Mega Cruise ships....how big is too big?

[halos]

[quote name='Dolphins']Considering we are currently in a recession with high unemployment, I found it amazing that they are able to fill these mega ships every week? How do they do it?[/quote]

I wonder the same. I cruise, ships are full...airports are full of traveling families.
I go out to dinner, have to have a reservation or a VERY long wait or can't get a table at all.
I go to the mall and people are shopping/buying
I have recently moved and have been to furniture stores and home repair (Lowe's etc) stores a LOT over the past 6 months...always busy. The realtors I dealt with to sell/buy a house have had a totally amazing past year. The one decided to start a family, the other bought themselves a very nice Lexus SUV.

I know there are still so many unemployed and I am not downplaying things...but you have to wonder of media is OVERplaying and there is a lot of plain old fear mongering going on. From what I actually am seeing with my own eyes, people [I]for the most part[/I] are doing ok. Plus, smart people, even if they are struggling[I] a little[/I], will cut back and save what they can in order to vacation because vacation is vital to mental health.

[quote name='beachmonkey']My issue with the larger ships is the commercial atmosphere. If you look at RC cruises, they have Starbucks and Johnny Rockets. These are okay for land based services, but I don't want to sail and see the same thing on the ship. I also don't want to feel like I am in a shopping mall.[/quote]



I agree!! I just got off the Sun...old ship, small by todays standards and I knew in my heart that the SUN was as big a ship as I like to be on. More attention to space as opposed to 'frills'

Only 1900 passengers...never feel crowded.

Booked it again for next year :D

[gambee]

We sailed on the Allure and had the most memorable trip ever yet. The ship while not feeling much like a ship, offers incredible opportunities for different type of activities. There is something for everyone. In addition to that the ship only felt crowded on embarkation day, after that you could rarely tell the amount of people on board.

I am big fan of technology and the wow factor, the bigger the better for us. We are really looking forward for Breakaway.

We are also set to depart this Sunday on Silhouette and I am a little bit worried that it might not offer the wow factor that we experienced on the Allure. Also the size is on the smaller size for our liking. No the less I am sure that it will be a trip to remember as all our vacations are.

[sdmike]

[quote name='terrydtx']The Jones act has out lived its purpose and needs to be repealed. Would open up the East and West Coast to competitive coastal cruises like in Europe and Asia. The Great Lakes cruise ship is an interesting thought but with 7 to 8 months of cold weather could be the limiting factor, what to do with them the during the cold season.[/quote]

Haul ore? ;)

Given the weather up there, I would think they would tied up firmly to a dock! (playing the Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald in my head)

[sdmike]

[quote name='NLH Arizona']I don't think anyone said they have a fear of mega ships, just that they prefer the smaller ships. Just like some like going to concerts in stadiums, while other like going to concerts in more intimate venues. Its all about personal choice and that is what makes the world go around. Just think if we all only preferred the same things.[/quote]

I agree that variety is the spice of life, and it's awesome that there's a cruise out there for everyone. My point around "fear" is that many folks have expressly stated that they are afraid that the ship would seem too crowded, or less personal. Folks are making assumptions about what it's like on a larger ship without having experienced it, and with some evidence to the contrary. Yeah..I know...you can decide that sticking your head in a hot oven isn't for you without trying it, but that's an unreasonable comparison. You know what "hot" is. :)

[frediver]

I just like to keep it simple:
Mega Ships Are the destination, not the ports. More money stays onboard.
Smaller ships mean the main passenger interests are port/shore based, less money
stays onboard.
If you were CEO where would you want passenger money to be spent?

[sdmike]

Along the lines of the discussion of this thread, I thought I would post this picture from CC's Face Book page. It is the Oasis of the Seas docked next to the 2000 pax X Constellation and the Constellation almost looks like a life boat in comparison.

 

Oasis Picture

 

I have a similar picture. This is the Oasis and the Splendor of the Seas in Cozumel. The Splendor is nearly 900 feet and 11 decks, so by no means a "tiny" ship.

 

[sdmike]

I just like to keep it simple:

Mega Ships Are the destination, not the ports. More money stays onboard.

Smaller ships mean the main passenger interests are port/shore based, less money

stays onboard.

If you were CEO where would you want passenger money to be spent?

 

The lines make significant money on shore excursions as well. The local operator often gets less than half of what the cruise line charges

[ChampionCruiser]

I have a similar picture. This is the Oasis and the Splendor of the Seas in Cozumel. The Splendor is nearly 900 feet and 11 decks, so by no means a "tiny" ship.

 

 

:D I LOVE pictures like these! It really is hard to imagine just how BIG they are!

