It got ugly in San Diego at 3:30pm today

[sail7seas]

HAL, or the TA who failed to pass along the notification?

 

 

 

In SOME cases, HAL, in effect, is the TA. We use a PCC at HAL..... I am almost positive he would not contact us. He wouldn't know where to find us as we book our own air and hotel.

[Hutch&Pat]

This was not the poker cruise. That was the Zaandam that departed on 8 Oct to Hawaii. We originally booked that cruise but changed to the next one because of the poker group.

 

The couple I spoke with who were planning to board on 10/8 still thought it was a Poker Cruise and was excited about that one and the Oosterdam one in Dec.

 

I'm sure that he'll have a nice time anyway!

 

Pat

[norcal2]

A couple of things come to mind when reading this thread. First is expectations that time can be so kind that with all the minute micro-planning that goes into a trip that final part about getting to the ship on time would be challenged by trying to get on later. I can't even imagine being at the port in the later times just to get in a meal or avoid a crowd. Too many things can go wrong. But then the same applies for me when arriving on the day of the cruise. I must arrive a day or more early because the cost of a room is so overshadowed by the massive expense of the entire trip should I miss it for any reason by waiting to arrive on the day of the cruise. I am a logic based thinker so no amount of side interests or personal decision can interfer with the bottom line, getting on that ship.

 

On ships being late or unexpected issues due to anything, better to be there waiting too early than heading home because I got there too late. For me, planning as if something can and will go wrong just makes sense.

 

As heartbreaking as these stories are maybe they will help others put a little more thought into making plans that require that everything work out perfectly. Real life usually doesn't run so smoothly so plan it so you are not relying on good luck. A hundred dollars or so for an overnight stay before the cruise is much cheaper than missing the trip. A last minute sightseeing or dining excursion missed is cheaper than missing a cruise. Having to wait 3 hours because the ship arrives late and you were not notified is better than having to wait 3 hours in the airport because you missed the ship.

 

Anything short of that is simply learning the hard way.

[hammybee]

.

 

 

As heartbreaking as these stories are maybe they will help others put a little more thought into making plans that require that everything work out perfectly.

 

I like the way you put this.

 

Regardless of should be's, the onus is on the customer to confirm, reconfirm and oh why not, re-re- confirm all flights and boarding times.

[ekerr19]

On our recent cruise, I enterred our information on line and printed out the boarding pass. When in the casino, trying to use our room key card in the Eurodam machines, it refused to take the card. When someone from HAL came to help, it turned out that DH's birthday had been enterred on the card as 1/1/ intsead of 1/2. Now, really, I didn't make this error on the boarding information and the passport should have to agree with the boarding pass, right? So, who transcribed this incorrectly ?

 

Carol -

 

The same thing happens to us on each and every cruise when we try and activate our internet account. My DH has "II" (as in the second) at the end of his name and whoever enters it on HAL's end, puts it in as "ii" so when we log on initially, we always have to remember our last name is not "Kerr" for HAL's purposes, but "Kerrii" :) I thought this stuff only happened to us, but I see we're not the only ones!

[Goldryder]

If there is one thing in this world I really hate, it's those who leave their common sense on the mantle at home (if they had any to begin with, of course). I was on my way back from Houston last weekend and had a stopover at Amsterdam, the times the voice came over the tannoy asking people to get to their departure gate now or their luggage would be offloaded.

 

If you are told to take your paperwork with you...TAKE IT...the cruise line/airline/bus line whatever sent it to you for a reason, its not there to decorate the wheeliebin outside the back door.

 

If you are told to be at a certain place at a set time, don't go bellyaching because you ignored it with a 'they don't really mean it' attitude and you get told to sling your hook. Get there ahead of time, OK yes it is boring standing in a queue but its a darn sight better than standing at the gate, grizzling and stamping your little foot cos you got offloaded.

 

Instructions are given to you for a reason, if you do not follow them, if then you miss or are offloaded from the ship, plane, train, bus, taxi or whatever else it is YOUR fault and no-one elses.

 

Follow the instructions that you are given...what is so flippin' hard to comprehend about that?

