Fresh Oysters Aboard?

[MarkBearSF]

Does anyone know if the QM2 regularly keeps fresh oysters aboard. (Oysters on the half shell with bubbles at the Champagne Bar?)

I've been thinking about our upcoming crossing in QG and decided that on my birthday, we'll request a special meal (it's scheduled to be a non-gala night). And for a starter, I'd like a half dozen oysters, some prawns, and some caviar (for my hubby, I'm not a fan of the stuff). Which started me thinking - Do they typically have fresh oysters?

Edited October 19, 2019 by MarkBearSF

[BigMac1953]

Unfortunately no.

 

A few years ago Commodore Christopher arranged for a group of six of us to visit a restaurant in La Corunna that was getting a delivery of oysters at midday.

 

Cunard's agent even turned up to ensure that everything went  well, which it did!

Edited October 19, 2019 by BigMac1953

[tv24]

Never ever saw fresh oysters, including the Queens Grill.  Does any cruise ship have such a food product?  I doubt  it since just about everything served has been frozen or put in some sort of packaging so that it can be shipped in containers.

[navybankerteacher]

There are a number of food items which, while possibly safe to eat, just do not retain their superior character with the passage of time- and stop being worth the effort to pursue.  Corn on the cob much longer than 48 hours after being picked, for example, or swordfish 3 days after being caught;  and, I believe, clams, oysters, mussels, etc. , more than a few days after being pulled from their beds.

 

Refrigeration and freezing may maintain safe edibility - but it does not always preserve special distinctive quality.

[BlueRiband]

The US Public Health Service requires that any shellfish must be previously frozen before it can be served on a cruise ship.  Freezing greatly affects the texture so frozen oysters would only be suitable for recipes like fried oysters or stir fried dishes.  (This doesn't concern oysters but my last experience with ordering caviar in PG was disappointing as it was pasteurized.  It does preserve shelf live but high heat is a terrible thing to do to delicate fish eggs.)

[majortom10]

We did have fresh oysters on our last cruise with Princess so they can be available think it must be when they are purchased locally in a port  of call and served almost immediately without the need for freezing. Having said that I have never seen any served on Cunard but dont see why they cannot do the same on Mediterranean cruises where there are many ports of call where they could purchase oysters fresh.

[Winchester Ranger]

Having lost not one but two work colleagues to “fresh oysters” their absence from menus on QM2 was never a disappointment for me.  They aren’t worth the risk in my honest opinion, and no I’ve never seen them served on either of my crossings.

[chengkp75]

23 hours ago, BlueRiband said:

The US Public Health Service requires that any shellfish must be previously frozen before it can be served on a cruise ship.  Freezing greatly affects the texture so frozen oysters would only be suitable for recipes like fried oysters or stir fried dishes.  (This doesn't concern oysters but my last experience with ordering caviar in PG was disappointing as it was pasteurized.  It does preserve shelf live but high heat is a terrible thing to do to delicate fish eggs.)

This is not correct.  Molluscan shellfish, intended to be eaten raw, may be brought onboard unfrozen (live):

 

"7.3.2.1.3 Fish for Undercooked Consumption FISH—other than MOLLUSCAN SHELLFISH—intended for consumption in their raw form may be served if they are obtained from a supplier that freezes the FISH to destroy parasites or if they are frozen on the vessel and records are retained"

 

Bolding is mine.  Other shellfish, like lobster, may be brought onboard live, but that is intended to be eaten cooked, so the above paragraph does not apply.

 

Oysters may be kept alive in refrigeration, but this is difficult on ships, as the shellfish must be kept in the original container (burlap bag is common), so that the identification tag remains with the shellfish.  The tag and records must be kept for 90 days after the package is emptied.  

[BlueRiband]

7 hours ago, chengkp75 said:

..."7.3.2.1.3 Fish for Undercooked Consumption FISH—other than MOLLUSCAN SHELLFISH—intended for consumption in their raw form may be served if they are obtained from a supplier that freezes the FISH to destroy parasites or if they are frozen on the vessel and records are retained"...

Oysters may be kept alive in refrigeration, but this is difficult on ships, as the shellfish must be kept in the original container (burlap bag is common), so that the identification tag remains with the shellfish.  The tag and records must be kept for 90 days after the package is emptied.  

