Is "Formal Wear" a bit of an anachronism?

[bdjam]

Granted I'm also including the shoe tree inside them.

Shoe trees are unnecessary. Roll up your socks - that you're taking anyway and so are already included in the weight of your luggage - and stuff them in your shoes - saves space and weight. I do it all the time and my shoes are fine.

Hey...I like Disneyland

Me too - when I'm there.

It sounds as if one poster was saying that middle class and lower-middle class people shouldn't cruise. Others are telling most of us what we should spend our money on. I'm middle class and maybe you have a money tree in your backyard, but I don't happen to. It goes both ways. If you want to dress formal and are offended because others are "just" dressy, and you own a money tree, go on a long cruise and it sounds like you will be really happy.

This isn't about class standing or money - dressing appropriately for formal evenings on board isn't expensive.

I chose to go on a cruise to Alaska because I want to go on a cruise to Alaska. I also chose this cruise because I liked the itinerary and the time fit my schedule. Are people saying that I shouldn't cruise where and when I want to because of the dress code on two nights?

Nope - that's why Princess offers you a casual alternative - in case you don't want to dress. But you should be aware of the cruise package you're buying and what comes with it. Most professional travel agents will tell you you're wasting your money buying a cruise that is formal if you don't want to be formal. I love crusing to Alaska too - so does my tux.

People used to dress up to go to football games. Who would do that now??? That dress code changed because times changed. I'm not promoting jeans, shorts, and sweats. Just choice as to how dressed up I need to get.

A cruise ship is not a football stadium and what if you exercise your choice by wearing jeans, shorts or sweats? You want a choice, but you're saying its OK to draw a line?

This poster is offering a great alternative. Have one dining room for formal and semi-formal and one for people who don't want to blow another hundred or two on something we may never wear again. Then, we can all have lobster and be happy. On every other day of the cruise we might all get along really well. It would be a shame to be looked down upon on two, two-hour periods just because I dress up and don't get formal.

I'm not sure what the big deal is about lobster - its a bug. But what some people don't understand is a formal "evening" isn't just about dressing for the dining room - there's more to it than that.

With weight restrictions, why in the world would you pack shoe trees? Just stuff your shoes with socks that you will be wearing with the shoes anyway.

LOL - we think alike! :D

Better yet, let's start the whole casual thing by letting the waiters wear golf shirts with discrete Sea Witch logos, rather than the formal tux shirt and tuxes of different colors they have to wear each night. Once they are allowed to be more casual to set the mood, then we can match. What? You didn't mean that? why not? It works at Denny's.

Exactly - people want lobster in the dining room, but the want to dress like they're going to McDonalds...why should the cruise line offer a high-end dinner when a burger and fries will do?

I think they should make formal nights optional and offer the same menu for the 'casual sport'/normal wear people. I think if someone wants to be pretentious and dress up on a cruise to show that is fine with me.

NCL does just this - give them a try.

If I want to eat lobster/caviar/baked alaska in a blazer that should be fine. I would dare anyone to refuse service to me in a nice tie and blazer on formal nights. Especially some underpaid help from some third world country who barely speaks English and probably and only owns that polyester funeral suit (tuxedo/waiter's uniform).

Your last sentence ruins any credibility you might have had in this discussion - if you can't relate to diverse people with dignity, then it's no wonder you don't understand the other side of this debate.

I hope not to run into these rigid Princess customers on my first cruise! I hope they're like most strangers I meet in a fine restaurant

in San Francisco. Cordial and friendly. Not condescending and pretentious! Hey wake up it's 2008... styles change....

One thing about these rigid Princess customers is that we're polite - you won't even know what we're thinking about you.

[nana nancy]

We ae in NJ, lots of cruise options. Bayonne, very easy-no Alaska, NYC-no Alaska, Red Hook-no Alaska. We want to see Alaska, not formal night. We will try not to upset the formal people, as we want to spend as much time as possible in Alaska.

[Ruffster]

If I want to eat lobster/caviar/baked alaska in a blazer that should be fine. I would dare anyone to refuse service to me in a nice tie and blazer

on formal nights. Especially some underpaid help from some third world country who barely speaks English and probably and only owns that polyester funeral suit (tuxedo/waiter's uniform).:eek:

 

I hope not to run into these rigid Princess customers on my first cruise! I hope they're like most strangers I meet in a fine restaurant

in San Francisco. Cordial and friendly. Not condescending and pretentious!

