Anyone else concerned about the size of Ocean Cay?

[BermudaBound2014]

I typed this in response to another thread, but thought it may be hijacking so I'll start my own thread for discussion about the size of ocean cay:

 

I'm a bit concerned about there being a YC area on Ocean Cay when it's all said and done simply due to size restrictions. In fact, I'm a bit concerned about the size of Ocean Cay even if MSC does not dedicate space to YC. According to MSC, Ocean Cay is only 65 acres. That's tiny. Teenie-tiny.

 

For comparison sake,  Half moon Cay (CCL) is 2,600 acres, Great Stirrup Cay (NCL) is approximately 270 acres,  Coco Cay (RCL) is 140 acres. Granted, these islands aren't entirely developed,  but even if the developed area is close to the total size of Ocean Cay, there isn't any wiggle room for people to spread out. Example, on Half moon cay, approximately 60 acres are developed, but there are an additional 9 miles of beach for people to spread out on (even if just walking/exploring). 

 

I recently returned from CocoCay on Anthem of Seas. Even thought the ship is slightly larger than Seaview (168 gt vs 153 gt respectively), they hold virtually identical amount of passengers at double occupancy (4132 vs 4180 respectively).  I would estimate that CocoCay has about half of it's 140 acres developed, maybe slightly less. If my logic holds true, that means the developed area of Coco Cay equals the total amount of area available on Ocean Cay (with no wiggle room).  Based on persnal experience, It's going to be super tight even without reserved area for MSC. 

 

If MSC reserves some area for YC, it couldn't be more than 10-15 acres could it (25%)? Taking the total amount of usable space down to about 50 acres for the remaining 4000 or so guests. My home sits on 10 acres. I can't imagine 150 YC guests stretching out on my lawn. Our cabin up-north lies is 100 acres. I can't imagine 4000 people fitting there either.

 

Of course, I'm just playing a numbers game that doesn't tell the whole story. Add to that, my calculations could be off so I welcome additional mathematicians to chime in.  Perhaps the space available on Ocean Cay is much more user friendly than the usable space on competition islands, which would make this discussion nothing more than a null hypothesis. However; it's been MSC's business practice to pack more people into less space (as identified by space ratios on all the new builds), so I do think space is going to be a restraint with or without a dedicated YC area. 

 

I'm headed to Labadee (RCL's little slice of Haiti) in a few weeks. It's 240 acres. We're coming in on an Oasis class which is significantly larger than any ship in the MSC fleet. I'm interest to see if it feels as crowded as Coco cay did. 

 

I've been following the development of Ocean Cay since MSC announced (4? 5? years ago). Getting close to the actual opening is exciting. The final product is anyone's imagination, but it's interesting to me and I thought it may be interesting to other cruise buffs :). 

 

Edited May 5, 2019 by BermudaBound2014

[G.M.T.]

Some people have to do with living on 600 sq mts.

 

If you think Ocean Cay is going to be too crowded for you, stay on the ship which you will have all to yourself.

[BermudaBound2014]

22 minutes ago, G.M.T. said:

Some people have to do with living on 600 sq mts.

 

If you think Ocean Cay is going to be too crowded for you, stay on the ship which you will have all to yourself.

 

You won't have a ship all to yourself if my numbers are accurate  lol :-D.

 

The point of this post is not to slam MSC or Ocean Cay, rather to engage in a good spirited dialogue about what Ocean Cay is going to be with other like minded cruise enthusiasts. 

 

Ever since MSC removed the YC area renderings on Ocean Cay there has been lots of posts by individuals who are wondering whether or not a YC area on Ocean Cay will actually exist once it's finished. I'm simply making a case that it won't. I reserve the right to be wrong.

 

 

[scpirate]

The ship is there all day.i for one won't be in the mad rush to be off the ship first.so let the first wave get sunburn and come back to the ship and I'll take the second shift.we are not beach people anyway we have beaches at home within a couple hours drive.we don't cruise for beach time but we are in the minority in many more ways than one.my grand kids live on the beach so I don't expect them to spend much time in the water.i would rather go to an actual port but it's the best itinerary I could get before the youngest has to go back to school.

[marcoigna]

The YC section was removed from the map as it will not be completed until February 2020 - until then there is going to be a makeshift YC section from day one complete with cabanas.  Hope this helps.   

[oldenslo]

How do you cope on seas days with so many people crammed on the ship?

 

65 acres sounds like a lot bigger area than the public areas of the ship.

 

As with all ports there will be a percentage that wont get off the ship at all.

