Aussies Ditching Their Kids To Cruise

[curtdesilets]

A little perspective on Celebrity and their children's programs. We first cruised on Celebrity with our children in 94 on the Horizon. They had excellent children programs at the time, they did not have rock climbing walls or water slides but no cruise line had that at the time. The closest to those things was the Big Red Boat which had the Disney characters on it. We did that cruise the year before the Horizon. Celebrity's first real build in children's spaces appears on the Century class ships, we did the Century in 95 and dedicated space was build into the ship Every ship after that has had children dedicated spaces. If Celebrity did not create spaces I seriously doubt they would be around now. They tried adult only cruises and they were a failure. Just giving a bit of perspective as dedicated spaces did not start with the M class ships and Celebrity was doing family friendly cruises long before the M class ships. One example of this was the Bermuda run in the 90s with two ships going there in the summer, loaded with children.

 

Thanks for the perspective. Celebrity obviously designed these spaces for sophisticated kids that travel with sophisticated parents. That I have no problem with. - Curt, OP

[miched]

I like that families enjoy time together and kids having fun.

 

Just a few things to consider.

 

Steve Wynn the architect of what Las Vegas has turned into promoted his casinos as family friendly with water slides and etc. and wanted families at his resorts. It didn't take him long to realize his mistake and tore everything to attract families and made his casinos into adults only.

 

We have always heard about how great the fun factory or children's program was on Celebrity. On a recent cruise there was a young couple with two young children about 7 and 9. We asked if they were in the children's program and suggested it to them if they weren't . They said that their children weren't really interested in that stuff no weren't. Two days later they thanked us for suggesting it to them as their kids love it and don't want to leave being there. Celebrity has a very nice program and all of the families that I have seen with children didn't bother me or take away from me enjoying my cruise. I have had more problems with so called adults that don't act as adults.

 

Now moving on to the next part that is very disturbing. I made a remark to my wife that when our only two grandkids that are twins get a little older we could take them on a cruise. She said no way for a few reasons of our own but the main one was that she just read a article about crime being committed by the employees of the cruise lines and many involved child sexual molestation by the crew members in the children's program. Some were where the employee would give alcohol to a young teenage female without her knowing it and then ...

Sad thing is that the kids don't know what is happening and the other is that the offender gets away with it.

 

Just a few things to consider🤔

 

Happy cruising 🌊🚢🇺🇸🌞

[dkjretired]

Thanks for the perspective. Celebrity obviously designed these spaces for sophisticated kids that travel with sophisticated parents. That I have no problem with. - Curt, OP

 

I would certainly not call myself or my kids when they were young as sophisticated but they did learn good manners in the dining rooms. I guess there was some sophistication because we all had to dress up at the time, no exceptions and nowhere else to eat except for room service.

[curtdesilets]

I would certainly not call myself or my kids when they were young as sophisticated but they did learn good manners in the dining rooms. I guess there was some sophistication because we all had to dress up at the time, no exceptions and nowhere else to eat except for room service.

 

That's what I was getting at. On our 14 day Baltic on Constellation many moons ago, my wife and I were seated with a University Professor and his family of five that included teenagers. The entire family were all very well mannered and we thoroughly enjoyed all 14 nights of dinners with them (this was before the Specialty Restaurant & Open Dining trends, obviously).

 

There are other types of kids and their parents on cruises though. Thus it is simply a numbers game. If say 20% of kids are unruly and you decide to cruise during a School Holiday Period and the total number of children on board is up to say an arbitrary point of 20% of the ship, and that ship is perhaps a larger S-Class ship... well the Quick Math is 0.2 x 0.2 x 2850 = 114 Bratty Kids. Wow, that would suck, even if you are a fan of Dennis the Menace.

