Nieuw Amsterdam Group Booking - HUGE - Eliminates fixed dining and cuts open seating

[Liz54]

First, I will clarify that I sent our concerns via email.

Just got an answer email back.

On behalf of the president, Christine Ferris has offered us a complimentary dinner in Tamarind on our next cruise.

 

Nuff said.

Wow! Bon Appetit!:)

[styles27]

I suppose that could come in handy if they limit the MDR to 45 min open seating on "your next cruise" too. :confused:

[Liz54]

I suppose that could come in handy if they limit the MDR to 45 min open seating on "your next cruise" too. :confused:

This might be my favourite post on this whole long thread!

[OlsSalt]

This might be my favourite post on this whole long thread!

 

Hold out for as many complimentary Tamarind dinners for all nights of your "next cruise". They have to make up for what you lost, as well as entice you to risk HAL again.

 

That offer is really an insult. I bet they were laughing up their sleeve when they offered you this. Sorry HAL, I have gone to bat for you constantly in the past. But this one was beyond the pale.

[bUU]

Which goes to show that no more generous guest recovery would likely be worthwhile. There are clearly some guests who will be satisfied with the offered guest recovery and others who won't be no matter what guest recovery is offered.

 

We have discussed before in this thread the likelihood that different sets of customers are worth different levels of profit to cruise line and that when different sets of passengers have conflicting expectations the service provider must play the odds with regard to who's expectations to place over who's. The likelihood of future revenues, such as group passengers returning with their extended family for personal cruises, will clearly predominate the right decision. How do folks feel customers who we begrudge even the offered guest recovery will stack up with regard to the likelihood of future revenues on an aggregate average basis across that segment?

[OVgirl]

Hold out for as many complimentary Tamarind dinners for all nights of your "next cruise". They have to make up for what you lost, as well as entice you to risk HAL again.

 

That offer is really an insult. I bet they were laughing up their sleeve when they offered you this. Sorry HAL, I have gone to bat for you constantly in the past. But this one was beyond the pale.

 

And being 4*, one Tamarind dinner is worth $25 to us.

[styles27]

And being 4*, one Tamarind dinner is worth $25 to us.

 

So that's the way HAL treats their loyal customers? That makes it even worse.

 

Remember "the good ole days" when loyalty was rewarded? Boy I miss those days for so many reasons.

[styles27]

This might be my favourite post on this whole long thread!

;) Thanks!

[sail7seas]

First, I will clarify that I sent our concerns via email.

Just got an answer email back.

On behalf of the president, Christine Ferris has offered us a complimentary dinner in Tamarind on our next cruise.

 

Nuff said.

 

 

th ey should be ashamed with such a response. AND t to mention not all the ships have a Tamarind........ Out of luck, I guess if you should c hoose a non-Tamirind ship. Their generosity is pitiful.

 

So much for Signat ure of Excellence.

Edited March 24, 2017 by sail7seas

[OlsSalt]

Which goes to show that no more generous guest recovery would likely be worthwhile. There are clearly some guests who will be satisfied with the offered guest recovery and others who won't be no matter what guest recovery is offered.

 

We have discussed before in this thread the likelihood that different sets of customers are worth different levels of profit to cruise line and that when different sets of passengers have conflicting expectations the service provider must play the odds with regard to who's expectations to place over who's. The likelihood of future revenues, such as group passengers returning with their extended family for personal cruises, will clearly predominate the right decision. How do folks feel customers who we begrudge even the offered guest recovery will stack up with regard to the likelihood of future revenues on an aggregate average basis across that segment?

 

HAL can satisfy both; this is not an either or situation. That is lazy thinking.

[bUU]

HAL can satisfy both; this is not an either or situation. That is lazy thinking.

No: It is realistic thinking, and thinking you personally don't like and have a vested interest in trying to make sound less actual than it is. I respect how much of a challenge it is to try to look at a decision that is a disappointment for passengers and recognize it for what it is rather than casting the folks who do so in a negative light. I wish you would reply to my comments without trying so hard to make it seem like a competition between your consumerist perspective and my business perspective. How about we broker a truce between the consumerist perspective, expressing how passengers feel, and the business perspective, expressing what passengers can actually expect to get from their service providers? It's getting very repetitive with you continually posting mischaracterizations about my comments, and me having to clarify the error in your characterizations.

