August 16th cruise out of NJ

[BND]

7 minutes ago, mizLORInj said:

 

Last year or the season before, there were 3 ships for a couple days--2 at the docks, and one Norwegian ship anchored by Kings Wharf.  So while it's not ideal for sure (who wants to tender--not me) it is possible to have more than one at Kings Wharf.    Yes, Hamilton is only for smaller ships.   Last one I saw there was HA Veendam.  Little guy compared to Anthem.  

 

I would love to go there on Oasis, esp. since it's redone.  Loved Allure.   But will any of that happen this season. . . I'm thinking no, but no one really knows.   It's a wait and see.  

 

I miss sitting on the balcony watching the sea go by.  

That's not the norm and I'm betting it wasn't originally scheduled that way.  Something caused that as King's Wharf really isn't set up for tendering.  We've been to Bermuda three times and there were always two ships there and one coming in after one left, usually within a few hours.   Empress can fit in Hamilton from what I've read.  Most cruise lines don't have small enough ships anymore to go there.  The point I was making to the PP was their idea of laying up Summit and bringing in Oasis wasn't going to happen.  Can you imagine a company telling another one that they can't do something because the first company wants to instead.  Um, yeah, not happening.

[mizLORInj]

10 minutes ago, BND said:

That's not the norm and I'm betting it wasn't originally scheduled that way.  Something caused that as King's Wharf really isn't set up for tendering.  We've been to Bermuda three times and there were always two ships . . .

 

oh definitely NOT the norm.   All the times we've cruised to Bermuda we were with one other ship or even alone at Kings Wharf.    

 

All this cruise talk. . . I think I have some Love Boat episodes saved up I'll need to watch. . . sigh.

[SeaHunt]

22 hours ago, Baron Barracuda said:

Assuming Royal only does shorter sailings for the first few months  with Canada closed Bermuda is the only available foreign port from NY/NJ.   Haven't read a word about their feelings toward cruise ships.  

 

 

The Premier made a little mention after talking about testing here:

 

"Mr Burt said airlines Delta, Air Canada, WestJet and possibly British Airways were expected to resume service when the airport reopened next month.

 

He added overseas mail would also come in when flights returned.

 

But Mr Burt warned: “There will be certainly less flights than we had before.”

 

He added that some hotels might not be able to reopen while airlift remained low.

 

Mr Burt said nasal swab tests would be taken at the airport but he expected a saliva test to be available in three weeks’ time.

 

He added antigen tests — which detect viral proteins that trigger antibody production in response infection — would “hopefully be up and running at the hospital before the end of the month”.

 

Mr Burt said an antibody test shipment was expected to arrive next week and the tests would be offered alongside regular testing.

 

He added he did not want to charge air arrivals for the test as the island reopened to tourists.

 

Mr Burt said people would be tested before and after arrival and that residents who returned would also have to be tested.

Residents are allowed to quarantine at home while they wait for their test results.

 

Mr Burt added that the United States ban on cruise ship voyages continued, but that the same testing rules would apply when cruise travel resumed".

 

So it looks like he's in favor of testing - but of course that could change at any time.

 

In the article it also says "Mr Burt added wearing a mask was “particularly, particularly important” so masks could be required, or that could change also. In other words, no real help here, but stay tuned!

 

http://www.royalgazette.com/health/article/20200613/burt-island-logs-two-more-cases-of-covid-19

 

 

[Baron Barracuda]

3 hours ago, SNJCruisers said:

The ships that are by RCI and the ships that are by Celebrity are not interchangeable so your proposal would be impossible.

At this point I consider ALL scheduled sailings to be merely placeholders that are subject to revision once sailing resumes.  If re-start will begin with fewer ships and shorter itineraries and RCCI can only sail one ship from NJ to Bermuda it only makes sense to use the one that will produce the most revenue.  That will be Fain's decision and he will tell Bailey and LLP who sails where.   Whole point may be moot though as I don't see any Summit Bermuda sailings scheduled until next May.  So if re-start occurs in 2020 there is no conflict.  

[SNJCruisers]

RCCL does not control the ships of Celebrity. Just like Carnival Corporation does not tell Princess or HAL or Costa which ships are going to sail. Each subsidiary works on its own, the ships are not interchangeable parts, even with the current epidemic going on.

[BND]

45 minutes ago, Baron Barracuda said:

At this point I consider ALL scheduled sailings to be merely placeholders that are subject to revision once sailing resumes.  If re-start will begin with fewer ships and shorter itineraries and RCCI can only sail one ship from NJ to Bermuda it only makes sense to use the one that will produce the most revenue.  That will be Fain's decision and he will tell Bailey and LLP who sails where.   Whole point may be moot though as I don't see any Summit Bermuda sailings scheduled until next May.  So if re-start occurs in 2020 there is no conflict.  

