S.A.L.T. on the Silver Moon

[Gourmet Gal]

3 hours ago, RetiredandTravel said:

 

That's very helpful, thanks.  I know they change the menu nightly but even when you look at Colonnade on the website it shows an MK American menu.

 

https://www.seabourn.com/en_US/experience/dining/the-colonnade.html

 

IMO the MK concept is sort of tired.  He opened the French Laundry in mid '90's and Per Se in 2004, that's just my personal opinion.

 

 

MK?  Do you mean Thomas Keller?  When was the last time you dined at French Laundry or Per Se?  I can assure you, those restaurants are not tired.  I am not familiar with his Seabourn endeavour but he has had an incredible impact on American fine dining and has trained many, many chefs who have gone on to open amazing restaurants. He currently holds 7 Michelin stars and whether you are impressed by the  Michelin guides or not you can appreciate that they don’t hand them out to chef’s with tired concepts.  

[cruiseej]

3 hours ago, RetiredandTravel said:

 

That's very helpful, thanks.  I know they change the menu nightly but even when you look at Colonnade on the website it shows an MK American menu.

 

https://www.seabourn.com/en_US/experience/dining/the-colonnade.html

 

IMO the MK concept is sort of tired.  He opened the French Laundry in mid '90's and Per Se in 2004, that's just my personal opinion.

 

 

 

Ah, I see. The sample menu you linked to for the Colonnade is an "American" menu. But it's not like that every night. As I mentioned, the French menu that drew us there had an excellent onion soup, escargots, perhaps the nicest chateaubriand I've ever had, an excellent creme brulee, and some other courses they tried to ply us with -- it was a great meal, and decidedly not TK nor American cooking. 

 

They do the Thomas Keller fried chicken meal once a week in the Colonnade; if it's not your thing, just eat elsewhere that night, and come back for the Indian menu (if that's your thing), or one that appeals to you. I think the Thomas Keller Grill restaurant is pretty far removed from the dining experience he offers at French Laundry and Per Se. We've had multiple fine meals at the TK Grill -- and it's definitely not all about a giant slab of meat (although one of the menu options is a ginormous steak if one wants). And as I said, the ever-changing menus in The Restaurant provide a good variety of dishes and cuisines. We also learned during our first couple cruises to ask for whatever you want; we often each get an appetizer and main course, but get an appetizer-sized portion of another main course we'd like to try; sometimes three appetizers and no main course, always double lobster on the night it's on the menu... 😉

 

I just hope Seabourn will borrow a bit of the S.A.L.T. approach to include more locally procured food & wine in the future. 

[Dolcevita Diva]

Can't wait to experience S.A.L.T.!

For those that have been on the Moon and also sailed on other Silversea ships (especially the Silver Spirit), any sense how much of the concept can be adapted to the other ships? 

 

Obviously, creating the S.A.L.T. Lab and separate dining room and bar are highly unlikely, but adding the local food focus and more S.A.L.T.-type shore experiences could be integrated across the non-expedition fleet.   Would it make sense or be feasible at some point without an extended dry dock to remodel one of the Spirit's dining rooms to be a S.A.L.T.  dining room?

[RetiredandTravel]

1 hour ago, Gourmet Gal said:

MK?  Do you mean Thomas Keller?  When was the last time you dined at French Laundry or Per Se?  I can assure you, those restaurants are not tired.  I am not familiar with his Seabourn endeavour but he has had an incredible impact on American fine dining and has trained many, many chefs who have gone on to open amazing restaurants. He currently holds 7 Michelin stars and whether you are impressed by the  Michelin guides or not you can appreciate that they don’t hand them out to chef’s with tired concepts.  

 

 

Sorry MK is a restaurant I used to frequent when on business in Chicago, I meant Thomas Keller.  They don't give much time to edit here.

 

 I ate at Per Se when it first opened in NYC, outrageously expensive even for NY, I thought it was good but there are much better in NY.  I have never eaten at The French Laundry, my brother and sister in law love it, honestly I find all the dishes annoying.  But that's just me.  There is no doubt Thomas Keller is a world renowned great chef.  I just have a problem with the mass marketing of these popular chefs/restaurants, I find it disingenuous.  IMO its more marketing than substance.  That's just my opinion.  Do the Seabourn TK restaurants have any Michelin stars?