 

Use your common sense and do as you are told, when you are told, how you are told, simple as that.

 

Keep your common sense with you at all times and start taking responsibility for your own actions....cruise lines etc are NOT nannies!

 

:rolleyes:

[bahrain_not_dubai!]

I tend to re check and re check and re check and re check all the cruise forms a billion times.... and on our last cruise on the Norwegian Jewel i arrived an hour before the start of boarding... i mean i am only 14 but it tends to be my job to choose the holiday and buy it (with my dads money) and organise everything so i if i do screw up i can only blame myself... thankfully i havnt so far but i dont understand why someone would pay for a cruise and then not take care to make sure he has no typos and loose it all... as heartbreaking as this may sound, it did say all people have to be onboard 90 minutes prior and they where not... And as such they paid the price.

[norcal2]

I tend to re check and re check and re check and re check all the cruise forms a billion times.... and on our last cruise on the Norwegian Jewel i arrived an hour before the start of boarding... i mean i am only 14 but it tends to be my job to choose the holiday and buy it (with my dads money) and organise everything so i if i do screw up i can only blame myself... thankfully i havnt so far but i dont understand why someone would pay for a cruise and then not take care to make sure he has no typos and loose it all... as heartbreaking as this may sound, it did say all people have to be onboard 90 minutes prior and they where not... And as such they paid the price.

 

At the age of 14, how did you get so smart? What a treat to read your post that contains a boatload of logic. I am sure your parents are very proud of you. Hopefully you just helped many people preparing for a cruise.

[Williebill]

Although it was another beautiful day here, mild temperatures and sunny skiies, the few who arrived "late" for today's Oosterdam sailing were in for a BIG surprise.

About a dozen guests, some children, were denied boarding due to the "90 minute" rule.....EVEN THOUGH THEY HAD COMPLETED THEIR DOCUMENTS ONLINE, because apparently some did not put any reply in the "Nationality" space.

This showed up on the ship's report to be submitted to CBP that their nationality is "unknown".

Whether it be a typo in entering you passport number, birthdate, etc. you can only protect yourself by having checked in at the pier at least 90 minutes before sailing. Have your room key in you hand at least one and a half hours before sailing!

I heard that one family today arrived in two cars, some in time to get their missing information into the computer at the check in station and the others not so lucky. The result was a heartbreaking experience for the HAL staff and the affected guests. You guessed it....one child and the father denied boarding, and the mother and other kids onboard. Not good.

Two other guests now have opted to pay to fly to Cabo San Lucas and pay the $400 per person fine, in order to meet relatives onboard for a reunion or birthday or whatever (I forget).

Another passenger dropped off his cabinmate and then went himself to park the car. Guess what....he'll be alone tonight and so will she.

Two other people were having a bite to eat at Anthony's at 3:45pm just 100 yards from the ship, (as I saw the Oosterdam luggage tags on their bags). I was hoping that they had already checked, but just a few minutes late they entered the terminal only to find out that they, too, had not completed one critical portion of their pre-registration. They joined the others....in frustration, and misplaced anger aimed at the HAL check in staff.

At this point, it was apparent to me that I need to reiterrate on this board....the minute that I get home....of the necessity to get to the pier on time. If you haven't allowed enough time to park the car, grab a bite to eat or whatever....you may have serious consequences awaiting you.

No one affected will get a refund, and those returning home be the airlines will be charged a rebooking fee plus whatever the current rate is for a new booking.

It was very, very sad, and the worst part is that it was completely avoidable.

The silly thing was that it was said that it was "HAL's fault for not notifying" these guests of the consequences of a minor typographical input error or omission.

It really doesn't matter who's to blame....it's an unpleasant ending to an otherwise nearly perfect day.....and as I said....completely avoidable.

David

 

It is amazing what some people will do and instead of taking responsibility, they will blame anyone else for the outcome.

[cruzmaven]

First of all I agree that the people involved should have taken the personal responsibility to make sure they arrived in time resolve any last minute issues and board the ship.

 

However, couldn't all of this be avoided if HAL, and other cruiselines, in light of the 90 minute reporting requirement, put on everyone's documentation the time they anticpate boarding to close. In other words, instead of listing the departure time and saying you must be there at least 90 minutes early, just list the earlier time and indicate no one will be allowed to board after that time.

