Nieuw Amsterdam Group Booking - HUGE - Eliminates fixed dining and cuts open seating

[RocketMan275]

Just to be clear. The ship still had early fixed for those that had booked early fixed. It was not available to you because it was already filled, leaving your only option being Anytime 5:30-6:15.

 

I wasn't aware that HAL guaranteed your choice of early or late fixed dining. I've seen many posts complaining about passengers finding that either or both of those options were already full even on ships without groups.

[Himself]

This sometimes happens. A few years ago we had six hundred National Review people and we all had early seating because this other group. had both floors zfor thief dinner meeting each night. I had no problem with this.

[RDC1]

I wasn't aware that HAL guaranteed your choice of early or late fixed dining. I've seen many posts complaining about passengers finding that either or both of those options were already full even on ships without groups.

 

Yep. Though usually one can switch to anytime. In this case anytime was also restricted.

[donaldsc]

We are experienced Princess cruisers who booked the NA for 2 weeks - February 19-March 5. We enjoy late fixed seating we had a lovely table for the first week. Mid cruise we were told that next week we could not be accommodated. The "choice" was open seating between 5.15 and 6.00 PM or go to the Lido Buffet.

The group booking was given as the reason. The ship's capacity is 2100 and the group was reported to be between 900 and 1200.

 

Needless to say this situation affected hundreds of people - all those wishing fixed dining AND any who wanted to use the dining room after 6.15.

 

The outcry was enormous and overwhelmed the staff who became rude in dealing with frustrated passengers.

 

This impacted everything on our cruise. The group were not drinkers or bar users so bar staff saw a drastic impact on their income. For everything else, - shows, lido dining, etc there were line ups. There was palpable tension between the 2 passenger groups.

 

We loved HAL in the first week but unsure if we can ever trust them with our cruising dollars again.

 

One way to avoid theme cruises would be to only book longer cruises. I would assume that most but obviously not all of the theme cruises would be on 7 day cruises.

 

DON

[OlsSalt]

One way to avoid theme cruises would be to only book longer cruises. I would assume that most but obviously not all of the theme cruises would be on 7 day cruises.

 

DON

 

Another way is for HAL to market these large group take-over bookings it as "theme cruise" up front, so regular passengers can choose to either stay away or join in.

 

Telling all passengers to stay away from all 7 day cruises, because they may get burned by the large group take-overs does not sound like good marketing for HAL. HAL needs to approach this with a scalpel, not a sledge hammer.

[styles27]

This sometimes happens. A few years ago we had six hundred National Review people and we all had early seating because this other group. had both floors zfor thief dinner meeting each night. I had no problem with this.

 

Even though we prefer to eat later I wouldn't have been too bothered by your situation either because at least you were put into the early seating and had a normal dining experience.

 

The non group passengers on this cruise weren't so lucky. Their only option to dine in the MDR was to go there for open seating between 5-6:15. They weren't just put in early seating.

[RDC1]

Even though we prefer to eat later I wouldn't have been too bothered by your situation either because at least you were put into the early seating and had a normal dining experience.

 

The non group passengers on this cruise weren't so lucky. Their only option to dine in the MDR was to go there for open seating between 5-6:15. They weren't just put in early seating.

 

However, with half of the ship in the group and locked into the late time period and the traditional dining room full. The remaining number of passengers should fit into the anytime dining in a single seating. As such not your normal anytime either.

[styles27]

However, with half of the ship in the group and locked into the late time period and the traditional dining room full. The remaining number of passengers should fit into the anytime dining in a single seating. As such not your normal anytime either.

 

 

Management probably thought by offering it as anytime dining that it would be better received. I wonder if they had just said "you've been switched to early seating at 5:45 because late seating and anytime dining is full" if it would have been less hectic.

 

 

That's happened to us when we used to book late seating only to be placed in early when we got on board.

 

 

Now that they offer anytime that's what we choose every time. I like flexibility.

[bUU]

HAL needs to approach this with a scalpel, not a sledge hammer.

Indeed, and it very well maybe that the very best thing the cruise line can do for its investors is to not do anything other than what it's already doing.