 

Quick Math # 2 = We are sailing Infinity Sept 17-24 when 99% of school aged children are either back in school or in some sort of school orientation. Wahoo! :D

[Fish Lover]

Thanks for your response, and I understand your points. The issue (for us at least) is not just the number of kids on board, it is the general lack of parenting these days. Is it fair for other passengers to tolerate unruly behavior of unchecked children? As an example, on all three of our R-type Oceania cruises, just a handful of unsupervised children decided to use the quite small pool and Jacuzzi area as an unfettered no holds bar jumping,diving and horseplay area for hours. Just trying to enjoy a cocktail in the Jacuzzi became sort of a nightmare.

 

You last sentence by the way was a bit of a jab. You may want to rethink how you present your points without going personal, especially when you do not know us. :mad:

 

With all due respect, you should have had a word with the attendant or security rather than suffer in silence. generally, a quite word is all that is needed. I agree that parents who use the opportunity to allow their children to act unruly or fail to supervise are at fault. I almost never run into that scenario on Celebrity. My kids were always respectful, polite and well mannered. I received many compliments. However, we traveled with strict rules and they knew if they broke a rule they would be sitting in the cabin with a book for a good long time. And...by the way... this is also why I prefer the formal nights, dressing in collared shirts for dinner, eating in the dining room etc. It creates an atmosphere that is good for children to be exposed to and learn how to behave. But...that's just me. Sorry about the last sentence. I should not have lumped you with the other anti-kids posters (who are generally, imo, grumpy complainers).

[dkjretired]

That's what I was getting at. On our 14 day Baltic on Constellation many moons ago, my wife and I were seated with a University Professor and his family of five that included teenagers. The entire family were all very well mannered and we thoroughly enjoyed all 14 nights of dinners with them (this was before the Specialty Restaurant & Open Dining trends, obviously).

 

There are other types of kids and their parents on cruises though. Thus it is simply a numbers game. If say 20% of kids are unruly and you decide to cruise during a School Holiday Period and the total number of children on board is up to say an arbitrary point of 20% of the ship, and that ship is perhaps a larger S-Class ship... well the Quick Math is 0.2 x 0.2 x 2850 = 114 Bratty Kids. Wow, that would suck, even if you are a fan of Dennis the Menace.

 

Quick Math # 2 = We are sailing Infinity Sept 17-24 when 99% of school aged children are either back in school or in some sort of school orientation. Wahoo! :D

 

We are sailing Equinox same time for our anniversary. We do a lot of our vacations now when kids are in school, not that I mind the kids but less people overall.

[Marelaine]

Read it with elderly instead. Imagine the reactions you would get..

 

"We are not "elderly haters" as some people (i.e.Norwegians) apparently surmise from my fairly cogent and succinct opening argument. We, like many cruise critic members, simply prefer not to spend our Holidays with them. Apparently my Aussie mates agree"..

 

Thumbs up (y)

[Fish Lover]

 

...Now moving on to the next part that is very disturbing. I made a remark to my wife that when our only two grandkids that are twins get a little older we could take them on a cruise. She said no way for a few reasons of our own but the main one was that she just read a article about crime being committed by the employees of the cruise lines and many involved child sexual molestation by the crew members in the children's program. Some were where the employee would give alcohol to a young teenage female without her knowing it and then ...

Sad thing is that the kids don't know what is happening and the other is that the offender gets away with it.

 

Just a few things to consider🤔

 

Happy cruising 🌊🚢🇺🇸🌞

 

This is an entirely different subject. I absolutely agree. If one takes kids on board, you have to know what environment you are dealing with and create your own rules for safe travel. The problem is that parents very often this that a ship is a safe self-contained space where kids cannot get into trouble and that the staff is responsible for monitoring them. This is very wrong and sets the stage for a miserable time of not a tragedy.

[caribill]

 

Now moving on to the next part that is very disturbing. I made a remark to my wife that when our only two grandkids that are twins get a little older we could take them on a cruise. She said no way for a few reasons of our own but the main one was that she just read a article about crime being committed by the employees of the cruise lines and many involved child sexual molestation by the crew members in the children's program. Some were where the employee would give alcohol to a young teenage female without her knowing it and then ...