 

Although you could argue it amounts to the same thing, I think for a 5:00 departure time say, that psychologically if people are told they will not be allowed to check in after 3:30 they are more likely to arrive on time than if they are told departure is at 5:00 arrive no less than 90 minutes early.

 

While I agree that you shouldn't have to baby people, sometimes it makes life easier for everyone if you do. If I was HAL I would put one everyone's documents a time 2 hours before scheduled departure as the latest time they will allow people to check in. This give them and their passengers a little leeway for late flights, traffic, etc.

[RuthC]

If I was HAL I would put one everyone's documents a time 2 hours before scheduled departure as the latest time they will allow people to check in.

Although your other suggestion is good, it isn't entirely accurate, as those people who checked in on-line correctly don't have to present themselves before the 90-minute mark.

The problem with the suggestion quoted is one of credibility. People have less than the 2 hours you suggest, and HAL allows them to check in up to 90 minutes before sailing (not 120). If HAL says something other than what they practice there would be less reason to believe anything else HAL tells them.

[pms4104]

... those people who checked in on-line correctly don't have to present themselves before the 90-minute mark.

The operative word here is "correctly".

It certanly is possible that any of us who have checked in online may not be aware of our own typos or buffoonery ... so it's good practice to get to the pier well before that 90-minute cutoff so as to clear up any questionable information submitted. Beats being denied boarding.

[RuthC]

The operative word here is "correctly".

 

It certanly is possible that any of us who have checked in online may not be aware of our own typos or buffoonery ... so it's good practice to get to the pier well before that 90-minute cutoff so as to clear up any questionable information submitted. Beats being denied boarding.

 

I don't disagree with that.

What I was responding to was the statement that HAL should give everybody a non-negotiable 90 (or even 120) minute deadline, when the requirements don't necessitate that.

They would have to let those who qualify for the lesser time standard board, and then there would be the "Why can't I get on, but you're letting them on?" arguments.

HAL's statement needs to be clear, but it also needs to be correct. There are two different boarding time standards for two different situations. HAL can't emphasize one while not mentioning the other.

[pms4104]

I don't disagree with that.

 

What I was responding to was the statement that HAL should give everybody a non-negotiable 90 (or even 120) minute deadline, when the requirements don't necessitate that.

They would have to let those who qualify for the lesser time standard board, and then there would be the "Why can't I get on, but you're letting them on?" arguments.

 

HAL's statement needs to be clear, but it also needs to be correct. There are two different boarding time standards for two different situations. HAL can't emphasize one while not mentioning the other.

Understood ... didn't mean to be contrary, simply to point out that any of us could make an error online and show up 75 minutes before sailing and be denied boarding. Perhaps HAL needs to state that correct and accurate info needs to be on file at least 90 minutes prior to sailing and that no corrections will be permitted after that time, resulting in denied boarding for anyone who did stupid.

[wrp96]

Understood ... didn't mean to be contrary, simply to point out that any of us could make an error online and show up 75 minutes before sailing and be denied boarding. Perhaps HAL needs to state that correct and accurate info needs to be on file at least 90 minutes prior to sailing and that no corrections will be permitted after that time, resulting in denied boarding for anyone who did stupid.

 

 

It may be more time than required by DHS, but at least RCCL is unequivocal about the fact that you MUST be checked in and onboard the ship no later than 90 minutes before departure (even if they recommend you be there 2 hours before departure if you haven't filled out the paperwork). It seems that the language that HAL uses could definitely be tightened up to eliminate some confusion (of course you can never completely eliminate the idiot factor but...).

[mamaofami]

Carol -

 

The same thing happens to us on each and every cruise when we try and activate our internet account. My DH has "II" (as in the second) at the end of his name and whoever enters it on HAL's end, puts it in as "ii" so when we log on initially, we always have to remember our last name is not "Kerr" for HAL's purposes, but "Kerrii" :) I thought this stuff only happened to us, but I see we're not the only ones!

