Carnival grats increasse to $12.95 & 16.50 respectively

[firemanbobswife]

They are told what their contracted salary is and that they can earn above that from the gratuities; the totals of those gratuities are not specified; usually the employment agencies will specify a range.

 

 

I'm sure the range is on the higher side to entice people to sign up. I believe the hiring agencies also collect a nice fee for their services.

 

At any rate, many Crew members have been around for more than 1 contract and they do expect gratuities because Carnival says that people should pay them. My feelings still stand.

[nissach]

This Canadian agrees 100%.

 

All these people here get outraged if someone dare suggest removing gratuities and tipping in cash. They call them cheap....yet how many times have I read here they are not willing to see their cruise fare increase for these hard working crew to be paid a fair wage? So who is cheap?

 

Your anger should not be directed at the person who didn't tip, but rather Carnival for not paying their staff a good salary.

 

Then you can Tip for the service you receive because it went above and beyond, not because they showed up.

 

I agree, eh!;)

[golfb4cruzing]

So they cut staff, service once a day, food barely cafeteria level, shows are done by passengers, carry your own luggage, slide down emergency chute cause they ran over the gangway and they raise daily grats while charging 15% on everything onboard automatically. Still the best Value for your Money??

[LMaxwell]

I'm sure the range is on the higher side to entice people to sign up. I believe the hiring agencies also collect a nice fee for their services.

 

At any rate, many Crew members have been around for more than 1 contract and they do expect gratuities because Carnival says that people should pay them. My feelings still stand.

 

I don't disagree with you, I'm just saying no cruiseline guarantees the amount paid from those gratuities, they only guarantee the base rate. That's why when gratuities go up I don't think everyone suddenly got an unscheduled raise either. It is probably negotiated with the staffing agency after so many contracts or so much time, a larger disbursement is paid out.

 

Also, many times crew have to pay thousands of dollars up front to get these jobs from the staffing agencies. It can take more than one contract to pay off these up front costs.

 

It's far from an ideal system.

 

The cruise lines have all gamed the system and done so with phenomenal success beyond even their own wildest dreams. There's no good reason that people who maintain the hotel functions (behind the scenes staff) should be forced to rely on discretionary service charges for the bulk of their pay. They should be paid fairly for their work and those that provide guest facing services should be the ones with lower base pay and share in a larger share of the gratuity pool. It's patently unfair that a dishwasher or laundry person has to rely on a tipped wage. Pay them consistent and fair living wages and let service providers like stateroom attendant and food service staff get a bigger piece of the tip pie.

[Computer Nerd]

That is because there are a lot of very angry people that feel they have the obligation to instruct the rest of the people how to spend their money.

 

if certain people didn't feel the need to circumvent their obligation to pay their gratuities, tips, service charge, or whatever else anyone wants to call them there would be no burning. if one doesn't want to or expect to pay their whatever you want to call it they shouldn't be taking a cruise where it is expected of them. just another reason to make the whatever you call it non-negotiable so cheapskates can be cheapskates somewhere else.

[firemanbobswife]

I don't disagree with you, I'm just saying no cruiseline guarantees the amount paid from those gratuities, they only guarantee the base rate. That's why when gratuities go up I don't think everyone suddenly got an unscheduled raise either. It is probably negotiated with the staffing agency after so many contracts or so much time, a larger disbursement is paid out.

 

 

 

Also, many times crew have to pay thousands of dollars up front to get these jobs from the staffing agencies. It can take more than one contract to pay off these up front costs.

 

 

 

It's far from an ideal system.

 

 

 

The cruise lines have all gamed the system and done so with phenomenal success beyond even their own wildest dreams. There's no good reason that people who maintain the hotel functions (behind the scenes staff) should be forced to rely on discretionary service charges for the bulk of their pay. They should be paid fairly for their work and those that provide guest facing services should be the ones with lower base pay and share in a larger share of the gratuity pool. It's patently unfair that a dishwasher or laundry person has to rely on a tipped wage. Pay them consistent and fair living wages and let service providers like stateroom attendant and food service staff get a bigger piece of the tip pie.

 

 

I think we are pretty much in agreement then. I would love to see the system overhauled and the workers get paid a fair wage without them relying on tips. Unfortunately, this is how it's set up. So until it changes (which I doubt it ever will) I would like to see the "gratuity" terminology replaced with "service charge" and make it mandatory.

 

We don't get a choice in paying for "resort fees" when staying at a hotel even though we don't use the pool or fitness center or whatever. And that is pure profit for the company. If we want to stay there, then we have to pay it.