Sad thing is that the kids don't know what is happening and the other is that the offender gets away with it.

 

 

I did an Internet search on the subject and did not find one instance of child molestation by crew members in the children's program. so I would appreciate the source of your information.

 

There was a recent NBC report on sex crimes on cruise ships and they did mention one involving a ship's gym instructor, but that is not part of a children's program.

 

Most of the minors involved in various reports were in their teens and although some were molested by adults, many were molested by other teenagers on the cruise.

 

I think your grandchildren would be perfectly safe while participating in a children;s program on a ship. At other times if they are young they should be with you. If teenagers, you need to properly supervise them including a list of rules to strictly follow.

[curtdesilets]

With all due respect, you should have had a word with the attendant or security rather than suffer in silence. generally, a quite word is all that is needed. I agree that parents who use the opportunity to allow their children to act unruly or fail to supervise are at fault. I almost never run into that scenario on Celebrity. My kids were always respectful, polite and well mannered. I received many compliments. However, we traveled with strict rules and they knew if they broke a rule they would be sitting in the cabin with a book for a good long time. And...by the way... this is also why I prefer the formal nights, dressing in collared shirts for dinner, eating in the dining room etc. It creates an atmosphere that is good for children to be exposed to and learn how to behave. But...that's just me. Sorry about the last sentence. I should not have lumped you with the other anti-kids posters (who are generally, imo, grumpy complainers).

 

Thanks for the clarification on the grumpy lumping. It appears that your rules while travelling with your children were similar to when we both grew up. Kudos for establishing some ground rules. But you have to admit, not all families do the same. My wife is a licensed marriage and family therapist and has seen a sort of disturbing trend recently as pertaining to child rearing, at least in our neck of the woods. But I digress.

 

I suppose you are right that I should have said something about the horseplay, actually for safety reasons. No Diving policies abound on cruises and I have read some disturbing tales of drownings and near drownings on ship pools recently. Tragic! I think on some of these Oceania Cruises that I described there was a pretty substantial international crowd. Hard to say if what I was observing was cultural and/or the families didn't understand the accepted rules, i.e. no diving/jumping/climbing the railings of the Jacuzzi to jump in the pool, etc. Those kids probably did not enroll in the kids program on Oceania, possibly due to language. The Cruise demographics may play into some of this.

 

Going back to the original premise however and what stirs my interest in this topic, is that the R-class ships on Oceania are too small to accommodate a large number of bored kids. What that magic high number is is anybody's guess. Sea Days in particular brought out the worst of these described antics. But if there is a well established and well utilized kids program (like on larger ships) perhaps their could be a better semblance of order. The total number of kids on board does enter into the equation however, and there are many comments about this on Cruise Critic. Celebrity and Royal Carribean are different lines with different approaches to family marketing and enrichment . I think the original plan for Celebrity was a bit different than what they may be striving for now. Hard to say what the marketing geniuses at Celebrity are currently trying to achieve. But that's a topic for another day.

Edited July 21, 2017 by curtdesilets
clarification

[dkjretired]

Disagree with the premise of this thread. In the future I believe children will be on more cruise year round. I say this due to the increased numbers of kids who are home schooled and the tendency of many school districts to go year round.

[curtdesilets]

Read it with elderly instead. Imagine the reactions you would get."We are not "elderly haters" as some people (i.e.Norwegians) apparently surmise from my fairly cogent and succinct opening argument. We, like many cruise critic members, simply prefer not to spend our Holidays with them. Apparently my Aussie mates agree"..

 

Now you are just getting silly. Move along. Nothing to see here.

[curtdesilets]

Disagree with the premise of this thread. In the future I believe children will be on more cruise year round. I say this due to the increased numbers of kids who are home schooled and the tendency of many school districts to go year round.

 

Plus all the "Kids Sail Free" promotions.

 

Note: The original premise was all a big marketing ploy by Carnival Corporation anyways. We were all duped! This BTW because it was in the Cruise Critic News Feed. Need I say it? "Fake News" :o

[RealNorwegianCruiser]

Now you are just getting silly. Move along. Nothing to see here.

