Freedom of Information on NOROVIRUS

[DAN 60]

Having just returned from the Constellation Holy land cruise,and suffered the norovirus, why do we have to fill in the health questioner stating that

we are well, which i was. But the cruise line don't tell us that they are not well and previous cruises also suffered.

[Bouff]

I would say it was fairly obvious that there was a problem as boarding was delayed and cabins were not available until much later than normal. Nor was there the usual welcome aboard drink. They still need new passengers to complete the health questionnaire as an ongoing measure to try and prevent the virus spreading.

[cruisestitch]

What would you have done differently? Not gone on the cruise?

[Lolotte]

Is the Constellation okay now?? We are going on it soon and we would like to know if it was eradicated on the TA.

[Gonzo70]

Is the Constellation okay now?? We are going on it soon and we would like to know if it was eradicated on the TA.

 

You should be fine; it would be all over these boards if the Constellation had been eradicated during the TA.

[Noobers]

Having just returned from the Constellation Holy land cruise,and suffered the norovirus, why do we have to fill in the health questioner stating that

we are well, which i was. But the cruise line don't tell us that they are not well and previous cruises also suffered.

 

I was on the same cruise - but was fortunate to escape the virus. It did affect our behavior as we were not motivated to see any shows. It would have been helpful if Celebrity was a little more transparent. I felt it was more of an "us" vs "them", and the communication was nonexistent. It led to a very active rumor mill. One day, no bedtime chocolate (no big deal), next day, no pillows on the couch (a bigger deal). I heard horror stories of hospital bills and denial of boarding... whether they were true or not...

 

By their behavior I'm assuming there isn't yet a developed policy on how to handle the spread of the virus.

 

On the bright side, I can say now since I'm home I'm acutely aware of when I'm touching common space and I'm requesting one of my employers to please move the trashcan next to the exit door. I'm kind of fond of those automated antibacterial stands now.

[Host Jazzbeau]

The thread title implies that the OP thinks Celebrity is bound by the Freedom of Information Act. This only covers government agencies, not private citizens or companies.

 

Celebrity is free to tell you as much or as little as they choose, subject to applicable government regulations (and the market pressure of disgruntled customers...)

[cruiseacecat]

Having just returned from the Constellation Holy land cruise,and suffered the norovirus, why do we have to fill in the health questioner stating that

we are well, which i was. But the cruise line don't tell us that they are not well and previous cruises also suffered.

 

I could not agree with you more. If I had not read about an outbreak on Infinity earlier this year on c.c., I would have taken the cruise and risked bringing the virus home to my husband who has health issues. I for one would cancel the cruise and take a loss, rather than take that risk. But I cannot cancel if I do not know there is a problem.

 

Anne

[DAN 60]

Celebrity cruises has a duty of care the same as any other company.

It's not unreasonable to expect information on how many people on a

previous cruise suffered from the noroviros, so that we can make an

informed decision on whether to continue with a cruise.

[Host Jazzbeau]

I didn't say it was unreasonable. In fact my last phrase suggested that many people would expect it.

 

I was simply pointing out that you had classified your thread under the wrong legal category.

[DAN 60]

You mentioned the word ACT not me.

[Shir Hayam]

I was also on this last Holy Land cruise. It was quite obvious that the Noro outbreak was widespread, but the staff were never forthcoming with exactly how widespread it was. At the Cruise Critic party early in the cruise, the hotel director did give the percentage of ill people (6% I believe) from the previous cruise and expressed hope they could avoid another outbreak. They couldn't, despite incredibly thorough cleaning efforts. One of the group of eight I was traveling with came down with it, although her significant other did not even though he stayed with her the whole time she was ill. Weird! We all had a good time, nevertheless, but would have enjoyed it even more without the Noro bug and the service changes it caused.

 

Sheila

[Host Jazzbeau]

Pissing contest over. You win. "Freedom of Information" is just three words that happened to come together in your sentence.

