daily service charge

[triptolemus]

Where does it say that? I've been looking and can't find it.

 

Harriet

 

Section 3© of the Guest Ticket Contract:

 

http://www.ncl.com/sites/default/files/Guest_Ticket_Contract_03_2014.pdf

[Ship2shoreCO]

On my last cruise, I couldn't even get two bottles of water removed from the bill after room service mistakenly sent them instead of a pitcher. In a case like that, I suppose I could have told them to adjust the DSC instead, but I doubt the person I was dealing with would have done it. I think guest services' primary job is to do protect the bottom line.

[hpecorari]

Section 3© of the Guest Ticket Contract:

 

http://www.ncl.com/sites/default/files/Guest_Ticket_Contract_03_2014.pdf

 

Thank you. Just read it and it does say that.

 

It appears that what's on the NCL Site under Service charges says one thing whereas the Guest Ticket Contract says something else.

 

Harriet

[Love my butler]

You are so consistently not answering the question asked that the only conclusion we can draw is that you are unable to.

 

I will try one last time. The question is simple. Have a look at it a few times if you still can't grasp it.

 

Can you please show is one place where NCL state that you can remove the DSC IN ORDER TO TIP PEOPLE INDIVIDUALLY?

 

Did you notice that last bit? That means that just pointing out that you can remove the DSC is not an answer to that question, as NCL's FAQs specifically state that you can remove them if you have an unresolved service issue. That isn't the same thing.

 

I won't hold my breath waiting for you to provide the proof.

 

You can breathe now. I can answer your question with 100% accuracy. Go to guest services on the ship, tell them you wish to adjust the Discretionary Service Charge, when they ask why, tell them you wish to cash tip. Works every time. No fuss, no muss.

 

Now you don't like that answer, but that doesn't make it inaccurate. As far as your silly argument about having exact wording indicating what you can do, consider this, you can take three showers per day but you won't find anywhere on the website the specifically allows you to do it. Get it now?

[KeithJenner]

Now you don't like that answer,

 

 

Someone else who thinks that they know whether I will like something or not, but just proves that they have absolutely no idea.

 

Still, your efforts do show how effectively you can completely miss the point.

Edited February 27, 2015 by KeithJenner

[Ship2shoreCO]

Thank you. Just read it and it does say that.

 

It appears that what's on the NCL Site under Service charges says one thing whereas the Guest Ticket Contract says something else.

 

Harriet

 

A few years back, I Tried to get some miles reinstated because of a medical emergency. I quoted the relevant section of the frequent-flier rules in my written request. The airline staff wouldn't follow the policy and refund the miles until I escalated it quite a ways up the food chain. The customer service manager at the airline told me that unfortunately, there is often a big difference between how a policy is written and how staff are trained to apply the policy.

Edited February 27, 2015 by Ship2shoreCO

[Ship2shoreCO]

Go to guest services on the ship, tell them you wish to adjust the Discretionary Service Charge, when they ask why, tell them you wish to cash tip. Works every time. No fuss, no muss.

 

 

So my question is this. If you do that and give cash tips, do the crew you tip get to keep the cash or do they have to turn it in to be distributed just like the DSC is? I have several relatives who work for various cruise lines. I will have to ask how this works in practice.

[ladylonghorn]

Clearly you have never worked in the service industry (well I guess we could have figured that out from your screen name.) Are you aware that in land based restaurants that the servers are required to provide a certain percentage of their tips to the back waiters, the bus boys, the bar tenders, and sometimes even the dish washers. In hotels the cleaning people have to give a percentage to the laundry staff. So in spite of what you think, even on land, you do not control who gets your gratuity.

 

Before the lines put in the daily service charge all of the staff who received gratuities were required to share them with the behind the scenes people. It has always been that way. None of the DSC goes to maintenance people, it all goes to people who are in the hotel division, which does not include the people who are responsible for keeping the ship running.

 

Hopefully this enlightens you but based on your bourgeois attitude I doubt that anything is going to make you understand how the service industry works. Thank goodness the staff know who removes the DSC and they are wise enough to distribute your gratuity to the people that it goes to. I really suggest that instead of sailing a mass market line you move to an all inclusive luxury line where gratuities are not required (of course you pay about $500 pp/pd).

 

Have a good day.

 

Ok - I hate to add fuel to this discussion, but I speak from personal experience from several years of work at Outback Steakhouses, Pappasitos and a Club Corp country club...

 

As a server, you give 3% of your tips to cover 1% each for bar tender, host/hostess and then bus boys. You do NOT pay out to tip dishwashers or any "back waitstaff".

[KeithJenner]

As far as your silly argument about having exact wording indicating what you can do

 

 

That would be a silly argument. Good job it isn't an argument I was making isn't it.

 

Get it now?

 

I get that you've written a totally irrelevant load of nonsense. Is that what you mean?

Edited February 27, 2015 by KeithJenner

[njhorseman]

Wrong. NCL and even the mods on these boards acknowledge the Discretionary Service Charge is a/the tip.

 

As usual you're wrong.