I think you missed the part where RCCL doesn't tell Celebrity what to do with their ships.  All Bermuda cruises for this year were cancelled because their season isn't year round.  They usually run from May-Sept/Oct.  You don't want to sail to Bermuda in Dec/Jan/Feb/Mar.  Do you know what the Atlantic weather is like during those months?  There's a reason there's no sailings then.

Edited June 15, 2020 by BND

[Iamcruzin]

Here is Bermuda's 2020 Cruise schedule. Looks like it's booked solid. Maybe some of you might want to call the other cruise lines and see if they are willing to give up their spot. You might get some takers since cruising this summer probably won't happen.

 

http://www.marops.bm/Documents/Shipping_schedules/2020 Cruise Ship Schedule.pdf

[Iamcruzin]

13 minutes ago, BND said:

 Bermuda in Dec/Jan/Feb/Mar.  Do you know what the Atlantic weather is like during those months?  There's a reason there's no sailings then.

Even in May and June the water is to cold for anyone who lives south of the mason dixon line.

[Baron Barracuda]

18 hours ago, BND said:

I think you missed the part where RCCL doesn't tell Celebrity what to do with their ships.  All Bermuda cruises for this year were cancelled because their season isn't year round.  They usually run from May-Sept/Oct.  You don't want to sail to Bermuda in Dec/Jan/Feb/Mar.  Do you know what the Atlantic weather is like during those months?  There's a reason there's no sailings then.

No one has proposed winter sailings to Bermuda.  This thread began with a question about sailing from NJ this August (doubtful) and shifted to a conversation about where ships from NJ might sail post re-opening.  Given that most hope for sailing to resume sometime this fall, Canada is currently closed to cruise ships,  and Fain has expressed a preference for shorter itineraries (theoretically ruling out Bahamas/Caribbean), the only foreign port that satisfies PVSA is Bermuda.   Late fall Bermuda weather is not ideal, but what other option is there from NJ?  January to March is a different story.  Have often cruised from NJ in winter and know how rough seas are.  Hopefully by January itineraries from NJ to Bahamas/Caribbean can resume.

 

As far as the corporate dynamic,  RCCI (not RCCL) can most certainly tell X and Royal what to do with their ships.  In normal times Bayley and LLP likely enjoy a great deal of autonomy operating their divisions.  However times are not normal, the company is in crisis and all decisions must focus on  what's best for RCCI, not her individual brands. 

[BND]

3 minutes ago, Baron Barracuda said:

No one has proposed winter sailings to Bermuda.  This thread began with a question about sailing from NJ this August (doubtful) and shifted to a conversation about where ships from NJ might sail post re-opening.  Given that most hope for sailing to resume sometime this fall, Canada is currently closed to cruise ships,  and Fain has expressed a preference for shorter itineraries (theoretically ruling out Bahamas/Caribbean), the only foreign port that satisfies PVSA is Bermuda.   Late fall Bermuda weather is not ideal, but what other option is there from NJ?  January to March is a different story.  Have often cruised from NJ in winter and know how rough seas are.  Hopefully by January itineraries from NJ to Bahamas/Caribbean can resume.

 

As far as the corporate dynamic,  RCCI (not RCCL) can most certainly tell X and Royal what to do with their ships.  In normal times Bayley and LLP likely enjoy a great deal of autonomy operating their divisions.  However times are not normal, the company is in crisis and all decisions must focus on  what's best for RCCI, not her individual brands. 

I think you need to give it up.  They are not going to tell Celebrity they can't sail their ship because Royal wants to instead.  

[TravelerThom]

On 6/15/2020 at 12:14 PM, BND said:

there are only two places to dock at in Bermuda

Last time I checked there were three places to dock in Bermuda: Kings Wharf, Hamilton and St. George’s. I have docked in St. George’s on a ship the size of Empress. 

[TravelerThom]

18 minutes ago, BND said:

I think you need to give it up.  They are not going to tell Celebrity they can't sail their ship because Royal wants to instead.  

Why do you think that RCI and Celebrity aren’t going to listen to their boss RCCL? Fain is responsible for the financial health of the whole RCCL corporation. Why do you think the RCCL Board would back Bailey and/or LLP and hang Fain out to dry? 

[BND]

7 minutes ago, TravelerThom said:

Why do you think that RCI and Celebrity aren’t going to listen to their boss RCCL? Fain is responsible for the financial health of the whole RCCL corporation. Why do you think the RCCL Board would back Bailey and/or LLP and hang Fain out to dry? 