 

So you think it would be perfectly fine if someone wrote this about elderly persons? Or Asians? Or Americans?

 

"We, like many cruise critic members, simply prefer not to spend our Holidays with them"

[Banjo]

I don't get this 'I don't like kids on my Celebrity Cruise'?

 

I cruise when school is in period when I do the Caribbean (because it's cheaper) and usually Spring or Fall for a European cruise. I could count on my one hand how many kids I seen on those cruises. Also, I never encountered misbehaving kids.

 

Back in the late 90s and early 2000s, it was mostly with NCL and Carnival, my kids used the kids club and loved it.

[miched]

 

I think your grandchildren would be perfectly safe while participating in a children;s program on a ship. At other times if they are young they should be with you. If teenagers, you need to properly supervise them including a list of rules to strictly follow.

 

We aren't concerned about that. I jokingly made a remark to my wife about taking them. We personally don't want to take them. We always took our children on yearly vacations that were appropriate for them like Disney and etc. When we took 3 or 4 day adult type vacations we left them at home with relatives willing to watch them. I guess we are selfish as we don't want them to be with us while we are enjoying our cruise. Their parents can take them on their vacation and enjoy the experience with them.

 

Happy cruising 🌊🚢🇺🇸🌞

[southernbreezes]

Celebrity has never been a kid friendly Cruise line, still is not never will be (with their current ships). When I see kids on a Celebrity or a HAL ship I shake my head and ask myself what were the parents thinking. So many great ships for kids...Carnival, RCCL, NCL and most of all Disney all have programs and activities 10 times better than Celebrity for families. We had 4 children and when we cruised we left them at home to get away from kids all kids, not just ours. Times have changed over the years we have taken our grandkids on Cruises first on Celebrity then got smart and took them on RCCL, Disney, etc. a world of difference for them. We cruise a lot have seen well behaved and kids gone wild on ships, Celebrity does a great job not letting the kids go wild I have to say. We love Celebrity and will continue to sail with them kids or no kids, just prefer no kids when leaving ours at home.

[curtdesilets]

So you think it would be perfectly fine if someone wrote this about elderly persons? Or Asians? Or Americans?

 

"We, like many cruise critic members, simply prefer not to spend our Holidays with them"

 

I agree, that was bad wording on my part, so touche to you. Your earlier Nasty Jab at me though was equally incendiary.

So behave like a normal Norwegian and zip it. We did like your Vigeland Park BTW. Perhaps you ought to revisit it. ;p

[curtdesilets]

Celebrity has never been a kid friendly Cruise line, still is not never will be (with their current ships). When I see kids on a Celebrity or a HAL ship I shake my head and ask myself what were the parents thinking. So many great ships for kids...Carnival, RCCL, NCL and most of all Disney all have programs and activities 10 times better than Celebrity for families. We had 4 children and when we cruised we left them at home to get away from kids all kids, not just ours. Times have changed over the years we have taken our grandkids on Cruises first on Celebrity then got smart and took them on RCCL, Disney, etc. a world of difference for them. We cruise a lot have seen well behaved and kids gone wild on ships, Celebrity does a great job not letting the kids go wild I have to say. We love Celebrity and will continue to sail with them kids or no kids, just prefer no kids when leaving ours at home.

 

You get my meaning. Now imagine 2 or 3 dozen unsupervised kids on a R-Class Oceania ship which has a total capacity of 684 and has literally nothing for kids to do. Eeek! :eek:

[richsea]

Celebrity has never been a kid friendly Cruise line, still is not never will be (with their current ships). When I see kids on a Celebrity or a HAL ship I shake my head and ask myself what were the parents thinking. So many great ships for kids...Carnival, RCCL, NCL and most of all Disney all have programs and activities 10 times better than Celebrity for families. We had 4 children and when we cruised we left them at home to get away from kids all kids, not just ours. Times have changed over the years we have taken our grandkids on Cruises first on Celebrity then got smart and took them on RCCL, Disney, etc. a world of difference for them. We cruise a lot have seen well behaved and kids gone wild on ships, Celebrity does a great job not letting the kids go wild I have to say. We love Celebrity and will continue to sail with them kids or no kids, just prefer no kids when leaving ours at home.

