The elephant in the room..

[Cafedumonde]

On 3/27/2021 at 9:08 PM, Doggielover68 said:

Again, not a right. It is a luxury! You don't have to cancel your life. But you can't get whatever you want. Even colleges require vaccines. If you need a vaccine for college, you definitely need one for an optional activity. 

Not all colleges require vaccines.  And even among the ones that do, they don’t all require the same ones.  We have a kid leaving for college in the fall and have been surprised to find this out.  Our last kid for example had to get the meningitis vac before going to college.  Current kid just as to prove he had the measles or measles vac at some point in his life.  
 

On another note, I’m not sure what you mean about vacation not being a right and what that has to do with vaccines.  Makes no sense.

[ledges1]

With all the bitterness displayed on this site toward Florida, no one has replied that they dislike Florida and the Governor enough to boycott the the cruise ports when cruising returns. I will step forward and commit to never cruising from New York based on their governor and his antics.

[walkintheplank]

23 minutes ago, ledges1 said:

With all the bitterness displayed on this site toward Florida, no one has replied that they dislike Florida and the Governor enough to boycott the the cruise ports when cruising returns. I will step forward and commit to never cruising from New York based on their governor and his antics.

I second that and will up the ante and declare that I have no desire to set foot in New York period. Florida rules!

[Cafedumonde]

Just now, walkintheplank said:

I second that and will up the ante and declare that I have no desire to set foot in New York period. Florida rules!

I third that sentiment and, as a one time New Yorker and frequent visitor, I also have zero desire to ever go back there again.   It is no longer the New York I once knew.  It was already putting me off pre covid but the nail is in the coffin now.

[BlerkOne]

15 hours ago, Butterbean1000 said:

I have a legit question.  If you are vaccinated, then why are you afraid of people who aren't?  Also. I have read that since the vaccine does not have any of the virus living or dead, it won't protect you from getting it, but you'll get a much milder case. Before you accused me of being an "antivaxxer", I'm not. I'm just very careful about what I put in my body. 

 

Who said vaccinated people are afraid of people who aren't?

 

Why do some not grasp that as long as the virus spreads, there will be mutations/variants. While the virus could mutate itself away, it hasn't shown any signs of having that tendency. And paraphrasing SNL, hoping for a miracle should not be Plan A. Asymptomatic people can still spread the virus and another chance for mutation.

[evandbob]

There isn't a Florida departure port that can compete with the sights seen from a cruise ship meandering down the Hudson. I think it would be a pity for someone to deny themselves this experience because they don't like the governor.  

 

Just to be fair, it's also a shame that some may avoid Florida departure ports because of its governor.

 

I mean, you roll into the departure port the same day or a day or two prior to the sail date.  How much can state wide politics or governor personalities affect you?  Safety is a whole 'nother issue, but state politics?

 

Crime or virus surge, itinerary choice and even price,  can be effective factors to consider for port choice.

 

If you put Cuomo or DeSantis in a sealed environment, I bet they would end up in a tie for the # of lies they put out in an hour.  Let's get back to cruise topics and leave the politics out of the discussion.

[FiremedicMike151]

20 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

 

Who said vaccinated people are afraid of people who aren't?

 

Why do some not grasp that as long as the virus spreads, there will be mutations/variants. While the virus could mutate itself away, it hasn't shown any signs of having that tendency. And paraphrasing SNL, hoping for a miracle should not be Plan A. Asymptomatic people can still spread the virus and another chance for mutation.

Antigenic shift occurs when the virus replicates.. This does not require moving to a new host.. 

 

Edited March 29, 2021 by FiremedicMike151

[Butterbean1000]

12 minutes ago, FiremedicMike151 said:

You're putting a lot of eggs in the basket of "we must all get vaccinated to prevent mutation".  I've said it before and I'll say it again, mutations will happen no matter what.

 

Just like the yearly flus always have.  Yes, I realize this virus is a whole new animal.  I can attest to that.  There is so much we don't know and one of the reasons I won't get the vaccine until we learn more and maybe not then.

 

[ProgRockCruiser]

16 hours ago, Butterbean1000 said:

I have a legit question.  If you are vaccinated, then why are you afraid of people who aren't? 