 

(that's the Grandeur, though ;) - even bigger than the Splendour!)

[terrydtx]

:D I LOVE pictures like these! It really is hard to imagine just how BIG they are!

 

(that's the Grandeur, though ;) - even bigger than the Splendour!)

 

On our Jewel cruise this year we will be in Cozumel with the NCL Pearl, NCL Dawn, Carnival Magic and the RCL Allure of the seas, I hope to get a picture like this as the Magic and Allure will also make the 3 NCL ships look like Dwarfs.:eek:

[gambee]

Some of you might already seen my picture, I have posted it on several places.

 

This one was taken on Nassau.

 

 

Left to right, Majesty OTS, Disney Dream, Carnival Dream, NCL Sky and Oasis OTS.

[newmexicoNita]

We have been till now, on the smaller class of cruise ship such as the Spirit and Sun (around 2000 passengers). I can't say the new class of ships such as 'Breakaway' (4000 or so passengers) appeal to me in the slightest. On our last cruise (this month) on the 'Sun' this was a matter of discussion with fellow cruisers. Consensus among most of those we talked to was that we were not alone. I guess for familiys the new ships are appealing in the facilities they offer, but for us old timers, big is not best.

 

Any thoughts?

 

this seems to be simply a matter of choice: the biggest ship we have sailed was the Princess about a year or so ago. It held over 3500 and was way too big for us. Yet we have a friend at church that just got off one of RCIs 5000 plus ships and she loved every minute of it, from the food to the splended entertainment. I guess it depends on what you cruise for and what you expect. We love the size of the Sun, which used to be considered a large ship. Now I guess it almost falls into the mid sized ship catagory.

[chengkp75]

Sorry, just back from my two months onboard a US flag tanker, so missed the interim messages. First off, you are mistaking the Jones Act (cargo vessels) with the Passenger Vessel Service Act, which applies to US flagged passenger vessels. The US has both the Jones Act and the PVSA for the simple reason that we are relatively unique in having coast lines long enough to warrant coast-wise trade. Other countries with coastlines that require more than 24 hours to transit (Brazil, Russia) tend to have their own cabotage laws that require coastwise trade to be performed on ships of their own flag. Why, when the US government gives loans, etc, to industries in the US that are not competitive world-wide (steel, automotive, most manufacturing) due to the need to pay a "living wage" to US workers, should the maritime industry be left out of protection from foreign competition, just to allow cruisers to have more inexpensive cruises. Why do people not follow the "buy local" philosophy when cruising?

[youngestof9]

I've sailed both a smaller ship and larger. Funny, I guess it's about perception. On the Epic on a "holiday" week (President's week in February - lots of families, very busy) I didn't find it overcrowded. Got into the MDR quickly, no problem with reservations for shows, etc. I sailed the Gem to Bermuda in October - less families, less people and felt it was more crowded. Spa was ridiculously crowded and we barely used it because every time the loungers were full, the little steam rooms and whirlpools were full. Bars were always packed. So I felt more crowded on Gem than Epic.

 

But ultimately, I don't go on any cruise ship thinking it's going to be intimate and quiet. Even with 2000 other people, it's a small city in one place. I like that the newer, bigger ships have more things to do, thereby displacing people evenly. It makes it feel less crowded when people are disbursed all over the ship in different venues.

[skittl1321]

For me, it isn't about crowds as I hear most are very well designed, but safety. The lifeboats carry too many passengers each. Can they be loaded and launched in a timely manner? What if the ship lists and half can't be used? Can 6000 people be evacuated safely and efficiently?

 

Until an accident happens that proves the safety of these giants, I won't go on them. I hope to God one never does, so I'll just stick to smaller ships.

[Bizaro86]

What will limit how big they can build new ships? Do the shipyards or ports have a maximum size?

[chengkp75]

What will limit how big they can build new ships? Do the shipyards or ports have a maximum size?

 

As far as shipyards are concerned, not really. The largest cargo ship in the world is 500,000 tons. The largest drydock that I know of, is in Lisbon, and is 1,000,000 tons, and cruise ships don't normally reach anywhere near these limits.

 

For ports, there are limits like depth of water in the main channel, depth of water at the dock, dock length, height of any bridges. That's not to mention the logistical requirements of the larger ships, but ports can expand to whatever is required, given enough money.

 

What I see as the main limiting factor will be IMO regulations on lifeboats. Many of the boats on the existing mega ships carry 200-300 people, and there is some debate as to whether having a survival craft this large is actually practical. These are essentially small cruise ships in themselves, and only having 3-4 crew members in each is somewhat problematical.