 

I simply cannot understand how people can spend hundreds or thousands of dollars on drinks that automatically have the 15% "gratuity" added on and don't fuss or complain and then turn around and take their auto gratuities off for the rest of the Crew that made their cruise possible. Again, if they were mandatory like the bar bill, there would be nothing to complain about and everyone would be taken care of and happy.

[Computer Nerd]

We also prepay and give extra cash, but to be fair that's .95 per PERSON per day. When we take an 8-day with our five-person family, that's $38. Still only one-hundredth the cost of the cruise, but not nothing. I don't mind if we continue to receive excellent service, the staff gets the extra money, and the amount doesn't keeping going up too fast.

 

no one is required to cruise if the cost of cruising is more than a family can handle.

[Computer Nerd]

Personally I'd prefer cruise companies paid their staff a decent wage and not expect customers to fund wages. Tips IMHO is given to people who have given you good service, not because they opened a bottle of beer and passed it to you.

 

I expect a difference of opinion on this depending on which side of the pond you sit.

 

seriously.... :confused: customers are going to fund the crews wages no matter how carnival gets the money. please take the time to think about where the money comes from to pay any employee of a private business.

[Sitzmark]

They can't possibly tell you upfront how much your meal costs because they don't know what you are going to eat. They don't tell you how much the entertainment is because they don't know how many shows or whatever you will be going to.

 

I don't care how they did it but I imagine they wouldn't just "roll it in" because it would make the fares appear higher when doing a straight up search/comparison. But if it's broken down separate like the taxes/port fees, then it might not seem so bad to some.

 

It would be disclosed that the service charge is already included. The same way Celebrity did for ATD (I hear they don't anymore but haven't been on them in quite a few years). Any additional tipping would be totally optional (unlike now where Carnival "recommends" a certain amount so the Crew members are expecting to receive that amount as part of their pay).

 

Bottom line is this - just add it in one way or another and quit calling it a

 

Lol, sure, but the steakhouse is $35 no matter what I order. And rolling an extra 12.95 per day into the cost would make the cost unacceptable but I should just accept that tipping is a "cost of cruising". Sorry, but I call it what it is, BS.

[firemanbobswife]

Lol, sure, but the steakhouse is $35 no matter what I order. And rolling an extra 12.95 per day into the cost would make the cost unacceptable but I should just accept that tipping is a "cost of cruising". Sorry, but I call it what it is, BS.

 

 

The tip is included in your $35 steakhouse dinner. So if they added the service charge as an added expense in the taxes/port fees section you wouldn't cruise? Yet you spend $35pp per night in the steakhouse? I'm not sure I follow what you're trying to say.

[LMaxwell]

if certain people didn't feel the need to circumvent their obligation to pay their gratuities, tips, service charge, or whatever else anyone wants to call them there would be no burning. if one doesn't want to or expect to pay their whatever you want to call it they shouldn't be taking a cruise where it is expected of them. just another reason to make the whatever you call it non-negotiable so cheapskates can be cheapskates somewhere else.

 

People aren't circumventing an obligation.

[Sitzmark]

The tip is included in your $35 steakhouse dinner. So if they added the service charge as an added expense in the taxes/port fees section you wouldn't cruise? Yet you spend $35pp per night in the steakhouse? I'm not sure I follow what you're trying to say.

 

You said they can't give a price on dinner, because they don't know what I'll order. I simply pointed out they seem to be able to do it at the steakhouse.

[LMaxwell]

I think we are pretty much in agreement then. I would love to see the system overhauled and the workers get paid a fair wage without them relying on tips. Unfortunately, this is how it's set up. So until it changes (which I doubt it ever will) I would like to see the "gratuity" terminology replaced with "service charge" and make it mandatory.

 

We don't get a choice in paying for "resort fees" when staying at a hotel even though we don't use the pool or fitness center or whatever. And that is pure profit for the company. If we want to stay there, then we have to pay it.

 

I simply cannot understand how people can spend hundreds or thousands of dollars on drinks that automatically have the 15% "gratuity" added on and don't fuss or complain and then turn around and take their auto gratuities off for the rest of the Crew that made their cruise possible. Again, if they were mandatory like the bar bill, there would be nothing to complain about and everyone would be taken care of and happy.

 

We are in basic agreement but I am not in favor of a mandatory charge.

 

I believe a guaranteed amount that has no relation to the quality of service leads service providers to do the bare minimum to get by and leaves the guest no leverage to resolve issues / unresponsive management. That's just my opinion on it though.

