Has FDR done anything to benefit cruisers?

[luvtheships]

There are a lot of things "to come" in the works. I'm no fan by any means, but try to be patient and see what he has to offer before you completely condemn the man.

 

Veitch, for all his faults, made some positive improvements to the company during his tenure. Sheehan wasn't perfect and cut corners at times to improve the bottom line. It's way too early to tell whether or not you'll benefit from what FDR wants to bring to NCL.

 

 

Not to early for me as I've already looked elsewhere for my Jan 2017 mom and college kids trip.

[luvtheships]

He has stated what he wants to offer and it interests me not in the least. If I wanted to sail on a more upscale line I would (and I would sail on a proven line rather than one that still has teething pains, which NCL will have for years to come before it morphs into Del Rio's vision for it). (I don't condemn Del Rio the person, but as a CEO he seems to leave a lot to be desired.)

 

 

I find it amusing that fdr wants to turn Ncl into an upscale line

 

How he plans to do that with ships that carry 4000 pax in predominantly minuscule insides and ov cabins is beyond me

 

The only upscale I found on the ba was the haven and those upper end balcony/suites or whatever they are called

 

If you want to pay a premium for a regular balcony and think it's upscale well that's your choice

 

Upscale to me is fine service and a comfortable ship....something the ba for example is missing

 

It is the most uncomfortable and poorly designed ship I've ever been on from the pool deck to the atrium to ocean 678 and don't get me started on the pretty but smoky casino.

 

 

Ncl bigwigs should spend a week on the ruby princess and study the cabins/layout/pool deck etc if they want to see how to build a 4000 upscale mega ship

 

Of course 4000 ...upscale...mega ship is one big oxymoron IMHO

[sparks1093]

I find it amusing that fdr wants to turn Ncl into an upscale line

 

How he plans to do that with ships that carry 4000 pax in predominantly minuscule insides and ov cabins is beyond me

 

The only upscale I found on the ba was the haven and those upper end balcony/suites or whatever they are called

 

If you want to pay a premium for a regular balcony and think it's upscale well that's your choice

 

Upscale to me is fine service and a comfortable ship....something the ba for example is missing

 

It is the most uncomfortable and poorly designed ship I've ever been on from the pool deck to the atrium to ocean 678 and don't get me started on the pretty but smoky casino.

 

 

Ncl bigwigs should spend a week on the ruby princess and study the cabins/layout/pool deck etc if they want to see how to build a 4000 upscale mega ship

 

Of course 4000 ...upscale...mega ship is one big oxymoron IMHO

 

The man dreams big, gotta give him that. Maybe he thinks that better beds and sheets, luxury carpets, fine cutlery, upscale linens and fine art will equate to a premium experience, since it is my understanding that is what they are investing in with all of the drydocks between now and 2017. Personally I wouldn't pay more for it but there may be enough out there who would to make it successful.

[William W]

While I still feel like I got a good deal with the bookings I had or have on NCL, their view of customers, poor communications, and drastic increases in pricing with no value returned to the guest has lead me on to Princess in November, Carnival in December, booking MSC for April, and likely to book a second MSC soon for their new Seaside ship. $589 pp with drinks package for a brand new ship. Waiting to find out if Kids Sail Free on that one.

 

So back to my original answer to the OP:

 

"No".

 

I have also strayed from NCL as like you, I thought they have increased in priced without providing any additional value.

 

When I called to book the Seaside yesterday, they have the Kids Sail Free Promo going, even during the week of March 10, which I believe will be the March Break sailing for 2018. FWIW, the MSC agent I talked to mentioned that they will be changing the promo. 1st 2 passenger get the alcohol beverage package and the kids sailing in the same cabin get the a non-alcohol beverage package. Once the new promo is annouced, the system will update all the existing booking to the new promo.

[LMaxwell]

I don't travel in a suite, I take a kid and don't gamble.

 

Whilst I wouldn't dismiss the changes as having a negative impact (I think only the most rabid really are), I also don't see them as having a major impact to us.

 

To be honest, the biggest differential at the moment seems to be between people who travel in mini suites and below and drink a fair bit (so are having the impact of higher fares negated by the UBP at present) and those who travel in suites and don't drink much (who are seeing much higher price increases and are getting a lower value perk).

