opting out of auto tipping?

[luddite]

I find these people who want to keep insisting there way is the right way. Everyone has free speech and free right to tip. What is the problem? Good service = Good Tip;) Don't understand why this entire message board acts like this?

 

Sorry 'bout that. Responded before looking at the date. I'm guessing that this poster has had time to learn how the system works.

[LHT28]

He told me yes he made good money, but he worked long hours with no days off until his contract ended. Then he would go home for 2 or 3 months and then start another contract and work 6 to 8 months until he had another 2 to 3 months off between contracts.

 

His biggest gripe was he missed his family, and as he got older and into his forties, he found the long hours were on harder on him. That is why he left the cruise industry. I agree-so what if they make good money, they work hard and they sacrifice a lot to make that income. I know I would not want my husband gone for 6 or 8 months at a time without seeing him.

I agree

We have met a couple of crew & they work long hours not a 9-5 job where you go home to your family at the end of your shift

Some of the older crew find it very hard to be on their feet all day but the option of finding work in their country may not be there

They do it to provide a better life for their family

[greatam]

I am a little disappointed that a large number of answers on the tipping subject would appear to be coming from those with motivated by self interest ie., crew members etc.

 

There are very few, if any, posts from crew members. The majority of posters in this thread are regular Cruise Critic posters.

 

As an ex waiter, my tips frequently were 3 to 4 times my wages and I received a fair wage. The slant that US crews are poorly paid therefore have the right to be tipped regardless of quality of service just does not hold water. In fact that 'it is my right to be tipped' encourages the lazy and less competent, ultimately goes against the interests of those who do work hard for their clients.

 

WHAT US CREW???? The only US crew is on NCL's ship that travels around Hawaii.

 

Most of the crew are from SE Asia or Eastern Europe. And tips make up a good part of the crew's wages.

 

Also this rubbish about the behind the scenes staff is a sob story. As a waiter I always shared my tips generously, otherwise I would not have got their support.

 

Auto tipping is generally supported by the lazy, the true professional will gamble on the knowledge that if he provides his best service he will get the best tips.

 

You are dealing with QUITE a different situation. These people are all living together although they are from very, very different countries and cultures. While a land based restaurant would generally have the same wait people and behind the scenes people working together, waiters on cruise ships may be working in the main dining room, the buffet, the outdoor grill, any one of many, many places where food is served. So the relationship between the back end and the buffet is certainly different than the relationship between a waiter in a good restaurant and the back end on land.

 

 

So here is a free TIP; NO AUTO TIPPING; DO NOT TIP FOR POOR SERVICE; TIP WELL FOR GOOD SERVICE; DO NOT WAIT TILL THE END OF THE TRIP TIP IMMEDIATELY WHEN THE SERVICE IS PROVIDED AND DIRECTLY TO THE PROVIDER; TOP UP AT THE END IF YOU HAVE HAD A GOOD TIME!!!!!!

 

If your cruise was disappointing, tell cruise critic. happy cruising

 

You REALLY don't understand, do you? On most lines, any tips given directly to staff IF you have opted out of auto tipping get pooled. You have DEFEATED YOUR STATED purpose of only tipping those who provide excellent service. EVERYONE shares!!!! The waiter who was exceptional and you handed a $100 bill to has to share with the waiter who was a jerk and you hated. What did you accomplish???

[wwcruisers]

Sorry 'bout that. Responded before looking at the date. I'm guessing that this poster has had time to learn how the system works.

 

Yeah -- first time poster, who doesn't seem very familiar with how things work on cruise ships, digs up a 6-month old thread -- makes you wonder... :rolleyes:

[dave_k63]

LOL No I do not want to stiff them. I would like to tip as I go along as I believe if the service is not up to standard then they do not deserve my tip, also if they are exceptional they deserve extra. Also my son who is 13 is travelling with me, I do not agree to the cruise liner charging a 13 yr old a daily fee for service (at the end of the day he's only a child) but hey that's just my opinion. Bearing in mind this my first ever cruise and I just want to enjoy it and not be stiffed myself :rolleyes:

whatever you are intending - you ARE stiffing some crew members that are serving you. Why do you think a 13 year old is less trouble than an adult? I think the tipping policy is more than fair to the passenger, and those to don't like it, should find vacation more to their budget.

[luddite]

I agree

We have met a couple of crew & they work long hours not a 9-5 job where you go home to your family at the end of your shift

Some of the older crew find it very hard to be on their feet all day but the option of finding work in their country may not be there

They do it to provide a better life for their family

 

In fairness, everyone that I know who goes to work does it to provide a better life for their family.

[LHT28]

In fairness, everyone that I know who goes to work does it to provide a better life for their family.

This is true

I guess some are away from family for months also EG military

[jamessemaj]

I haven't bothered to read this thread, but I know cheap is cheap. I tip generously to those who provide service to me. Discuss as you will or choose, I don't care. Cheap is cheap.