 

If NCL acknowledges the service charge is a/the tip, why is it that NCL allows tips to be paid from nonrefundable OBC, but they do not allow service charges to paid from nonrefundable OBC?

 

If NCL acknowledges the service charge is a/the tip why are there separate FAQs on their website explaining each, and the two FAQs are completely different and do not contain any cross reference to the other?

 

No offense to our board mods, but they are not an infallible authority on NCL rules and NCL's guest ticket contract.

Edited February 27, 2015 by njhorseman

[swedish weave]

So my question is this. If you do that and give cash tips, do the crew you tip get to keep the cash or do they have to turn it in to be distributed just like the DSC is? I have several relatives who work for various cruise lines. I will have to ask how this works in practice.

 

It would seem that your relatives could give you a more definitive answer to your question

Edited February 27, 2015 by swedish weave

[Ship2shoreCO]

It would seem that your relatives could give you a more definitive answer to your question

 

Unfortunately none of them work for NCL, so the value of thei input may be somewhat limited regarding this particular discussion.

[swedish weave]

Unfortunately none of them work for NCL, so the value of thei input may be somewhat limited regarding this particular discussion.

 

You will find that question answered several times and with several different opinions on this thread. Realistically, if I give money to a crew member who will know about it ?

[luddite]

Wrong. NCL and even the mods on these boards acknowledge the Discretionary Service Charge is a/the tip.

 

It is discretionary and you are wrong.

It isn't a tip, and you are wrong.

[Out to sea!]

Do you generally make stuff up in order to "win" arguments?

 

The language in the Contract, which you later posted, is CRYSTAL CLEAR. Pax have the absolute discretion to adjust the service charge. NOWHERE in the Contract is there anything about "only if a service issue cannot be corrected."

 

Try reading post #330. Show me anywhere in the contract (or anywhere on the NCL website) that allows for removal of the DSC. There is no arguing going on because there is no argument to be made for removal of the DSC. Everywhere else(other than the contract) the verbiage is more specific to state that adjustment should only be made if a solution to a problem cannot be found. NEVER is the word removal ever used, anywhere at anytime. If you can prove otherwise, go for it.

[Out to sea!]

Has anyone successfully gotten guest services to remove the DSC entirely? My experience with guest services is that I can't even get small charges taken off without a big fight, even when I have a clear and convincing case. Guest services staff seem to be trained very well in the art of politely saying no to everything.

 

As they should be. :)

[Out to sea!]

@NHL Arizona:

 

I agree with you. They simply want to argue the point and try to gain support for their tasteless choice to stiff the crew. I actually dislike the way we have a separate charge to support crew pay, but it is our reality. The charge should just be included in the fare. If enough people keep this up, it will eventually have to be included....then they will have no choice (which is fine with me, since I pay it anyways).

 

Personally, I find it classless and selfish to punish the crew for what an industry has standardized as their normal operating procedures. All the times someone tries to justify this behavior, it always works out the same.....20 people say it is unethical and 2 people say it can technically be done. If they really wanted to do something nice, they would pay the DSC and carry extra cash for add'l tipping....but it is quite clear they really just want to hand cash to someone to look like big shots (and hope the receiver assumes that this cash is on top of the DSC). They need to stroke their own ego, but it is so fragile that they also require our approval and will fight tooth and nail to try to prove it is the right thing to do....all the while, we all know they are just being cheap.

 

You can't change their mind, don't even try. I'm not even going to address them, as I can carry a better conversation with a coat rack. Think of it as a personality defect, or maybe they were not raised to properly. In either case, the result is them looking for a way to manipulate the system for their own personal gain (at the expense of the crew).

 

You are absolutely correct. The crassness of these individuals is beyond belief and the growing number of them is hastening the decline of this country. Personally, I'm tired of arguing with crass individuals who's only way to take a cruise it seems is by cheating others and making them miserable and therefore will just put them on my ignore list. So if anyone on this thread wonders why I'm not responding to your posts, you know the reason why.

 

Just like y'all do to the DSC, you have been adjusted to ZERO. :p

[LMaxwell]

 

Just like y'all do to the DSC, you have been adjusted to ZERO. :p

 

But you just said DSC couldn't be zeroed out. Pick a story and stay with it. :D

[Level six]

All I can say is that I just got off a 21 day cruise on the Jade and I cannot imagine that the staff is working for tips.........it was the worst service I have ever gotten on any cruise, from room attendant to food service. Room attendant: never knew who he was until we walked in on him on day 7! Had to ask for TP, soap and shower gel. Vacuumed ONCE in 21 days, changed sheets once, horrible. When I complained to JOVO (head hotel staff)............muh. Never once got one order right in food venues, once a staff even left while in the middle of our dinner and never told anyone about our order. After waiting 35 minutes, we asked, were told staff had left, but, "what do you need" we left. On Princess and RCCI, we were treated like they were working for the tip and alway left above and beyond the service charge. On this cruise it was a joke and for once I felt like removing the tip. If they are working for the "service charge" or "tips" it sure doesn't show, they all seem like nice people, but they need some serious training on customer service. I think it all is the upper staff who are not training or who don't care if the customer is taken care of or not. Will not sail on NCL again.