[neptuno]

We are hoping to find nice coral formations to snorkel from shore.  Does anyone know about this?

[BermudaBound2014]

10 hours ago, oldenslo said:

How do you cope on seas days with so many people crammed on the ship?

 

65 acres sounds like a lot bigger area than the public areas of the ship.

 

As with all ports there will be a percentage that wont get off the ship at all.

This is actually a great point! While it may be more crowded than competitors private island, it won't feel more crammed than sea days for certain. 

 

My post was about opening discussion because having just been to private island it dawned on me that Ocean Cay was tiny. Never thought about the size of Ocean Cay before Saturday. Thanks for contributing :). 

[BermudaBound2014]

10 hours ago, neptuno said:

We are hoping to find nice coral formations to snorkel from shore.  Does anyone know about this?

 

Ocean Cay was an industrial island before MSC took it over so I'm not sure if any original coral exists. Ocean Cay also sits closer to the shipping lane and deeper water than the rest of the bahamas so I'm not sure if that will effect marine life.   I did read way back when that MSC was adding under-water structures to promote coral growth. 🙂

Edited May 6, 2019 by BermudaBound2014

[BermudaBound2014]

10 hours ago, marcoigna said:

The YC section was removed from the map as it will not be completed until February 2020 - until then there is going to be a makeshift YC section from day one complete with cabanas.  Hope this helps.   

 

Looking forward to photos 😉

[Mattnvick]

20 hours ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

I typed this in response to another thread, but thought it may be hijacking so I'll start my own thread for discussion about the size of ocean cay:

 

I'm a bit concerned about there being a YC area on Ocean Cay when it's all said and done simply due to size restrictions. In fact, I'm a bit concerned about the size of Ocean Cay even if MSC does not dedicate space to YC. According to MSC, Ocean Cay is only 65 acres. That's tiny. Teenie-tiny.

 

For comparison sake,  Half moon Cay (CCL) is 2,600 acres, Great Stirrup Cay (NCL) is approximately 270 acres,  Coco Cay (RCL) is 140 acres. Granted, these islands aren't entirely developed,  but even if the developed area is close to the total size of Ocean Cay, there isn't any wiggle room for people to spread out. Example, on Half moon cay, approximately 60 acres are developed, but there are an additional 9 miles of beach for people to spread out on (even if just walking/exploring). 

 

I recently returned from CocoCay on Anthem of Seas. Even thought the ship is slightly larger than Seaview (168 gt vs 153 gt respectively), they hold virtually identical amount of passengers at double occupancy (4132 vs 4180 respectively).  I would estimate that CocoCay has about half of it's 140 acres developed, maybe slightly less. If my logic holds true, that means the developed area of Coco Cay equals the total amount of area available on Ocean Cay (with no wiggle room).  Based on persnal experience, It's going to be super tight even without reserved area for MSC. 

 

If MSC reserves some area for YC, it couldn't be more than 10-15 acres could it (25%)? Taking the total amount of usable space down to about 50 acres for the remaining 4000 or so guests. My home sits on 10 acres. I can't imagine 150 YC guests stretching out on my lawn. Our cabin up-north lies is 100 acres. I can't imagine 4000 people fitting there either.

 

Of course, I'm just playing a numbers game that doesn't tell the whole story. Add to that, my calculations could be off so I welcome additional mathematicians to chime in.  Perhaps the space available on Ocean Cay is much more user friendly than the usable space on competition islands, which would make this discussion nothing more than a null hypothesis. However; it's been MSC's business practice to pack more people into less space (as identified by space ratios on all the new builds), so I do think space is going to be a restraint with or without a dedicated YC area. 

 

I'm headed to Labadee (RCL's little slice of Haiti) in a few weeks. It's 240 acres. We're coming in on an Oasis class which is significantly larger than any ship in the MSC fleet. I'm interest to see if it feels as crowded as Coco cay did. 

 

I've been following the development of Ocean Cay since MSC announced (4? 5? years ago). Getting close to the actual opening is exciting. The final product is anyone's imagination, but it's interesting to me and I thought it may be interesting to other cruise buffs :). 

 

 

Norwegians island Harvest Caye off of southern Belize is only 75 acres. I was there in February on the Getaway.

 

They have an area for only the Haven (i wasnt in the haven) but the island never felt small or constricted to me.

 

There was a beach, a pool, a wildlife area and zip line.

 

Although i wasnt too impressed with NCL i thought the private island was something they did really well.

