Muster drill during boarding?

[shawn742]

This may be a silly question due to my lack of understanding of maritime laws, but is their a reason that the muster drill can't be performed in sub-groups during boarding? E.g. Form a group of 500 or so guests (just throwing out a number), escort them to a room, theater, etc., and provide the muster drill immediately upon boarding. Once you're done, vacation has started. IMO, dropping everything around 4pm to shuffle thousands of guests to muster stations is a huge inconvenience and buzzkill.

 

If it has to do with knowing where you're exact muster station is, setup kiosks (or some way of validation) at the muster stations, and your sail and sign card isn't activated to get into your room, get drinks, etc., until you've "checked-in" at your muster station kiosk.

 

Like I said, maybe it's a law that I'm not familiar with that prevents this, but I think it would make the entire muster process much less inconvenient from a guest's standpoint.

[Lottacruises]

It doesn't make since to do it multiple times per day. I have behind people at the kiosk where you check your balance and people are definitely kiosk challenged. The lines would be horrendous and there would still be people that wouldn't attend. As bad as it is, I think that's the best it gets to comply with this law.

[riffatsea]

IF there was an emergency on board the whole ship would be involved.

Muster Drill is to teach you what to do in case of an emergency so the whole ship should be involved not small groups. It is also a waste of time for the staff to do this multiple times .

Sorry you feel that safety is a "buzzkill".

[shawn742]

It doesn't make since to do it multiple times per day. I have behind people at the kiosk where you check your balance and people are definitely kiosk challenged. The lines would be horrendous and there would still be people that wouldn't attend. As bad as it is, I think that's the best it gets to comply with this law.

 

The kiosk would be a simple scan and go, just like when you exit/re-board the ship at ports.

 

The drill could also be performed by a much smaller crew than the typical muster drill, which offsets the "not making sense to do it multiple times a day" feedback.

[jayscore]

Yes, the Muster Drill can be tedious. CCL's "new" system of scanning your S&S card before you line up has helped immensely.

Another thing to consider is all those CCL people conducting the drill do have their work waiting for them as soon as the drill is finished.

 

Yes the OP's idea has some merit, but I can't see it well received. :confused:

[shawn742]

IF there was an emergency on board the whole ship would be involved.

Muster Drill is to teach you what to do in case of an emergency so the whole ship should be involved not small groups. It is also a waste of time for the staff to do this multiple times .

Sorry you feel that safety is a "buzzkill".

 

Muster stations on large cruise ships = multiple "small groups."

 

In a perfect world, the entire ship would collaborate in harmony during a lifeboat necessary emergency. We all know how that would turn out, seeing that a lot of guests can't even wait for other guests to exit the elevator prior to pushing in.

[Lottacruises]

The kiosk would be a simple scan and go, just like when you exit/re-board the ship at ports.

 

The drill could also be performed by a much smaller crew than the typical muster drill, which offsets the "not making sense to do it multiple times a day" feedback.

 

It cant be a scan and go, there would be acknowledgements to confirm. There would also be an identity verification, which would require user input. If not only one person from my group of 20 is going, and their scanning everyone's cards!

 

I am down for anything that makes this process better though. A punishment for those that don't attend or are late would be a start.

[shawn742]

It cant be a scan and go, there would be acknowledgements to confirm. There would also be an identity verification, which would require user input. If not only one person from my group of 20 is going, and their scanning everyone's cards!

 

I am down for anything that makes this process better though. A punishment for those that don't attend or are late would be a start.

 

Fair argument. Identity verification would definitely be necessary.

[HawkIVette]

Come on. It takes about a half an hour, and then it is done for the week. It's not so bad.

[sanmarcosman]

The USCG might want to have a say in this :D

[shawn742]

Come on. It takes about a half an hour, and then it is done for the week. It's not so bad.

 

I'm not arguing the amount of time it takes, I just think the timing of it could be improved upon.

[tea4ular]

There's a head count to the muster drill (which is why folks who try to "hide" or avoid it, hold the rest of us up) as well as crew in those stations. A kiosk type experience would not provide the average passenger enough detail on where and how to find their muster station.

 

As much as I dislike the process, the end also signifies we are "officially" on vacation.

[Garth2]

And for those who feel they can blow off the safety drill, they now know who you are and you will be sent to safety drill detention after it's over.

[sc4125]

I don't mind the timing issue - however, I do wish that ALL ships would have the muster drill inside. I've been on some where you meet inside - listen to the cruise director's instructions and then make your way to the life boats. Others where you never have to leave the gathering place (ie the dining room). And, by far the worse, those where you make your way to the life boats - stand outside in 90 degree heat, 5 deep and inevitably wait for what seems like forever for those that either don't show up or waltz up 15-20 minutes late.