 

 

 

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[OlsSalt]

Indeed, and it very well maybe that the very best thing the cruise line can do for its investors is to not do anything other than what it's already doing.

 

 

 

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I

 

If HAL is now run only for its "investors" (large corporate block holders), then perhaps those investors should be their only passengers. And forget about the rest of us.

[bUU]

If HAL is now run only for its "investors" (large corporate block holders), then perhaps those investors should be their only passengers. And forget about the rest of us.

Nonsense. Practically every American corporation that is not a not-for-profit is run for the exclusive benefit of its owners as a matter of law. They still produce high-quality service offerings that many millions of customers purchase and appreciate. Strategically serving and satisfying customers is one way corporations serve their investors best interests.

 

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Edited March 20, 2017 by bUU

[OlsSalt]

Creating product customers want is always a good success formula. The Warren Buffet rule of investing. Everyday products done well for a greater number of people.

 

Not sure what circular logic you are arguing - saying HAL has to put its shareholders first and stiff the regular customers when necessary or keeping regular customers happy and returning is one way to keep shareholders happy.

 

Let's just say they are all really one and the same. And HAL apparently does send coded messages when they plan on stiffing their regular passengers in favor of larger groups - we broke the code - they do send out early notice there will be limited dining options on that particular cruise. They may not explain why, but now we know -- large groups to keep the shareholders happy.

[bUU]

Creating product customers want is always a good success formula.

Group passengers are product customers.

 

Not sure what circular logic you are arguing - saying HAL has to put its shareholders first and stiff the regular customers when necessary

I said nothing of the sort so you're basically raising a straw man here. Let's stick to the actual things people are saying rather than arguing against things people didn't say. No one is "stiffing" anyone. If you want to, come up with a better word... one that doesn't mean "not getting anything".

 

I want to be real clear.

 

I wish the world was the way you're describing.

 

Maybe we'll get there/get back there someday. In the meantime we're stuck with American capitalism.

 

 

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Edited March 20, 2017 by bUU

[iancal]

Really, how many cruisers would knowingly buy a cruise like the OP experienced that had such limited/restricted dining hours.

 

My guess....almost none. Why would anyone think that this is acceptable?

[styles27]

Really, how many cruisers would knowingly buy a cruise like the OP experienced that had such limited/restricted dining hours.

 

My guess....almost none. Why would anyone think that this is acceptable?

 

You nailed it!

[sheepers21]

Should it not be incumbent for Holland America to inform people at the time of booking their cruise that the dining reservation time that they prefer would be compromised on the second week of the connector cruise by a huge group??? (E.G.) the gospel group... I WOULD THINK SO!!😬

[OlsSalt]

We did get reports here that some passengers were okay being on similar dining-restricted, large group cruises, but I think they also got prior notice.

 

And it did look like an upcoming large group cruise ion the N-A to Alaska was discounted for the remaining regular passenger slots. Even though a passenger might not understand upfront why that cruise was priced more attractively than others in the same month.

 

We are learning what clues to look for, besides an independent google search for your cruise date to see it this cruise is also marketed to a large group booking.

 

1. 7 day cruises - most vulnerable - on the larger HAL ships - Vista class on up

2. Notice up front your main dining room time options will be restricted

3. Noticeably lower prices for that cruise, compared to others during the same time period

[jhsocal]

OlsSalt, your last post is quite informative.Booked our July Alaska 7 night RT Seattle on Westerdam the previous Oct. At that time our request for late set seating was waitlisted. This should have been a red flag, did not realize the reason until helpful CC members alerted me to Inspirations Group and that wonderful list. Called Inspirations in Spring, would not tell me their number booked, did indicate they could book up to half the ship. Took our chances, the group numbered 700. Were able to dine in lower level of MDR at 8PM and very helpful MDR Mgr. assigned a two top, same table and wait staff for five nights. 700 was manageable although, far from ideal. In the future, if I have the flexibility, would avoid these large groups.

[Charlie1422]

We did get reports here that some passengers were okay being on similar dining-restricted, large group cruises, but I think they also got prior notice.