 

If 98% of people participate in the current program and 2% of people abuse the spirit of the program (while abiding by the letter of the program) it still is not right to punish the 98% because of the 2%. Such is life.

 

When I go out to dinner I know tipping is expected of me. I know what the societal norms are for tipping and what constitutes a low tip and what is average, and what is a great tip. I then base my actual tip on the service I receive. I choose to retain that right and won't give business to places that remove that choice.

 

But we do both believe everyone should be paid fairly.

[Computer Nerd]

People aren't circumventing an obligation.

 

that's your opinion. to me, since it is known from the minute you book a cruise that you are expected to pay a service charge/gratuity/tip of x dollars a day per person and you fail to do that just because there is some clause that allows you to do that, you are indeed circumventing your obligation.

 

to me, it's fairly obvious. the service charge should be paid like port charges. it is non-negotiable. it will be returned if a person doesn't make the cruise but otherwise, it becomes a part of cruising, just like the port charges.

[LMaxwell]

that's your opinion. to me, since it is known from the minute you book a cruise that you are expected to pay a service charge/gratuity/tip of x dollars a day per person and you fail to do that just because there is some clause that allows you to do that, you are indeed circumventing your obligation.

 

to me, it's fairly obvious. the service charge should be paid like port charges. it is non-negotiable. it will be returned if a person doesn't make the cruise but otherwise, it becomes a part of cruising, just like the port charges.

 

We have a difference of opinion it seems.

 

That's alright.

[firemanbobswife]

You said they can't give a price on dinner, because they don't know what I'll order. I simply pointed out they seem to be able to do it at the steakhouse.

 

 

Only for one meal. Not the whole cruise. And the tip is part of the upcharge. So by that reasoning, the service charge should be automatically added to the cruise one way or another. Not negotiable just like the steakhouse. You are free to tip above and beyond if so desired but it is not expected.

Edited May 13, 2016 by firemanbobswife

[JMAE]

I think the tips should be include with the fair, without an option to remove them. We given extra on every cruise the staff do a wonderful job.

[Computer Nerd]

We have a difference of opinion it seems.

 

That's alright.

 

seems we do. my reasoning is that i'm tired of watching the cheapskates lie through their teeth the last night of the cruise coming up with any bs reason to pull their tips at gs. also makes the line at gs extremely long for those of us who want to do something other than pull their tips. maybe carnival should have a 'remove tip' only line for those people so they can stand there until midnight to save a few bucks that they were obligated to pay.

[LMaxwell]

seems we do. my reasoning is that i'm tired of watching the cheapskates lie through their teeth the last night of the cruise coming up with any bs reason to pull their tips at gs. also makes the line at gs extremely long for those of us who want to do something other than pull their tips. maybe carnival should have a 'remove tip' only line for those people so they can stand there until midnight to save a few bucks that they were obligated to pay.

 

Couldn't tell you; I avoid GS as much as possible on a cruise. If I never have to go to GS it means I've not had any issues at all. I'm going to shows and eating pizza and walking the decks or having a drink. I don't hang out at GS and listen to people. Total waste of my time.

 

But if I did have an issue why should I have to jump through hoops to get it resolved? Remember, the cruise line calls it discretionary, not obligatory. That is your definition and opinion.

 

I simply choose to believe most people are good and follow the spirit of the policy. Do some abuse the policy? Probably. I don't support that. But I won't make it unfair for the vast majority who do follow it just because of the few who simply don't want to pay. Honestly, that's Carnivals problem. Not my problem.

Edited May 13, 2016 by LMaxwell

[Computer Nerd]

Couldn't tell you; I avoid GS as much as possible on a cruise. If I never have to go to GS it means I've not had any issues at all. I'm going to shows and eating pizza and walking the decks or having a drink. I don't hang out at GS and listen to people. Total waste of my time.

 

But if I did have an issue why should I have to jump through hoops to get it resolved? Remember, the cruise line calls it discretionary, not obligatory. That is your definition and opinion.

 

I simply choose to believe most people are good and follow the spirit of the policy. Do some abuse the policy? Probably. I don't support that. But I won't make it unfair for the vast majority who do follow it just because of the few who simply don't want to pay. Honestly, that's Carnivals problem. Not my problem.

