Fewer people on the first few cruises?

[ontheweb]

1 hour ago, beerman2 said:

You and I will never agree that’s for sure

And since this is a zero sum game, cruising either will or will  not start in November in the USA, we will all see who was right.

[beerman2]

5 minutes ago, ontheweb said:

And since this is a zero sum game, cruising either will or will  not start in November in the USA, we will all see who was right.

I’ll take that for 1,000.00 Alex. Lol

[ProgRockCruiser]

37 minutes ago, sanger727 said:

You are giving them a lot of credit for being to do things "at a moments notice". What they can't do "at a moments notice" is all the logistics that will be required to restart. This is really going to come down to how much notice the CDC gives them ahead of the no sail order being lift. If they give them no notice, Carnival will not be sailing when it's lifted.

 

The CDC doesn't "lift" the no sail order, they let it expire.  And maybe the CDC has privately said "we have no intention of extending it, so get your stuff together!"

 

We have no idea what else has been communicated to/from the CDC and the cruise lines.  For all we know, they've had the wheels set in motion for a few weeks, and Del Rio's rant was false bluster because he already knows when things are going to resume, and how.

 

On the other hand, it is quite possible that the cruise lines have indeed done no prep work until now, but are finally deciding to get their acts in gear. 

 

37 minutes ago, sanger727 said:

Once the no sail order is lifted they still have to check port by port to see if the governor's or mayor's order would prohibit embarkation/debarkation; they have to find out what ports will actually allow a cruise ship to dock and under what circumstances; they have to integrate the ports requirements into their "detailed plan"; they have to order and receive provisions; they have to get the crew onboard plus a two week quarantine once all crew are on board...

 

agree with the other posters who think that once they know they will be able to sail it will still be a 4-6 week process to get them sailing. 

 

I would be very surprised if the cruise lines have not been constantly touching base with State and local leaders to make sure they know what can happen when.  And similarly placing contingent orders with suppliers.

 

And according to JH, Carnival is already using the Magic (?) to pick up crew for sailings at some point in the near future.

 

It might indeed take 4 to 6 weeks to get going again, but since they are officially targeting 1 Nov, and they may have already started the process, that deadline does not seem threatened.  They could get there if they started as late as next weekend.

 

Now, all that being said...I am not convinced Carnival (or RC) is sailing in Nov, at least not as planned most recently.  I think it will be a significantly re-jiggered schedule and itineraries.

 

But I am not adverse to being pleasantly surprised.

Edited September 14, 2020 by ProgRockCruiser
i kant speel

[lobster1313]

The CDC is just one aspect and the cruises lines have been working with other agencies to get the industry started.

 

 

https://www.fmc.gov/dhs-secretary-briefed-on-covid-19-impacts-to-cruise-industry-ocean-shipping/

 

 

[Joe817]

35 minutes ago, regoodwinjr said:

The CDC is just one aspect and the cruises lines have been working with other agencies to get the industry started.

 

 

https://www.fmc.gov/dhs-secretary-briefed-on-covid-19-impacts-to-cruise-industry-ocean-shipping/

 

 

Good read Reg. Thanks for posting! 👍

[ProgRockCruiser]

40 minutes ago, regoodwinjr said:

The CDC is just one aspect and the cruises lines have been working with other agencies to get the industry started.

 

 

https://www.fmc.gov/dhs-secretary-briefed-on-covid-19-impacts-to-cruise-industry-ocean-shipping/

 

 

Hmm, that is good news indeed.  Finally, some words from the Government that indicate a path forward. And from an "independent agency" that isn't beholden to the CDC.

[xDisconnections]

1 hour ago, ontheweb said:

And since this is a zero sum game, cruising either will or will  not start in November in the USA, we will all see who was right.

 

1 hour ago, beerman2 said:

I’ll take that for 1,000.00 Alex. Lol

Good thing I only relayed the cruise line’s message and only posted my prediction once (which ironically is not in November) 😄 

[Cruiseboy06]

4 hours ago, ontheweb said:

And since this is a zero sum game, cruising either will or will  not start in November in the USA, we will all see who was right.