 

And it did look like an upcoming large group cruise ion the N-A to Alaska was discounted for the remaining regular passenger slots. Even though a passenger might not understand upfront why that cruise was priced more attractively than others in the same month.

 

We are learning what clues to look for, besides an independent google search for your cruise date to see it this cruise is also marketed to a large group booking.

 

1. 7 day cruises - most vulnerable - on the larger HAL ships - Vista class on up

2. Notice up front your main dining room time options will be restricted

3. Noticeably lower prices for that cruise, compared to others during the same time period

Thank you for alerting me to what to look for in regards to large group bookings. So far My October cruise on NA seems to be unaffected. Fingers crossed it stays that way.

 

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[RocketMan275]

Really, how many cruisers would knowingly buy a cruise like the OP experienced that had such limited/restricted dining hours.

 

My guess....almost none. Why would anyone think that this is acceptable?

 

It wouldn't bother us in the slightest. But, then, we believe the MDR is over-rated, crowded, noisy, and pretentious. Truly amazing the emphasis some place on the MDR.

[RocketMan275]

Should it not be incumbent for Holland America to inform people at the time of booking their cruise that the dining reservation time that they prefer would be compromised on the second week of the connector cruise by a huge group??? (E.G.) the gospel group... I WOULD THINK SO!!😬

 

Why? HAL does not promise your choice of dining times or locations.

 

Step back and think for a moment; specific seating is often unavailable on certain sailings. What difference does it make whether that is caused by a group or not? (Or, whether the group has a religious affiliation?)

[OlsSalt]

It wouldn't bother us in the slightest. But, then, we believe the MDR is over-rated, crowded, noisy, and pretentious. Truly amazing the emphasis some place on the MDR.

 

Many like a sit-down dinner as part of their cruise vacation. Many on HAL even like dressing up for the occasion in this uniformed waiter, white table cloth, and silver service setting. HAL does market "As You Wish" sit-down dining in the main dining room. That creates the upfront expectations one will get their preferred dining choice. Including a fixed dining time, if this is as they wish.

 

All they have to do is change their marketing to reflect the truth. You will be limited to sit-down evening dining during a very limited time 45 minute period only, or else you can serve yourself at the buffet, eat in your cabin, or pay extra for sit-down specialty dining. As you wish.

[RocketMan275]

Many like a sit-down dinner as part of their cruise vacation. And HAL does market "As You Wish" sit-down dining in the main dining room. That creates the upfront expectations one will get their preferred dining choice. Including a fixed dining time, if this is as they wish.

 

That "upfront expectation" has no basis in reality. Those "expectations' are marketed as 'options', not promises. Show where any cruise line promises the general passenger (not suites) that they will be provided their preferred dinner seating or location.

[RocketMan275]

Many like a sit-down dinner as part of their cruise vacation. Many on HAL even like dressing up for the occasion in this uniformed waiter, white table cloth, and silver service setting. HAL does market "As You Wish" sit-down dining in the main dining room. That creates the upfront expectations one will get their preferred dining choice. Including a fixed dining time, if this is as they wish.

 

You are trying to manufacture promises out of preferences. Show me where HAL promised specific seating and locations. Show me where HAL promised you could walk up and be seated at the time of your preference.

 

All they have to do is change their marketing to reflect the truth. You will be limited to sit-down evening dining during a very limited time 45 minute period only, or else you can serve yourself at the buffet, eat in your cabin, or pay extra for sit-down specialty dining. As you wish.

 

It is far more likely that you will have to change your expectations to match reality.

[VennDiagram]

Really, how many cruisers would knowingly buy a cruise like the OP experienced that had such limited/restricted dining hours.

 

My guess....almost none. Why would anyone think that this is acceptable?

 

Some people truly do not care if something affects someone else, as long as it is not them being affected. Some other people feel it is their personal duty to take a contrarion viewpoint about anything that the majority cares about. So, really, the people who seem to think this is acceptable may care once it affects them. And the ones espousing the contrarion point of view may in fact stop espousing it if people stop engaging with them ;)