 

:confused: Now really, was that necessary? Btw, I have yet to see anyone in a tie and blazer be refused service on formal night.

[julia]

OK PEOPLE...... TIME OUT!!!

This thread has disintegrated into a p***ing match, as have the 575 ones before it.

 

Wear want you want. Look nice. Make an effort. Enjoy your cruise. Play nice. Make friends.

[Woobstr112G]

Shoe trees are unnecessary. Roll up your socks - that you're taking anyway and so are already included in the weight of your luggage - and stuff them in your shoes - saves space and weight. I do it all the time and my shoes are fine. Me too - when I'm there. This isn't about class standing or money - dressing appropriately for formal evenings on board isn't expensive. Nope - that's why Princess offers you a casual alternative - in case you don't want to dress. But you should be aware of the cruise package you're buying and what comes with it. Most professional travel agents will tell you you're wasting your money buying a cruise that is formal if you don't want to be formal. I love crusing to Alaska too - so does my tux. A cruise ship is not a football stadium and what if you exercise your choice by wearing jeans, shorts or sweats? You want a choice, but you're saying its OK to draw a line? I'm not sure what the big deal is about lobster - its a bug. But what some people don't understand is a formal "evening" isn't just about dressing for the dining room - there's more to it than that. LOL - we think alike! :D Exactly - people want lobster in the dining room, but the want to dress like they're going to McDonalds...why should the cruise line offer a high-end dinner when a burger and fries will do? NCL does just this - give them a try. Your last sentence ruins any credibility you might have had in this discussion - if you can't relate to diverse people with dignity, then it's no wonder you don't understand the other side of this debate.

One thing about these rigid Princess customers is that we're polite - you won't even know what we're thinking about you.

Don't you think these many multi's is a bit much???????????????

 

Bob

 

Future: Diamond Princess Aus/Nz 01/09

Future: Emerald Princess Med/Trans Atlantic 10/08

Constellation Europe 07/06

Summit Alaska Repositioning 05/05

Summit Panama Canal 10/02

Rhapsody Of The Seas Alaska 09/01

Spledour Of The Seas Baltic 09/99

Veendam Eastern Caribbean 07/96

Holiday Western Carribean 07/93

[Woobstr112G]

Sorry, but on this one, I've decided that I'm a little close minded and not open to seeing the other person's viewpoint....Formal nights are as much a part of cruising as tossing your covers at West Point's graduation. I know I might p*** some people off by my narrow mind, but so be it....

 

Bob

 

Future: Diamond Princess Aus/Nz 01/09

Future: Emerald Princess Med/Trans Atlantic 10/08

Constellation Europe 07/06

Summit Alaska Repositioning 05/05

Summit Panama Canal 10/02

Rhapsody Of The Seas Alaska 09/01

Spledour Of The Seas Baltic 09/99

Veendam Eastern Caribbean 07/96

Holiday Western Carribean 07/93

[BigGuy25]

JULIA .... DITTO!!! I don't even know what drew me to read one of these threads again. I totally understand why people like to dress up a few nights ... and I also totally understand why some (especially those who wear suits and ties every work day) don't want to dress up on vacation. To each his own. Dress stylishly and enjoy your cruise!! I know I always do, no matter how others dress for dinner. Life is way too short to get excited about this. And, just for the record, out of the old cruising tradition, "yes" I do dress up on formal nights. But, respectfully, I really don't care what you do!

[DGNY]

Since the dress code is for the evening on the ship, I don't see where this is a solution.

 

It was my understanding that this was not the case and that the dress code was only for the dining rooms. Seeing as there are casual alternatives then logically the dress code isn't ship wide. And as such, there theoretically could be a dining room available for non-formal guests (assuming the ship has multiple dining rooms).

[cruisingalaska]

I think the comment about 'dress stylish' and enjoy your cruise is

correct. Who really cares what you're dress in as long as it is

stylish and clean. Maybe a visit to Barney's Blomingdales or Neiman Marcus

is in order. Someone who wants wear something like a tux or dinner jacket

should just do it. Someone who wants to wear something stylish (NOT

sweats or beach wear) should be fine.