I bet @beerman2 will be right........  Also I believe that there will be no cruises in November......... All but 6 ships have no bookable sailings in November........  "Sold out because of Cap" excuse is getting old...   Carnival needs to be upfront

Edited September 14, 2020 by Cruiseboy06

[ontheweb]

1 hour ago, Cruiseboy06 said:

I bet @beerman2 will be right........  Also I believe that there will be no cruises in November......... All but 6 ships have no bookable sailings in November........  "Sold out because of Cap" excuse is getting old...   Carnival needs to be upfront

Maybe someone should start a poll.😉

[xDisconnections]

4 hours ago, Cruiseboy06 said:

I bet @beerman2 will be right........  Also I believe that there will be no cruises in November......... All but 6 ships have no bookable sailings in November........  "Sold out because of Cap" excuse is getting old...   Carnival needs to be upfront

They are being upfront...

[Raxter54]

Let's see:

 

1) CDC taking input/suggestions til Sept 21.

2) CDC compiling suggestions, formulating policy - mid October?

3) CDC publishing policy/guidelines - late October?

4) Cruise industry implementing said guidelines - 4-6 weeks ramp up ships/get crew back/etc - mid December?

5) Maybe some Christmas cruises to end the year....

 

Remember, the CDC is a government agency that has been somewhat antagonistic to the cruise industry over the years. Don't see them suddenly speeding things up to make the industry happy.....

[lobster1313]

42 minutes ago, Raxter54 said:

Let's see:

 

1) CDC taking input/suggestions til Sept 21.

2) CDC compiling suggestions, formulating policy - mid October?

3) CDC publishing policy/guidelines - late October?

4) Cruise industry implementing said guidelines - 4-6 weeks ramp up ships/get crew back/etc - mid December?

5) Maybe some Christmas cruises to end the year....

 

Remember, the CDC is a government agency that has been somewhat antagonistic to the cruise industry over the years. Don't see them suddenly speeding things up to make the industry happy.....

The difference now is that other agencies are now actively involved and there is pressure from not only the industry but from unions and local certain local governments.  Also, assuming that the CDC finalizes the policy/guidelines at the end of October then the rumors of the cruise lines ramping up on a limited basis prior November would be true. They would be ready soon after the review is complete not 4 to 6 weeks later.

 

Edited September 15, 2020 by regoodwinjr

[ProgRockCruiser]

1 hour ago, Raxter54 said:

Let's see:

 

1) CDC taking input/suggestions til Sept 21.

2) CDC compiling suggestions, formulating policy - mid October?

3) CDC publishing policy/guidelines - late October?

4) Cruise industry implementing said guidelines - 4-6 weeks ramp up ships/get crew back/etc - mid December?

5) Maybe some Christmas cruises to end the year....

 

Remember, the CDC is a government agency that has been somewhat antagonistic to the cruise industry over the years. Don't see them suddenly speeding things up to make the industry happy.....

You are assuming those tasks are sequential.  They are not.  They could all be "finish to finish" dependencies, as one might say in a scheduling tool.

 

1) CDC taking input/suggestions til Sept 21.

2) CDC compiling suggestions, formulating policy in parallel with existing comments - assuming no surprises, internal review 22 Sept (the next day).

3) CDC publishing policy/guidelines - 23 Sept.

3a) CDC does not extend the No Sail Order.

4) Cruise industry implementing said guidelines - cruise industry already given informal heads-up, started 4-6 weeks ramp up ships/get crew back/etc in mid-Sept (John Heald says Carnival is already gathering crews).  4-6 week ramp up complete by 31 Oct.

5) Cruise 1 Nov.

 

Things can happen seemingly quickly, if the parties involved are interested in it happening.

 

Whether that will actually happen, I don't know.  But it is technically feasible, as far as I can tell.

[jetsfan58]

It's a solid mystery as to what Carnival and/or the Cruise Industry is doing. My hope is that they are planning an "absolute safe" return for us all. In the interim, my family and I will keep our Cruise bags packed by the garage door ready for action when Carnival announces "Back To The Waters" we go!!!   

