NY-NY 21 Cancellation?

[zoncom]

Booked but wondering of odds this 30 July cruise will be cancelled. Also,how far in advance will we know?Anyone have any info?

[Flatbush Flyer]

38 minutes ago, zoncom said:

Booked but wondering of odds this 30 July cruise will be cancelled. Also,how far in advance will we know?Anyone have any info?

You may want to peruse this forum. There are numerous Oceania threads regarding the current policy of once monthly “travel advisories” on the O website citing upcoming cruise cancellation windows (usually the next 1-3 months depending on circumstances) and current rebook/refund policies.

[Hlitner]

That cruise would be contrary to the current CDC Guidelines (limiting cruises from US ports to no more than 7 days in length).  So the real question for the OP is whether the CDC will change its Guidelines in the near future and that is something nobody (not even O) can answer.    It is also very unlikely that Canada and Iceland will open up to cruises in 2021.  I do think much of the cruising world depends on the answer to the question, "can folks vaccinated for COVID still spread the virus?"  If the answer to that question turns out to be no then I can see ports again opening to cruises that have a 100% mandatory vaccination policy.  If the answer is yes (vaccinated folks can still be spreaders) then all bets are off.

 

Hank

 

[Daniel A]

On 1/13/2021 at 5:23 PM, zoncom said:

Booked but wondering of odds this 30 July cruise will be cancelled. Also, how far in advance will we know?  Anyone have any info?

I am booked on a July 9 NYC-Bermuda-NYC 7 day cruise.  I'm still wondering if that one will go off.  Being an eternal optimist, I plan to make the final payment in April.  However, I won't go on this cruise unless everybody is vaccinated and no mask requirement onboard.  I wouldn't be comfortable wearing one of these d****d masks all day long for a week.

[LHT28]

1 hour ago, Daniel A said:

I am booked on a July 9 NYC-Bermuda-NYC 7 day cruise.  I'm still wondering if that one will go off.  Being an eternal optimist, I plan to make the final payment in April.  However, I won't go on this cruise unless everybody is vaccinated and no mask requirement onboard.  I wouldn't be comfortable wearing one of these d****d masks all day long for a week.

I doubt  you will NOT have to wear a mask IF the cruise goes ahead 

They will still be taking precautions  for quite  a while

JMO

[Daniel A]

1 hour ago, LHT28 said:

I doubt  you will NOT have to wear a mask IF the cruise goes ahead 

They will still be taking precautions  for quite  a while

JMO

In that case they'll be taking precautions without me, DW and two other guests.  They may have an empty ship.  Who wants to be on a cruise where they'll need to wear a mask whenever they're out of their cabin?

[ORV]

19 minutes ago, Daniel A said:

In that case they'll be taking precautions without me, DW and two other guests.  They may have an empty ship.  Who wants to be on a cruise where they'll need to wear a mask whenever they're out of their cabin?

I think you'd be surprised. There are a lot of people just wanting to go, under almost any conditions. Look at all the people that keep booking cruises, even though the companies may not even be in business in another year. 

[Flatbush Flyer]

32 minutes ago, Daniel A said:

In that case they'll be taking precautions without me, DW and two other guests.  They may have an empty ship.  Who wants to be on a cruise where they'll need to wear a mask whenever they're out of their cabin?

Many many many O cruises (through 2022) are already “waitlisted” with folks who fully understand that, even with everyone onboard vaccinated, a mask may still be required.
 

In any case, 4 individuals deciding not to go (which represents less than a rounding error in any cruise line’s daily bottom line) is not going to convince Oceania to endanger passengers, crew and the line’s viability by not employing the most stringent controls.

 

If you are new to O, please know that it’s food safety and public health policies/practices represent the gold standard of the industry.

 

For example: We were on Nautica for a month starting at the beginning of February 2020. Even then, before Covid cruising issues “hit the fan,” Oceania had extra staff going page by page in every embarking passenger (and crew) passport to determine whether anyone had recently been in China. And, if they were, they were denied boarding. Onboard precautions were comprehensive and, even though we were cleared to finish the cruise in the scheduled port of Singapore, the Captain decided to go to Dubai instead. (And, FWIW, O provided more than expected financial accommodations for the inconvenience).

 

Bottom line: “This ain’t Princess.”

 

 

 

Edited January 16, 2021 by Flatbush Flyer

[Daniel A]

11 hours ago, Flatbush Flyer said:

Many many many O cruises (through 2022) are already “waitlisted” with folks who fully understand that, even with everyone onboard vaccinated, a mask may still be required.
 

In any case, 4 individuals deciding not to go (which represents less than a rounding error in any cruise line’s daily bottom line) is not going to convince Oceania to endanger passengers, crew and the line’s viability by not employing the most stringent controls.