[woodsmen]

I was on the same cruise - but was fortunate to escape the virus. It did affect our behavior as we were not motivated to see any shows. It would have been helpful if Celebrity was a little more transparent. I felt it was more of an "us" vs "them", and the communication was nonexistent. It led to a very active rumor mill. One day, no bedtime chocolate (no big deal), next day, no pillows on the couch (a bigger deal). I heard horror stories of hospital bills and denial of boarding... whether they were true or not...

 

By their behavior I'm assuming there isn't yet a developed policy on how to handle the spread of the virus.

 

On the bright side, I can say now since I'm home I'm acutely aware of when I'm touching common space and I'm requesting one of my employers to please move the trashcan next to the exit door. I'm kind of fond of those automated antibacterial stands now.

Yes here is what you can do. When in buffet, use tongs. Wash your hands a lot.

[bighairtexan]

I'm not sure what difference it makes how many people have noro. If it's 20 or 200 I'm going to take the same stringent precautions.

[Bouff]

Sorry, but I think the ship's crew were quite open about the problem.

 

1) One of the captain's daily announcements from the bridge ended with quite a long message about the hygiene restrictions and what we were all asked to do.

 

2) It appeared on the Celebrity Today every time.

 

3) We attended the Officers Question & Answer session on the last sea day. Obviously the issue was raised. All those who asked questions about the problem stated that they considered the crew were doing all they could to contain the outbreak and commended all the actions taken. We were told by the Hotel Director that CDC require cases to be reported to them when 2% of the passenger or crew complement were affected. Celebrity undertake that action when 1.5% of either complement are affected. That is only 30 people out of a 1950 passenger count.

 

He also told us that 91 cases were reported. Of course there may be those who did not report to the medical centre but more fool them.

 

My wife had one symptom of the virus and we reported to the medical centre. She received excellent attention, everything was checked such as blood pressure and so on, she was given an injection and a short course of medication and some special fluid to re-hydrate her. All without charge.

 

Furthermore on the last day she received a letter thanking her for her co-operation and advising that she would receive a future cruise credit in acknowledgement of the time of the vacation she lost which was one day. We have now received Future Cruise Certificates for £100 each.

 

Come on, you can't say fairer than that.

 

The virus is carried by human beings and is easily transferred by touching. I suspect therefore that the outbreak was caused by one of us, the passengers, who did not take adequate hygiene precautions.

[Noobers]

Sorry, but I think the ship's crew were quite open about the problem.

 

1) One of the captain's daily announcements from the bridge ended with quite a long message about the hygiene restrictions and what we were all asked to do.

 

2) It appeared on the Celebrity Today every time.

 

3) We attended the Officers Question & Answer session on the last sea day. Obviously the issue was raised. All those who asked questions about the problem stated that they considered the crew were doing all they could to contain the outbreak and commended all the actions taken. We were told by the Hotel Director that CDC require cases to be reported to them when 2% of the passenger or crew complement were affected. Celebrity undertake that action when 1.5% of either complement are affected. That is only 30 people out of a 1950 passenger count.

 

He also told us that 91 cases were reported. Of course there may be those who did not report to the medical centre but more fool them.

 

My wife had one symptom of the virus and we reported to the medical centre. She received excellent attention, everything was checked such as blood pressure and so on, she was given an injection and a short course of medication and some special fluid to re-hydrate her. All without charge.

 

Furthermore on the last day she received a letter thanking her for her co-operation and advising that she would receive a future cruise credit in acknowledgement of the time of the vacation she lost which was one day. We have now received Future Cruise Certificates for £100 each.

 

Come on, you can't say fairer than that.

 

The virus is carried by human beings and is easily transferred by touching. I suspect therefore that the outbreak was caused by one of us, the passengers, who did not take adequate hygiene precautions.

 

Thank you Bouff!!! I am so glad you posted this information. I knew about the first part of point 3, and very glad to hear Celebrity made amends with you. As I mentioned all I heard was the product of the rumor mill so I'll take what you said as far more factual! Kudos to Celebrity.

 

I spoke with one passenger in Barcelona on the way home and he said he was sick the moment he got on board, so I think we were dealing with more than just Noro...

[Gracie115]

Thank you Bouff!!! I am so glad you posted this information. I knew about the first part of point 3, and very glad to hear Celebrity made amends with you. As I mentioned all I heard was the product of the rumor mill so I'll take what you said as far more factual! Kudos to Celebrity.

 

I spoke with one passenger in Barcelona on the way home and he said he was sick the moment he got on board, so I think we were dealing with more than just Noro...

 

 

While I think it was very nice of Celebrity to provide the credits I do object to the statement "made amends" to you. They did nothing wrong! The virus was brought on board and several here have already mentioned the efforts made by all the crew to limit it as much as possible. It's not fun to be sick and Celebrity doesn't want you sick...they want you out spending $$... They can't prevent someone who is sick (either knowingly or unknowingly) brining the virus on board....they are very nice to offer credits to those affected, it's a good PR move, but it sure is not "owed" to anyone. Unfortunately sometimes bad things happen..and we just have to deal with it....

 

Now, if they kept the virus on board a secret...that would be different...but based on what Bouff posted that was not the case.

[dkjretired]

Sorry, but I think the ship's crew were quite open about the problem.

 

1) One of the captain's daily announcements from the bridge ended with quite a long message about the hygiene restrictions and what we were all asked to do.

 

2) It appeared on the Celebrity Today every time.

 

3) We attended the Officers Question & Answer session on the last sea day. Obviously the issue was raised. All those who asked questions about the problem stated that they considered the crew were doing all they could to contain the outbreak and commended all the actions taken. We were told by the Hotel Director that CDC require cases to be reported to them when 2% of the passenger or crew complement were affected. Celebrity undertake that action when 1.5% of either complement are affected. That is only 30 people out of a 1950 passenger count.

 

He also told us that 91 cases were reported. Of course there may be those who did not report to the medical centre but more fool them.

 

My wife had one symptom of the virus and we reported to the medical centre. She received excellent attention, everything was checked such as blood pressure and so on, she was given an injection and a short course of medication and some special fluid to re-hydrate her. All without charge.

 

Furthermore on the last day she received a letter thanking her for her co-operation and advising that she would receive a future cruise credit in acknowledgement of the time of the vacation she lost which was one day. We have now received Future Cruise Certificates for £100 each.

 

Come on, you can't say fairer than that.

 

The virus is carried by human beings and is easily transferred by touching. I suspect therefore that the outbreak was caused by one of us, the passengers, who did not take adequate hygiene precautions.

 

Buoff:

 

Thank you for the info from the Captains meeting. Just a couple of quick points. Cruise lines do not have a responsibility to report norovirus to the CDC unless the ship stops at a US port which I believe your cruise did not.

 

The CDC listings do not have anything on them for Constellation for your cruise or the week before so it wasn't reported. There is also an excellent web site that shows illness outbreaks on ships which is pretty good and they don't have anything for Connie.

 

http://www.cruisejunkie.com/outbreaks2011.html

[lysolqn]

Celebrity cruises has a duty of care the same as any other company.

It's not unreasonable to expect information on how many people on a

previous cruise suffered from the noroviros, so that we can make an

informed decision on whether to continue with a cruise.

 

Playing devil's advocate, other than an occasional evening news report about a local school closing to properly disinfect after a particularly bad noro outbreak, what company are you aware of that routinely shares info re noro? Does your employer divulge how many employees are doing battle with noro at any given time so you can make an informed decision re whether or not you wish to go to work? How about the supermarket in which you shop? The restaurant in which you regularly dine? How about the hotel or all-inclusive resort you're about to check into; do you expect to be told about recent noro outbreaks to enable you to make an informed decision re whether or not you wish to spend your vacation there?