 

I dont think you need to worry about the 6o acres in Ocean Caye. I think it will be beautiful. MSC takes a pride in their appearemce of their ships  i have no reason to believe the island will be any different.

 

Im looking fwd very much to going there

[GOLDENBONNY]

no. I am only concern about things that important in my life and I can change them . 

[BermudaBound2014]

42 minutes ago, GOLDENBONNY said:

no. I am only concern about things that important in my life and I can change them . 

 

I used the term 'concern' as a noun as in  "concern: a matter of interest". You must of thought I was using concern as a verb. "concern: to worry or be anxious". 

 

I have absolutely no worries or anxiety about ocean cay, I'm simply just interested. I'm interested in lots of things that aren't important to others. Heck, I'm even interested in a mirage of things I can't change. 🙂 It's the curse of being curious by nature. 

[DCGuy64]

The title of the thread was "Anyone else concerned about the size of Ocean Cay?" Maybe I'm in the minority, but for me, "concerned" in that context suggests anxiety or worry. That's obviously not what you meant, but it could be read that way. And as a fellow curious person, I'm with you, I'm also very much interested in Ocean Cay.

[BermudaBound2014]

12 minutes ago, DCGuy64 said:

The title of the thread was "Anyone else concerned about the size of Ocean Cay?" Maybe I'm in the minority, but for me, "concerned" in that context suggests anxiety or worry. That's obviously not what you meant, but it could be read that way. And as a fellow curious person, I'm with you, I'm also very much interested in Ocean Cay.

 

I totally defer to your knowledge about language. It's your specialty and I just yack, yack, yack ;).

 

Thanks for being curious with me, for a minute I thought I was the only one.

[max996]

23 hours ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

I typed this in response to another thread, but thought it may be hijacking so I'll start my own thread for discussion about the size of ocean cay:

 

I'm a bit concerned about there being a YC area on Ocean Cay when it's all said and done simply due to size restrictions. In fact, I'm a bit concerned about the size of Ocean Cay even if MSC does not dedicate space to YC. According to MSC, Ocean Cay is only 65 acres. That's tiny. Teenie-tiny.

 

For comparison sake,  Half moon Cay (CCL) is 2,600 acres, Great Stirrup Cay (NCL) is approximately 270 acres,  Coco Cay (RCL) is 140 acres. Granted, these islands aren't entirely developed,  but even if the developed area is close to the total size of Ocean Cay, there isn't any wiggle room for people to spread out. Example, on Half moon cay, approximately 60 acres are developed, but there are an additional 9 miles of beach for people to spread out on (even if just walking/exploring). 

 

I recently returned from CocoCay on Anthem of Seas. Even thought the ship is slightly larger than Seaview (168 gt vs 153 gt respectively), they hold virtually identical amount of passengers at double occupancy (4132 vs 4180 respectively).  I would estimate that CocoCay has about half of it's 140 acres developed, maybe slightly less. If my logic holds true, that means the developed area of Coco Cay equals the total amount of area available on Ocean Cay (with no wiggle room).  Based on persnal experience, It's going to be super tight even without reserved area for MSC. 

 

If MSC reserves some area for YC, it couldn't be more than 10-15 acres could it (25%)? Taking the total amount of usable space down to about 50 acres for the remaining 4000 or so guests. My home sits on 10 acres. I can't imagine 150 YC guests stretching out on my lawn. Our cabin up-north lies is 100 acres. I can't imagine 4000 people fitting there either.

 

Of course, I'm just playing a numbers game that doesn't tell the whole story. Add to that, my calculations could be off so I welcome additional mathematicians to chime in.  Perhaps the space available on Ocean Cay is much more user friendly than the usable space on competition islands, which would make this discussion nothing more than a null hypothesis. However; it's been MSC's business practice to pack more people into less space (as identified by space ratios on all the new builds), so I do think space is going to be a restraint with or without a dedicated YC area. 

 

I'm headed to Labadee (RCL's little slice of Haiti) in a few weeks. It's 240 acres. We're coming in on an Oasis class which is significantly larger than any ship in the MSC fleet. I'm interest to see if it feels as crowded as Coco cay did. 

 

I've been following the development of Ocean Cay since MSC announced (4? 5? years ago). Getting close to the actual opening is exciting. The final product is anyone's imagination, but it's interesting to me and I thought it may be interesting to other cruise buffs :). 

 

I've been looking for information on the actual size of Ocean Cay. Can you point me to the MSC site that provides that information? Thanks. 

I'll be on the Meraviglia sailing out of Miami on March 15th and I'm looking forward to my day on the island.

