Yikes! Noro on the Maasdam - two fold deep cleaning question please.

[kazu]

Apparently there is currently Noro on the Maasdam. At least according to this article - http://www.travelerstoday.com/articles/9167/20140319/holland-american-maasdam-passengers-claim-to-be-sick-with-norovirus-on-cruise-ship.htm I am unfamiliar with this publication so not sure how seriously to take it but.......assuming NORO is on the ship........

 

I don't know if they will beat it before we board on March 28th (sure hope so).

 

I know if it is still there they will be doing a deep cleaning. What would be a time that you would expect to be able to embark?

 

If they beat the NORO and the ship is now ok, do they still deep clean after a Noro outbreak? Just trying to figure when to go to the ship. If embarkation (boarding) is delayed, we will obviously go later.

 

Thanks so much for the advice :D

Edited March 20, 2014 by kazu

[RuthC]

I was continuing on a ship when there was a deep cleaning due to noro, and stayed aboard throughout the whole thing. We had to put everything in our cabins away, to leave every surface bare of our belongings. They went around spraying everything on the ship. Every surface had a coating of whatever it is that does the "deep clean".

 

It's not as I pictured it would be, that people where rubbing and scrubbing every surface. Not at all like that. It was canisters with a small hose forcing the spray out.

 

New passengers were able to start boarding around 1:30 on that cruise.

[LAFFNVEGAS]

Apparently there is currently Noro on the Maasdam. At least according to this article - http://www.travelerstoday.com/articles/9167/20140319/holland-american-maasdam-passengers-claim-to-be-sick-with-norovirus-on-cruise-ship.htm I am unfamiliar with this publication so not sure how seriously to take it but.......assuming NORO is on the ship........

 

I don't know if they will beat it before we board on March 28th (sure hope so).

 

I know if it is still there they will be doing a deep cleaning. What would be a time that you would expect to be able to embark?

 

If they beat the NORO and the ship is now ok, do they still deep clean after a Noro outbreak? Just trying to figure when to go to the ship. If embarkation (boarding) is delayed, we will obviously go later.

 

Thanks so much for the advice :D

Jacqui, the first thing I would be leery of is Jim Walkers Cruise Law News :rolleyes: Just my opinion but would guess this is HIGHLY Exaggerated. While I could be wrong but my guess is that the one or two who called in exaggerated then it really became a big exaggeration once Jim walker got a hold of it.

Edited March 20, 2014 by LAFFNVEGAS

[runnergirl71]

If the outbreak has not been reported to/by the CDC, it has not reached the level it has to (I forget the percentages, but there is a minimum percentage for it to be an epidemic).

 

I had to roll my eyes at the "medical professional" implying that ONLY the crew doesn't wash their hands. That is crazy.

 

 

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[kazu]

I was continuing on a ship when there was a deep cleaning due to noro, and stayed aboard throughout the whole thing. We had to put everything in our cabins away, to leave every surface bare of our belongings. They went around spraying everything on the ship. Every surface had a coating of whatever it is that does the "deep clean".

 

It's not as I pictured it would be, that people where rubbing and scrubbing every surface. Not at all like that. It was canisters with a small hose forcing the spray out.

 

New passengers were able to start boarding around 1:30 on that cruise.

 

Jacqui, the first thing I would be leery of is Jim Walkers Cruise Law News :rolleyes: Just my opinion but would guess this is HIGHLY Exaggerated. While I could be wrong but my guess is that the one or two who called in exaggerated then it really became a big exaggeration once Jim walker got a hold of it.

 

 

 

thanks very much both. Lisa, a roll call member emailed me that her husband found several mentions of NORO but this is the only one I saw quickly - so if this is a 'not to be believed' website I won't worry about it (much).

 

Thanks so much for the help:D

[kazu]

If the outbreak has not been reported to/by the CDC, it has not reached the level it has to (I forget the percentages, but there is a minimum percentage for it to be an epidemic).