 

For me, the actual impact of the changes is relatively small. This is a rough estimate of what the latest changes will cost me extra on a 7 day cruise. I think I've included everything:

 

Additional DSC £26.25

Increased gratuity on drinks £20

Gratuity in speciality £7

Loss of 50% kids rate in speciality £9

Saving on Asian restaurant £15 saving

 

I haven't taken into account potentially losing Moderno as a latitudes perk, as if this happens we will probably just alternate that restaurant and Cagneys and go elsewhere for the other latitudes meal, so we will get the same number of meals at about the same cost.

 

I'm actually not seeing the cost of the increased gratuity on drinks at the moment as I'm getting the UBP thrown in, and also I view the DSC as part of the booking price (I add it to my final bill, and won't pay a higher rate until 2017), but even taking that into account, it results in an increase of just over £2 per person per day. Others may have a different opinion on this, but for me, when you take into account the total cost of a holiday it really isn't a factor.

 

Obviously, some people will do more things which are impacted by the changes and their experiences will be different.

 

For those cost increases, or cost increases that you see on the horizon, have you received additional value?

 

I've long said that a good value is getting what you pay for. A lot of people use that phrase as an insult or downplay. got a good deal but something went wrong? "Well, you got what you paid for." No you didn't. You got less than you paid for. If someone says "I got what I paid for" to me that is a very strong endorsement. It means the company advertising and actual delivery are in line.

 

There is absolutely no factual way I could say to someone about my upcoming NCL cruise "I got what I paid for." Because what I paid for and what I am getting are going to be different than what NCL has told me I was paying for. "I didn't get what I paid for" is more apt in this case.

 

Again, I think generally speaking CC is representative of a very, very small set of enthusiasts that cruise MUCH more often than the average. When looked at from the context of a family that might cruise 1x per year, or 1x every 2 or 3 years, it is really a struggle to find where the increased prices and amenity changes and offerings have translated to benefits for the guests.

 

It is doubtful I'd ever book way in advance again; especially now that they no longer combine one of the membership discounts I get with any promotions. I now have to select the discount or the promo, but on my last bookings I had both. That skews the value equation further.

 

I'd love there to be a benefit. I'm searching for it. I literally laughed out loud at the plates in a hallway thing. Nothing to do with the CEO at all. totally random and chance if you see plates or not. And that's on the facilities manager, not the CEO.

 

If there were clear cut benefits and advantages to the guests someone could cut and paste a marketing blurb and we'd all have our campfire moment and be in agreement.

[LMaxwell]

I have also strayed from NCL as like you, I thought they have increased in priced without providing any additional value.

 

When I called to book the Seaside yesterday, they have the Kids Sail Free Promo going, even during the week of March 10, which I believe will be the March Break sailing for 2018. FWIW, the MSC agent I talked to mentioned that they will be changing the promo. 1st 2 passenger get the alcohol beverage package and the kids sailing in the same cabin get the a non-alcohol beverage package. Once the new promo is annouced, the system will update all the existing booking to the new promo.

 

Taking a look at some pricing, can do Eastern Caribbean, on brand new ship coming out late 2017, which includes an ALL day (until midnight) stay at their new Ocean Cay private island (with dock) being built in 2017; 3 people, upgrade to Fantastica level experience, get 2 adult beverage packages, 1 kids package, have all of their black card perks from status match....and the grand total with taxes and fees is under $1700.

 

That's value.

[SuiteCruiser]

I don't travel in a suite, I take a kid and don't gamble.

 

Whilst I wouldn't dismiss the changes as having a negative impact (I think only the most rabid really are), I also don't see them as having a major impact to us.

 

To be honest, the biggest differential at the moment seems to be between people who travel in mini suites and below and drink a fair bit (so are having the impact of higher fares negated by the UBP at present) and those who travel in suites and don't drink much (who are seeing much higher price increases and are getting a lower value perk).

 

For me, the actual impact of the changes is relatively small. This is a rough estimate of what the latest changes will cost me extra on a 7 day cruise. I think I've included everything:

 

Additional DSC £26.25

Increased gratuity on drinks £20

Gratuity in speciality £7

Loss of 50% kids rate in speciality £9

Saving on Asian restaurant £15 saving

 

I haven't taken into account potentially losing Moderno as a latitudes perk, as if this happens we will probably just alternate that restaurant and Cagneys and go elsewhere for the other latitudes meal, so we will get the same number of meals at about the same cost.