[NH Cruisers]

Being on a cruise to me should be about the ocean. I want to feel the roll, I want to see the sea. As long as I can see, feel and smell the sea the ship can be as big as they can make it. I do not care for the "Oasis class" ships of RCCL because the emphasis is on the inside of the ship were you cannot sea the ocean. You can go to your balcony or an upper deck sure, But NCL new "Breakaway" hit a home run with me. Emphasising the sea having essentially that outside boardwalk. Thats the type of stuff I cruise for.

 

I do say, some cruise lines have them lounges way up high with wrap around views. Carnival doesn't. "Norweigian Dawn" didn't. That bums me out.

 

I guess if it takes more than 20 seconds to sprint the width of the bridge on a large ship, it is getting too big.

[xenagurl]

They both have their pluses and minuses and will appeal to different people for different reasons, however as long as a cruise vacation has good food and a tidy room to come back to it'll work for me. I've been throwing around the idea of taking a small boutique line cruise somewhere the kind with only a few hundred passengers, but it would be to be isolated from the world and just sit back and read not to interact.

[hattack]

I think alot of one's comfort level is based upon as one gets older, or who has cruised alot..the smaller vessels makes one feel more in touch with why one really cruises...my alltime favorite ship was the Olympia Explorer (Royal Olympc Cruises -Greek registry) that held 800 guests. we sailed from Venice and did the Agean, and it was very relaxing and one felt a kinshio with other guests...not alot of bells and whistles

 

When I cruise I don't need alot of "bells and whistles"...clean ship, great food, smooth waters, lots of peace and quiet

 

On the other hand that would drive my son...nuts...

[Bizaro86]

As far as shipyards are concerned, not really. The largest cargo ship in the world is 500,000 tons. The largest drydock that I know of, is in Lisbon, and is 1,000,000 tons, and cruise ships don't normally reach anywhere near these limits.

 

For ports, there are limits like depth of water in the main channel, depth of water at the dock, dock length, height of any bridges. That's not to mention the logistical requirements of the larger ships, but ports can expand to whatever is required, given enough money.

 

What I see as the main limiting factor will be IMO regulations on lifeboats. Many of the boats on the existing mega ships carry 200-300 people, and there is some debate as to whether having a survival craft this large is actually practical. These are essentially small cruise ships in themselves, and only having 3-4 crew members in each is somewhat problematical.

 

Thanks! That's very interesting. I guess the only way to know for sure they've reached their practical limit will be when the ships stop geting bigger!

[DMLyons]

A smaller ship built to accommodate the northern US ports - with indoor heated pool so you could enjoy from day one the "I'm on a cruise" atmosphere when sailing from the northeast in the winter - that would be my dream new ship!

 

You took the words right out of my mouth! Yes! This is precisely what they need. Not a larger ship, but a ship where you can enjoy the pool from day one, even if it's the early spring, late fall, or even winter. As an idea...imagine a grand atrium setup, where you have the pool in the center, lounges around, walk-up food/drink and maybe even the buffet restaurant along the walls...and sure...keep the plants in the area!

 

I'm thinking of the West Baden natatorium and their grand rotunda mixed.

 

I'm thinking of a nice overarching area like the rotunda...

http://images.google.com/imgres?q=west+baden+springs+hotel+indiana&biw=1366&bih=556&tbm=isch&tbnid=nU0svSOz0LhD-M:&imgrefurl=http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:West_Baden_Springs_Hotel_atrium.jpg&docid=bNt9ewYK5wfxrM&imgurl=http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a6/West_Baden_Springs_Hotel_atrium.jpg&w=3003&h=2316&ei=b7yjUdi5Caq_0gH354CICw&zoom=1&ved=1t:3588,r:1,s:0,i:86&iact=rc&dur=535&page=1&tbnh=184&tbnw=256&start=0&ndsp=10&tx=144&ty=115

Mixed with this idea...

http://images.google.com/imgres?q=west+baden+indiana+natatorium&biw=1366&bih=556&tbm=isch&tbnid=qv5CXMlLC0YrrM:&imgrefurl=http://www.flickr.com/photos/78469770%40N00/4475549762/&docid=4pjcYyo2i7medM&imgurl=http://farm5.staticflickr.com/4035/4475549762_22051b973e_z.jpg&w=640&h=426&ei=BL2jUZyDHsyz0QGgqoG4CQ&zoom=1&ved=1t:3588,r:0,s:0,i:83&iact=rc&dur=630&page=1&tbnh=176&tbnw=258&start=0&ndsp=11&tx=204&ty=91

 

DML

[big al]

We have been till now, on the smaller class of cruise ship such as the Spirit and Sun (around 2000 passengers). I can't say the new class of ships such as 'Breakaway' (4000 or so passengers) appeal to me in the slightest. On our last cruise (this month) on the 'Sun' this was a matter of discussion with fellow cruisers. Consensus among most of those we talked to was that we were not alone. I guess for familiys the new ships are appealing in the facilities they offer, but for us old timers, big is not best.

