Should Carnival Try Again?

[Thorncroft]

Carnival created this monster when they banned balcony smoking and limited smoking to the casino and a few outdoor areas. What they need to do is make the casino non smoking and have a number of indoor, closed smoking lounges in various locations on the ship where people can be out of the weather. With proper ventilation and ionic air purification, there would be no lingering smoke and smell drifting out of those lounges. It would be a win for everybody, as opposed to the failed moral victory that non smokers got in the last round of smoking guidelines.

[hrwi]

That's true - I know that on the Paradise a few weeks back, it's on one of the through-levels, so if you happened to be on a floor that didn't go through, you could hop up (or down) one floor to pass through, but had to walk through the smoky area. I don't think it needs to be completely isolated, but I hated when I didn't plan correctly and needed to walk through.

[jimbo5544]

My exact thoughts.

 

 

 

Do t think that will ever happen but good luck.

 

 

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[jimbo5544]

This is just my observation from 1 CCL cruise, but I know the design is common on CCL ships. The main promenade, which is the hub for evening activity, goes right through the smoky casino. It was my only real complaint about the ship.

 

Celebrity Solstice Class has a similar design, but the casino is non smoking, so this issue doesn't exist. Same goes for HAL, who recently banned casino smoking.

 

RCI came up with a smart design on Oasis. The casino spans the width of the ship (which is very wide) and only the port side allows smoking. Plus casino is not on a deck typically used for walking fore and aft. It's pretty well hidden.

 

As far as what CCL can do...I'd like to see a little better separation between the promenade and casino. Maybe glass walls or something, so the walkway doesn't get so smoky. Another option is banning smoking altogether in the casino. Two other major lines have done it already, (edit...make that 3 including MSC..I wasn't aware of them) so maybe the writing is on the wall for the rest of the industry.

 

Just my opinions. I'm just happy all the major lines have banned it on balconies. :)

 

 

 

They have done a better job of that on the. Sits and will continue it on the Horizon. That said, I doubt they will totally ban it from any ship.

 

 

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[cherbear4000]

I was on the Glory this summer and the smoke in the casino was so bad at times I had to leave. I actually wrote to John Heald and he replied that Carnival was in the process of upgrading their air ventilation systems on all the ships.

[Saint Greg]

Carnival created this monster when they banned balcony smoking and limited smoking to the casino and a few outdoor areas. What they need to do is make the casino non smoking and have a number of indoor, closed smoking lounges in various locations on the ship where people can be out of the weather. With proper ventilation and ionic air purification, there would be no lingering smoke and smell drifting out of those lounges. It would be a win for everybody, as opposed to the failed moral victory that non smokers got in the last round of smoking guidelines.

 

A non-smoking casino isn't a win for Carnival. The last thing you want is players to have to leave the casino to take smoke breaks. You want them feeding machines.

[cltnccruisers]

A non-smoking casino isn't a win for Carnival. The last thing you want is players to have to leave the casino to take smoke breaks. You want them feeding machines.

 

They also don't want players skipping the casino altogether because of the smoke and filth. That's what happened with us and others we knew on RCCL's FOS last year. It's the main reason we are trying Celebrity next. Perhaps a no smoking in the casino during certain times? Although I doubt it would be honored.

[Saint Greg]

They also don't want players skipping the casino altogether because of the smoke and filth. That's what happened with us and others we knew on RCCL's FOS last year. It's the main reason we are trying Celebrity next. Perhaps a no smoking in the casino during certain times? Although I doubt it would be honored.

 

People smoke in casinos. Non-Smoking Casinos don't work

 

Inside Gaming: Smoking Ban Hurting Harrah's New Orleans Revenue, Says Caesars

 

Two years ago in this space we reported on the New Orleans City Council having voted unanimously in favor of instituting a smoking ban in the city's bars, restaurants and other establishments, including casinos.

Speaking to the Riverboat Economic Development and Gaming Task Force on Tuesday, Caesars Entertainment president and CEO Mark Frissora "said Harrah's lost about $70 million in revenue during the two years following the start of the smoking ban in New Orleans."

https://www.pokernews.com/news/2017/03/inside-gaming-smoking-ban-harrahs-new-orleans-caesars-27460.htm

[firefly333]

wouldnt happen.

 

One smoker in a family so the whole family books a different cruise.