 

Funny. This was the one cruise I didn't use the internet. Decided it was too short to spend the time or the money. Just an asside...I once noticed that my car registration had a small letter b in front of my name. What a mess that was to undo. Now, I really do know how to spell my name....

[Robin7]

Regardless of should be's, the onus is on the customer to confirm, reconfirm and oh why not, re-re- confirm all flights and boarding times.

 

Oh, Hammy! You cannot state that strongly enough. Check, re-check, double-, triple-, and quadruple-check!

 

We just had a near-catastrophe for our upcoming cruise. We were originally slated to leave on 20 Oct. on Korean Air. I called 28 days before our flight to re-confirm (having called once a month since we booked the dang flights back last December) and found they'd CANCELLED our flight to Auckland. And booked us in 24 hours later with us arriving at the end of our day-tour to the Bay of Islands!

 

They were SkyMiles tickets with nothing available earlier, so we ended up canceling them and having to book (what I consider to be) last minute tickets. (I didn't really want to replace the 17-year-old family room furniture this year anyway. :D ) So, while we wouldn't have missed boarding the Volendam, the rest of the family would have been off touring without us. :mad: We are now getting there another day early, and I'm really not complaining about another day in New Zealand, but it is a cautionary tale. (As is the Original Post! Do your homework, people!)

 

I'm getting discouraged. Just how does one plan ANY kind of vacation anymore if one can't plan on arriving at the time one books?????

 

Robin

[jcrandle]

And the one we use is "PICNIC"

 

"Problem In Chair, Not In Computer" :D

We would always politely say, it must have been an I/O problem, but never explain that meant Idiot/Operator.

[SAILSKAT]

After reading this thread (and knowing that I am flying in same day - couldn't work out a flight on Friday with work committments etc.) I returned to the check in site to make sure everything was 100%. It wasn't - there were some new questions that were blank. I looked at my previous printout and they were answered on that, but not on the online version when I went into edit. There was also a red warning that I should re-check my online check in the week of travel, up to 2 days before to make sure that they do not require any additional information. I wrote it in on my calendar for 3 days prior and will re-check everything.

[Hutch&Pat]

In SOME cases, HAL, in effect, is the TA. We use a PCC at HAL..... I am almost positive he would not contact us. He wouldn't know where to find us as we book our own air and hotel.

 

I'm confused ..... those using PCC's, on-line res, TA's etc all had the problem-- not sure who should be checking and where they should be checking.

 

I had presumed, that the most recent info received from HAL would be correct (in this case the boarding time in documents), but that info didn't reflect the fact that they moved the ship's arrival time back 3 hours. Never thought to check elsewhere ..... is there a site we can check last minute before leaving our hotel for the ship, like we do for airlines?

 

Pat

[SarahQ]

I've been reading this thread with some interest for the last couple of days, as I think there have been some good points brought up on both sides of the issue.

 

I'm not sure if anyone has mentioned this (it so, I must have missed it), so I'm going to post this for those who think HAL should make things more clear.

 

I just received my docs for my Eurodam 11/1 sailing (although my TA has had them for awhile already) and there is actually a completely separate full-size sheet of paper with the following information (capitalization and bold is as it appears in the letter):

 

---

 

January 17, 2008

 

IMPORTANT NOTICE TO GUEST

 

The Department of Homeland Security has implemented new requirements for the screening of cruise passenger names on all cruises departing from U.S. ports. Effective February 19, 2008, cruise lines must report a complete passenger list of names and identification at least 60 minutes prior to scheduled sailing time which requires us to have that information in our records at least 90 minutes before departure.

 

In order to meet this requirement, Holland America Line guests MUST EITHER COMPLETE

 

1. Pre-register online at www.hollandamerica.com at least 72 hours prior to departure.

 

We strongly recommend use of this service for quicker processing at the pier. Please do not forget to print out and bring your Signature Preferred Boarding Pass with proof of citizenship. (For more information on the required travel documents, please visit www.travel.state.gov/passport.)

 

OR

 

2. Register at the pier at least 90 minutes prior to scheduled departure time.

 

For those guests unable to use our online service, please arrive at the pier for embarkation approximately three (3) hours prior to sailing time to allow for list preparation and transmittal.