 

 Example: We used to eat in Il Mulino in NYC quite often, fabulous restaurant.  Il Mulino opened "branch" restaurants in Puerto Rico  and Miami Beach , same menu, style and price, not close to the same restaurant.  Really just leveraging the name, same concept.

 

 TK is not a deal killer but its not a positive either.   SALT on the other hand is a big positive for SS.

 

 

 

 

Edited October 15, 2021 by RetiredandTravel
typo

[rkacruiser]

58 minutes ago, RetiredandTravel said:

I just have a problem with the mass marketing of these popular chefs/restaurants

 

I agree.  Often, the "hype" does not match the experience.  A major exception to my statement, however, is Rudi's Sel de Mer on HAL ships.  Whether a stand alone dining venue or a "pop-up" one evening in the Pinnacle Grill, the experience matches, and may exceed, the "hype".  

[rkacruiser]

5 hours ago, bitob said:

I am just forced to have a simple meal of caviar on some nights. LOL

 

Many years ago when Holiday Magazine was in print, I remember reading an article written by an experienced travel writer that described her Embarkation Day Lunch on either the Queen Mary or the Queen Elizabeth.  Always in the Verandah Grill; always with an order of Caviar, hot buttered toast, and Champagne.  Sounds good to me!  (And apparently you as well!)  

[Catlover54]

21 minutes ago, rkacruiser said:

 

Many years ago when Holiday Magazine was in print, I remember reading an article written by an experienced travel writer that described her Embarkation Day Lunch on either the Queen Mary or the Queen Elizabeth.  Always in the Verandah Grill; always with an order of Caviar, hot buttered toast, and Champagne.  Sounds good to me!  (And apparently you as well!)  

Fish eggs, high glycemic simple carbs, saturated animal fat, and fermented grape juice -- the combination is nectar for the gods. 🤗

[Gourmet Gal]

1 hour ago, RetiredandTravel said:

 

 

Sorry MK is a restaurant I used to frequent when on business in Chicago, I meant Thomas Keller.  They don't give much time to edit here.

 

 I ate at Per Se when it first opened in NYC, outrageously expensive even for NY, I thought it was good but there are much better in NY.  I have never eaten at The French Laundry, my brother and sister in law love it, honestly I find all the dishes annoying.  But that's just me.  There is no doubt Thomas Keller is a world renowned great chef.  I just have a problem with the mass marketing of these popular chefs/restaurants, I find it disingenuous.  IMO its more marketing than substance.  That's just my opinion.  Do the Seabourn TK restaurants have any Michelin stars?

 

 Example: We used to eat in Il Mulino in NYC quite often, fabulous restaurant.  Il Mulino opened "branch" restaurants in Puerto Rico  and Miami Beach , same menu, style and price, not close to the same restaurant.  Really just leveraging the name, same concept.

 

 TK is not a deal killer but its not a positive either.   SALT on the other hand is a big positive for SS.

 

 

 

 

Thanks for the further explanation…No the Seabourn TK has no stars but I do agree with your comments about truly fine restaurants that open branches that always seem to be diminished somewhat. Also, I think I get your dissatisfaction with certain high end establishments and master chefs.  I feel the same way about Atelier Crenn…Dominique Crenn seems to be trying way too hard there - I really disliked the experience and having to slog through poetry and her life story to somehow have a deeper understanding of her over-wrought food…but apparently the Michelin folks disagree!  I do think Thomas Keller is the real deal - I have all his cookbooks and have learned so much.  Anyway, aren’t we lucky to be such food critics!

[bitob]

5 hours ago, RetiredandTravel said:

 

 

Sorry MK is a restaurant I used to frequent when on business in Chicago, I meant Thomas Keller.  They don't give much time to edit here.

 

 I ate at Per Se when it first opened in NYC, outrageously expensive even for NY, I thought it was good but there are much better in NY.  I have never eaten at The French Laundry, my brother and sister in law love it, honestly I find all the dishes annoying.  But that's just me.  There is no doubt Thomas Keller is a world renowned great chef.  I just have a problem with the mass marketing of these popular chefs/restaurants, I find it disingenuous.  IMO its more marketing than substance.  That's just my opinion.  Do the Seabourn TK restaurants have any Michelin stars?