 

If you are new to O, please know that it’s food safety and public health policies/practices represent the gold standard of the industry.

 

For example: We were on Nautica for a month starting at the beginning of February 2020. Even then, before Covid cruising issues “hit the fan,” Oceania had extra staff going page by page in every embarking passenger (and crew) passport to determine whether anyone had recently been in China. And, if they were, they were denied boarding. Onboard precautions were comprehensive and, even though we were cleared to finish the cruise in the scheduled port of Singapore, the Captain decided to go to Dubai instead. (And, FWIW, O provided more than expected financial accommodations for the inconvenience).

 

Bottom line: “This ain’t Princess.”

I'm not looking to influence others who may want to go, no matter the conditions.  I'm also not 'going on strike' in order to influence O's policies.  I was expressing that I won't go on any vessel that doesn't require all souls onboard to be vaccinated.  If everyone aboard have been vaccinated then it is my belief that it would be overkill to require additional onerous conditions on sailing.  If others are comfortable with those conditions then "Bon Voyage."

 

[LHT28]

2 hours ago, Daniel A said:

I'm not looking to influence others who may want to go, no matter the conditions.  I'm also not 'going on strike' in order to influence O's policies.  I was expressing that I won't go on any vessel that doesn't require all souls onboard to be vaccinated.  If everyone aboard have been vaccinated then it is my belief that it would be overkill to require additional onerous conditions on sailing.  If others are comfortable with those conditions then "Bon Voyage."

 

so on the ship you would feel safe without a mask & other precautions  BUT  now  are you going to be happy  if you are not allowed to go ashore ?

 Not everyone in every port  will be vaccinated  so you could still bring back  the virus to the ship

As noted in many reports the vaccine is NOT 100% effective  could you be one of the 5 %  that will get the virus  even though vaccinated

Food for though

 

 

[Daniel A]

14 minutes ago, LHT28 said:

so on the ship you would feel safe without a mask & other precautions  BUT  now  are you going to be happy  if you are not allowed to go ashore ?  I wouldn't have a problem wearing a mask ashore, I would expect that to be required.  I also think that excursions may still need to be in a 'bubble' due to local regulations.  I can live with that.

 Not everyone in every port  will be vaccinated  so you could still bring back  the virus to the ship

As noted in many reports the vaccine is NOT 100% effective  could you be one of the 5 %  that will get the virus  even though vaccinated  Unless I'm wearing an N95 respirator, a mask won't protect me from the virus, it would just protect others from my respirations.  If one were to get sick, the illness shouldn't be severe due to being vaccinated and might be treatable onboard.

Food for though  Yes, it is food for thought but those same conditions will exist in our everyday lives.  At some point, I think we need to trust in the vaccines.

 

I'm not concerned about intermittent use of a mask, it's the concept of needing to wear a mask all the time each time you leave your cabin for a week.  That would just be too onerous for me and I wouldn't enjoy the cruise.

 

 

 

[Flatbush Flyer]

3 hours ago, Daniel A said:

..... If everyone aboard have been vaccinated then it is my belief that it would be overkill to require additional onerous conditions on sailing.....

 

So wrong!

Leading epidemiologists like Monica Gandhi at UC San Francisco and Gregory Poland at the Mayo Clinic (as well as Anthony Fauci of the NIH) all caution against relying too heavily on the vaccine, noting that (as Poland states): “masks, distancing and hand-washing will probably turn out to be as or more effective than vaccines. What I suspect may happen is that vaccines will turn out to be moderately effective with an unknown durability of protection, meaning even after you get your vaccine, you’re going to have to wear a mask.”

[pinotlover]

I believe we are in a short window of time. By July or August, I expect most States here to lift the mandatory mask requirements. As an increasingly large portion of Europe is vaccinated and cases fall, I suspect the same will be true there. I don’t see masks being mandatory on fully vaccinated ships by the 4th Qtr 2021. I don’t believe that many ships will be sailing before then anyway.

 

We’ll live through this short window of time, but things will improve. I believe it’s a ludicrous to believe that the masks requirements will continue indefinitely as it is to believe reduced ship capacity will continue permanently. If it does, the cost of cruises will be so high wearing a mask will  be the least of our problems. 

[Daniel A]

22 minutes ago, Flatbush Flyer said:

So wrong!

Leading epidemiologists like Monica Gandhi at UC San Francisco and Gregory Poland at the Mayo Clinic (as well as Anthony Fauci of the NIH) all caution against relying too heavily on the vaccine, noting that (as Poland states): “masks, distancing and hand-washing will probably turn out to be as or more effective than vaccines. What I suspect may happen is that vaccines will turn out to be moderately effective with an unknown durability of protection, meaning even after you get your vaccine, you’re going to have to wear a mask.”