 

I'm actually not seeing the cost of the increased gratuity on drinks at the moment as I'm getting the UBP thrown in, and also I view the DSC as part of the booking price (I add it to my final bill, and won't pay a higher rate until 2017), but even taking that into account, it results in an increase of just over £2 per person per day. Others may have a different opinion on this, but for me, when you take into account the total cost of a holiday it really isn't a factor.

 

Obviously, some people will do more things which are impacted by the changes and their experiences will be different.

 

For us we also add on $90 a week for the new service charges on the UBP promos, and with the Cdn dollar in the dumps, all of these fees add up significantly, especially when paying for your whole family.

[SuiteCruiser]

Taking a look at some pricing, can do Eastern Caribbean, on brand new ship coming out late 2017, which includes an ALL day (until midnight) stay at their new Ocean Cay private island (with dock) being built in 2017; 3 people, upgrade to Fantastica level experience, get 2 adult beverage packages, 1 kids package, have all of their black card perks from status match....and the grand total with taxes and fees is under $1700.

 

That's value.

 

That sure is value!

[KeithJenner]

For those cost increases, or cost increases that you see on the horizon, have you received additional value?

 

 

Considering that I calculated the increased cost for our family for a week to be less than £50, including the DSC increase and gratuity on drinks (which I question whether I should have included anyway), then I'm not really looking for much additional value.

 

For me, just the ability to order what drinks I want in the UBP without considering the cost adds value to my holiday. The new menus also are an improvement for me.

 

Remember, I'm in the position where I am currently paying the same, maybe a bit less overall for our cruises, so added value isn't an issue. When they stop offering the UBP then, based on current pricing, the cost of cruising will move towards the upper end of what I would be willing to pay, but I've always viewed what we have been paying as being on the cheap side.

[KeithJenner]

For us we also add on $90 a week for the new service charges on the UBP promos, and with the Cdn dollar in the dumps, all of these fees add up significantly, especially when paying for your whole family.

 

 

Yes, the fact that we don't pay the gratuity on the UBP makes a big difference.

[electro]

You two need to hang out now!!

We can't, I'm from Ottawa but I live in Colorado Springs right now.

[SuiteCruiser]

We can't, I'm from Ottawa but I live in Colorado Springs right now.

 

Damn, I was going to suggest grabbing a two four and some poutine while we watch the hockey game :)

[luvtheships]

The man dreams big, gotta give him that. Maybe he thinks that better beds and sheets, luxury carpets, fine cutlery, upscale linens and fine art will equate to a premium experience, since it is my understanding that is what they are investing in with all of the drydocks between now and 2017. Personally I wouldn't pay more for it but there may be enough out there who would to make it successful.

 

 

Oh there are definitely many who will pay $$$$ for a cramped inside ...not me of course lol....

 

 

It must be me but I'm still scratching my head over the idea that it is even possible to fill a 4000 pax ship with pax willing to pay inflated prices for a ship that was built and intended as a mass market mid priced ship

[electro]

Damn, I was going to suggest grabbing a two four and some poutine while we watch the hockey game :)

 

Haha, I would have taken you up on that as long as your a Sens fan:D

[sparks1093]

Oh there are definitely many who will pay $$$$ for a cramped inside ...not me of course lol....

 

 

It must be me but I'm still scratching my head over the idea that it is even possible to fill a 4000 pax ship with pax willing to pay inflated prices for a ship that was built and intended as a mass market mid priced ship

 

I think Del Rio has forgotten the old saying "you can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear". You might be able to dress it up some but at the end of the day it's still a sow's ear.

[bjlaac]

Oh there are definitely many who will pay $$$$ for a cramped inside ...not me of course lol....

 

 

It must be me but I'm still scratching my head over the idea that it is even possible to fill a 4000 pax ship with pax willing to pay inflated prices for a ship that was built and intended as a mass market mid priced ship

 

Here's what bothers me the most. For the longest time NCL has been marketed as "freestyle" in every way possible. Dine when, where and with who you want. Want a special dinner, pick a specialty dinning location or pay for a unique show. It came across as nickle and diming to the traditionalists who were use to getting everything included. The cheerleaders loved to point out why should I pay for something I don't use. If you want something you should pay for it.