 

 Example: We used to eat in Il Mulino in NYC quite often, fabulous restaurant.  Il Mulino opened "branch" restaurants in Puerto Rico  and Miami Beach , same menu, style and price, not close to the same restaurant.  Really just leveraging the name, same concept.

 

 TK is not a deal killer but its not a positive either.   SALT on the other hand is a big positive for SS.

 

 

 

 

OMG  Il Mulino.  The best. I have eaten in both French Laundry and Per Se.  Overrated IMO.  I cannot remember a single thing I ate.  I just remember that the waiters spent a lot of time instructing us in HOW to eat some of the courses.

[Lois R]

On 10/15/2021 at 8:09 PM, Dolcevita Diva said:

Can't wait to experience S.A.L.T.!

For those that have been on the Moon and also sailed on other Silversea ships (especially the Silver Spirit), any sense how much of the concept can be adapted to the other ships? 

 

Obviously, creating the S.A.L.T. Lab and separate dining room and bar are highly unlikely, but adding the local food focus and more S.A.L.T.-type shore experiences could be integrated across the non-expedition fleet.   Would it make sense or be feasible at some point without an extended dry dock to remodel one of the Spirit's dining rooms to be a S.A.L.T.  dining room?

Hi, I have no clue about the Expedition ships but as for the other ones, they would have to do a lot of drydocking to add the Salt venues to those vessels.

[sea bright]

I suppose they could convert Indochine to SALT Kitchen on the Muse/Spirit, but I can't see how they could replicate the SALT bar or the lab. I did notice that some of  the excursions listed for San Juan on our Feb Caribbean cruise on the Spirit are local food experiences similar to the SALT shore excursions on the Moon in Greece. I really hope they add similar options for other ports and on other ships!

[cruiseej]

On 10/15/2021 at 3:12 PM, RetiredandTravel said:

TK is not a deal killer but its not a positive either.

 

I'll respectfully disagree. If you forget about any hype about Thomas Keller, and simply dine in the restaurant, there's some really good food served there, in my opinion. Since the menu doesn't change, you probably wouldn't eat there more than once or twice a cruise, but we find it is a nice option, certainly not the negative you describe it as.

 

 

[highplanesdrifters]

18 hours ago, cruiseej said:

 

I'll respectfully disagree. If you forget about any hype about Thomas Keller, and simply dine in the restaurant, there's some really good food served there, in my opinion. Since the menu doesn't change, you probably wouldn't eat there more than once or twice a cruise, but we find it is a nice option, certainly not the negative you describe it as.

 

 

I agree @cruiseej. TK has really grown on me. We like to slip in on occasion at 6:30 when available and have a simple meal. A ceasar and some protien. I also get the lobster thermador without the thermador.  The art of customizing without the 24 hour advance notice to the chef. And it has windows, unlike the La Dame cave.

[Gourmet Gal]

Someone should correct me if I’m wrong but I think La Dame has windows on The Moon.

[sea bright]

Windows and an outdoor area.

[les37b]

On 10/17/2021 at 9:52 PM, sea bright said:

I suppose they could convert Indochine to SALT Kitchen on the Muse/Spirit, but I can't see how they could replicate the SALT bar or the lab. I did notice that some of  the excursions listed for San Juan on our Feb Caribbean cruise on the Spirit are local food experiences similar to the SALT shore excursions on the Moon in Greece. I really hope they add similar options for other ports and on other ships!

 

 

Silversea - please don't do that! Indochine is the best! 😁

[RetiredandTravel]

17 minutes ago, les37b said:

 

 

Silversea - please don't do that! Indochine is the best! 😁

 

 

This has occurred to me, Indochine looks like a great venue.  I guess one way to alleviate the situation is take the Moon around Asia 🙂.  What exactly does SALT serve on Trans Atlantic/Pacific cruises?  Fish?

[les37b]

13 minutes ago, RetiredandTravel said:

 

 

This has occurred to me, Indochine looks like a great venue.  I guess one way to alleviate the situation is take the Moon around Asia 🙂.  What exactly does SALT serve on Trans Atlantic/Pacific cruises?  Fish?