 

it's not a total waste of time to stand in line such as when my son lost his glasses and ipod on a cruise and we had to go to gs about 5 times before they were found. can't help but hear these people when most of them are shouting to get their gratuities removed. if gratuities were mandatory the lines would be cut in half......my opinion.....and no one would have to jump through hoops to get real issues resolved. and if you had a real issue that could not get resolved there are other ways to compensate a person.....a free drink, free meal at a specialty restaurant, free excursion, some other way other than removing the gratuities. yes, it is an animal that carnival has created but they can also change it overnight which is what i would like to see. those that have no problem paying their expected......since you don't like the word obligated or do you truly think you are not expected to pay them......gratuities will see no difference in their cruise experience other than short gs lines and the folks working at gs could spend their time actually working on true issues.

[firemanbobswife]

it's not a total waste of time to stand in line such as when my son lost his glasses and ipod on a cruise and we had to go to gs about 5 times before they were found. can't help but hear these people when most of them are shouting to get their gratuities removed. if gratuities were mandatory the lines would be cut in half......my opinion.....and no one would have to jump through hoops to get real issues resolved. and if you had a real issue that could not get resolved there are other ways to compensate a person.....a free drink, free meal at a specialty restaurant, free excursion, some other way other than removing the gratuities. yes, it is an animal that carnival has created but they can also change it overnight which is what i would like to see. those that have no problem paying their expected......since you don't like the word obligated or do you truly think you are not expected to pay them......gratuities will see no difference in their cruise experience other than short gs lines and the folks working at gs could spend their time actually working on true issues.

 

 

I agree. If service is that bad then it needs to be addressed right then and there with a supervisor - mandatory service charge or not. I don't think service will suffer at all as a cash tip could still be an option and no one wants to lose their job for slacking off.

 

I prepay gratuities and I always get excellent service. They know that I have done so from the time I step foot on the ship and not once did I ever need to address any shortcomings in regards to service. There are other more effective avenues for weeding out poor performers besides withholding funds such as a talk with their boss and a dishonorable mention on the survey.

[LMaxwell]

it's not a total waste of time to stand in line such as when my son lost his glasses and ipod on a cruise and we had to go to gs about 5 times before they were found. can't help but hear these people when most of them are shouting to get their gratuities removed. if gratuities were mandatory the lines would be cut in half......my opinion.....and no one would have to jump through hoops to get real issues resolved. and if you had a real issue that could not get resolved there are other ways to compensate a person.....a free drink, free meal at a specialty restaurant, free excursion, some other way other than removing the gratuities. yes, it is an animal that carnival has created but they can also change it overnight which is what i would like to see. those that have no problem paying their expected......since you don't like the word obligated or do you truly think you are not expected to pay them......gratuities will see no difference in their cruise experience other than short gs lines and the folks working at gs could spend their time actually working on true issues.

 

I know the cost. I factor for it. I pay for it. I've never not paid it. I know it is expected. But I know I am not obligated to do so. The crew know I am not obligated to do so, and I think that keeps them motivated to provide good service. I just don't like the idea of it being mandatory and I have already explained why. I trust you're smart enough to see my point of view. You don't have to accept it or agree, but it won't do either of us any good to keep repeating our positions, we won't change anyones mind so we'll just talk in circles and argue, which wasn't what lead me to this thread to start with.

 

I was wondering where the $16.50 figure came from as I haven't seen it anywhere.

[Sitzmark]

Only for one meal. Not the whole cruise.

 

And if you ate it every day they'd lose track? You'd be prevented from tipping additional? It just isn't as hard as you pretend it is.

[firemanbobswife]

And if you ate it every day they'd lose track? You'd be prevented from tipping additional? It just isn't as hard as you pretend it is.

 

 

Not at all. The steakhouse is $35 including gratuity for one meal. There are several choices to choose from for appetizers, main course, and dessert. They have a pretty good idea of the combinations of things that will be chosen. The rest of the meals throughout the ship could be thousands of mix/match combinations. Some people eat breakfast, some don't. Same for lunch. Some have pizza at midnight. Some order room service. The possibilities are endless.

 

I already said you could add extra gratuity if you wished but it isn't expected because it's included in the upcharge. The waiters in the steakhouse have gotten paid by you eating there. Unlike the people who go to dinner in the MDR and remove gratuities. Or the people that don't eat there but do eat in the buffet or order room service which are the same people that work the MDR at night.

[Dave994]

seems we do. my reasoning is that i'm tired of watching the cheapskates lie through their teeth the last night of the cruise coming up with any bs reason to pull their tips at gs. also makes the line at gs extremely long for those of us who want to do something other than pull their tips. maybe carnival should have a 'remove tip' only line for those people so they can stand there until midnight to save a few bucks that they were obligated to pay.

 

 

Just curious....if your cruise fare went up by say 20-25% and carnival removed gratuities and paid their staff a better wage. Any issues?