You do realize this is some obscure idea that the poster came up with?  No one has suggested it except for him.  Why do you think it's even on the table?

[BND]

17 minutes ago, TravelerThom said:

Last time I checked there were three places to dock in Bermuda: Kings Wharf, Hamilton and St. George’s. I have docked in St. George’s on a ship the size of Empress. 

That has already been talked about.  

[Charles4515]

 Last year or the season before, there were 3 ships for a couple days--2 at the docks, and one Norwegian ship anchored by Kings Wharf.  So while it's not ideal for sure (who wants to tender--not me) it is possible to have more than one at Kings Wharf.    Yes, Hamilton is only for smaller ships.   Last one I saw there was HA Veendam.  Little guy compared to Anthem.    I would love to go there on Oasis, esp. since it's redone.  Loved Allure.   But will any of that happen this season. . . I'm thinking no, but no one really knows.   It's a wait and see.    I miss sitting on the balcony watching the sea go by.  

 

 

 

 

 

 There are two docks at the Dockyard. King’s Wharf and Heritage Wharf. Heritage Wharf can take super mega ships like Anthem and NCL Encore. Kings Wharf takes ships smaller than that like Summit. Oasis can not do Bermuda. It is too large for the channel. The largest ships that can do Bermuda are Quantum class.   

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

 

 

 

 

[TravelerThom]

2 hours ago, BND said:

You do realize this is some obscure idea that the poster came up with?  No one has suggested it except for him.  Why do you think it's even on the table?

Because the shareholders of RCCL (stock symbol RCL) worry about whether RCCL makes lots of money, and couldn’t care less whether it comes from RCI or Celebrity (or other subset of the corporation). Neither RCI nor Celebrity issues stock. Neither has a Board of Directors. Neither issues SEC 10-Ks. Fain’s job as CEO of RCCL is to maximize return for shareholders, not to stroke the egos of the heads of the various cruise lines under him. Now I’m unclear if Oasis can make it in the channel to Bermuda, but that’s a technical nautical issue. Maximizing value however is a pretty basic concept of capitalism. So why do YOU think maximization of value is not on the table?

[BND]

1 minute ago, TravelerThom said:

Because the shareholders of RCCL (stock symbol RCL) worry about whether RCCL makes lots of money, and couldn’t care less whether it comes from RCI or Celebrity (or other subset of the corporation). Neither RCI nor Celebrity issues stock. Neither has a Board of Directors. Neither issues SEC 10-Ks. Fain’s job as CEO of RCCL is to maximize return for shareholders, not to stroke the egos of the heads of the various cruise lines under him. Now I’m unclear if Oasis can make it in the channel to Bermuda, but that’s a technical nautical issue. Maximizing value however is a pretty basic concept of capitalism. So why do YOU think maximization of value is not on the table?

First, it's such a random idea.  Second, there has been absolutely NO talk of this happening.  I don't think Oasis can fit, but even if it could, RCI is not going to tell Celebrity what to do with their ships.  Once again, this is just a random idea someone dreamed up. It's never been mentioned by ANYONE else.

[Iamcruzin]

3 hours ago, TravelerThom said:

Why do you think that RCI and Celebrity aren’t going to listen to their boss RCCL? Fain is responsible for the financial health of the whole RCCL corporation. Why do you think the RCCL Board would back Bailey and/or LLP and hang Fain out to dry? 

 If you look at the link to the Bermuda Cruise Ship schedule that I posted, you would see that Celebrity doesn't call on Bermuda after July 2020 and Royal Caribbean is already calling on Bermuda in Aug through the fall.

 

http://www.marops.bm/Documents/Shipping_schedules/2020 Cruise Ship Schedule.pdf

Edited June 16, 2020 by Iamcruzin

[Baron Barracuda]

2 minutes ago, BND said:

First, it's such a random idea.  Second, there has been absolutely NO talk of this happening.  I don't think Oasis can fit, but even if it could, RCI is not going to tell Celebrity what to do with their ships.  Once again, this is just a random idea someone dreamed up. It's never been mentioned by ANYONE else.

Fain has spoken publicly about re-starting with short voyages from drive-to ports specifically mentioning Florida and NJ.  So, if sailing resumes this fall what ship(s) will sail from NJ and where will their short voyages go if not Bermuda?    As far as X goes,  why do you keep bringing them up, they don't even have Bermuda sailings scheduled this fall.  Even if they did, the notion that RCCI would grant scarce Bermuda dock space to a little Celebrity M class  rather than a Royal Oasis, Freedom or Quantum class is absurd.  As a good corporate citizen I'm sure LLP would agree.   Imagine Fain having to explain to the board why Summit is in Bermuda while Oasis (or Freedom or Quantum class) remains in layup.  The ships that should sail first are those that can produce the highest revenue.  