 

I was gutted when I'd booked the Moon for the TA last November and learned in the build months later, they'd change Indochine to SALT...... So I've changed that booking after it was cancelled to the TP from Tokyo to Seward on the Muse to have another taster. Everything is subjective and personal opinions I know - but for me, Indochine was the best concept and for once, could probably go through the whole menu.

[RetiredandTravel]

20 minutes ago, les37b said:

 

I was gutted when I'd booked the Moon for the TA last November and learned in the build months later, they'd change Indochine to SALT...... So I've changed that booking after it was cancelled to the TP from Tokyo to Seward on the Muse to have another taster. Everything is subjective and personal opinions I know - but for me, Indochine was the best concept and for once, could probably go through the whole menu.

 

 

Certainly understandable.

 

We like the appearance of SALT & Indochine, both great concepts.  All kidding aside it would just come down to the itinerary for us.  We are considering two SS cruises in 2023 one on the Moon the other Spirit.    Indochine vs SALT is a push in that decision.

 

 

[les37b]

14 hours ago, RetiredandTravel said:

 

 

Certainly understandable.

 

We like the appearance of SALT & Indochine, both great concepts.  All kidding aside it would just come down to the itinerary for us.  We are considering two SS cruises in 2023 one on the Moon the other Spirit.    Indochine vs SALT is a push in that decision.

 

 

 

Well the 3 I have currently in future bookings (which have been changing as we go with re-re-bookings) sit with Moon, Muse and Dawn. Most of my previous bookings have been on the Wind, so the dining venue certainly isn't a primary consideration. (Have sailed on Wind, Cloud, Shadow and Muse - with cancelations on Wind, Moon, Dawn and Spirit.) The Itinerary is all important, but unfortunately the price hikes that Silversea has imposed, the cost has now become a huge factor and are pricing themselves out of my market. The January 2022 Panama has a 70% hike in Jan 2023 (Though I note there has also just been the usual increase added for 2022 so does close the gap considerably.) Should I not get to sail on this  at the third attempt and SS don't transfer me onto the exact same sailing, I will simply get a refund and book it with Viking instead with a similar itinerary for half the cost. They don't have Indochine either, but at least I get the equivalent of 2 for 1, but will miss the free laundry! That example may well be on the extreme of the hikes, but I will say that nothing stands out anymore in the price aspect as a great deal. I don't want a limo to the airport and I don't want a worthless free tour in each port and importantly I don't want to pay for these things I don't want. I'm really convinced this target to compete head to head with Regent on this will backfire. Of course, that's just my opinion.

 

[RetiredandTravel]

3 hours ago, les37b said:

 

Well the 3 I have currently in future bookings (which have been changing as we go with re-re-bookings) sit with Moon, Muse and Dawn. Most of my previous bookings have been on the Wind, so the dining venue certainly isn't a primary consideration. (Have sailed on Wind, Cloud, Shadow and Muse - with cancelations on Wind, Moon, Dawn and Spirit.) The Itinerary is all important, but unfortunately the price hikes that Silversea has imposed, the cost has now become a huge factor and are pricing themselves out of my market. The January 2022 Panama has a 70% hike in Jan 2023 (Though I note there has also just been the usual increase added for 2022 so does close the gap considerably.) Should I not get to sail on this  at the third attempt and SS don't transfer me onto the exact same sailing, I will simply get a refund and book it with Viking instead with a similar itinerary for half the cost. They don't have Indochine either, but at least I get the equivalent of 2 for 1, but will miss the free laundry! That example may well be on the extreme of the hikes, but I will say that nothing stands out anymore in the price aspect as a great deal. I don't want a limo to the airport and I don't want a worthless free tour in each port and importantly I don't want to pay for these things I don't want. I'm really convinced this target to compete head to head with Regent on this will backfire. Of course, that's just my opinion.

 

 

Yes adding excursions to the cost raised prices at SS.  When I compare SS to Regent and back out the airfare SS is actually cheaper in many cases.  Apples to apples SS & Seabourn appear to be close in price, basic microeconomics.