[BermudaBound2014]

1 hour ago, max996 said:

I've been looking for information on the actual size of Ocean Cay. Can you point me to the MSC site that provides that information? Thanks. 

I'll be on the Meraviglia sailing out of Miami on March 15th and I'm looking forward to my day on the island.

 

I printed four articles about Ocean cay several years ago and each reference Ocean Cay as 65 acres which is what prompted my initial thoughts yesterday when I wrote the post. As many of you know, ocean cay is man made. Here's a link to one such article talking about the dredging Ocean cay for argonite: too:https://www.dredge.com/2001/03/pumps-convey-aragonite-slurry-6000-feet-in-bahamas-mining-project-for-marcona/ 

 

However; your question prompted me to do a quick google search where I found that MSC is claiming Ocean Cay as 95 acres. Knowing that Ocean Cay is man made and thus can grow, I did a google earth map of the island and it came in around 90 acres (see below), so MSC figures appear much more in line than my post about Ocean Cay yesterday.

 

So, thank you for the dialog. I stand corrected!! It appears Ocean Cay is 95 acres now (not 65) which makes it about 30% larger than what I wrote yesterday. That makes a huge difference. It's not teenie tiny, it's just tiny.  While still the smallest of private islands, 95 acres will put it much closer to it's nearest competition Coco Cay (140 acres). 

 

A few of the initial articles initially posted about Ocean Cay claimed it  would be the 'largest private island in the Caribbean". https://www.ship-technology.com/features/featureocean-cay-the-worlds-biggest-private-cruise-resort-emerges-5819076/ What I think the articles really mean is the largest MAN MADE island in the Caribbean.

 

It's all very interesting to me :). 

 

 

Edited May 6, 2019 by BermudaBound2014
add photo

[JAGR]

4 hours ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

 

Ocean Cay was an industrial island before MSC took it over so I'm not sure if any original coral exists. Ocean Cay also sits closer to the shipping lane and deeper water than the rest of the bahamas so I'm not sure if that will effect marine life.   I did read way back when that MSC was adding under-water structures to promote coral growth. 🙂

I thought it was just water a few years ago!  Isn't it man-made and not a reclaimed island?

[BermudaBound2014]

2 minutes ago, JAGR said:

I thought it was just water a few years ago!  Isn't it man-made and not a reclaimed island?

 

You are correct, the island is entirely man made. It appears as though the Argonite dredging company were the initial creators. I also remember reading about a pipeline designed to go from from the island to Miami since it really is very close (only 65 miles). Based on what I can tell, MSC purchased the island once it was abandoned but it was already partially created. There is video circulating POST msc purchase that shows the dredgers adding sand to the island, but based on everything I can put together, MSC already had an island before the purchase :). 

[hamrag]

2 hours ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

So, thank you for the dialog. I stand corrected!! It appears Ocean Cay is 95 acres now (not 65) which makes it about 30% larger than what I wrote yesterday. That makes a huge difference. It's not teenie tiny, it's just tiny.  While still the smallest of private islands, 95 acres will put it much closer to it's nearest competition Coco Cay (140 acres). 

 

If you do the maths correctly, it is about 45% larger...not 30%, as you claim!!

[BermudaBound2014]

1 minute ago, hamrag said:

 

If you do the maths correctly, it is about 45% larger...not 30%, as you claim!!

 

I thought using the word 'about' gave allowance for a rough estimate (albeit very rough)?   I  do agree, the difference between 30% and 45% of 95 acres might be statistically significant not to mention that 45% just sounds much bigger. However; being a math person you know that one can crunch the numbers until they confess a variety of ways. 

 

I could have stated that even at 95 acres....... 

 

Ocean Cay is 47% smaller than Coco Cay

Ocean cay is 185% smaller than Stirrup Cay

Ocean Cay is 2,637% smaller than Half moon cay.

 

I think my math is correct, but feel free to chime in :). 

 

Again, I'm not implying that Ocean Cay isn't going to be lovely. MSC builds lovely ships (with low space ratios). This isn't a slam on MSC.  I'm not making any absolute 'claims'. This is a conversation about size when compared to the competition. Most in this thread seem to think the small size won't make any difference.  I find it interesting. 

 

 

[max996]

16 hours ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

 

 

However; your question prompted me to do a quick google search where I found that MSC is claiming Ocean Cay as 95 acres. Knowing that Ocean Cay is man made and thus can grow, I did a google earth map of the island and it came in around 90 acres (see below), so MSC figures appear much more in line than my post about Ocean Cay yesterday.