 

This message may have been entered using voice recognition. Please excuse any typos.

Edited March 24, 2017 by bUU

[sail7seas]

I have done myself a severe disservice by reading this thread and participating in it. I had been excited to return to HAL after all the sadness I have expeienced but my joy has been dulled. HAL of today does not seem to be the HAL MY dh and I loved so much. I should have left my memories intact and stayed away.

[OlsSalt]

No: It is realistic thinking, and thinking you personally don't like and have a vested interest in trying to make sound less actual than it is. I respect how much of a challenge it is to try to look at a decision that is a disappointment for passengers and recognize it for what it is rather than casting the folks who do so in a negative light. I wish you would reply to my comments without trying so hard to make it seem like a competition between your consumerist perspective and my business perspective. How about we broker a truce between the consumerist perspective, expressing how passengers feel, and the business perspective, expressing what passengers can actually expect to get from their service providers? It's getting very repetitive with you continually posting mischaracterizations about my comments, and me having to clarify the error in your characterizations.

 

This message may have been entered using voice recognition. Please excuse any typos.

 

HAL can take care of both interests.

[bUU]

HAL can take care of both interests.

Let's turn this around. Why do YOU think they don't?

 

This message may have been entered using voice recognition. Please excuse any typos.

[OlsSalt]

I have done myself a severe disservice by reading this thread and participating in it. I had been excited to return to HAL after all the sadness I have expeienced but my joy has been dulled. HAL of today does not seem to be the HAL MY dh and I loved so much. I should have left my memories intact and stayed away.

 

HAL is in the hospitality business. Creative minds will find a way to take care of all booked passengers. HAL onboard staff does not want to get caught in the middle either.

 

I agree, as a long time HAL loyalist who felt HAL business practices really earned our repeat business, including using HAL shore excursions almost exclusively, part of this discussion has been very troubling for me too. We don't sign up for HAL cruises to be in a forced march, totalitarian boot camp once we arrive.

 

We sign up because we have always felt welcomed and appreciated; not driven suddenly into second class citizen status with the cruise contract shoved in our faces, if we ended up in the situation which recently happened on the "large group" NA cruise.

 

Let's hope the more generous hospitality- centered management that has long been the HAL tradition will prevail against those now showing indifference and even support for this extremely disturbing and disruptive new "large group" preference situation. And not ever hear this new message: tough, take it or leave it and you will be seeing more of this in the future. So suck it up, whiners. Shareholders matter more than you do.

 

That is the message I was picking up, which is a very odd message from a cruise line long known for being genuinely the ships of smiles. May she long reign as what we have also come to know, appreciate and have continued to select. Let's hope this is a temporary detour, some upper management missteps, and will correct itself in good time.

[OlsSalt]

Let's turn this around. Why do YOU think they don't?

 

This message may have been entered using voice recognition. Please excuse any typos.

 

There is no reason to even answer this question. (NB: Please remove your distracting tag line message in your future posts. Thanks)

[RocketMan275]

HAL can take care of both interests.

Really? So far no one has proposed a way to do that.

[sail7seas]

HAL is in the hospitality business. Creative minds will find a way to take care of all booked passengers. HAL onboard staff does not want to get caught in the middle either. They may not wqant to be in the middle,, however they are, most guests havew little contact with the Board of DirecTORS OR CORPORATE Oficers. It is the crew3on board who the loyaalistts appreciate an return again and again to sail with Thhe company cxertainly has come to edepend upon that loyalty. Loyalty that is not re reciprocated can die a speedy death.

 

I agree, as a long time HAL loyalist who felt HAL business practices really earned our repeat business, including using HAL shore excursions almost exclusively, part of this discussion has been very troubling for me too. We don't sign up for HAL cruises to be in a forced march boot camp once we arrive.

 

We sign up because we have always felt welcomed and appreciated; not driven suddenly into second class citizen status with the cruise contract shoved in our faces, if we ended up in the situation which recently happened on the "large group" NA cruise.

 

Let's hope the more generous hospitality- centered management that has long been the HAL tradition will prevail against those now showing indifference and even support for this extremely disturbing and disruptive new "large group" preference situation. And not ever hear this new message: tough, take it or leave it and you will be seeing more of this in the future. So suck it up, whiners. Shareholders matter more than you do.