[NLH Arizona]

All I can say is that I just got off a 21 day cruise on the Jade and I cannot imagine that the staff is working for tips.........it was the worst service I have ever gotten on any cruise, from room attendant to food service. Room attendant: never knew who he was until we walked in on him on day 7! Had to ask for TP, soap and shower gel. Vacuumed ONCE in 21 days, changed sheets once, horrible. When I complained to JOVO (head hotel staff)............muh. Never once got one order right in food venues, once a staff even left while in the middle of our dinner and never told anyone about our order. After waiting 35 minutes, we asked, were told staff had left, but, "what do you need" we left. On Princess and RCCI, we were treated like they were working for the tip and alway left above and beyond the service charge. On this cruise it was a joke and for once I felt like removing the tip. If they are working for the "service charge" or "tips" it sure doesn't show, they all seem like nice people, but they need some serious training on customer service. I think it all is the upper staff who are not training or who don't care if the customer is taken care of or not. Will not sail on NCL again.

Sorry you had such bad service and in case you didn't know, RCCL pretty much does the same as NCL, except they call it gratuity automatic.

 

 

From RCCL's website:

 

Q: Why is the gratuity automatic?

 

A: The automatic daily gratuity is based on customary industry standards. Applying this automatically helps streamline the recognition process for the crew members that work to enhance your cruise. We hope you find the gratuity to be an accurate reflection of your satisfaction and we thank you for your generous recognition of our staff. Should you have questions or wish to adjust the amount of the automatic gratuity, please visit Guest Services during your cruise. Any modifications or adjustments to your gratuities are required to be requested before you depart your

[SJ]

I think all the megaships have diluted the number of above average service personnel. They're not properly trained and understaff. I think the cruiselines should improve service while increasing the dsc. No one wants to pay more for less.

 

A rose by any other name is still a rose. A tip by any other name is still a tip. Dsc replaced those envelopes we used to hand out so I failed to see how it's not a tip. Just because ncl allows obc to be used for non dcs tips, doesn't make the dsc not a tip.

 

I am also curious how much ncl will pay the crew for those who will have the dsc free in the next promo. Prices have risen since yesterday in anticipation of the new promo but not by the amount of the dsc at least for the lower categories. Does this mean ncl is willing to put in the difference to rightfully compensate the crew? Just wondering. ..

[zqvol]

Ok - I hate to add fuel to this discussion, but I speak from personal experience from several years of work at Outback Steakhouses, Pappasitos and a Club Corp country club...

 

As a server, you give 3% of your tips to cover 1% each for bar tender, host/hostess and then bus boys. You do NOT pay out to tip dishwashers or any "back waitstaff".

 

 

Back waits in some restaurants are called bus boys and food runners in others, and yes, in some higher quality establishments you also have to tip the kitchen staff.

[Out to sea!]

I think all the megaships have diluted the number of above average service personnel. They're not properly trained and understaff. I think the cruiselines should improve service while increasing the dsc. No one wants to pay more for less.

 

A rose by any other name is still a rose. A tip by any other name is still a tip. Dsc replaced those envelopes we used to hand out so I failed to see how it's not a tip. Just because ncl allows obc to be used for non dcs tips, doesn't make the dsc not a tip.

 

I am also curious how much ncl will pay the crew for those who will have the dsc free in the next promo. Prices have risen since yesterday in anticipation of the new promo but not by the amount of the dsc at least for the lower categories. Does this mean ncl is willing to put in the difference to rightfully compensate the crew? Just wondering. ..

 

Based on this line of thought, NCL should just simply make the DSC mandatory and non-negotiable so there is no illusion of it possibly being a tip. If anyone wanted to actually tip above the DSC they could happily do so but bottom line, the DSC could not be removed so the expected wages from the DSC could not be touched (of course, that is the way it is supposed to work now but some people like to interpret things their own way). Problem solved.

Edited February 27, 2015 by Out to sea!

[LMaxwell]

Based on this line of thought, NCL should just simply make the DSC mandatory and non-negotiable so there is no illusion of it possibly being a tip. If anyone wanted to actually tip above the DSC they could happily do so but bottom line, the DSC could not be removed so the expected wages from the DSC could not be touched (of course, that is the way it is supposed to work now but some people like to interpret things their own way). Problem solved.

 

 

Well, that's not the way it is supposed to work now no matter how often you repeat it. if it were supposed to work that way DSC would not be a discretionary opt-out charge. For that matter though, why isn't DSC mandatory and unable to be touched? It doesn't really cost NCL anything if it is paid or not. :confused:

[jackson bernard]

Well, that's not the way it is supposed to work now no matter how often you repeat it. if it were supposed to work that way DSC would not be a discretionary opt-out charge. For that matter though, why isn't DSC mandatory and unable to be touched? It doesn't really cost NCL anything if it is paid or not. :confused:

 

 

Then it would have to be disclosed when you book, just like the taxes and port fees.

 

Now they can say it's discretionary so that they can still advertise prices that don't include it.