 

So, thank you for the dialog. I stand corrected!! It appears Ocean Cay is 95 acres now (not 65) which makes it about 30% larger than what I wrote yesterday. That makes a huge difference. It's not teenie tiny, it's just tiny.  While still the smallest of private islands, 95 acres will put it much closer to it's nearest competition Coco Cay (140 acres). 

Thank you for taking the time and effort to research this for us all. My question was honestly meant to find something from MSC Cruises about the size of the island. I knew it was going to be bigger than the developed sections of Disney's Castaway Cay (which Disney lists as 55 acres), but I think we'll have to wait and see how big (or small) it "feels."  Making a direct comparison to another island based solely on acreage isn't accurate because I think it'll depend a lot on the size of the vessel and the amount of passengers on board at the time.

I called on Castaway Cay aboard the Disney Wonder once and it felt a lot less crowded than a stop my family made while aboard the Fantasy in July one year. So although 95 acres is bigger than 55 acres, when MSC Seaside pulls in with a full passenger manifest of over 5,000 passengers it's probably going to feel much more congested than Castaway Cay with Fantasy in port (<4,000 passengers).

Edited May 7, 2019 by max996

[dexddd]

3 minutes ago, max996 said:

Thank you for taking the time and effort to research this for us all. My question was honestly meant to find something from MSC Cruises about the size of the island. I knew it was going to be bigger than the developed sections of Disney's Castaway Cay (which Disney lists as 55 acres), but I think we'll have to wait and see how big (or small) it "feels."  Making a direct comparison to another island based solely on acreage isn't accurate because I think it'll depend a lot on the size of the vessel and the amount of passengers on board at the time.

I called on Castaway Cay aboard the Disney Wonder once and it felt a lot less crowded than a stop my family made while aboard the Fantasy in July one year. So although 95 acres is bigger than 55 acres, when MSC Seaside pulls in with a full passenger manifest of over 5,000 passengers it's probably going to feel much more congested than Castaway Cay with Fantasy in port (<4,000 passengers).

Overall, CC is 1,000 acres but you are right only a small portion is developed.  There is a noticeable difference at main beach between the old vs new class of DCL ship there in terms of passenger density.

[BermudaBound2014]

4 hours ago, max996 said:

So although 95 acres is bigger than 55 acres, when MSC Seaside pulls in with a full passenger manifest of over 5,000 passengers it's probably going to feel much more congested than Castaway Cay with Fantasy in port (<4,000 passengers).

 

The density I experienced at  Coco Cay a few weeks ago is what lead me down this rabbit hole. We sailed on Anthem (4,000 passengers) and coco cay was crowded with just her in port. Granted the water park was still under construction so that took off a big chunk of the island out of commission and part of coco cay is still undeveloped, but the first and second beach had every lounge chair filled by the time I debarked and the sea was  The far beach was less dense and had available chairs 3/4 rows back from the water. There are rumors that RCL is going to try to bring 2 ships (with one being Oasis class) into Coco Cay :::eyeroll::::

 

MSC is planning to bring 2 ships into Ocean Cay on at least some itineraries also. On the December 15, 2019, both Divina And Seaside will be in Ocean Cay. http://crew-center.com/ocean-cay-msc-marine-reserve-cruise-ship-schedule-2019 I don't see the 2020 schedule just yet to verify if two ships will be on a regular schedule. 

 

[DCGuy64]

21 minutes ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

 

The density I experienced at  Coco Cay a few weeks ago is what lead me down this rabbit hole. We sailed on Anthem (4,000 passengers) and coco cay was crowded with just her in port. Granted the water park was still under construction so that took off a big chunk of the island out of commission and part of coco cay is still undeveloped, but the first and second beach had every lounge chair filled by the time I debarked and the sea was  The far beach was less dense and had available chairs 3/4 rows back from the water. There are rumors that RCL is going to try to bring 2 ships (with one being Oasis class) into Coco Cay :::eyeroll::::

 

MSC is planning to bring 2 ships into Ocean Cay on at least some itineraries also. On the December 15, 2019, both Divina And Seaside will be in Ocean Cay. http://crew-center.com/ocean-cay-msc-marine-reserve-cruise-ship-schedule-2019 I don't see the 2020 schedule just yet to verify if two ships will be on a regular schedule. 

Thank you for this! It looks like we'll be alone on December 10, and only the 12th ship to visit Ocean Cay overall. That could be good or bad (pristine, unspoilt vs untested, growing pains, etc...) Guess we'll see.

21 minutes ago, BermudaBound2014 said: