Nieuw Amsterdam Group Booking - HUGE - Eliminates fixed dining and cuts open seating

[sail7seas]

Others have commented that they know that Seattle DOES monitor this forum. However, even if they didn't you KNOW that the crew of that miserable cruise will tell corporate what happened.

 

I was on a Panama Canal repo on Amsterdam in the spring of 2015. She had just finished drydock after her World Cruise and was repositioning for the start of the Alask season. I was on all the way from FLL to Seattle (because I live there) so I had the misfortune of having to endure the short coastal segment from San Diego to Seattle.

 

It's been discussed in other threads how the nature of a "normal" cruise changes during a short segment. Well, on this one the evening of the San Diego boarding was unfortunately a scheduled Formal night. Those short-segment folks showed up in the MDR in unspeakably HORRIBLE attire -- and there were just too many of them to be turned away by the DRM and his staff. This caused many of the long-segment folks to vent their outrage on the DRM. I felt so sorry for him that I didn't join in the protest. However, I certainly expressed my feelings about it on the comment card and my post-cruise survey. It was not too long after that that "Formal" was changed to "Gala" and I've since been told by others that Gala nights are no longer scheduled on the short coastal segments. I'm positive that the DRM reported the situation to Corporate as soon as Amsterdam tied up in Seattle...if he hadn't already fired off an email to them immediately following the debacle.

 

Disclaimer: I'm not implying that the decision to change from Formal to Gala was precipitated by that cruise alone but perhaps the deluge of complaints by pax (AND crew) generated by that awful night probably convinced Corporate that the change was needed.

 

 

 

Do not kid yourselves............... meant gnerally and not speic ifically to anyone. Many who work in Sattle office arre fully aware what happened on that cruise and how many guests not a part of the group were denied the dining experience they paid for. The only un known, IMO is whaf will be the response fom those in Seattle offi e.

[sammiedawg]

How very "down market" to tell passengers who have paid for a Neptune suite that they should eat in a cafeteria. One of the listed perks to entice people to pay for a suite is: "Priority dining and seating requests." I suspect even the HAL cheerleaders would find this unacceptable.

 

Great post and it applies to passengers in all cabin categories who paid to sail on this ship. Downmarket seems to be where this once wonderful cruise line is heading.

Even more shocking is the post from the passengers who were told to go have pizza for dinner because the Lido was closing.

[slidergirl]

Susan, I believe that that is true on no Gala nights for those cruises. There were none on our 2015 nor 2016 sailing for the coastal portion on the Westerdam.

 

I just did my documents for my 4/24 repo on the Eurodam. It does indeed show a Gala night:

 

Number of Nights: 4

Confirmed Dining: OPEN SEATING

Gala Attire Evenings: 1

It does not matter to me, in either case. I don't do "Gala", "Formal", "Elegant." I will spare you the horror of looking at me on that night - I don't do the MDR, either ;)

[kazu]

I just did my documents for my 4/24 repo on the Eurodam. It does indeed show a Gala night:

 

Number of Nights: 4

Confirmed Dining: OPEN SEATING

 

Gala Attire Evenings: 1

It does not matter to me, in either case. I don't do "Gala", "Formal", "Elegant." I will spare you the horror of looking at me on that night - I don't do the MDR, either ;)

 

Just because it is on your documents, doesn't mean it happens. ;) Our Prinsendam cruise had the formal nights cut from what was on our documents.

 

It's the captain and HD's discretion.

 

Hopefully it's not on embarkation night if it is happening - not fair to those boarding on embarkation IMO. Most are tired from travelling and the check in process, etc.

[iancal]

That experience would make us vote with our feet and with our wallet.

 

When a cruise line sells such a large group on a sailing they are very much aware of the impact that it has on the remaining customers.

 

It is a management decision to force a reduction in the cruise experience and enjoyment of booked passengers in order to increase revenue from the group. I call it cheating your customers.

 

Bottom line profit trumps customer satisfaction in this instance.

[VennDiagram]

That experience would make us vote with our feet and with our wallet.

 

 

Totally agree.

[st1100y2k]

We are booked on the GasMonkey cruise leaving March 19th. Can't wait, I think it will be a hoot. A few years ago we were on Hal...found out it was a charter full of

"The Nation" members. They came to dinner at night in flip flops and muscle shirts. We really didn't mind, they paid 4 times more for interior rooms than we paid for a balcony.