Thanks for the clarification.  The answer that I copied came up in the context of crab legs and fish from Alaska.  From the more thorough details you have given it appears that the regulatory hassle involved in serving fresh oysters or any other type of shelfish is a major effort for a cruise line.  

 

If memory serves, I seem to recall a cruise line getting fined over one box of frozen lobster tails.  The line had records that they were caught when legally in season but the issue was that they were still in their freezer.  It wasn't enough to trap the lobsters in season but they also had to be consumed within so many weeks after the season!   Just one draconian legal interpretation like that will motivate somebody to avoid ever procuring that item again. 

[chengkp75]

1 hour ago, BlueRiband said:

Thanks for the clarification.  The answer that I copied came up in the context of crab legs and fish from Alaska.  From the more thorough details you have given it appears that the regulatory hassle involved in serving fresh oysters or any other type of shelfish is a major effort for a cruise line.  

 

If memory serves, I seem to recall a cruise line getting fined over one box of frozen lobster tails.  The line had records that they were caught when legally in season but the issue was that they were still in their freezer.  It wasn't enough to trap the lobsters in season but they also had to be consumed within so many weeks after the season!   Just one draconian legal interpretation like that will motivate somebody to avoid ever procuring that item again. 

The way I've been told to keep oysters is to place them in a pan, with the deep side of the shell down to retain the "liquor", and cover each layer with damp paper towels.  This of course is impossible if the oysters are to be kept in their original packaging (unless the fish market lays them out in trays like egg crates, pretty costly), which is most often the burlap bag.

 

I've not heard of any frozen protein being a problem due to time in storage.  Fresh, live, lobster are frequently carried onboard, and I have heard of oysters and mussels being served during the first couple of days of a cruise.

 

I know that Princess has excursions where you can catch Salmon and have it served onboard, but it must be from a vendor "known" to Princess (booked through them), so that the vendor is known to be familiar with the requirements for temperature maintaining from the moment of catching to the moment it is placed on the ship.

Edited October 20, 2019 by chengkp75

[exlondoner]

10 hours ago, BlueRiband said:

Thanks for the clarification.  The answer that I copied came up in the context of crab legs and fish from Alaska.  From the more thorough details you have given it appears that the regulatory hassle involved in serving fresh oysters or any other type of shelfish is a major effort for a cruise line.  

 

If memory serves, I seem to recall a cruise line getting fined over one box of frozen lobster tails.  The line had records that they were caught when legally in season but the issue was that they were still in their freezer.  It wasn't enough to trap the lobsters in season but they also had to be consumed within so many weeks after the season!   Just one draconian legal interpretation like that will motivate somebody to avoid ever procuring that item again. 

 

Very odd. Cunard regularly offers pheasant when it is completely out of season. How does that work?

[BlueRiband]

1 hour ago, exlondoner said:

 

Very odd. Cunard regularly offers pheasant when it is completely out of season. How does that work?

The incident that I mentioned only refered to lobster.   Don't know if other food items have catch by/consume by dates.   I found the article and it's from June 2013 where a cruise to Galapagos was cancelled when Ecuador cancelled Celebrity's operating license to the park:

 

"...It appears Celebrity Xpedition’s licence was suspended due to a dispute over 12 kgs of frozen lobster tails that the ship was transporting out of season, with Celebrity saying in a statement that the lobsters were purchased legally during the season from local fishermen certified by the Park and that no purchases of lobsters were made out of season. Celebrity says this was verified by National Park officials, however it appears that a new regulation requires that all lobsters have to be consumed within five days of the end of season. [my emphasis] Celebrity also says that when the company was suspended, it was not aware of the change as the regulation was not published until April 22. Celebrity was also fined $2,000 fine and is appealing the fine and suspension, which could take some time...."

 

I remembered that because it appeared to me to be a perfect example of overburdensome government regulation and draconian enforcement.

Edited October 21, 2019 by BlueRiband

[Underwatr]

There must be more to the story.  There are standards for the packaging and sale of raw whole frozen lobster so clearly they're not universally banned. 

 

For example: this product specification.

[chengkp75]

4 hours ago, BlueRiband said:

purchased legally during the season from local fishermen certified by the Park and that no purchases of lobsters were made out of season. Celebrity says this was verified by National Park officials, however it appears that a new regulation requires that all lobsters have to be consumed within five days of the end of season.