[jetsfan58]

On 9/14/2020 at 11:17 AM, sanger727 said:

 

You are giving them a lot of credit for being to do things "at a moments notice". What they can't do "at a moments notice" is all the logistics that will be required to restart. This is really going to come down to how much notice the CDC gives them ahead of the no sail order being lift. If they give them no notice, Carnival will not be sailing when it's lifted. Once the no sail order is lifted they still have to check port by port to see if the governor's or mayor's order would prohibit embarkation/debarkation; they have to find out what ports will actually allow a cruise ship to dock and under what circumstances; they have to integrate the ports requirements into their "detailed plan"; they have to order and receive provisions; they have to get the crew onboard plus a two week quarantine once all crew are on board...

 

agree with the other posters who think that once they know they will be able to sail it will still be a 4-6 week process to get them sailing. 

Why would Carnival reveal their "total return plan" to the general public? That would certainly cause much more "panic and stress" than normal. When they are "fully ready" to return to the high seas we will all know. Until then "Stop-Pause-Park" and trust the Carnival Powers To Be to get it right and get it going.  

[Raxter54]

3 hours ago, ProgRockCruiser said:

You are assuming those tasks are sequential.  They are not.  They could all be "finish to finish" dependencies, as one might say in a scheduling tool.

 

1) CDC taking input/suggestions til Sept 21.

2) CDC compiling suggestions, formulating policy in parallel with existing comments - assuming no surprises, internal review 22 Sept (the next day).

3) CDC publishing policy/guidelines - 23 Sept.

 

😂😂😂😂😂😂

[loveallships]

My family and i (13 ppl in all) had 5 oceanview cabins on the Dec. 28th sailing of the Sensation from Miami.  Cabins booked were three doubles, one triple and one quad cabin. 

We were switched to the larger Sunrise and new cabins assigned are all oceanview quads, five cabins in a row, better location.

My travel agent and I surmise that Carnival is anticipating being able to sail with a limited capacity.  Why else use 20 berths for 13 people?

 

[Runaway Parent]

We were on a ship when the shut down happened in March. We took the onboard credit to still sail over spring break. We took a walk on the deck with lifeboats and counted how many people were listed on each of the signs next to lifeboats (I'd never noticed those numbers written on the signs before!) Posted life boat counts were only about 50% of possible capacity. It was an awesome cruise! No lines, no overcrowding! I would love being on one of those first cruises with limited capacity!

[xDisconnections]

5 hours ago, loveallships said:

My travel agent and I surmise that Carnival is anticipating being able to sail with a limited capacity.  Why else use 20 berths for 13 people?

 

Less effort was required for the inventory control team when assigning room blocks if that was the case.

[ProgRockCruiser]

11 hours ago, Runaway Parent said:

We were on a ship when the shut down happened in March. We took the onboard credit to still sail over spring break. We took a walk on the deck with lifeboats and counted how many people were listed on each of the signs next to lifeboats (I'd never noticed those numbers written on the signs before!) Posted life boat counts were only about 50% of possible capacity. It was an awesome cruise! No lines, no overcrowding! I would love being on one of those first cruises with limited capacity!

(Bold my emphasis.)

 

I must say I doubt that - cruise ships are required by law to have life boat capacity equal to or exceeding max passenger load, with crew permitted to be relegated to inflatables. 

 

That isn't something that is easily glossed over when being inspected by the Coast Guard.

 

And Carnival traditionally has more than met the minimum requirement, IIRC, where less than half the crew would be required to get onto an inflatable.

 

Which ship were you on?

[beerman2]

21 hours ago, jetsfan58 said:

Why would Carnival reveal their "total return plan" to the general public? That would certainly cause much more "panic and stress" than normal. When they are "fully ready" to return to the high seas we will all know. Until then "Stop-Pause-Park" and trust the Carnival Powers To Be to get it right and get it going.  

Don't you think pax should know ASAP , BTW there are protocols listed on website that was updated 9/15.