[Liz54]

We are booked on the GasMonkey cruise leaving March 19th. Can't wait, I think it will be a hoot. A few years ago we were on Hal...found out it was a charter full of

"The Nation" members. They came to dinner at night in flip flops and muscle shirts. We really didn't mind, they paid 4 times more for interior rooms than we paid for a balcony.

 

But the key is you were allowed to go to dinner!

[summersigh]

A few years ago we were on Hal...found out it was a charter full of "The Nation" members. They came to dinner at night in flip flops and muscle shirts. We really didn't mind, they paid 4 times more for interior rooms than we paid for a balcony.

But the key is you were allowed to go to dinner!

We inadvertently booked a cruise with that same group "The Nation" for 2016 - or at least booked until we found we couldn't get late fixed seating in the MDR 9 months prior to the cruise date. We called our TA and bailed out asap :D

[st1100y2k]

They are slightly left of center.

 

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

[bUU]

Bottom line profit trumps customer satisfaction in this instance.

Remember, the group passengers are still passengers. There was customer satisfaction on both sides of the equation. So the bottom line was that higher profit customer satisfaction trumped lower profit customer satisfaction.

 

It always will.

[ON cruiser]

Having read all this thread, I share the concerns of many. Fixed 8PM dining is something to which DW and I look forward on a cruise. I am interested to learn of what response those who complained to HAL corporate office receive: apology, a promise to make pro-active disclosure of such groups, a future cruise credit?

 

Frankly, if those impacted on the NA cruise effectively complain, and in large numbers, then corporate may "re-think" these arrangements in future. One can hope, anyway!

[bUU]

Without a doubt. By the same token, if only a small number of people complain, that also informs the cruise line.

[kazu]

Remember, the group passengers are still passengers. There was customer satisfaction on both sides of the equation. So the bottom line was that higher profit customer satisfaction trumped lower profit customer satisfaction.

 

It always will.

 

 

Having been a group passenger on a number of cruises, I can safely say that our group did NOT pay more than the other passengers.

 

And I don't know if our groups were higher profit. I highly doubt it to be honest.

 

don't assume that the non group passenger is lower profit.

 

You know what happens when you assume, right?

[iancal]

All money issues aside, no matter how you look at it HAL stiffed the non group passengers to make the group sale.

 

Those non group customers did not get what they paid for. Their expectations were not met.

 

As a consumer I don't make excuses for vendors. I expect to get what I paid for based upon the commitments made and expectations set by the vendor.

[bUU]

Having been a group passenger on a number of cruises, I can safely say that our group did NOT pay more than the other passengers.

 

And I don't know if our groups were higher profit. I highly doubt it to be honest.

 

don't assume that the non group passenger is lower profit.

 

You know what happens when you assume, right?

Please read what I wrote in the context of what I was replying to, iancal's "assumption" that profit was limited to the group side of the equation: "Bottom line profit trumps customer satisfaction in this instance." I was applying a correction to that statement without trashing it entirely.

 

If what you posted is true, then the cruise lines would be doing everything they can to discourage group bookings. Clearly that's not the case.

 

So the reality is probably between your two perspectives. Group passengers are effectively just-plain-passengers who happen to book together. They contribute to profit just like other passengers. Their satisfaction matters as much as that of any passenger. There is nothing nefarious about how group passengers are served by the cruise line. It's just an unfortunate circumstance when you are adversely affected by the presence of a group aboard your cruise, like being seated with dining companions you don't get along with.

[styles27]

All money issues aside, no matter how you look at it HAL stiffed the non group passengers to make the group sale.

 

Those non group customers did not get what they paid for. Their expectations were not met.

 

As a consumer I don't make excuses for vendors. I expect to get what I paid for based upon the commitments made and expectations set by the vendor.

 

I agree with you! HAL could have just as easily told the group that they had to dine in the MDR before 6 but instead chose to invonceniece the non group passengers. That tells me exactly where their loyalty lies.

[OlsSalt]

Remember, the group passengers are still passengers. There was customer satisfaction on both sides of the equation. So the bottom line was that higher profit customer satisfaction trumped lower profit customer satisfaction.