 

That is the message I was picking up, which is a very odd message from a cruise line long known for being genuinely the ships of smiles. May she long reign as what we have also come to know, appreciate and have continued to select. Let's hope this is a temporary detour, some upper management missteps, and will correct itself in good time.

 

Some of the 'former loyalistts' may suck up gtheir cash ands go elsedwhere. Yes, I get it,,,, there is plenty more cash around to make up for that.

[bUU]

There is no reason to even answer this question.

Yes, there is, but I respect your refusal to do so.

 

Really? So far no one has proposed a way to do that.

It is such a throwaway comment that, to use someone's own words, "there is no reason to even" grant it that much credence. This is one balance struck between customer focus and profitability. Is it the right one? All objective signs (profitability, revenue growth, remarkable growth in capacity, etc.) are "yes", while many subjective feelings say "no". The direct and overtly expressed unwillingness to grant that decisions that disappoint customers can be the right decision for the service provider stifles any chance of there being discussion; it makes it seem as if some folks just want a thread that embraces just one perspective, the one they happen to hold.

 

Some of the 'former loyalistts' may suck up gtheir cash ands go elsedwhere. Yes, I get it,,,, there is plenty more cash around to make up for that.

Precisely. And that's critical: These cruise lines (Holland America, Carnival, Royal Caribbean, NCL and perhaps even Princess and Celebrity to some extent) are moving down market because that's where massive infrastructure they all have can capitalize on a vast well of untapped potential customers. In the upper end of the market, massive infrastructure doesn't help - it actually hurts. And so we have Silversea, and Seaborne, and Oceania, and now Viking coming into the market as that "elsewhere" that formal "loyalists" (I'm only using that word because you are - I question any claims of loyalty since the word is abused so often by consumers) can bring their cash to.

 

And everyone wins - or could if they cared to. Every grade of service is serviced with offerings priced commensurate with value.

Edited March 24, 2017 by bUU

[sail7seas]

Not quite that simple. I was invited by Silversea to tour one of their ships, have lunch and hopefully be wooed into booking......... I did not like much about the ship or what I observed or experrienced while ab oard. they wasted their time and lunch on me. :D

[sammiedawg]

I have done myself a severe disservice by reading this thread and participating in it. I had been excited to return to HAL after all the sadness I have expeienced but my joy has been dulled. HAL of today does not seem to be the HAL MY dh and I loved so much. I should have left my memories intact and stayed away.

 

Can you cancel?

[sail7seas]

Can you cancel?

 

 

 

Yes, of couse I Can b ut I will not.

[sail7seas]

Can you cancel?

 

 

 

Yes, of couse, I Can b ut I will not. I feel I wish to 'go full circle.'

[bUU]

Not quite that simple. I was invited by Silversea to tour one of their ships, have lunch and hopefully be wooed into booking......... I did not like much about the ship or what I observed or experrienced while ab oard. they wasted their time and lunch on me. :D

And that's why there's also Regent Seven Seas, and Seaborne, and Crystal, and Oceania and Viking.

 

Now is it possible that nothing would please you? Sure. Sometimes we want things that are so unique to our own preferences, or want things to cost less than they're worth to many others, that nothing would please us. However, every grade of service is serviced with offerings priced commensurate with value.

[sail7seas]

And that's why there's also Regent Seven Seas, and Seaborne, and Crystal, and Oceania and Viking.

 

Now is it possible that nothing would please you? Sure. Sometimes we want things that are so unique to our own preferences, or want things to cost less than they're worth to many others, that nothing would please us. However, every grade of service is serviced with offerings priced commensurate with value.

A rather simple assumption that more costly is better. In this case, some say Not. Some of our HAL cruisers went to Oceania and returned happily to HAL. they were disappointed with the product. More pricey is not always superior. Simple assumptions are just that. .... simple,,,, in many cases.

Too often, it is stated as fact and acutal but in this c ase, it is not so according to some who sailed.While it is easy to implythe reaon s for disatisfafation is pesonal to one hard to please individual, it is useful to keep in mind some who arre dissaatisifd with some things HAL has done. They were most sastsified for many years, for dozesn and dozens of c ruises. So. maybe the indivdiual has changed but probably HAL has as well.

Edited March 24, 2017 by sail7seas