DCL returning to old-style muster -- Will Carnival and other lines do the same?

[crazy4themouse]

So apparently, Disney Cruise Line is going back to the old, tortuous way of doing muster drills. No reasons have been given, only speculations -- but it makes zero sense to me. A few people have said that it's the Coast Guard who actually has the say over muster drills, and the way it has been done since the restart was just a Covid concession. I have no idea on the truth to that. But my husband and I were talking about it, and we both agree that not only is the new-and-improved muster 1000X easier and faster, it's more effective.

 

The old way, you're with a huge crowd spread out over the dining room or the club or someplace similar, while a crew member half a football field away says something about a life preserver that you can't hear because some kids near you are already bouncing off the walls. The new way, it's just a half dozen people -- or maybe just you, sometimes -- and the crew member is right in front of you. They have your undivided attention for that 2 minutes.

 

Has anyone heard anything about Carnival or other lines going back to the dreaded pack-'em-in way, or worse -- melt in the hot sun on deck -- way of doing muster?

 

[tidecat]

It seems like the way to fix this would be to make your presence at your muster station "activate" your Sail and Sign card. I also wonder if it would be more efficient to even have the muster personnel keep the Sail and Sign cards and you get them when you complete the drill.

[mz-s]

I read the government just extended the COVID state of emergency until 2023...so under what premise does the Coast Guard say it is safe to go back to the old muster without COVID protocols while under a state of emergency?

[shof515]

nothing official from Disney about this. the only source i can find is some twitter post:

and this page:
https://dclfan.com/news/disney-cruise-line-to-return-to-in-person-muster-drills/

 

 

[cruisin from vegas]

DCL is a little different, they only required one person in the party to go to the abbreviated version… according to this they are now requiring the whole party.  Carnival has always required everyone to attend.. that’s what I get out of it

[crazy4themouse]

52 minutes ago, shof515 said:

nothing official from Disney about this. the only source i can find is some twitter post:

and this page:
https://dclfan.com/news/disney-cruise-line-to-return-to-in-person-muster-drills/

 

 

 

A couple different people on the DIS boards said they had it confirmed by crew members, and one person who boarded the Fantasy yesterday said it looked like it was indeed going back to the old way. But as @cruisin from vegas said, DCL has only required one person in the party to check in, which doesn't make any sense to me... If that's the case then yeah, not everyone knows where their emergency station is, and that defeats the purpose. So hopefully, this is a choice by DCL and not something any of the other cruise lines will be required to do.

 

 

[hurricane0226]

Can't hold the sail and sign cards, since they get delivered to the cabin, so I like the Idea that

you cannot buy drinks until you do the muster.

[Tyro1]

I’m not sure about Carnival, but Royal Caribbean had their new muster system in development and approved by the coast guard a month before covid hit, so if anything I think Carnival would just have to pay for the rights on the royal system, vs the one they made that may fall under any kind of temporary exemption. I don’t see a world when any major cruise line goes back to old school muster full time. (DCL has so many kids on board it may be different for them)

Edited November 14, 2022 by Tyro1

[Lane Hog]

Kids may be the driver.  There's a reason schools do fire drills more than once a year, while most businesses only do them every couple years or so if at all.  I'd been in the workforce for 28 years before I had my first at-work drill.  My current employer seems to do them twice a year, so maybe they see us as schoolchildren?..

[Moviela]

I am always concerned with safety. I thought the previous drills of dragging everyone out on deck to stand in the sun for an extended period whilst everyone aboard was rounded up was not contributing to the message of safety. I do think groups in theaters to demonstrate life vest and reporting places was helpful. The current system has reduced the full demonstration and instructions to scan-n-go. They show you a life vest and ask "any questions?" My favorite line is "This is a whistle. You may use it to attract attention. If you blow harder it will be louder."

 

I feel a combination of the video on the ship and a live demo of the life vest WITH the chance to try it on should be offered. I feel also extra instruction should be offered to passengers with mobility issues, like where to leave the scooter when called to muster. Persons with children should demonstrate the ability to properly put the vest on their kids. I hope all the safety instruction is a waste of time, and never has to be used, but it an investment in a good future.

 

[Mic101680]

I haven't sailed DCL in AGES, but did they have a video version of a muster drill during covid? And if so, are they doing away with the video option and that's why they're saying the 'in person' requirement is back? I know NCL has the video option, and as long as they can verify you watched it, you're good to go with them. 

[cruisingguy007]

I sure hope not, the old way was so inconvenient, people are always late/missing, people talking and it sucks being jammed in herd style. The new way is so much better, it's the your time dining of muster, no one wants to stand around in the hallways waiting on dinner and no one wants to be herded into crowds for muster. It's a terrible idea.     

[sparks1093]

The muster drills aren't just for the passengers, they are also for the crew. While the old way was inconvenient, and I do much prefer the new way, I do see the benefit of the old way in getting the crew used to their assignments (practice) and also for the passengers. You train the way you fight and when muster happens everyone reports to their muster station. @chengkp75 has posted on the topic before and hopefully he can chime in on this discussion as well.

[chengkp75]

12 hours ago, mz-s said:

I read the government just extended the COVID state of emergency until 2023...so under what premise does the Coast Guard say it is safe to go back to the old muster without COVID protocols while under a state of emergency?

In fact, it is not the USCG, which has very little jurisdiction over foreign cruise ships, that allowed the new muster system, it was the IMO.

 

8 hours ago, Tyro1 said:

I don’t see a world when any major cruise line goes back to old school muster full time.

It is not up to the cruise lines, but the maritime safety experts at the IMO.  The old system has been tried and tested for decades, but I am afraid it will take a disaster to point out the flaws in the new system.