 

That would be true if all kids were created equal. You are assuming that all kids have to have rock climbing and water slides. That is just not true. Like adults, kids likes and dislikes are very different. Many parents don't want to get away from their kids like you did; they gladly bring them exactly to spend time with them. It's called building life long memories.

[southernbreezes]

That would be true if all kids were created equal. You are assuming that all kids have to have rock climbing and water slides. That is just not true. Like adults, kids likes and dislikes are very different. Many parents don't want to get away from their kids like you did; they gladly bring them exactly to spend time with them. It's called building life long memories.

 

You assume we did not take family vacations. My wife was a stay at home mom and yes she earned a week vacation with out taking care of children, cooking, cleaning, dressing them, etc. Building life long memories, we did at least two family vacations each year, once a year to our Florida Beach Condo, once a year to places like Mexico, Virgin Islands, St. Kitts etc. at all inclusive resorts with kids activities. We coached little league, soccer my wife was the Brownie leader then Girl Scott leader. Lucky us lucky kids. We have been on over 60 cruises and yes I know a little about children having 4 and now 13 grandchildren it's not hard to see who is enjoying their vacations and who is bored to death. Much more than rock climbing walls, what entertainment, music, restaurants, etc. does Celebrity have geared to kids? Never met a kid that liked big band music. The most fun a kid has on Celebrity ships is going up and down the elevators. Take your kids on a Disney ship go to their private Island and compare, go to the nightly shows, have dinner in one of the restaurants all geared to families. NCL, RCCL, and Disney all have activities, great pools for the kids to enjoy, Celebrity small and boring pools. Kids all do not like the same thing at the same time, that is why we need lots of different choices for them to keep them busy and for them to enjoy THEIR vacation it's not about us it's about them.

My only point was Celebrity is a poor choice for families with kids, so many better choices. Every mom should not feel guilty taking a vacation not wanting kids to deal with. Do not even attempt to explain to me what " called building life long memories" is about.:mad:

[Fish Lover]

,,, The most fun a kid has on Celebrity ships is going up and down the elevators. ...

 

You couldn't be more off base. Not all kids want to rock climb. The kids and ten club activities on Celebrity are excellent. Well supervised and lots of fun (according to any kid I know who has attended.) Celebrity also deliberately schedules their activities so that they are somewhat separated from where most of the adults are likely to be.

[RealNorwegianCruiser]

So behave like a normal Norwegian and zip it. .

 

You seem to be such a charming person....

[southernbreezes]

;p

You couldn't be more off base. Not all kids want to rock climb. The kids and ten club activities on Celebrity are excellent. Well supervised and lots of fun (according to any kid I know who has attended.) Celebrity also deliberately schedules their activities so that they are somewhat separated from where most of the adults are likely to be.

And you were on a Disney ship when? Or RCL or NCL or Carnival to compare kids activities? I have been in them all!;p And so have my grandchildren.

[Fish Lover]

;p

And you were on a Disney ship when? Or RCL or NCL or Carnival to compare kids activities? I have been in them all!;p And so have my grandchildren.

 

First, I've sailed them all within the past few years. Second, you are simply wrong when you say that all Celebrity ships have to offer kids are elevators. Lots of kids actually dislike coming on vacation and being thrust into the overly physically active things like rock climbing and giant water slides. They simply do not appeal to all children. My kids always preferred quieter activities, perhaps even more intellectual or less competitive activities on vacation, especially on sea days when port days tend to be filled with activity. Many, grandparents especially, assume that kids need to be physically occupied by staff every minute of the day in order to be satisfied. Simply not true for many. I cannot say about your grandchildren, but it is an mistaken assumption often made that children need or want a floating amusement park.