 

I had to roll my eyes at the "medical professional" implying that ONLY the crew doesn't wash their hands. That is crazy.

 

 

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CDC takes time to report incidents. It isn't instantaneous. I have been on a NORO ship before and I know it was not posted on the website until it was nearly licked.

 

The physician raises some good points though - there are menus, cards (in the casino), etc. So a lot of ways for it to spread and yes, I agree that the passengers are more responsible than the crew - but there are ways that anything can spread.

[runnergirl71]

CDC takes time to report incidents. It isn't instantaneous. I have been on a NORO ship before and I know it was not posted on the website until it was nearly licked.

 

 

 

The physician raises some good points though - there are menus, cards (in the casino), etc. So a lot of ways for it to spread and yes, I agree that the passengers are more responsible than the crew - but there are ways that anything can spread.

 

 

I definitely agree the WAYS it can be spread were accurate. But it is far more likely to be initially brought Onboard by passengers - particularly those without trip insurance who lie on embarkation forms to not be denied boarding.

 

 

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[CowPrincess]

I definitely agree the WAYS it can be spread were accurate. But it is far more likely to be initially brought Onboard by passengers - particularly those without trip insurance who lie on embarkation forms to not be denied boarding.

 

 

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Bolding mine

 

Wow that is pretty harsh speculation. I suspect that many people who board with noro don't even know they have it until after they board.

[chengkp75]

CDC takes time to report incidents. It isn't instantaneous. I have been on a NORO ship before and I know it was not posted on the website until it was nearly licked.

 

The physician raises some good points though - there are menus, cards (in the casino), etc. So a lot of ways for it to spread and yes, I agree that the passengers are more responsible than the crew - but there are ways that anything can spread.

 

Jim Walker's website is my version of the daily chuckle.

 

The report to the USPH/CDC needs to be made when the reportable cases reaches 2% of passengers or crew, within 15 days of arrival in US waters. So, if the reports of sickness from the beginning are true, HAL would not need to have notified the USPH/CDC until the 13th, given a 28th arrival.

 

As one poster noted, the sanitizing is not done by wiping, but mostly by fogging, which takes place at night, and USPH/CDC requirements are that all hard surfaces be sanitized at least daily, so that includes casino chips, etc. Unless the doctor quoted by Walker has been trained by the USPH/CDC, as I have, you will not necessarily know how the crew is dealing with sanitation. The "rags" used to clean tables, chairs, and galley/dining venue food preparation/service surfaces are in a solution of 100ppm bleach, and the bucket with the sanitizing solution is checked several times daily to ensure that the concentration is still correct. What restaurant that you know of are required to clean things with a bleach solution?

 

Many passengers want to blame the crew for transmission of noro, but remember, these people LIVE there, and don't want to get sick or continue to have fellow crew sick so they have to do more work. Unfortunately, while the crew is trained in USPH requirements, the passengers are not. Think about the fact that the first change done when a noro outbreak happens: the self-serve is removed from the buffet. Who does the serving? The crew. Who is not allowed to serve? The passengers.

 

Noro is never really "beaten". It is almost always there, it is a question of limiting the transmission. Deep cleaning will continue until the number of reportable cases has dropped or reached zero for at least 4-5 days, since the incubation period for noro is 3 days. Normally, if there is a delay in embarkation due to deep cleaning, it is only 1-2 hours.

[chengkp75]

The one advantage the Maasdam has is that it is on a 3+ week cruise with the same passengers. The real problem with clearing up noro on a ship is the weekly turnover of passengers.

[innlady1]

Jacqui...if in fact, the Maasdam does come into FLL with Noro., this is what was done on our Ryndam cruise last winter.

 

All of us who were continuing on had to disembark...they arranged a shore excursion for us...to a lovely museum in Tampa, to see the historic sites, and finally the aquarium. We got back to the ship at 4.

 

New embarkees (is that a word?) received a letter that they could also board at 4 PM.