 

If you don't take the excursions the added cost is obviously a negative.  It will be important to watch how SS actually handles the excursions.    Its still a ways off but many seem to be just very basic.   If this is the case then the other excursions at a cost price should be reduced because the person isn't taking the included excursion.  I also noticed comparing two identical South American cruises (pre/post included excursions) that the 2023 stopped at less ports, hmm.

 

We like the concept  of SS smaller ships but will probably start with Muse & company because of the dining choices when we start.

 

We looked at Viking several times, found the price to be more like 60-70%, just couldn't get there.  They have an interesting expedition cruise to the US Great Lake region we have considered.

 

Either way its great to get back to travelling.

 

Hope you enjoy yours.

 

 

[Dolcevita Diva]

21 hours ago, RetiredandTravel said:

 

 

Certainly understandable.

 

We like the appearance of SALT & Indochine, both great concepts.  All kidding aside it would just come down to the itinerary for us.  We are considering two SS cruises in 2023 one on the Moon the other Spirit.    Indochine vs SALT is a push in that decision.

 

 

I've only sailed on the smaller ships thus far, so haven't yet had a chance to experience Indochine, which clearly has a strong following as well.  Smart strategy by Silversea - keeping Indochine on Muse/Spirit and S.A.L.T on Moon/Dawn creates differentiation between the larger ships  and if they add a bit of the S.A.L.T experience across the fleet by offering more local culinary-focused excursions, that will continue to enhance their positioning as a cruise line that appeals to foodies.  

[les37b]

2 hours ago, Dolcevita Diva said:

I've only sailed on the smaller ships thus far, so haven't yet had a chance to experience Indochine, which clearly has a strong following as well.  Smart strategy by Silversea - keeping Indochine on Muse/Spirit and S.A.L.T on Moon/Dawn creates differentiation between the larger ships  and if they add a bit of the S.A.L.T experience across the fleet by offering more local culinary-focused excursions, that will continue to enhance their positioning as a cruise line that appeals to foodies.  

 

Agree it's a good move not to change them, but we shall see.

 

An interesting point was raised regarding Local foods when you are crossing an ocean for SALT. It just reminded me, I'm not keen on Guinea pig for my visit to Peru! lol (Though some might be up for it of course! haha)

 

I've just sent in an email to run through the options and various situations for my upcoming Panama cruise which is now at T-75. I've always thought it would be cancelled, but now think its more likely it will sail. The dilemma has always been the prospect of advisory notices by the government not to travel and pending quarantine on return, but another is now also a concern. Ive just learned today that a few countries have added the UK to their ban lists because of a rise in infections. Just another thing to worry about I guess. I'm sure the list will grow!

 

On a separate note, I did look at entry requirements to a few of the countries with many needing a PCR to be allowed in. I wonder how that will be dealt with when we are midway through a cruise and in a ship bubble! Hopefully these scenarios have been thought about! I hadn't thought about asking this in the email I just sent!

[Stumblefoot]

10 hours ago, les37b said:

The January 2022 Panama has a 70% hike in Jan 2023…

 

…That example may well be on the extreme of the hikes…

I think it’s becoming more of the norm on several itineraries and not the exception.  I’ve tracked prices for years and can tell you for the Moon voyages that have already been cancelled in 2022, their 2024 counterpart fares are +50%.  

[RetiredandTravel]

35 minutes ago, Stumblefoot said:

I think it’s becoming more of the norm on several itineraries and not the exception.  I’ve tracked prices for years and can tell you for the Moon voyages that have already been cancelled in 2022, their 2024 counterpart fares are +50%.  

 

 

Interesting, prices seem to be going up across the board for the luxury lines.

 

I've looked at a lot of cruises and have found it to be very difficult to figure out what drives pricing between the different luxury cruise lines.  They seem to vary geographically, time to cruise etc.  One line will be cheaper (on a per day basis) in one region and more expensive in another. 

 

When you back out airfare the Regent Explorer (24k) is quite a bit more expensive than the SS Muse (21k) on basic 14 day Auckland <-> Sydney 2024 cruise.   I priced mid level veranda rooms.  Explorer and Muse seem to be fairly equivalent.  Viking by the way for a similar 15 day (+1) is 17k.  We intend to book a SS Med cruise which is considerably cheaper than the equivalent Seabourn.   So its important to do your homework on the pricing unless you are set on one brand.