So what's the point of them pushing the vaccines in the first place if they don't believe it will work?

 

“masks, distancing and hand-washing will probably turn out to be as or more effective than vaccines."  Doesn't that also mean the vaccine is probably just as effective as masks, distancing and hand-washing?  Are we to be needing to have vaccines, masks, distancing and hand-washing forever?

[Tranquility Base]

52 minutes ago, Daniel A said:

So what's the point of them pushing the vaccines in the first place if they don't believe it will work?

Vaccinations are part of the Swiss Cheese Model of Covid Defence.

 

James Reason originally proposed the Swiss Cheese Model of Accident Causation.

 

This illustrates that, although many layers of defence lie between hazards and accidents, there are flaws in each layer that, if aligned, can allow the accident to occur. 

 

In other words, the more layers of defence you have, the less likely the holes in the slices of swiss cheese will align, therefore reducing the chances of an accident occurring.

Edited January 16, 2021 by Tranquility Base

[Flatbush Flyer]

1 hour ago, Daniel A said:

So what's the point of them pushing the vaccines in the first place if they don't believe it will work?

 

“masks, distancing and hand-washing will probably turn out to be as or more effective than vaccines."  Doesn't that also mean the vaccine is probably just as effective as masks, distancing and hand-washing?  Are we to be needing to have vaccines, masks, distancing and hand-washing forever?

Ever fired a shotgun? 
 

Right now, all we have is drug trial data for the vaccines. Perhaps in a year or two, we’ll be able to get truly informed decisions about what precautions still need to be taken. But, for now, the best course of action is to “throw everything” at Covid if for no other reason than to reduce the number of worldwide deaths.

[Rob the Cruiser]

2 hours ago, Daniel A said:

So what's the point of them pushing the vaccines in the first place if they don't believe it will work?

 

“masks, distancing and hand-washing will probably turn out to be as or more effective than vaccines."  Doesn't that also mean the vaccine is probably just as effective as masks, distancing and hand-washing?  Are we to be needing to have vaccines, masks, distancing and hand-washing forever?

 

I hope that the use of hand sanitizer is mandatory when entering any venue. No exceptions. I'm amazed at how many people refuse to use the hand sanitizer, even when politely asked to do so.

Edited January 16, 2021 by Rob the Cruiser

[Daniel A]

1 hour ago, Flatbush Flyer said:

Ever fired a shotgun? 
 

Right now, all we have is drug trial data for the vaccines. Perhaps in a year or two, we’ll be able to get truly informed decisions about what precautions still need to be taken. But, for now, the best course of action is to “throw everything” at Covid if for no other reason than to reduce the number of worldwide deaths.

If everyone onboard a ship has been vaccinated against Covid, wouldn't that establish herd immunity for that population of PAX onboard?

[Flatbush Flyer]

7 minutes ago, Daniel A said:

If everyone onboard a ship has been vaccinated against Covid, wouldn't that establish herd immunity for that population of PAX onboard?

With almost non-existent long-term “real world” data, you’re assuming the vaccine(s) is/are a cure-all. It’s way-too-early to tell.

[Daniel A]

1 hour ago, Rob the Cruiser said:

 

I hope that the use of hand sanitizer is mandatory when entering any venue. No exceptions. I'm amazed at how many people refuse to use the hand sanitizer, even when politely asked to do so.

That would go a long way toward controlling Noro on cruises.  🤢

[LHT28]

5 hours ago, Daniel A said:

 

In that case  do  not cruise  until you are assured you will NOT need a mask on the ship

[Daniel A]

1 hour ago, LHT28 said:

In that case  do  not cruise  until you are assured you will NOT need a mask on the ship

Thanks, that was my original point.  I don't see them removing a mask requirement without instituting a vaccination requirement.  JMHO

[thepla]

On 1/15/2021 at 3:21 PM, Daniel A said:

I am booked on a July 9 NYC-Bermuda-NYC 7 day cruise.  I'm still wondering if that one will go off.  Being an eternal optimist, I plan to make the final payment in April.  However, I won't go on this cruise unless everybody is vaccinated and no mask requirement onboard.  I wouldn't be comfortable wearing one of these d****d masks all day long for a week.

I too am on this cruise. Really want to do an Oceania cruise. Hopefully it goes. Not sure a mask would be great deterrent. To me doing a cruise with excursions only with ship would be worse than masks. I have a good friend that lives in Bermuda and would like to enjoy a visit with his family.

[susiesan]

On 1/16/2021 at 10:55 AM, Daniel A said:

  Are we to be needing to have vaccines, masks, distancing and hand-washing forever?

Yes, we will. The virus is here to stay, it is not going to dissipate. We will be wearing muzzles and have limits on how we live our lives for a very long time, if not forever, governments using the virus as an excuse to control the masses.