 

Guests who do not meet this requirement will be denied boarding with no refund and will be responsible for all related personal expenses. Please understand this is the new security requirement of the U.S. Government and not Holland America Line.

 

We appreciate your cooperation to ensure compliance with the new U.S. Government regulations.

 

Thank you for choosing Holland America Line. We look forward to welcoming you on board.

 

---

 

So, I'm not sure when they started including this, but I can't imagine anyone could claim ignorance after having something like that included with your documents...

[Jade13]

I've been reading this thread with some interest for the last couple of days, as I think there have been some good points brought up on both sides of the issue.

 

I'm not sure if anyone has mentioned this (it so, I must have missed it), so I'm going to post this for those who think HAL should make things more clear.

 

I just received my docs for my Eurodam 11/1 sailing (although my TA has had them for awhile already) and there is actually a completely separate full-size sheet of paper with the following information (capitalization and bold is as it appears in the letter):

 

---

 

For those guests unable to use our online service, please arrive at the pier for embarkation approximately three (3) hours prior to sailing time to allow for list preparation and transmittal."

January 17, 2008

 

IMPORTANT NOTICE TO GUEST

 

The Department of Homeland Security has implemented new requirements for the screening of cruise passenger names on all cruises departing from U.S. ports. Effective February 19, 2008, cruise lines must report a complete passenger list of names and identification at least 60 minutes prior to scheduled sailing time which requires us to have that information in our records at least 90 minutes before departure.

 

In order to meet this requirement, Holland America Line guests MUST EITHER COMPLETE

 

1. Pre-register online at www.hollandamerica.com at least 72 hours prior to departure.

 

We strongly recommend use of this service for quicker processing at the pier. Please do not forget to print out and bring your Signature Preferred Boarding Pass with proof of citizenship. (For more information on the required travel documents, please visit www.travel.state.gov/passport.)

 

OR

 

2. Register at the pier at least 90 minutes prior to scheduled departure time.

 

For those guests unable to use our online service, please arrive at the pier for embarkation approximately three (3) hours prior to sailing time to allow for list preparation and transmittal.

 

Guests who do not meet this requirement will be denied boarding with no refund and will be responsible for all related personal expenses. Please understand this is the new security requirement of the U.S. Government and not Holland America Line.

 

We appreciate your cooperation to ensure compliance with the new U.S. Government regulations.

 

Thank you for choosing Holland America Line. We look forward to welcoming you on board.

 

---

 

So, I'm not sure when they started including this, but I can't imagine anyone could claim ignorance after having something like that included with your documents...

 

 

Isn't this a conflict in the times from 90 minutes to 3 hours? I understand someone could be stuck in a long line.

 

"Register at the pier at least 90 minutes prior to scheduled departure time.

[cf_chuck]

Isn't this a conflict in the times from 90 minutes to 3 hours? I understand someone could be stuck in a long line.

 

"Register at the pier at least 90 minutes prior to scheduled departure time.

 

Well, the write up requires complete registration at least 90 minutes before departure. If you get stuck in a line of those that did not complete the online process (there are separate lines and the online registration does expedite the registration process), how long before do you think you should arrive at the pier? HAL's bid is 3 hrs, what's yours?

[jhannah]

I don't see a conflict. They state the 90-minute cutoff, then suggest that those who do not utilize the online system get there 3 hours prior to sailing to get all paperwork taken care of.

[MadManOfBethesda]

 

In order to meet this requirement, Holland America Line guests MUST EITHER COMPLETE

 

1. Pre-register online at www.hollandamerica.com at least 72 hours prior to departure.

 

OR

 

2. Register at the pier at least 90 minutes prior to scheduled departure time.

 

So, I'm not sure when they started including this, but I can't imagine anyone could claim ignorance after having something like that included with your documents...

 

Well, what you posted states that they have to either pre-register or show up at the pier 90 minutes before departure. From what I understand, the people denied boarding DID pre-register; it just wasn't complete and they weren't informed that it wasn't complete.

 

I'm not saying that HAL is responsible for their problems, but the issue isn't as cut-and-dried as your post implies.

 

Scott