 

It always will.

 

Actually, I think the issue is notice. So a passenger can make the choice up front, not have it inflicted on them after the fact. Something HAL may want to pay more attention to in the future to avoid mid-reservation surprises and disruptions, in the interests of all parties.

[bUU]

I agree with you! HAL could have just as easily told the group that they had to dine in the MDR before 6 but instead chose to invonceniece the non group passengers. That tells me exactly where their loyalty lies.

 

Except it really doesn't. Again, both the group passengers and non-group passengers are passengers. One or the other were going to be affected. Why do you think it was something other than arbitrary?

[styles27]

There is nothing nefarious about how group passengers are served by the cruise line. It's just an unfortunate circumstance when you are adversely affected by the presence of a group aboard your cruise, like being seated with dining companions you don't get along with.

 

I don't know...I think being told you can't dine in the MDR at all after 6pm the entire cruise is a little different than just being seated with dining companions you don't get along with.

The latter issue is easily resolved by switching tables, dining times etc. Not much you can do about having to dine before 6 (if you want to eat in the MDR at all.)

 

I'd say that's a major inconvenience that would certainly have negatively impacted us if we had been on that sailing.

[bUU]

Actually, I think the issue is notice.

However there is no reasonable expectation that a cruise line will inform a passenger of the details about other passengers... no reasonable expectation of notice. We just WANT notice. That's not the same thing.

[bUU]

I don't know...I think being told you can't dine in the MDR at all after 6pm the entire cruise is a little different than just being seated with dining companions you don't get along with.

Not at all. Some folks we cruised with recently were told the same thing... because late seating was already full when they booked their trip. I'm glad because that got them stuck with us in early seating, but they were still blocked from what they originally wanted, a seating after 6pm.

[OlsSalt]

However there is no reasonable expectation that a cruise line will inform a passenger of the details about other passengers... no reasonable expectation of notice. We just WANT notice. That's not the same thing.

 

Yes, we want notice before we give HAL our money. You got it. Let's hope HAL gets it in the future too.

[kazu]

Please read what I wrote in the context of what I was replying to, iancal's "assumption" that profit was limited to the group side of the equation: "Bottom line profit trumps customer satisfaction in this instance." I was applying a correction to that statement without trashing it entirely.

 

If what you posted is true, then the cruise lines would be doing everything they can to discourage group bookings. Clearly that's not the case.

 

So the reality is probably between your two perspectives. Group passengers are effectively just-plain-passengers who happen to book together. They contribute to profit just like other passengers. Their satisfaction matters as much as that of any passenger. There is nothing nefarious about how group passengers are served by the cruise line. It's just an unfortunate circumstance when you are adversely affected by the presence of a group aboard your cruise, like being seated with dining companions you don't get along with.

 

Cruise lines book group bookings as they get an easily sold out ship - or partly sold out and they don't have to discount last minute. It's as simple as that.

 

When our leader booked our 2nd cruise it would have cost more to fly us to Montreal (the group of 100 at that time - It grew) and put us up in a hotel than it did to do a 7 day cruise.

 

He literally had bids on our group cruise and went with the best bid provided it was a good cruise line, with good reputation that would accommodate us.

 

by the time I went on my last group cruise, we were up to 400 (so 800 with partners).

 

Large groups have power and don't necessarily pay the largest amount at all. In fact TA's that have group bookings available can offer lower prices.

 

What someone spends on board, no one knows in advance.

[styles27]

Except it really doesn't. Again, both the group passengers and non-group passengers are passengers. One or the other were going to be affected. Why do you think it was something other than arbitrary?

 

 

HAL made the choice...I don't know why they made it but they did. Ultimately some passengers were going to be negatively affected.

 

Maybe the correct thing to do is to not guarantee that groups that large will be able to dine together exclusively, unless they charter the ship...especially if it means closing off the MDR to everyone else.

 

From what I understand this group doesn't want to dine with other passengers who may be drinking alcohol, which is why they closed the dining room to others.

 

So HAL accommodated their request to dine alone.

 

What I'd like to know is what happened at lunch when they were eating with other people on the Lido, or sitting by the pool with others who were drinking alcohol?

 

If it were that much of an issue wouldn't those instances have been a problem too?

 

That's a general question not singling you out. :)