 

They brought people on to do the deep cleaning and it seemed to work...no more noro for the 2nd segment of our B2B.

[SJSULIBRARIAN]

When the Amsterdam had the noro on the Grand Pacific Voyage in December 2012, those of us on the next cruise received an email that we could not board before 2PM due to the deep cleaning etc. It didn't matter to us as we were visiting with friends. We arrived shortly before 3PM and walked on - and it appeared that they started boarding well before 2PM so I guess the cleaning went well. Once on board, we noticed a lot of non-ship crew helping with the luggage. I would assume HAL will notify you if delayed boarding - if not notified I would go at whatever time you usually do.

Edited March 20, 2014 by SJSULIBRARIAN

[Lizzie68]

Bolding mine

 

Wow that is pretty harsh speculation. I suspect that many people who board with noro don't even know they have it until after they board.

 

Indeed, what an awful assumption. And if someone waiting in line actually had Noro - no way could they hide it.:eek: There is an incubation period, too.

[Homosassa]

Several years ago, we had the first cruise out of Ft Lauderdale after the Zuiderdam's trans- Atlantic crossing. Noro had been a big problem on that crossing and the ship was to undergo deep cleaning in Ft Lauderdale before our cruise.

 

Embarking passengers were taken to the convention center where we were served lunch. We then had a choice of taking buses to Sawgrass Mills or spending the day at the convention center where movies were shown in the auditorium.

 

Dinner was also served at the convention center. Embarkation started at 8PM and finished around 11:30PM. The order of embarkation was the standard way of embarkation in the terminal. I was glad we had arrived early and had group 1 tags.

 

Once in our cabin, we found that there was many items missing. Because all the bedding and towels were undergoing sterilization, we only had sheets and one blanket on the bed. Pillows were in plastic bags (had been cleaned somehow) and we put on the pillow cases that had been left. No glasses in the cabin and we each had one towel to use that night. All ice canisters and pitchers were also gone. The mini bar was completely empty. Even the Gideon Bible had been taken out to be wiped down.

 

Everything in the cabin was replaced the following day.

 

Hard surfaces in the public areas (hand rails, elevator call buttons, mirrors, doors (and their handles), table tops, etc) had a filmy residue from the cleaning agent. They had the film for the first four days of the cruise as the cleaning agent was constantly applied and left to dry on the surfaces.

 

Of course, there was no handling of food serving utensils or drink dispensers by passengers in the buffet and all condiments were individual packages.

 

These conditions continues for the first 3 -4 days (don't remember) of the cruise until it was clear no one else was coming down with noro.

 

According to crew members, the noro was brought unto the ship by a passenger embarking in Europe.

[POA1]

New embarkees (is that a word?)....

 

It MOST DEFINITELY IS!

[runnergirl71]

Indeed' date=' what an awful assumption. And if someone waiting in line actually had Noro - no way could they hide it.:eek: There is an incubation period, too.[/quote']

 

 

It's not an assumption. People do it more than you want to think. They'll blame any nausea on "excitement" or the like. I've seen it discussed numerous times on other boards. Not ALL but some. Take medicine to seem normal, etc. Like how when I worked in daycare we had parents dose their kid up with medicine so they wouldn't have a fever - until it came back. More than once the response to the call was "You mean the Tylenol wore off already?"

 

 

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Edited March 20, 2014 by runnergirl71

[Lizzie68]

It's not an assumption. People do it more than you want to think. They'll blame any nausea on "excitement" or the like. I've seen it discussed numerous times on other boards. Not ALL but some. Take medicine to seem normal, etc. Like how when I worked in daycare we had parents dose their kid up with medicine so they wouldn't have a fever - until it came back. More than once the response to the call was "You mean the Tylenol wore off already?"

 

 

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Anyone with real Noro (not just an upset stomach) will not be able to hide it, no way, no how - trust me.:(

[kazu]

Jacqui...if in fact, the Maasdam does come into FLL with Noro., this is what was done on our Ryndam cruise last winter.