[karatemom2]

It's so funny how this same debate comes up over and over again, but it really should be quite clear cut. Princess as a line has maintained formal evenings and offers very specific guidelines on appropriate dress for those evenings. If someone does not want to dress accordingly there are other dining options available. Yet people continue to book cruises with Princess knowing this and then proceed to argue why it should not apply to them.

 

If you want a cruise without formal nights there are lines that offer that option. If formal evenings are that big of an issue why would you book a cruise on a line where it is still observed and then proceed to complain about it? It's like buying a product that has a feature you really dislike, but you spend money on it anyway and then tell the whole world how terrible it is. I just don't get it.

[OuiOnboard]

In the history of sailing one dressed for dinner....period. The clientel (other than steerage, of course) did so at home and so dressed accordingly aboard.

 

When sailing became more affordable and the passenger list represented those who were not so accustomed to formal dressing, the appeal of sailing included dressing the part, hence formal wear rentals. As sailing became even more affordable, passengers like the idea of formal dressing but not every evening and the custom was lost. It degenerated with each afforability to a point of sometimes, and only if one must, wearing a tie. As sailing became most affordable, one can dress the hell the way one wants, when one wants.

 

As sailing now becomes more expensive with the ever escalating fuel prices...

Indeed! This could be very interesting. Where will we go from here? Especially with so many staterooms on so many large ships that will need to be filled, who knows what the cruiselines will come up with.

For now though, we will continue to pack lightly (usually including one dress-up outfit) in our carry-on size backpack bags for our cruises of whatever length.

May we all cruise well.

 

Del

[Pam in CA]

It was my understanding that this was not the case and that the dress code was only for the dining rooms. Seeing as there are casual alternatives then logically the dress code isn't ship wide. And as such, there theoretically could be a dining room available for non-formal guests (assuming the ship has multiple dining rooms).

At the top of the Patter, it says, "Formal" and on our Sapphire cruise, it then repeated the entire dress code -- in the Patter headline. It doesn't say, "Formal only in dining rooms." And there are already options for those who don't want to dress up.

 

As karatemom2 says, "If you want a cruise without formal nights there are lines that offer that option. If formal evenings are that big of an issue why would you book a cruise on a line where it is still observed and then proceed to complain about it? It's like buying a product that has a feature you really dislike, but you spend money on it anyway and then tell the whole world how terrible it is. I just don't get it." -- I agree completely.

[DGNY]

At the top of the Patter, it says, "Formal" and on our Sapphire cruise, it then repeated the entire dress code -- in the Patter headline. It doesn't say, "Formal only in dining rooms." And there are already options for those who don't want to dress up.

 

I'm looking at a patter from CB 2/4/08. Yes, at the top it says "Tonight's dress: Formal" although it doesn't go on to define it (not that that matters). My thought is that this is just to alert passengers for the dining room...to avoid confusion. Not as a declaration for the entire ship for the night.

 

I say this because there are casual alternatives. How can a pax get to/from these if the ship truly is all formal. Are you saying that non-formal pax should stay in their rooms all night (outside of a mad dash to the Cafe Caribe for dinner)?

 

Aforementioned patter:

http://www.cruisingthecaribbeanprincess.com/020408.pdf

[oilbert]

This seems to be a never ending debate . However after 3 cruises on NCL (Akaska, Panama Canal and South America) my DW and I are considering a 10 day Alaska Cruise tour in 2009 on Coral Princess. We would have at least one and perhaps two older couples with us . We would choose the anytime dining option and I suspect have 2 formal nights to contend with. A suit or tux is simply out of the question, as is a formal gown of ANY type for DW. For a formal night I would wear dress pants, a collared shirt, and preferably no tie .If at all possible no sports coat. DW would prefer a pant suit or a simple dress or some combination of blouse and dark slacks , with perhaps a sweater .(it is Alaska after all) This is very similar to what we would wear for any supper on NCL and for any expensive restauart near to our home. Neither one of us really cares what anyone else thinks , we got over that years ago. Dressed as described would in your opinions there be any problem with Princess ? I have read the Princess brochure and find the phrase "country club casual" to mean very little , except no jeans , bathing suits torn sweat pants etc. which we would not wear anyway. Please - I posted a similar question on the opposition and got royally flamed . Please be nice !!!

[karatemom2]

The following is directly from the Princess website:

 

Onboard Attire

 

Princess makes it easy to know what to pack and what to wear when you're dining onboard. There are two designations for dress codes: Smart Casual and Formal.