 

With the changes today and all the free UDP and UBP kinda flies in the very face of what NCL was built on and it seems everyone is unhappy. It seems everyone is now subsidizing these packages and it creates a lot of unhappy people as well as happy ones. I'm not sure if that's better or worse from NCL's perspective, but from mine, all its done is raise the fares because most of the free stuff does not appeal to me at all.

[KeithJenner]

With the changes today and all the free UDP and UBP kinda flies in the very face of what NCL was built on and it seems everyone is unhappy. It seems everyone is now subsidizing these packages and it creates a lot of unhappy people as well as happy ones. I'm not sure if that's better or worse from NCL's perspective, but from mine, all its done is raise the fares because most of the free stuff does not appeal to me at all.

 

 

I agree with this. I'm lucky because the deals work for me, but it flies in the face of one of the things which appealed to me about NCL in the first place.

 

Given the choice, I'd rather have lower fares and the option to buy what I wanted. However, I'm of the opinion that prices were going up whatever, so the beer package softens the blow for me.

 

I'm not actually convinced that you non drinkers are actually subsidising us as such at the moment though. Rather, it is part of a transition which will result in us all paying more in time.

[fshagan]

I think Del Rio has forgotten the old saying "you can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear". You might be able to dress it up some but at the end of the day it's still a sow's ear.

 

I actually think the "upscale" line idea has been misunderstood. Remember the outrage that he wanted to get $50 more per passenger per cruise (or was it $5 per day per passenger?)

 

From what I've seen, here is the marketing plan:

 

1. Use the large ships for the "milk runs" to the eastern and western Caribbean where the lower cost per passenger allows them to remain competitive with RCI (not Carnival, which is where the extra $$ per passenger comes in). Epic, the Away and Away+ class ships fill this need and provide plenty of capacity for these routes. You will continue to see competitive prices vis-a-vis RCI on these routes, but Carnival will be slightly less expensive.

 

2. Upgrade the Jewel and Dawn class ships so they can be used in innovative, new and changing itineraries and command a premium price. You may see these cruises at great prices at first while they work out the kinks. This is the model borrowed from Oceania and Regent. The Australian and Asian cruises coming soon are testing this concept at good prices. This introduces NCL cruisers to the idea of unique and new itineraries, and provides a good gateway experience to moving up to Oceania.

 

3. Position the upgraded Jewel and Dawn class ships as equal to RCI in cruises for Alaska, Pacific Coastal repos, Panama Canal and New England cruises. The demographic skews a bit older on those cruises due to cost anyway; upping the experience on board equates to more perceived value and will command slightly higher prices.

 

Finally, I'm not sure what benefit a new CEO could bring to a line. In five years, if the above marketing plan works, and we have happy CAS passengers plying the waters of the Caribbean, families stepping up from Carnival to experience "Disney light" cruising on a huge ship with ropes courses, slides and other modern features, and a small ship experience that people will pay a premium for, and cash in the coffers to offer ever more in our favorite cruise line, he will be a genius, and everyone will be singing his praises (CC excepted, of course).

[sparks1093]

I actually think the "upscale" line idea has been misunderstood. Remember the outrage that he wanted to get $50 more per passenger per cruise (or was it $5 per day per passenger?)

 

From what I've seen, here is the marketing plan:

 

1. Use the large ships for the "milk runs" to the eastern and western Caribbean where the lower cost per passenger allows them to remain competitive with RCI (not Carnival, which is where the extra $$ per passenger comes in). Epic, the Away and Away+ class ships fill this need and provide plenty of capacity for these routes. You will continue to see competitive prices vis-a-vis RCI on these routes, but Carnival will be slightly less expensive.

 

2. Upgrade the Jewel and Dawn class ships so they can be used in innovative, new and changing itineraries and command a premium price. You may see these cruises at great prices at first while they work out the kinks. This is the model borrowed from Oceania and Regent. The Australian and Asian cruises coming soon are testing this concept at good prices. This introduces NCL cruisers to the idea of unique and new itineraries, and provides a good gateway experience to moving up to Oceania.

 

3. Position the upgraded Jewel and Dawn class ships as equal to RCI in cruises for Alaska, Pacific Coastal repos, Panama Canal and New England cruises. The demographic skews a bit older on those cruises due to cost anyway; upping the experience on board equates to more perceived value and will command slightly higher prices.