[momofmeg]

In fairness, everyone that I know who goes to work does it to provide a better life for their family.

 

True, but the family suffers especially the children, if your job is more than 40 hours a week and you have little time to spend with them. Young children need each parent to spend time with them daily.

[momofmeg]

I haven't bothered to read this thread, but I know cheap is cheap. I tip generously to those who provide service to me. Discuss as you will or choose, I don't care. Cheap is cheap.

 

LOL! and that has nothing to do with the discussion right now-that was discussed earlier in the thread. You don't care to read but you care to post your opinion? For your opinion to be worthwhile to others besides yourself you need to read the posts.

[momofmeg]

This is true

I guess some are away from family for months also EG military

 

My dad was military and you are right-he was gone more than months. He was gone even years as my mother did not gnat us to go overseas with him. Once he spent 2 years in France that we did not see him. I can tell you us kids suffered too. We hardly knew our dad and we did not have a strong bond with him.

[thinfool]

I haven't bothered to read this thread, but I know cheap is cheap. I tip generously to those who provide service to me. Discuss as you will or choose, I don't care. Cheap is cheap.

 

Everyone here is, more or less, spitting in the ocean. The OP, her feelings and actions, is long gone.

[spookwife]

LOL No I do not want to stiff them. I would like to tip as I go along as I believe if the service is not up to standard then they do not deserve my tip, also if they are exceptional they deserve extra. Also my son who is 13 is travelling with me, I do not agree to the cruise liner charging a 13 yr old a daily fee for service (at the end of the day he's only a child) but hey that's just my opinion. Bearing in mind this my first ever cruise and I just want to enjoy it and not be stiffed myself :rolleyes:

 

this serves no purpose. as has been stated.. the people you would be tipping have to share anyway . also.. sorry but everyone regardless of age generates work.. and kids.. can be three times the work. the 13 year old still gets fed and waited on the same way you do, he has access to the kids clubs, he gets spoiled rotten by the staff missing their own kids and siblings. he uses the bathroom, he uses a bed.

[icecake]

Why would you want to opt out of auto-tipping?

 

Because I want to decide who looks after me more than they are paid to do so. If you think that auto tipping is such a great idea, why not lobby the companies to incorporate tips in the price.

I cannot understand a culture of automatic tipping. Surely tipping is for service over and above the service that is being paid for.

[icecake]

this serves no purpose. as has been stated.. the people you would be tipping have to share anyway . also.. sorry but everyone regardless of age generates work.. and kids.. can be three times the work. the 13 year old still gets fed and waited on the same way you do, he has access to the kids clubs, he gets spoiled rotten by the staff missing their own kids and siblings. he uses the bathroom, he uses a bed.

 

Are you telling me that 13 year olds have to pay extra to use the bathroom, sleep in a bed! Thank you very much for this information. There is me thinking bed and bathroom were included in the price.

[thinfool]

Because I want to decide who looks after me more than they are paid to do so. If you think that auto tipping is such a great idea, why not lobby the companies to incorporate tips in the price.

I cannot understand a culture of automatic tipping. Surely tipping is for service over and above the service that is being paid for.

 

I assume that you are new to the world of cruising. The waitstaff, room stewards, bus boys, etc are not paid a living wage. They are not subject to US labor laws, either. The majority of their living is made from the gratuity charges. For many, if not most, passengers, the autotip is a convenient way to make sure that they do not go unrewarded.

 

Everyone is assessed the autotip...young, old, infants, etc. You can opt to remove it if you like.

 

Whatever choice you make be assured that you will not change the way that the various servers are paid. If you remove the autotip, know that you will miss tipping someone in your 'service chain' who deserves a tip.

[smeyer418]

I hate tipping threads...and this is not aimed at anyone in particular.

 

as I said I hate tipping threads mostly because there is so much misinformation(in some cases deliberately so by people who have an ax to grind or a particular view of the world).

 

The service people on most of the tipping cruise lines are paid a base salary of something around $100 per MONTH plus on board room and board and some on board medical care) here is a thread from someone who works/ed in the dining room that talks about this.

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1107696

 

They do take home more because they get a draw against the tips and the tips themselves.

 

This method of paying the traditional tipped crew goes back to at least the early 1900's and was continued by Samuel Cunard who was born in Canada and immigrated to England.

 

In fact in the 1910-30 there was a movement in the US to do away with tipping-which obviously failed.

 

Because of the fare structure now the remuneration for the traditionally tipped crew is NOT included in the fare. Generally those cruise lines that do include it charge more than the difference between the cost of tipping non tipping(Azamara announced a 25% increase and included the "basic" tipping and some other items-none of which when added together could justify a 25% increase-but I don't know if the full increase has held this is an example I realize that your cruise line may not be Azamara or Seaborn or other of the luxury lines where in general you pay a premium to get the base tip included-do you really think that people no longer tip on these lines).