 

Smart Casual Evenings:

• Passenger attire should be in keeping with what would be worn to a nice restaurant at home. Inappropriate dinner wear such as pool or beach attire, shorts, ball caps and casual jeans (with fraying and/or holes), is not permitted in the dining rooms. Shoes must be worn.

Formal Evenings:

• Evening gown, cocktail dress, or elegant pant suit for women
  
• Tuxedo, dark suit or dinner jacket and slacks for men

Having traveled on both NCL and Princess, I can say that most passengers on Princess follow the dress guidelines and it is definitely more formal than NCL even on Smart Casual evenings. As I understand it Formal Nights are optional on NCL. This is not the case on Princess and guests are expected to follow the guidelines for the evening in the dining rooms.

[cs]

I think everyone may have a "range" of what formal wear is. For men, it's easy, suit & tie, or tux. For ladies, not so easy.

 

There are some things that I don't consider "formal" per se, but I would still think they are appropriate to wear to a cruise dinner. Would anybody who loves formal wear have a problem seeing a woman dressed in a business suit - like a skirt, blouse, and jacket or slacks, blouse, and jacket? I don't think that would detract from anyone's dining experience but I still don't consider that "formal wear".

 

When I say I don't want to dress formally, I mean I don't want to wear a ball gown or necessarily a cocktail dress. Sometimes a skirt and blouse or slacks and a blouse - I know, I'm a rebel! ;) Does that take away from those of you who like to dress more formally?

[tvaud]

This seems to be a never ending debate . However after 3 cruises on NCL (Akaska, Panama Canal and South America) my DW and I are considering a 10 day Alaska Cruise tour in 2009 on Coral Princess. We would have at least one and perhaps two older couples with us . We would choose the anytime dining option and I suspect have 2 formal nights to contend with. A suit or tux is simply out of the question, as is a formal gown of ANY type for DW. For a formal night I would wear dress pants, a collared shirt, and preferably no tie .If at all possible no sports coat. DW would prefer a pant suit or a simple dress or some combination of blouse and dark slacks , with perhaps a sweater .(it is Alaska after all) This is very similar to what we would wear for any supper on NCL and for any expensive restauart near to our home. Neither one of us really cares what anyone else thinks , we got over that years ago. Dressed as described would in your opinions there be any problem with Princess ? I have read the Princess brochure and find the phrase "country club casual" to mean very little , except no jeans , bathing suits torn sweat pants etc. which we would not wear anyway. Please - I posted a similar question on the opposition and got royally flamed . Please be nice !!!

 

NCL basically has no dress code. Why would you travel on Princess and expect to dress as you would on NCL? Princess HAS a dress code and if you want to eat in the dining room, please follow the dress code set by the cruise line. If you were to be invited to the White House for a formal affair...black tie...would you dress as you described above? If you did, you'd never get past the front gate. Respect your fellow passengers and your host, Princess Cruise Lines. Dress accordingly. The buffet is always available to you otherwise.

 

BTW, the longer the cruise, the more formal they tend to be on Princess.

[tvaud]

I think everyone may have a "range" of what formal wear is. For men, it's easy, suit & tie, or tux. For ladies, not so easy.

 

No range...it's spelled out for you on the Princess site:

Onboard Attire

 

Princess makes it easy to know what to pack and what to wear when you're dining onboard. There are two designations for dress codes: Smart Casual and Formal.

Formal Evenings:

• Evening gown, cocktail dress, or elegant pant suit for women
  
• Tuxedo, dark suit or dinner jacket and slacks for men

[bdjam]

Don't you think these many multi's is a bit much???????????????

'xcuse me? Are you talking about the number of quotes/responses? If I don't do that I get accused of answering too many times to get my post count up.

 

Apologies if you feel I formatted incorrectly. What did you think of the content? :rolleyes:

[tvaud]

I think they should make formal nights optional and offer the same menu

for the 'casual sport'/normal wear people. I think if someone wants

to be pretentious and dress up on a cruise to show that is fine with me.

But to deny me the same menu (pizza and fried chicken is not dinner food to me)

at the buffet or anytime dining room is dumb. Maybe instead of providing some

white threadbare robe, they should provide tuxes for men hanging in the closet upon

embarkation!