 

From Fain's cc interview last week:

 

Cruisers have their favorite lines, but he was unable to specify what the return to the seas would look like, in terms of whether each cruise line would come back with one ship, whether Royal would start before Celebrity and the others, or even what area of the world would resume first.

"I don't know," he said. "It won't be all of a sudden, all the ships start going, but which ship is very much a question of which markets are the most reopened.

"And I know that's frustrating. They would like to know which comes first. So would I, by the way.

[B-52]

19 minutes ago, Baron Barracuda said:

"I don't know," he said. "It won't be all of a sudden, all the ships start going, but which ship is very much a question of which markets are the most reopened.

"And I know that's frustrating. They would like to know which comes first. So would I, by the way.

 

But their opening cruises August 1st.....Right.

[Charles4515]

Now I’m unclear if Oasis can make it in the channel to Bermuda, but that’s a technical nautical issue. Maximizing value however is a pretty basic concept of capitalism. So why do YOU think maximization of value is not on the table?

 

Nothing to be unclear about. When the channel was widened for Quantum class it was purposely limited to exclude Oasis class. The channel is not a straight shot. There are a number of turns. The dredging and widening was limited for environmental reasons. It was stipulated no Oasis class size ships.

 

As I mentioned another limitation is that only one dock can accommodate Quantum class ships. The other dock can not at this time although there are future plans to lengthen it. Future, no work underway or contracted.

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[cured]

6 hours ago, Charles4515 said:

 There are two docks at the Dockyard. King’s Wharf and Heritage Wharf. Heritage Wharf can take super mega ships like Anthem and NCL Encore. Kings Wharf takes ships smaller than that like Summit. Oasis can not do Bermuda. It is too large for the channel. The largest ships that can do Bermuda are Quantum class.   

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

 

 

 

 

Thank you. I thought I had read somewhere else that the Oasis class ships were too large for the channel.  

 

I hope cruising happens sooner than later for those that are in serious cruise withdrawal. 🙂  But if you look at what is still happening in NYC, I just cannot see them welcoming a cruise ship. Things are still closing. Just this week the Metropolitan Opera announced they were canceling the first part of the 2020-2021 season and won't reopen till Dec. 31. Broadway is still shut down till at least labor day.  With NYC still closed or closing, I can't see NY/NJ welcoming cruise ships.

Edited June 17, 2020 by cured

[SNJCruisers]

7 hours ago, Baron Barracuda said:

 

As far as the corporate dynamic,  RCCI (not RCCL) can most certainly tell X and Royal what to do with their ships.  In normal times Bayley and LLP likely enjoy a great deal of autonomy operating their divisions.  However times are not normal, the company is in crisis and all decisions must focus on  what's best for RCCI, not her individual brands. 

You are going the opposite way on a 1 way street if you think that Royal Caribbean Cruises Ltd. (RCCL) the parent company is going to dictate what Celebrity does.  Royal Caribbean International (RCI) as well as Celebrity are both subsidiaries that operate independently of one another.

Many on here are preaching the same gospel to you, but you're being close minded, which is an attribute that many here on CC have so you're not alone.

[Charles4515]

You are going the opposite way on a 1 way street if you think that Royal Caribbean Cruises Ltd. (RCCL) the parent company is going to dictate what Celebrity does.  Royal Caribbean International (RCI) as well as Celebrity are both subsidiaries that operate independently of one another.
Many on here are preaching the same gospel to you, but you're being close minded, which is an attribute that many here on CC have so you're not alone.

Of course the parent company can dictate what Celebrity does. Celebrity is a brand. RCCL owns the brand. Fain is the Chairman of the Board of Director’s of RCCL. Perlo reports to him.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[Iamcruzin]

8 hours ago, cured said:

Thank you. I thought I had read somewhere else that the Oasis class ships were too large for the channel.  

 

I hope cruising happens sooner than later for those that are in serious cruise withdrawal. 🙂  But if you look at what is still happening in NYC, I just cannot see them welcoming a cruise ship. Things are still closing. Just this week the Metropolitan Opera announced they were canceling the first part of the 2020-2021 season and won't reopen till Dec. 31. Broadway is still shut down till at least labor day.  With NYC still closed or closing, I can't see NY/NJ welcoming cruise ships.

 My neighbors and friends who work in NYC will be working from home until September.  My son went back to work this week and the bank he works for isn't open to the public yet. I don't see cruising starting up in NY or NJ in August. Oasis stands a better chance of sailing out of Florida. The Floridians would be all over short Oasis sailings like white on rice.