 

I also think it would help if you got a "speech" when checking in at the port that says if you are more than 5 minutes late for the drill there would be some kind of consequence. Not sure what these people could be threatened with, but it's ridiculous that hundreds wait for the few idiots. Maybe they should just carry on with the drill and for any showing up more than 5 minutes late, they should be required to go to an area and wait until the drill is over, then have their own drill. If you don't show for that, they deactivate your Sail & Sign until you do show.

[sanmarcosman]

And for those who feel they can blow off the safety drill, they now know who you are and you will be sent to safety drill detention after it's over.

You've touched upon an important point: safety isn't something people need to feel about, they need to think about their safety and the lives of their loved ones travelling with them.

[teknoge3k]

It doesn't make since to do it multiple times per day. I have behind people at the kiosk where you check your balance and people are definitely kiosk challenged. The lines would be horrendous and there would still be people that wouldn't attend. As bad as it is, I think that's the best it gets to comply with this law.

 

The kiosk would be a simple scan and go, just like when you exit/re-board the ship at ports.

 

The drill could also be performed by a much smaller crew than the typical muster drill, which offsets the "not making sense to do it multiple times a day" feedback.

 

 

 

 

You have to realize, there are people who get confused by a simple freestyle soda machine. If someone can't figure out a simple drink machine, they would be mind-blown by a kiosk that requires additional input.

[Alaskan Joe]

Muster stations on large cruise ships = multiple "small groups."

 

In a perfect world, the entire ship would collaborate in harmony during a lifeboat necessary emergency. We all know how that would turn out, seeing that a lot of guests can't even wait for other guests to exit the elevator prior to pushing in.

 

 

AKA my DW, she does this all the time and is like I don't think about it. Although, she thinks about it when we are the ones trying to get off. She is like some people are so rude :confused:that's when I remind her, she does the same thing. Then she gets mad at me and says "like I said before, I don't think about it" then I'm like maybe they didn't think about it either.

[Micahs Grandad]

They are not going to do it in small groups, crew is needed on embarkation day for other things.

 

Lately they are not going on and on about other things than emergencies so it has been shortened

[chengkp75]

The passenger muster drill is for crew just as much as for passengers. While those crew assigned to search and clear cabins, direct traffic down passageways and stairwells, and who take the muster list at the muster stations do this during the weekly crew drill, the passenger muster is the only time this crew gets real life training with handling large groups of what can be obnoxious and unruly passengers. So, this is a vital exercise in keeping you safe, as crew learns techniques, and supervisors can determine who is better equipped to manage crowds, and re-arrange the crew emergency stations accordingly. I know lots of cruisers feel that everything is about them, and if there is a way to make their vacation better, then that is the way it should be done. It sure is a shame that you've got to stop drinking a couple hours after boarding and do the "boring, tedious, and ridiculous" muster drill, but stop and think about how the crew feels, since they have got to stop their normal duties of serving you or getting your cabin ready, to "herd cats" at muster drill.

 

You would not be mustering in "small groups" in an emergency, why do you think this would be a good idea for a drill. As all safety professionals say "drill as if it were real". Having you stop doing what you are doing and going to muster is another important part, for you, to think about how to get to your muster station from various places around the ship.

[deadmoney]

Hate it.

Understand the need for it, BUT hate it.

Being packed in like sardines in the hot sun.

Hate it.

[moongal]

for me its a very serious thing as being a commercial fisherman in Alaska and Russia and being on a vessel that sank back in 1988 in the bering sea and trying to get 21 people off I for one take it very serious, knowing your muster station, life raft you are supposed to be on and accounting for everyone, one of the first things we do upon boarding is not only go to our designated area but also locate where the inflatable rafts are on both sides of the ship,

 

people complain all the time about these muster drills but when the sh-t hits the fan its better to know where and when to go, if the drill was 2 hours long you would not hear complaining from me and yes its very frustrating to see the people who just complain about drill when its going on and not paying attention, as this can save your life

 

 

 

I try to pay attention but can never seem to hear a word of what is being said. For myself, I would learn a lot more about what to do in an emergency if I could watch a video on the tv in my room. Then I could go find my muster station to see where it is I needed to go.

 

As it is now, I can hardly pay any attention to where the muster station is because I am being herded usually and then packed like a sardine in the Galveston Tx heat and I can neither hear nor concentrate on what is being said under these circumstances.

 

I understand the need for the drill but it needs to be made more efficient and done in such a way so that more people can actually learn from it.

[chengkp75]

There are really only three things you need to know about muster drill:

 

1. Where is your station

2. How to get to it from anywhere on the ship

3. When you get there, shut up and await instructions

 

The things to be learned during a drill are learned by doing it. It's called "muscle memory", the more times you go to your station, the less thought you need to do to get there. And if you're on a ship you've sailed before, or a sister ship, try to make the exercise more useful by either picking a new spot to start from to go to muster, or once at the station, mentally picture your path from an imagined starting point, and add a fire in between you and your muster station. How do you get there?