 

Finally, I'm not sure what benefit a new CEO could bring to a line. In five years, if the above marketing plan works, and we have happy CAS passengers plying the waters of the Caribbean, families stepping up from Carnival to experience "Disney light" cruising on a huge ship with ropes courses, slides and other modern features, and a small ship experience that people will pay a premium for, and cash in the coffers to offer ever more in our favorite cruise line, he will be a genius, and everyone will be singing his praises (CC excepted, of course).

 

Could be, but I think he is aiming higher than that but no matter what his vision is it is higher on the cruise line food chain than currently (and away from the mainstream model as I understand it). And of course if he fails the question is will there be anything left of NCL at all?

[William W]

Taking a look at some pricing, can do Eastern Caribbean, on brand new ship coming out late 2017, which includes an ALL day (until midnight) stay at their new Ocean Cay private island (with dock) being built in 2017; 3 people, upgrade to Fantastica level experience, get 2 adult beverage packages, 1 kids package, have all of their black card perks from status match....and the grand total with taxes and fees is under $1700.

 

That's value.

 

OTOH, NCL were offering similar value up until approximately 10-12 months ago, as I recall I was able to book the Escape for approximately $1900 for a family of 4 on an outside cabin with one of the perks being offered, be it UDP or UBP. Unfortunately, I think those days are behind us.

 

MSC is definitely offering one of the better value proposition in cruising. In addition to the Seaside, I'm also booked on the Splendida for a week in the Meds, granted it is an inside and the ship is the same age as the Epic, but for 4 people, I'm only paying $931 tax and port fees included and that's before the $100 OBC they are throwing in. At that price, I am going in with very low expectation, and I'm sure it would be very tough for me not to get what I paid for.

[sjbdtz]

NCL's mass market competitors are also moving into more premium territory with their latest ships. It's either evolve or miss out on the wave of millennials that will redefine the cruise market.

 

 

Parents sail free? (so they can help ensure that any difficulty their little millennial might encounter, is resolved?)

 

Cell phone charging ports by the pool deck.

 

More shaded areas so you can read your ipad.

 

....

 

 

Stephen

 

.

[SuiteCruiser]

Parents sail free? (so they can help ensure that any difficulty their little millennial might encounter, is resolved?)

 

Cell phone charging ports by the pool deck.

 

More shaded areas so you can read your ipad.

 

....

 

 

Stephen

 

.

 

OMG! That is so funny :)

[Loonbeam]

1. Use the large ships for the "milk runs" to the eastern and western Caribbean where the lower cost per passenger allows them to remain competitive with RCI (not Carnival, which is where the extra $$ per passenger comes in). Epic, the Away and Away+ class ships fill this need and provide plenty of capacity for these routes. You will continue to see competitive prices vis-a-vis RCI on these routes, but Carnival will be slightly less expensive.

 

2. Upgrade the Jewel and Dawn class ships so they can be used in innovative, new and changing itineraries and command a premium price. You may see these cruises at great prices at first while they work out the kinks. This is the model borrowed from Oceania and Regent. The Australian and Asian cruises coming soon are testing this concept at good prices. This introduces NCL cruisers to the idea of unique and new itineraries, and provides a good gateway experience to moving up to Oceania.

 

3. Position the upgraded Jewel and Dawn class ships as equal to RCI in cruises for Alaska, Pacific Coastal repos, Panama Canal and New England cruises. The demographic skews a bit older on those cruises due to cost anyway; upping the experience on board equates to more perceived value and will command slightly higher prices.

 

This makes sense, except I think the target market might be more in line with Princess cruisers, who want something a little more casual but love the exotic itineraries they do, and its similar to Princess' strategy minus the caribbean (which they have pretty much abandoned to the megaships)

[RickandRobin]

Haven't read through the entire thread so pls excuse if it's in there somewhere but where did you get the dog statue ? Looks hauntingly like my pit bull mix and I gotta have one !

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[KeithJenner]

Haven't read through the entire thread so pls excuse if it's in there somewhere but where did you get the dog statue ? Looks hauntingly like my pit bull mix and I gotta have one !

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

 

I believe it's on the Epic as part of the new Cavern.