 

A lot of casino folks smoke, dont want to alienate people spending money.

 

they already having to give a ton of casino rates to fill ships, in order not to reduce prices. half my roll call is on casino ultra rates, you and i know this is to fill the ship. some said they only gambled like $50 total to get those $75 rates on a $1000 or more cruise (Im on a western 7 day and had to pay rate X 2 to book).

 

if they are having to pretty much give away a bunch of cabins to fill ships, there is no way they going to do anything that would cut down on bookings.

 

lol and Im on Freedom, never been on it before, but I see its the topic of this thread, thanks for the warning.

[2447874]

I just got off the Dream last week and the smoke was so bad from the casino that it was in the adjacent midship elevators and Alchemy Bar/Coffee Bar/Bonsai Sushi/Hub computer areas plus the lobby/atrium and forward elevators as well on the other side of the casino. You can smell smoke in any elevator on any deck from the forward and midship elevators. The other area is port side on deck 11 but you could smell pretty much anywhere on deck 11 plus deck 10 lido pool area and deck 12 near the slides as well. The smokers don't necessarily stay in their prospective areas. This was by far the worse ship I have ever been on with regards to cigarette smoke. We also had someone smoke on their balcony which is not allowed but by the time you get someone to come check, it's too late as smell has dissipated and the person is gone. I came home with a nasty sinus infection I'm still not over yet. We have another cruise on the Magic next year and I'm having second thoughts since the layout is similar but I'm hoping the passenger mix will be less smokers. Anyone been on the Magic lately, can you tell me if the smoke was bad anywhere?

[Saint Greg]

I could see no smoking at the casino bar. No smoking in the casino when it's closed. That could be a compromise. But they need a smoking lounge or something if they do that. And give me a place to smoke a cigar other than deck 11 aft starboard

[Aquahound]

People smoke in casinos. Non-Smoking Casinos don't work.

 

..said people on the Celebrity board and HAL board before they banned casino smoking. 2 for 2 on people being proven wrong.

 

Issues with a land based casino do not relate to a captive audience of several days on a cruise ship. Huge difference....again, as proven by 3 other cruise lines so far.

 

I don't really care. I don't gamble so I don't have a horse in this race (pun intended). But I am able to see history's facts.

[OCruisers]

Loved being able to smoke a cigar at an actual bar. Now they cram you in the top back corner of the boat where the only thing going on is a bunch of wind.

 

========================================================

 

While this is the Carnival Forum, still thought it might be of interest.

Caribbean Princess has Churchill's (cigar bar) that has an actually bar and bartenders.

Good place for cigar smokers to sit at an inside bar and socialize with other smokers. ;)

[Saint Greg]

..said people on the Celebrity board and HAL board before they banned casino smoking. 2 for 2 on people being proven wrong.

 

Issues with a land based casino do not relate to a captive audience of several days on a cruise ship. Huge difference....again, as proven by 3 other cruise lines so far.

 

I don't really care. I don't gamble so I don't have a horse in this race (pun intended). But I am able to see history's facts.

 

I gamble just a little bit and don't smoke in the casino. I think we all have a horse in the race because if casino revenue goes down I'd bet (pun intended) fares go up.

[meatloafsfan]

People smoke in casinos. Non-Smoking Casinos don't work

 

Inside Gaming: Smoking Ban Hurting Harrah's New Orleans Revenue, Says Caesars

 

Two years ago in this space we reported on the New Orleans City Council having voted unanimously in favor of instituting a smoking ban in the city's bars, restaurants and other establishments, including casinos.

Speaking to the Riverboat Economic Development and Gaming Task Force on Tuesday, Caesars Entertainment president and CEO Mark Frissora "said Harrah's lost about $70 million in revenue during the two years following the start of the smoking ban in New Orleans."

https://www.pokernews.com/news/2017/03/inside-gaming-smoking-ban-harrahs-new-orleans-caesars-27460.htm

 

Canada has banned smoking inside all of their casinos. They are still busy and making tons of money.

[Pellaz]

:cool: The casino on the Vista is enclosed and all the smoke stays with the smokers (LOL). It's one deck below the promenade. Being non smokers we really enjoyed the smoke free atmosphere and the smokers got to smoke while losing their money so we were both happy cruisers. There were other smoking areas on the Vista but they were all outside.

