will have an additional cruise line booking number in addition to the agency system reservation number they have assigned to you.

*IF* prices go up between the time the agency takes your details and the time they book in the HAL system and process a deposit, then yes, HAL will not accept any responsibility (and quite rightly so!).

As an agent, I always booked in the cruise line system FIRST, then issued the customer both our own internal number, as well as the cruise line booking number. That way if prices went up, we could relay that to the customer before we actually confirmed they were booked the cruise.

My suggestion for the OP would be to speak to the agency branch manager and:

a) inform them when you instructed the agency to book you on HAL, and at what rate

b) find out when the agency finally tried to process the booking with HAL

c) if there was a delay between A and B, then instruct the agency that it's not your fault that the agency did not process the booking promptly and that pricing subsequently went up. Your expectation therefore would be that as the error or delay is with the agency, you expect them to make good on the difference.

You entered into a contract with the agency, and agreed upon a price. It sounds like the agency then stalled on booking with HAL for whatever reason - and when prices went up, they tried to hit you for the difference. If this is the case, I would hit hard at the agency.

FYI that if the agency has a good relationship with HAL, they will have a regional sales manager assigned to them. In instances where my agency dropped the ball in the past, we would always call our rep, explained the situation, and almost always our cruise rep would work with us to 'split the difference' in the cost, with the client bearing no brunt.

Finally - a tip to anyone booking with an agent - getting the agency reservation number is fine, but always insist upon the cruise lines own reference as well. For HAL it is a 6 digit PNR type alpha-numerical reference number.

YYC F/A · September 17, 2006