I'm not "afraid" of people who aren't vaccinated, though I think they currently present a mild danger to some portion of the population that is vaccinated, since you can still "catch" the coronavirus if vaccinated, and in certain immune-compromised people that could still be a threat.

 

My main concern is that if 40% of the cruise is unvaccinated, that leaves a sizeable portion of the ship's population that could trigger a mini-outbreak on a 7 day cruise.  And we don't know how ports will respond to that situation, but IIRC, they did not respond well last Feb/March.  I do not want to be confined to my quarters or face the prospect of the "plague ship" wandering the oceans looking for a place to debark.

 

Remember when Florida denied that Princess ship from being able to dock at Port Everglades because two crew members might have the virus?

 

https://www.sun-sentinel.com/coronavirus/fl-ne-regal-princess-coronavirus-20200308-nyin3kwkvfhrlkaf42kck6qofa-story.html

 

While I hope that wouldn't happen again, I don't trust The Powers That Be from over-reacting again.

[sammee]

On 3/27/2021 at 8:30 PM, Doggielover68 said:

AMEN. 

 

Vacation is a privilege that should only be awarded to people who do the right thing. 

 

Remember back in the beginning of the pandemic when people told "scared people" to stay home? Well if you're afraid to get the vaccine, STAY HOME.

The shoe is now on the other foot. As far back as the end of March. It was really nasty between "scared", "sheep" and "stay home if you're scared" crap. And just by reading through here and several social media groups, they haven't stopped. I certainly don't want to be on a ship if an unvaccinated person gets covid. That can trigger a bunch of results we don't want that could put a damper on our vacations.

[Butterbean1000]

9 minutes ago, ProgRockCruiser said:

I'm not "afraid" of people who aren't vaccinated, though I think they currently present a mild danger to some portion of the population that is vaccinated, since you can still "catch" the coronavirus if vaccinated, and in certain immune-compromised people that could still be a threat.

 

My main concern is that if 40% of the cruise is unvaccinated, that leaves a sizeable portion of the ship's population that could trigger a mini-outbreak on a 7 day cruise.  And we don't know how ports will respond to that situation, but IIRC, they did not respond well last Feb/March.  I do not want to be confined to my quarters or face the prospect of the "plague ship" wandering the oceans looking for a place to debark.

 

 

As of now, we choose not to get the vaccine because of the reasons I have already stated.  We have also decided not to cruise until things settle down and there aren't so many restrictions.   

[BlerkOne]

42 minutes ago, Butterbean1000 said:

Reading the posts that say they won't go on a cruise unless everyone is vaccinated, that sounds like fear to me.  That's ok. We are all free to make choices. Again, the holier than thou attitude is tiring.

How is that different from those who say they won't get vaccinated? What are they afraid of? How holy are they?

[BlerkOne]

56 minutes ago, FiremedicMike151 said:

You're putting a lot of eggs in the basket of "we must all get vaccinated to prevent mutation".  I've said it before and I'll say it again, mutations will happen no matter what.

 

No, not everyone has to be vaccinated for herd immunity.

[stellarose]

just watch the very unofficial travel guides you tube channel.  

 

it can be done. 

[Butterbean1000]

9 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

How is that different from those who say they won't get vaccinated? What are they afraid of? How holy are they?

Because the "anti-vaxxers" aren't blaming/ridiculing/verbally attacking those who choose not to get the vaccine. I have been a victim of all of the above.  A woman i work with demanded a list of people who haven't received the vaccine. She wants to make sure she is not scheduled to work with them. BTW,  we work in retail.  Let that sink in. 

 

I am afraid of a "vaccine" that has not been fully been vetted.  I don't care if you get it or not. Its your choice 

 

Edited March 29, 2021 by Butterbean1000

[ledges1]

I go to grocery stores, restaurants, department stores, church, lawn & garden stores, hardware stores, etc... and it is unknown who has had a vaccination other than by guess by age. I wear my mask and I have had the Pfizer vaccine. I wear the mask mainly as a defensive measure, not necessarily for the virus but out of respect for others. All of this is not much different than a cruise ship.