[shawn742]

The passenger muster drill is for crew just as much as for passengers. While those crew assigned to search and clear cabins, direct traffic down passageways and stairwells, and who take the muster list at the muster stations do this during the weekly crew drill, the passenger muster is the only time this crew gets real life training with handling large groups of what can be obnoxious and unruly passengers. So, this is a vital exercise in keeping you safe, as crew learns techniques, and supervisors can determine who is better equipped to manage crowds, and re-arrange the crew emergency stations accordingly. I know lots of cruisers feel that everything is about them, and if there is a way to make their vacation better, then that is the way it should be done. It sure is a shame that you've got to stop drinking a couple hours after boarding and do the "boring, tedious, and ridiculous" muster drill, but stop and think about how the crew feels, since they have got to stop their normal duties of serving you or getting your cabin ready, to "herd cats" at muster drill.

 

You would not be mustering in "small groups" in an emergency, why do you think this would be a good idea for a drill. As all safety professionals say "drill as if it were real". Having you stop doing what you are doing and going to muster is another important part, for you, to think about how to get to your muster station from various places around the ship.

 

It's funny that you refer to the muster drill as "real life" training. It's real life in the sense of dealing with a large crowd, but nowhere near real life of a ship with a disaster and everyone (passengers and crew alike) in a panicked state. I guarantee that the majority of the passengers on the ship wouldn't have a clue how to get back to their muster station without crew guidance. Obviously safety is of the utmost importance, but lets be realistic.

 

Have you ever heard the Mike Tyson quote "everyone has a plan, until they get punched in the mouth?"

 

Back to the point of my thread though, I'm not complaining about the muster drill...I just think it could be done in a more convenient fashion for all.

[chengkp75]

It's funny that you refer to the muster drill as "real life" training. It's real life in the sense of dealing with a large crowd, but nowhere near real life of a ship with a disaster and everyone (passengers and crew alike) in a panicked state. I guarantee that the majority of the passengers on the ship wouldn't have a clue how to get back to their muster station without crew guidance. Obviously safety is of the utmost importance, but lets be realistic.

 

Have you ever heard the Mike Tyson quote "everyone has a plan, until they get punched in the mouth?"

 

Back to the point of my thread though, I'm not complaining about the muster drill...I just think it could be done in a more convenient fashion for all.

 

Convenience is about the last consideration when planning and executing a safety drill. When they hold a fire drill at a building, do they do what's convenient for the employees, or do they do the same thing every time, so that everyone knows reflexively what to do. Do they do this in small groups, and say "oh, your group has to wait, or your group doesn't need to follow the alarm, that's for another group, you'll do yours later."?

 

As for "real life" emergencies, have you experienced any? Any on a ship? Over 43 years at sea, I have, and between those experiences and working with crew on many different ships, I have a much higher opinion of the crew than you do. Let's look at some examples:

 

Prinsendam in 1980: Ship caught fire in engine room, lost power, and eventually sank. All passengers and crew rescued with no loss of life or serious injury, in the Gulf of Alaska. Crew cited for their excellent behavior during evacuation.

 

Star Princess in 2006: Ship caught fire on a balcony, passengers were at muster stations for 7 hours. Crew cited for excellent work during emergency. Some policies and practices needed review at corporate level, but no panic among crew.

 

Carnival Splendor in 2010 and Triumph in 2013: Aft engine room fires resulting in total loss of power. In neither case was any panic among the crew reported in the official investigation reports.

 

Costa Concordia in 2012: Here the problem was not panic among crew, but the conflicting orders and information given by the bridge team. Crew were instructed to send passengers away from muster stations, so no orderly and timely muster could be made (there never was a signal for passenger muster), and the only public announcement was to "abandon ship", which is not the normal order, causing more confusion among the crew. While there was evidence of lack of training on the part of the Concordia's crew, the fault for which falls on the company and the Captain, there was no panic reported among the crew. Even the videos from the time show crew attempting to perform their normal functions.

 

When the passengers go to their muster stations, and possibly be told to board their lifeboats, 95% of the crew are nowhere near the boats, and are not getting ready to evacuate the ship. The only crew that leave the ship with the passengers are the 2-3 assigned as boat crew in each boat. The crew remain at their emergency stations, dealing with the emergency, even after the passengers have evacuated, until the Captain determines that there is no further purpose to remaining on the ship, at which time a separate signal will send the crew to their boat stations.

[WLHyatt]

Thanks chengkp75! I always appreciate your opinion since you've lived through some of these scenarios.