This appears to be a special requirement for lobster obtained within a National Park.

[exlondoner]

37 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

This appears to be a special requirement for lobster obtained within a National Park.

 

So nothing whatsoever to do with US regulations, despite what was said earlier?

[frantic36]

I love fresh oysters but understand it would be difficult to to serve on a ship. 

 

If any visit us here in Perth can I suggest you find some at our local fishmongers especially arriving in Fremantle. I don't pay more than AUS$24 a dozen for freshly shucked oysters. Kailis Bros is not too far from where the ship docks, but I haven't brought from them in awhile, though I know the quality is good. It costs more in a restaurant around $4/oyster. 

 

Sorry for the long ramble but only because QM2 stops here next March.

 

Julie

[chengkp75]

1 hour ago, exlondoner said:

 

So nothing whatsoever to do with US regulations, despite what was said earlier?

Well, as the National Park Service is part of the US government, then yes, it is a US regulation, but is not specific to cruise ships.  It is not, however, a part of the USPH requirements for cruise ships.

[exlondoner]

3 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

Well, as the National Park Service is part of the US government, then yes, it is a US regulation, but is not specific to cruise ships.  It is not, however, a part of the USPH requirements for cruise ships.

 

I thought it was in Ecuador?

[BlueRiband]

18 minutes ago, exlondoner said:

 

I thought it was in Ecuador?

Correct - the lobster incident involved Galapagos which is an Ecuadorian National Park.  It had nothing to do with the US.
Tale of the lobster -part 3

[chengkp75]

1 hour ago, BlueRiband said:

Correct - the lobster incident involved Galapagos which is an Ecuadorian National Park.  It had nothing to do with the US.
Tale of the lobster -part 3

My bad, didn't read the post thoroughly, still a bit muzzy from late maneuvering out of Houston last night.  

[Windsurfboy]

2 hours ago, frantic36 said:

I love fresh oysters but understand it would be difficult to to serve on a ship. 

 

If any visit us here in Perth can I suggest you find some at our local fishmongers especially arriving in Fremantle. I don't pay more than AUS$24 a dozen for freshly shucked oysters. Kailis Bros is not too far from where the ship docks, but I haven't brought from them in awhile, though I know the quality is good. It costs more in a restaurant around $4/oyster. 

 

Sorry for the long ramble but only because QM2 stops here next March.

 

Julie

 

Dear frantic36 going to Perth on way to visiting our son in Sydney , small by plane not ship. Any fishmongers in city centre  like Kallis Bros ,  where's the best area for good quality  sea food.

[frantic36]

6 hours ago, Windsurfboy said:

 

Dear frantic36 going to Perth on way to visiting our son in Sydney , small by plane not ship. Any fishmongers in city centre  like Kallis Bros ,  where's the best area for good quality  sea food.

 

I would have to be prejudiced and say my two fishmongers in my neighbourhood have the best, but that won't help 🙂. This is because not easily accessible unless by car for visitors.

 

So Fremantle it is. Kailis Bros Cafe is iconic in the area

https://www.fremantlefishingboatharbour.com/attraction/kailis/

 

You can catch a train, ferry, uber or taxi from Perth city. While in Fremantle there is the historical maritime museum or the modern Maritime museum with Australia 2 who won the America's Cup. If you visit on a weekend the Fremantle markets are also fun. I don't know fishmongers in Perth city. Kailis main fishmonger centre is in Leederville but not as easy for a tourist to get too.

 

In Perth city and Fremantle there are free CAT buses to use as transport to get around the main parts of the cities.

 

Sorry MarkBear for going off your topic.

 

Edited October 21, 2019 by frantic36

[MarkBearSF]

1 hour ago, frantic36 said:

Sorry MarkBear for going off your topic.

 

 

No problem. My question was answered early-on but the thread went in interesting directions.

[Windsurfboy]

Thank you frantic36 for the information  and  MarkBear for indulging my off topic question, but opportune advice from a local is always helpful

[canoncruiser]

In Mark Chirnside’s book about White Star’s ‘Oceanic’ of 1899-a lavish lunch was served to newspapermen in New York after the Maiden Voyage; the menu included oysters- I wonder whether they were part of the ship’s stores-she carried fresh fish and vegetables- or whether the oysters were sourced in New York, which had an enormous shellfish market.🤔