 

Noro is everywhere all the time but thanks to the media the public has fallen hook, line and sinker into the notion that noro is somehow a cruise ship illness. The result is not pax demanding cruise lines offer them the same duty of care shown by other companies, as you suggest, but rather pax demanding that cruise lines be held to a higher standard, owing them a much higher duty of care than even businesses with whom pax interact on a daily basis. JMHO.

[Gracie115]

Playing devil's advocate, other than an occasional evening news report about a local school closing to properly disinfect after a particularly bad noro outbreak, what company are you aware of that routinely shares info re noro? Do you expect your employer to divulge how many employees are doing battle with noro at any given time? The supermarket in which you shop? The restaurant in which you regularly dine? How about the hotel or all-inclusive resort you're about to check into?

 

Noro is everywhere all the time but thanks to the media, the public has fallen hook, line and sinker into the notion that noro is somehow a cruise ship illness. That has resulted not in cruise lines being expected to show the same duty of care as any other company re noro, but rather a much higher duty of care than any other company. JMHO.

 

 

Well said..and very true...

[dkjretired]

Playing devil's advocate, other than an occasional evening news report about a local school closing to properly disinfect after a particularly bad noro outbreak, what company are you aware of that routinely shares info re noro? Does your employer divulge how many employees are doing battle with noro at any given time so you can make an informed decision re whether or not you wish to go to work? How about the supermarket in which you shop? The restaurant in which you regularly dine? How about the hotel or all-inclusive resort you're about to check into; do you expect to be told about recent noro outbreaks to enable you to make an informed decision re whether or not you wish to spend your vacation there?

 

Noro is everywhere all the time but thanks to the media the public has fallen hook, line and sinker into the notion that noro is somehow a cruise ship illness. The result is not pax demanding cruise lines offer them the same duty of care shown by other companies, as you suggest, but rather pax demanding that cruise lines be held to a higher standard, owing them a much higher duty of care than even businesses with whom pax interact on a daily basis. JMHO.

 

Great post, it goes along with the news media motto "if it bleeds, it leads". To put things in perspective about 4000 people per year get noro on cruise ships while something like 30 million people get Noro in the US each year...

[Lsimon]

... I spoke with one passenger in Barcelona on the way home and he said he was sick the moment he got on board, so I think we were dealing with more than just Noro...

 

It probably was noro, and the reason he was sick "the moment he got on board" was because he got infected a day or two prior during his travels or pre-cruise stay and brought it with him just in time for the symptoms to present themselves on board. This is exactly how these get introduced and reintroduced onto the ship.

 

Celebrity knows how to handle noro and can usually wipe it out between cruises. But if they are sailing from a port, or time of year, where there is a lot of people bringing it on then it gets re-introduced on successive cruises.

[Minoushka]

One of the ways to avoid NORO is definitely lots of hand washing Avoid contact with face or nose and mouth Also do not use public bathrooms Bring your own sani wipes to wipe your own bathroom...regularly .Lysol wipes are good Do not take a sanitizer as substitute for vigorous hand washing

On our cruise to SOUTH AMERICA lots of Noro THank God we did not get sick because of precautions taken

[Noobers]

While I think it was very nice of Celebrity to provide the credits I do object to the statement "made amends" to you. They did nothing wrong! The virus was brought on board and several here have already mentioned the efforts made by all the crew to limit it as much as possible. It's not fun to be sick and Celebrity doesn't want you sick...they want you out spending $$... They can't prevent someone who is sick (either knowingly or unknowingly) brining the virus on board....they are very nice to offer credits to those affected, it's a good PR move, but it sure is not "owed" to anyone. Unfortunately sometimes bad things happen..and we just have to deal with it....

 

Now, if they kept the virus on board a secret...that would be different...but based on what Bouff posted that was not the case.

 

Agreed - poor choice of words, Celebrity doesn't owe anything to OP but they would appreciate if he'd return to spend $$.

 

As I was told (through the rumor mill) there was someone prevented from boarding in Istanbul due to being sick but I was not a witness.