 

Whether its in the fare or the expected tip, its you are paying it anyway. I really don't see why you may want to pay more to have it included in the fare.

 

On most cruise lines when you remove the auto -tip all or most of the cash tip is put back into the pool anyway so in fact you make it more difficult for those who you want to reward. The best way to reward these people is to either write a note to their supervisors explaining how they went over and above or giving them a little extra(at your discretion of course).

The auto tip takes care of what the employees were required to do anyway(called tipping out). The rooms stewards traditionally tipped out the laundry room supply room staff and asst head housekeeper(the name for this varies among cruise lines); and the waiters tipped out the bus boys, dishwashers, line cooks and asst head waiter/maitre d(also varies by cruise line).

Do the employees just pocket the cash? mostly no. If the auto-tip is removed and they don't turn it in(BTW I have been told by some staff they sometimes convert extra tips left by some which they don't have to turn in at all to pay for the cheapos/stiffers because they ARE marked down when people keep taking the auto-tip off and leave nothing or less than the suggested amount-rightfully or wrongfully its held against them). The employees live in close quarters 3-4 in a room and they don't want large amounts of cash lying around either. The employees know pretty quickly who are the slackers and pocketers and since the supervisor is one of the people being stiffed by the employees they get a. fired b. non renewed or c the worst assignments....and also have been known to be visited by their own countries of origin mafia on board.

Ships are clearly a different culture with somewhat different rules. The tipping culture is a tradition on board. I know some people dis like being told when in Rome....but you aren't in Kansas either.

If you don't like the auto-tip you are of course free to chose another cruise line that includes it but if you like the cruise line’s product and the service you really SHOULD follow the tradition.

 

There is also not one iota of evidence that the entire auto tip doesn't make it to the traditionally tipped and tipped out crew. The cruise lines even absorb the credit card charge although that is subject to change. Cruise employees sue cruise lines all the time and there is NOT one report of any crew member that the entire amount doesn't eventually get to them and not one reported lawsuit...yet(I monitor a number of cruise lawyers reports who would report any such lawsuit).

I also don’t believe that in most cases that tipping has anything to do with the service you-or even how much the employees get paid. It’s a function more of training, supervision and the individual’s employees work ethic more than anything else…as in a good McDonald’s.

 

 

 

Now them is the facts. If you would like to discuss the facts please do but just like you may complain when someone on formal night wears shorts, traditions should be obeyed.

[njhorseman]

Are you telling me that 13 year olds have to pay extra to use the bathroom, sleep in a bed! Thank you very much for this information. There is me thinking bed and bathroom were included in the price.

 

I'd suggest you read the post again and attempt to make another interpretation.

[paul929207]

Are you telling me that 13 year olds have to pay extra to use the bathroom, sleep in a bed! Thank you very much for this information. There is me thinking bed and bathroom were included in the price.

You sure twisted that post. Try reading it again. They do not have pay toilets on ships. There is not a charge everytime you get into a bed.

[dave_k63]

Has opting out of auto-tipping impacted anyones previous cruise aboard the Grand Princess at all?

Yes - you will most likely be labeled a low-life cheap skate on the message boards

[SusanSmithJr]

Do I want to go around with a notebook figuring who gets what and when? What was that attendent's name again? Which of our waiters sang the best? Did that maid give me the stink-eye? Were my dishes removed promptly on formal night? And are we supposed to tip the dishwasher?

 

Princess's motto is "Escape Completely". That's what I want to do, not have to worry. If the cruise line says 11 bucks a day is fair, and the crew signed on for that, and I signed on for that, then it is right and it is one less thing I have to worry about.

 

I can understand if we were talking about tipping the trash collectors or the mailman, both services are needed. But this is a cruise and you can always just opt out of going if you don't like the rules. If you don't like tipping the cab driver take the bus, if you don't like tipping the waitress eat at Burger King, if you don't like tipping the cruise crew fly.

[MrsPete]

LOL No I do not want to stiff them. I would like to tip as I go along as I believe if the service is not up to standard then they do not deserve my tip, also if they are exceptional they deserve extra. Also my son who is 13 is travelling with me, I do not agree to the cruise liner charging a 13 yr old a daily fee for service (at the end of the day he's only a child) but hey that's just my opinion. Bearing in mind this my first ever cruise and I just want to enjoy it and not be stiffed myself :rolleyes:

Tipping three times a day (no, more -- don't forget bartenders and people who serve snacks) is going to take a good bit of effort, and you're unlikely to receive bad service. Really, if you don't believe me, start a thread and ask how often people have received bad service. If you follow your ill-conceived method, you're going to spend more time and effort yourself, and you're forcing the wait staff to turn in piddly couple-dollar tips every day to the pool rather than just waiting 'til the end of the week and collecting their "pay" in one lump sum. Would you really like your boss to come around and hand you a couple dollars every hour, or would you prefer one check directly deposited into your checking account at the end of the week?