 

I have a problem on people thinking that on formal nights seeing someone in casual sport (blazer/khaki Banana Republic type clothes) would ruin their evening. If they really think the middle class shouldn't be cruising well tough luck, because they shouldn't be on Princess Cruise, because

that is so run of the mill and marketed at Costco! Also most people

on this cruise is middle class (looking for cheap airfare/on board credits).

Those with real money can't be bothered logging into this board. They

would have their hired help (travel agent) do the work.

 

If I want to eat lobster/caviar/baked alaska in a blazer that should be fine. I would dare anyone to refuse service to me in a nice tie and blazer

on formal nights. Especially some underpaid help from some third world

country who barely speaks English and probably and only owns that polyester funeral suit (tuxedo/waiter's uniform).

 

I hope not to run into these rigid Princess customers on my first cruise! I hope they're like most strangers I meet in a fine restaurant

in San Francisco. Cordial and friendly. Not condescending and pretentious! Hey wake up it's 2008... styles change....

 

Hello!! Wake up and read your own post. You attract what you put out in this world...:rolleyes:

If you don't like the dress code, sail on a line that lets you dress the casual way you want. Not everyone shares your opinions.

[cs]

No range...it's spelled out for you on the Princess site:

Onboard Attire

 

Princess makes it easy to know what to pack and what to wear when you're dining onboard. There are two designations for dress codes: Smart Casual and Formal.

Formal Evenings:

• Evening gown, cocktail dress, or elegant pant suit for women
  
• Tuxedo, dark suit or dinner jacket and slacks for men

 

It's funny you said that. I noticed that "Pam in MA" is very pro-formal wear and yet she isn't even dressing by the spelled out attire.

 

If a woman's business suit isn't up to par for formal wear then a t-shirt dress shouldn't be either.

 

I used to bring fancy beaded dresses but these days, I have a black, full-length T-shirt dress from Lands End that I wear with different "glitzy" shawls and jewelry. Worn with black sandals that I can also wear with slacks, I am comfortable with what I'm wearing. The dress weighs very little and packs flat, taking up very little room.

[tvaud]

'xcuse me? Are you talking about the number of quotes/responses? If I don't do that I get accused of answering too many times to get my post count up.

 

Apologies if you feel I formatted incorrectly. What did you think of the content? :rolleyes:

 

bdjam,

 

I appreciate your posts....most of them.;)

[bdjam]

As karatemom2 says, "If you want a cruise without formal nights there are lines that offer that option. If formal evenings are that big of an issue why would you book a cruise on a line where it is still observed and then proceed to complain about it? It's like buying a product that has a feature you really dislike, but you spend money on it anyway and then tell the whole world how terrible it is. I just don't get it." -- I agree completely.

I have participated in these boards since July of 2000 and this is still my number one unanswered question. People have said that there’s more to a cruise than the requirement of formal evenings – and I totally get that. Princess does too and provides the casual alternatives. But what I still don’t get is this great need to complain about guidelines, refuse to abide by them, and threaten to try to get them changed when first, there are other products that offer the passenger exactly what they want, and second, they knew about they guidelines when they put their money down.

I like Princess, I can compromise my desires to align with what they offer. While I feel the casual alternatives they offer was one of the worst things they could have done, I understand the business sense behind it and can live with it. Rather than try to get Princess to stop offering casual alternatives, I encourage people to use them. When Princess stops offering me a product that I want to spend my money on, I’m going somewhere else...it seems like the sensible thing to do with one's money.

[tvaud]

It's funny you said that. I noticed that "Pam in MA" is very pro-formal wear and yet she isn't even dressing by the spelled out attire.

 

If a woman's business suit isn't up to par for formal wear then a t-shirt dress shouldn't be either.

 

When I first read her post, I thought, "Oh no," but after thinking about it, a nice black t-shirt dress can be dressed up with jewelry and accessories and dressier shoes to comply. A simple dress can always be dressed up with a little thought. Try it sometime.:)

I'll bet that suit with a fancier blouse, string of pearls and nice pair of strappy sandals could be quite appropriate.

[burm]

I agree with those who suggest a formal and a non-formal dining room offering identical menus. It does not make sense that someone who does not want to dress up should have to eat at the buffet like a second class citizen, since they are paying the same price. Any ship that holds 2,000 pasengers can easily accomodate a formal and non-formal dining room. Those of us who wish to dress up could feel justifiably superior and all of us could enjoy a wonderful meal.

 

Dressed in a gown or country club casual I will still have a wonderful time!