 

All of us who were continuing on had to disembark...they arranged a shore excursion for us...to a lovely museum in Tampa, to see the historic sites, and finally the aquarium. We got back to the ship at 4.

 

New embarkees (is that a word?) received a letter that they could also board at 4 PM.

 

They brought people on to do the deep cleaning and it seemed to work...no more noro for the 2nd segment of our B2B.

 

When the Amsterdam had the noro on the Grand Pacific Voyage in December 2012, those of us on the next cruise received an email that we could not board before 2PM due to the deep cleaning etc. It didn't matter to us as we were visiting with friends. We arrived shortly before 3PM and walked on - and it appeared that they started boarding well before 2PM so I guess the cleaning went well. Once on board, we noticed a lot of non-ship crew helping with the luggage. I would assume HAL will notify you if delayed boarding - if not notified I would go at whatever time you usually do.

 

Thank you both very much for answering my question. We boarded around 2:30 pm on our last NORO cruise. So, I was trying to figure things out in case.

 

So, if the virus is not an issue, then is it safe that boarding will be as normal and that there will not be deep cleaning?

 

I really appreciate your help.

 

Thank you for helping me with the question:D

[RuthC]

Anyone with real Noro (not just an upset stomach) will not be able to hide it' date=' no way, no how - trust me.:([/quote']

 

How right you are!

I caught what must have been noro when visiting my sister, and it went through the house. I couldn't even sit up without much effort. It took all my strength to lie still.

I thought I would have to rally to die!

 

The idea of being able to stand in a boarding line, or even sit up in the waiting room, is beyond absurd.

If you are sick with noro, you don't have the strength to attempt to hide it.

[frankc98376]

How right you are!

I caught what must have been noro when visiting my sister, and it went through the house. I couldn't even sit up without much effort. It took all my strength to lie still.

I thought I would have to rally to die!

 

The idea of being able to stand in a boarding line, or even sit up in the waiting room, is beyond absurd.

If you are sick with noro, you don't have the strength to attempt to hide it.

 

I'll second that one- I don't think I have ever felt as bad as I did with Noro.

Wash, wash, wash and keep hands away from the face is the best defense

[Typhoon1]

Noro isn't even news any longer. It's part of cruising. We know how to treat it, and contain it.

 

Move forward, and look forward to your cruise on the 28th.

[Linda&Vern]

We were on the Zuiderdam Feb. 24 to March 7. On the last cruise day the Captain came on with his usual mid-day announcement - then added that "a higher number than usual" cases of gastro-intestinal sickness had reported. He said it was NOT an outbreak - just more cases than on a normal cruise. He explained that for the remainder of the cruise we would operate in code orange to be cautious. The cruse after ours should be back now, and I've heard nothing about any outbreak - so hopefully it was stopped in its tracks.

 

I would also like to add that in 2013 as we entered the FLL terminal for our Westerdam cruise, one of the portside staff whispered in my ear "just answer no to any question on the health form." I thought that very odd.

Edited March 20, 2014 by Linda&Vern

[POA1]

You know what's ironic? We were on the 2/28 Noordam sailing out of Port Everglades and there were a couple thousand people - all sharing the same 8 or so pens to fill out the health questionnaire. What could possibly be wrong with that?

[theloo]

You know what's ironic? We were on the 2/28 Noordam sailing out of Port Everglades and there were a couple thousand people - all sharing the same 8 or so pens to fill out the health questionnaire. What could possibly be wrong with that?

 

Yikes! Will bring my own pen ;)

[durangoscots]

Definitely my own pen. Always carry one anyway. As to Noro.... if you know you have it, so does everyone around you. There is no controlling yourself. I had it few years ago when it swept out college campus and believe me I could not have hidden the fact I was sick. I could not even crawl out to take my dogs for walks, fortunately some neighbors helped or I would have had to have done a massive sanitation job on my hallway. Not fun, no way, no how.

 

Susan