 

 

Serving food and drink to a 13-year old takes just as much effort as serving food and drink to an adult. Making a 13-year old's bed or clearing out his towels takes just as much effort as cleaning up after an adult. So why would you NOT expect to tip for him?

 

 

You say it's your first cruise. Don't try to guess about a better system -- especially when you haven't yet seen the reality of the system. Really, just do what's expected. It's easy for you, it's fair for the people who receive the tips.

I hope everyone doesn't mind if I ask a question about tips. Does the bar staff pool their tips with the other crew meembers or does the bar staff keep their own tips to themselves. Does the bar staff get a potion of autotips?

No. Autotips go to all food-service staff and your cabin steward. Bartenders have no part in the autotip.

 

Bartender tips are added (I think it's 15%) onto each drink you buy. This is true whether you buy a Coke, a beer, a glass of wine or a mixed drink. These are automatically added to the slip you sign every time you get a drink.

 

So let's place the blame where it belongs. The cruise line management are the ones who seem like the bad guy. They avoid all the taxes they can. They play all sorts of games with the wages of their workers and the listed prices of cruises.

I agree that a better way exists -- but the cruise line won't use it because they want their bottom line to appear small at booking time. So, that leaves me, the consumer with two moral options:

 

1. Protest with my dollar. Do not cruise, at least until they change the system.

2. Go along with it, recognize that the tip is a portion or the cruise cost, and pay the servers, bartenders, etc. the suggested, standard tip.

 

And it leaves the consumer with one immoral option:

 

3. Go ahead and cruise, but stiff the server because you don't like the company's policy.

 

We don't tip in advance in a hotel or restaurant, why in the world would we do it on a cruise ship?

Because it makes your cruise more simple when you don't have to bother to carry small bills around / when you don't have to stop to consider how much to leave. Also because if you pay your tips ahead of time on your RC VISA it garners you double-points, which can lead to OBC.

That is exactly the point I'm making. The cruiselines acknowledge that 3rd and 4th people require less effort, and kids pay less in restaurants for a reason. So why not acknowledge it on the DSC as well?

You have half a point when it comes to the cabin steward: Yes, vaccuming a room and cleaning a bathroom for 4 people takes exactly the same amount of effort and time as vaccuming or bathroom-cleaning for 2 people. However, that's where the similarities end. Pulling down bunks or opening a sofa bed requires a good bit of effort each night (and then they must be put away the next day). Twice as many towels, twice as much garbage, twice as much ice, twice as many plates and glasses to remove. And although some families may be neat as a pin, when you double the people in the cabin, you double the number of shoes left on the floor, etc. More people does usually = more mess. So I really can't see charging the 3rd and 4th person less for the cabin cleaning.

 

And when it comes to food, I can't see it at all. No matter whether you're eating in the dining room, the buffet, or the pizza place, cooking and cleaning is cooking and cleaning -- no matter who is being served. I know that most waiters have gone out of their way to be super-good to our kids. A couple things stand out: On one cruise (last time we had traditional dining), every single night the waiters presented the five kids at our table with their own plate of chocolate chip cookies to take back to the cabin (always on a pretty plate topped with a silver dome). On another cruise, my super-shy youngest wouldn't say what she wanted for dessert, so the waiter announced, "Don't worry -- I'll bring you the shy girl special". Let me just say that it was so special that for the rest of the cruise all four of my girls were clambouring to sit at his table so they could order "The Shy Girl".

 

Do me a favor. Pretend like you are not a 'know it all' and go onto rccl's website and, just for fun, create a cruise from start to finish. When you are done come back and apologize. It is not automatically added. Maybe thru the TA you use or something but not the way I book. Once you have done that and realize that you too could learn something on these boards maybe you wont be so rude.

 

quid pro quo motha!

This varies from cruise line to cruise line and is not as cut-and-dry as you make it sound.

 

We tend to go with Royal Caribbean, and I can tell you that if you're sailing with them, the auto-tip is automatically added IF, like many of us, you prefer to use My Time Dining. No option. Alternately, if you still like the old-fashioned assigned-dining times, you have the choice to auto-tip or not to auto-tip.

[luddite]

Because I want to decide who looks after me more than they are paid to do so. If you think that auto tipping is such a great idea, why not lobby the companies to incorporate tips in the price.

I cannot understand a culture of automatic tipping. Surely tipping is for service over and above the service that is being paid for.

 

I can see that you've not done much research on this subject and that you are unaware of how the system works, nor why it is actually cheaper for as a passenger with the current system.

 

I'm certain that after you have checked on how things work that you'll have a better understanding and will work with the system.