[stellarose]

Europe does it.  it can be done . have a bubble.  my TA told me to wait things may change by December. 

[firefly333]

1 hour ago, Butterbean1000 said:

Reading the posts that say they won't go on a cruise unless everyone is vaccinated, that sounds like fear to me.  That's ok. We are all free to make choices. Again, the holier than thou attitude is tiring.

I've seen as many or more posts from those who say their rights are being impinged upon, and they dont think it's legal for rcl to say everyone must get a vaccine. .. though it's only this summer from non usa ports. 

 

I've even seen posts how if rcl dares to do this from a usa port miami lawyers will be set upon them. It goes both ways.

 

Why dont these posts tire you equally? Too many people have such a narrow view only one side of the coin bothers them.

 

I'm vaccinated so either way I cant undo it. My parents are elderly so it gives me peace of mind to be around them as I drive them and do all their shopping. Neither side bothers me.. but at least it makes me more open minded to both views. 

Edited March 29, 2021 by firefly333

[firefly333]

32 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

How is that different from those who say they won't get vaccinated? What are they afraid of? How holy are they?

Oh no, stop the presses. We agree there are 2 sides and both are being attacked. 

 

Makes no sense to me why someone thinks it's ok to attack those who want everyone vaccinated..but feels their side shouldn't be. .. close minded if you cant see both sides have good pts.

[BlerkOne]

26 minutes ago, Butterbean1000 said:

Because the "anti-vaxxers" aren't blaming/ridiculing/verbally attacking those who choose not to get the vaccine. I have been a victim of all of the above.  A woman i work with demanded a list of people who haven't received the vaccine. She wants to make sure she is not scheduled to work with them. BTW,  we work in retail.  Let that sink in. 

 

I am afraid of a "vaccine" that has not been fully been vetted.  I don't care if you get it or not. Its your choice 

 

 

Those who get the vaccine aren't spreading the plague to those who haven't. We have heard it called poison, people who accept it, sheep, it goes on. No difference.

[Don Kehote]

8 minutes ago, firefly333 said:

I've seen as many or more posts from those who say their rights are being impinged upon, and they dont think it's legal for rcl to say everyone must get a vaccine. .. though it's only this summer from non usa ports.

This always makes me chuckle to myself.  Okay, rights-havers, you do you 🙂

[Butterbean1000]

3 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

 

Those who get the vaccine aren't spreading the plague to those who haven't. We have heard it called poison, people who accept it, sheep, it goes on. No difference.

Agree to disagree.  Opinions are like bellybuttons, everybody has one.

 

One more observation, sorry,  I just can't stop.  If you can't spread the virus after you're vaccinated, then why are you still advised to wear a mask?  Because they still don't have a grip on this thing. 

Edited March 29, 2021 by Butterbean1000

[Butterbean1000]

15 minutes ago, firefly333 said:

I've seen as many or more posts from those who say their rights are being impinged upon, and they dont think it's legal for rcl to say everyone must get a vaccine. .. though it's only this summer from non usa ports. 

 

I've even seen posts how if rcl dares to do this from a usa port miami lawyers will be set upon them. It goes both ways.

 

Why dont these posts tire you equally? Too many people have such a narrow view only one side of the coin bothers them.

 

I'm vaccinated so either way I cant undo it. My parents are elderly so it gives me peace of mind to be around them as I drive them and do all their shopping. Neither side bothers me.. but at least it makes me more open minded to both views. 

We all have choices.  RCL is a business and they have the right to manage that business.  I have the right not to cruise with them.  It's wonderful the way that works. 

[stellarose]

things will be what they will be. if a cruise line wants people vaccinated- they can.  

 

just waiting things out bf I give CCL more money. 

[BlerkOne]

5 minutes ago, Butterbean1000 said:

Agree to disagree.  Opinions are like bellybuttons, everybody has one.

 

One more observation, sorry,  I just can't stop.  If you can't spread the virus after you're vaccinated, then why are you still advised to wear a mask?  Because they still don't have a grip on this thing. 

Who says you can't spread the virus? But true that much is still not known. If we waited for everything to be known, millions more would be dead.