 

Spending $$$$$ on a cruise I certainly want to know before hand.

 

They could always preface it by saying "at this time this is how we feel/plan on  going forward". Obviously things are subject to change, however it's communicating with booked pax.

 

 

[ProgRockCruiser]

4 minutes ago, beerman2 said:

Don't you think pax should know ASAP , BTW there are protocols listed on website that was updated 9/15.

 

Spending $$$$$ on a cruise I certainly want to know before hand.

 

They could always preface it by saying "at this time this is how we feel/plan on  going forward". Obviously things are subject to change, however it's communicating with booked pax.

 

 

Well, what you have summarized, in terms of available data, is how Carnival is currently informing their passengers of the current plan.

 

The website summarizes their new health and safety protocols.

 

The available sailings for bookings notionally represent their available cruises/cabins.

 

Are you expecting them to put out a weekly/daily press release or mass email mailing that gives you a warm and fuzzy of "the current plan"?

 

The gruesome details of the plan requires negotiations with the CDC, ports, State/Regional Governments, and associated agreements to release the info publicly.  That stays silent until the involved parties agree it can be announced.

 

If they announce something as detailed as "we will not (or will) require masks in all indoor public areas", and then it changes, all heck would break loose with complaints of flip flopping, not knowing what they really mean, bait and switch, etc.

 

Whatever they announce for those details, they have to be able to commit 100% to that plan.

[jetsfan58]

13 minutes ago, ProgRockCruiser said:

Well, what you have summarized, in terms of available data, is how Carnival is currently informing their passengers of the current plan.

 

The website summarizes their new health and safety protocols.

 

The available sailings for bookings notionally represent their available cruises/cabins.

 

Are you expecting them to put out a weekly/daily press release or mass email mailing that gives you a warm and fuzzy of "the current plan"?

 

The gruesome details of the plan requires negotiations with the CDC, ports, State/Regional Governments, and associated agreements to release the info publicly.  That stays silent until the involved parties agree it can be announced.

 

If they announce something as detailed as "we will not (or will) require masks in all indoor public areas", and then it changes, all heck would break loose with complaints of flip flopping, not knowing what they really mean, bait and switch, etc.

 

Whatever they announce for those details, they have to be able to commit 100% to that plan.

In any high level business discussion/planning the worst you can do is "tip" your hat early. You inadvertently provide your competition with your "guarded" next move. This process has become the ultimate demise for some corporations. I have said this before; we are Carnival's prize possession (addicted legacy Cruisers) that will be somewhat loyal moving forward. Carnival is more concerned (via this outbreak) in convincing "new Cruisers" to join our ranks. They would and/or should not dare reveal any significant planning too soon as to "confuse and/or input any doubt" into those potential legacy partners.  

[beerman2]

2 hours ago, ProgRockCruiser said:

Well, what you have summarized, in terms of available data, is how Carnival is currently informing their passengers of the current plan.

 

The website summarizes their new health and safety protocols.

 

The available sailings for bookings notionally represent their available cruises/cabins.

 

Are you expecting them to put out a weekly/daily press release or mass email mailing that gives you a warm and fuzzy of "the current plan"?

 

The gruesome details of the plan requires negotiations with the CDC, ports, State/Regional Governments, and associated agreements to release the info publicly.  That stays silent until the involved parties agree it can be announced.

 

If they announce something as detailed as "we will not (or will) require masks in all indoor public areas", and then it changes, all heck would break loose with complaints of flip flopping, not knowing what they really mean, bait and switch, etc.

 

Whatever they announce for those details, they have to be able to commit 100% to that plan.

Nope never said anything about a weekly/daily press release, and thanks but at my age I don't need warm and fuzzy feelings.

 

That is so far off base it's laughable!

[ProgRockCruiser]

10 minutes ago, beerman2 said:

Nope never said anything about a weekly/daily press release, and thanks but at my age I don't need warm and fuzzy feelings.

 

That is so far off base it's laughable!

Well, what are you looking for then?  You say you want more/better updates, but I'm not sure what you actually expect?