 

Well, not ALL the smoke stays with the smokers on Vista; there is an open circular mini-atrium with an LED "funnel" (like the one in the main atrium) that connects the casino on Deck 4 Mezzanine with Deck 5 Promenade, so there was some smoke "transfer" there.

We DID notice a lot less smoke on the Promenade than on regular ships, though, so it's a step for Carnival in the right direction.

 

..said people on the Celebrity board and HAL board before they banned casino smoking. 2 for 2 on people being proven wrong....

I am able to see history's facts.

 

So, factually, how much has Celebrity or HAL lost in decreased casino revenue from banning smoking in their casinos? And how much upward pressure will this cause on their fares?

 

I'm sure you have this information immediately at-hand, since you are "able to see history's facts."

[Saint Greg]

Canada has banned smoking inside all of their casinos. They are still busy and making tons of money.

 

It's easy to just say someone makes tons of money without any numbers. Give me numbers. Let's compare it to American Casinos. If you're sailing these smoke free ships out of Canada maybe you'll be fine. I've seen casinos try non-smoking floors and they don't last because not enough people use them. They become a waste of valuable gaming space.

[Aquahound]

So, factually, how much has Celebrity or HAL lost in decreased casino revenue from banning smoking in their casinos? And how much upward pressure will this cause on their fares?

 

I'm sure you have this information immediately at-hand, since you are "able to see history's facts."

 

Celebrity banned casino smoking 9 years ago. They still sail with full ships and have built 6 new ships since. Kinda speaks for itself, huh? ;)

[Saint Greg]

Celebrity banned casino smoking 9 years ago. They still sail with full ships and have built 6 new ships since. Kinda speaks for itself, huh? ;)

 

Depends on how much their casino makes. And how much carnival would have to increase prices if their casinos make less money.

[Drazil65]

We have another cruise on the Magic next year and I'm having second thoughts

We love the magic...been on her twice with 2 more cruises book for December and end of March on Magic....that being said...the smoke is atrocious in the casino especially at night....terrible just to walk through, smokers all gathered together and packed in tight against each other puffing away in the casino bar...strange and nasty way to spend a cruise I think (I mean, just saying)....not worth the money at that point if all you are going to do all week is stand at that bar and smoke one after the other all night???? Cannot imagine letting cigarettes control my vacation....IDK

[gnocchi_mommy]

Carnival could reduce a LOT of that smoke if they re-instituted the cigar bar! It used to be people who wanted an indoor smoke, could head there in an enclosed room and enjoy a drink and a smoke. Now that they don't exist you see people stopping in the casino for a smoke instead. The worst is the bar itself right outside the casino on the Paradise, each day of the cruise the "do not smoke" line seems to creep forward, and I swear the # of smokers increases. It's like every former smoker (guilty) on board decides about day 4 they need to start again for the duration (guilty!)

 

A casual enclosed smoking/cigar bar would reduce that sort of traffic into/by the casino a lot.

 

You can see this on the RCCL ships that still have cigar bars (not all do) I see way less people just standing in the casino smoking on those ships.

[bumorgan]

Was on NCL Breakaway last year and they have a smoke lounge in the casino next to the bar. Imagine seeing 30-40 people sitting there smoking all night and they don't have to gamble. I couldn't believe it.:(

[timeinthesand]

It all comes down to money. I guess with gamblers, smokers are the majority. Bleh

[Oshawapilot]

Canada has banned smoking inside all of their casinos. They are still busy and making tons of money.

 

Exactly. Basically any indoor space in Canada is smoke free.

 

Yes, there was a massive uproar when these changes started to happen. Bars and restaurants claimed they'd go bankrupt. Casino's complained they'd lose 50% of their customers. Etc etc etc.

 

And you know what? Smokers adjusted, and life has gone on. Casino's are still full, bars are still packed, and restaurants still manage just fine.

[Saint Greg]

Exactly. Basically any indoor space in Canada is smoke free.

 

 

 

Yes, there was a massive uproar when these changes started to happen. Bars and restaurants claimed they'd go bankrupt. Casino's complained they'd lose 50% of their customers. Etc etc etc.

 

 

 

And you know what? Smokers adjusted, and life has gone on. Casino's are still full, bars are still packed, and restaurants still manage just fine.

 

 

 

And if you get the entire United States to do that, people will probably accept it on cruise ships sailing out of the United States.

 

 

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