 

Any thoughts?

 

Thoughts are... on smaller ships there are NO OPTIONS! We've done the Sun, Pearl, and other small 70,000-86,000 ton ships, and although we had a good time, there wasn't much to do..one dining room seems a joke now..I like variety and options...I was STUNNNED when we went on the RCI Oasis and found NO LINES anywhere!! That is because the ship has 7 DIFFERENT & distinct areas on the ship. And they are so large, that feeling crowded just didn't happen....I love the many dining options, and we LOVE the adult pools now...sitting at the pool on the Sky, Sun, or Pearl was torture- all those kids running and screaming and you have no where to evade this...on the bigger ships, adults have their own pool area and it's bliss...I hope those of you who said they don't like mega-ships, have already cruised on one, because nothing ticks me off more than someone who "knocks it before they try it"...GAMBEE has written his review now on the Breakaway, but believe me, he was BLOWN AWAY ( as many have been ) by the Allure of The Seas ( and he thought he would hate it!)..just the water diving show at the back of the ship was worth the price of the cruise! Hairspray IMHO, was the best show we've ever seen at sea...Central park area is magnificent, especially at night, where a classical trio play every night under the open roof & stars..and the Kids LOVE the H20 Fun Zone, the Boardwalk & Carousel, Ice skating shows with Russian & Canadian skaters..it is truly amazing..if you don't want more dining options, more entertainment ( INCLUDING Jazz, disco, Pub sing-alongs,Wine Bars, 70's dance music, comedy clubs, and more, lots of pools & hot tubs ( we could NEVER get in any of the hot tubs on smaller ships like HAL, NCL,etc., because there are only 3-4 at the small pool areas and they were always full..).then that's OK...some people like the charm & romance of the older smaller ships...but DON'T KNOCK IT TILL YOU TRY IT....28 cruises on all but Costa and counting, we've done all sizes & lines...favorite cruise was Oasis, followed by Freedom Of The Seas & Liberty Of The Seas..Disney ( which we are going on the new Dream in Nov..) was also terrific- and we have no kids...Don't look at the tonnage size or amount of passengers- look at how many dining venues there are, how many pools & hot tubs & how many lounges there are...if we go on a cruise, there BETTER be a hot tub I can go in without 20 kids sitting in it LOL..BTW, we are 60 & 58 ,my wife & I, hardly kids, and I have been on all the old OCEAN LINERS like USS United States, Queen Mary, France ( which became the Norway), Queen Elizabeth, Raffaelo, and many more...on the Oasis ships, there are 8 pools & 20 hot tubs..you WILL find one for sure you can get in, and that my friends, is VERY COOL....just my thoughts & opinions....

 

Big Al

[swim13]

To put it into simple terms...

 

-There should be a ship for everyone on every line.

 

-There needs to be different sized ships so there is a better variety for port options.

 

-Everyone who says they will never sail on a behemoth ends up getting lured in somehow and LOVE it.

 

-I just like to sail the newest and best, why wouldn't you want to experience amazing venues?! :rolleyes:

[big al]

To put it into simple terms...

 

-There should be a ship for everyone on every line.

 

-There needs to be different sized ships so there is a better variety for port options.

 

-Everyone who says they will never sail on a behemoth ends up getting lured in somehow and LOVE it.

 

-I just like to sail the newest and best, why wouldn't you want to experience amazing venues?! :rolleyes:

 

 

Swim13- I couldn't have said it any better...although I tried in the post before yours!! LOL....

[SciFiCruiser]

Until 2 years ago my cruising experience had been with "normal sized" ships. A vacation on Oasis of the Seas was enjoyable. It was an impressive sight. I was thrown a bit by the dazzling array of entertainment choices. Having to make a reservation seemed a bit odd...but it was easily achieved on-line and I had no problems.

 

We are trying Breakaway in a few months, so it will be an interesting comparison. Not sure where I stand, but I think I might favor the smaller ships where I never felt to need to plan out everything in advance...which is odd as Breakaway and Norwegian is "freestyle" based. I actually felt pushed like I needed to make show and dining reservations as soon as they were opened. I was not able to book any restaurants at all and only a few shows. I hear from others on CC that I will be able to do so once on board, but still feel like I might miss out. And for what we are paying, if I do, I'll be upset. Never felt like that with the "normal" ships.

 

But I shall reserve judgement till after the trip.