 

8 hours ago, Moviela said:

I thought the previous drills of dragging everyone out on deck to stand in the sun for an extended period whilst everyone aboard was rounded up was not contributing to the message of safety.

How so?  The old muster gave every passenger the experience of what an actual muster would be, rather than a saunter along at your own pace and timing.

 

8 hours ago, Moviela said:

The current system has reduced the full demonstration and instructions to scan-n-go.

The requirement to show lifejacket donning has been allowed to be a video presentation for a long time, the cruise lines used this to fill time while the crew finished the "behind the scenes" aspects of the muster that passengers have no clue about.  As you are herded to your muster station, hundreds of crew are opening, searching, and marking every cabin and public space as "clear".  While not perfect (someone moving around the ship can avoid detection for a while (those late comers), it is a necessary part of the muster function.

 

However, the new system has removed all crowd control training from the crew (dealing with recalcitrant pax, which would translate to frightened pax in an emergency), and also removed the experience of an actual muster from the pax.

5 hours ago, cruisingguy007 said:

I sure hope not, the old way was so inconvenient, people are always late/missing, people talking and it sucks being jammed in herd style.

So, during a real muster, we wouldn't want it to be inconvenient, and should just let you all saunter on down to muster when you feel it is convenient?  Remember, the crew are taken away from their duties for muster drill as well, but their convenience doesn't matter?  Whose lives are they training to save?  I guess I should be grateful that the vast majority of people have never experienced a life threatening emergency so they can blithely accept convenience over a few minutes of responsibility.

[mz-s]

Frankly on my cruises since COVID, I couldn’t help but shake the feeling that during a real emergency the “new” muster would be proven inadequate. Other than knowing where your muster station is, there was no other training or information given.

 

I don’t want to line up five deep on the boat deck ever again but I also want everyone to have a sense of being prepared if the unthinkable does happen.

Edited November 14, 2022 by mz-s

[shof515]

6 minutes ago, mz-s said:

I don’t want to line up five deep on the boat deck ever again but I also want everyone to have a sense of being prepared if the unthinkable does happen.

something i always wonder since i started cruising, how does alcohol  effect the passenger safety? We know the effects of too much alcohol causing people to be drunk and disorderly. but what happens in a real emergency. how do get prepare for the worse while not sober?

[cruisingguy007]

6 minutes ago, NYHartChapp said:

Nah, you’re not expressing a view…just being insulting.  Not cool.  

 

Feel free to check with chengkp75 before you have an opinion. I appreciate being able to have mine. I like it the way it is and didn't need all the snark, I'm a passenger, not a seafarer, he could have provided his insight without snark and smartassery. Have a great day!   

Edited November 14, 2022 by cruisingguy007

[cruisingguy007]

25 minutes ago, mz-s said:

Frankly on my cruises since COVID, I couldn’t help but shake the feeling that during a real emergency the “new” muster would be proven inadequate. Other than knowing where your muster station is, there was no other training or information given.

 

I don’t want to line up five deep on the boat deck ever again but I also want everyone to have a sense of being prepared if the unthinkable does happen.

 

It's essentially the same from a passenger standpoint, you still have to go to your muster station. It's not like the old way was anymore in-depth from a passenger perspective. It's not like we actually went through an emergency drill or anything. You herded in, sit around waiting, watch the short demo and then herd out. If anything, the new way makes people pay attention more. What safety benefits (from the passenger perspective) were there with the old system vs the new? It isn't like we practice getting into lifeboats or anything, it essentially the same from the passenger experience.     

[sparks1093]

38 minutes ago, cruisingguy007 said:

 

It's essentially the same from a passenger standpoint, you still have to go to your muster station. It's not like the old way was anymore in-depth from a passenger perspective. It's not like we actually went through an emergency drill or anything. You herded in, sit around waiting, watch the short demo and then herd out. If anything, the new way makes people pay attention more. What safety benefits (from the passenger perspective) were there with the old system vs the new? It isn't like we practice getting into lifeboats or anything, it essentially the same from the passenger experience.     

The main safety benefit to the passenger is that the entire crew gets to participate in the process as well and they get to practice their assignments in a realistic way and that experience could prove to be invaluable in an emergency.

[cruisingguy007]

5 minutes ago, sparks1093 said:

The main safety benefit to the passenger is that the entire crew gets to participate in the process as well and they get to practice their assignments in a realistic way and that experience could prove to be invaluable in an emergency.

 

I'd hardly call it realistic, I think the drills that they do during port days are actual drills and preparedness training, not so much muster. The crew could just as easily practice the same way of old without herding passengers, it's only the herding of passengers that is a difference and that was already a hot mess with people taking forever to show up or not showing up at all. Hardly a substitute for an emergency but I guess there is some benefit to practice soft herding. If they want to simulate a real emergency, sound an alarm and offer passengers five free drinks for the first 200 passengers to each muster station. Then you'd have more hard realistic stampede response during an emergency lol. From a passenger perspective there is no practical difference but I can see the herding practice being viewed as a tangible benefit for the crew, and by extension the passengers.      

[rellersi]

14 hours ago, tidecat said:

It seems like the way to fix this would be to make your presence at your muster station "activate" your Sail and Sign card. I also wonder if it would be more efficient to even have the muster personnel keep the Sail and Sign cards and you get them when you complete the drill.

This was the case on our last Carnival Cruise on the Spirit, you could not buy a drink in the bar if you had not gone to muster drill,

[jedi bobs]

IMHO, the reason DCL is going back to old scool muster is becuse people are not doing there muster drill.  The cruise lines need to make an example of the people who refuse t go to there muster by disebarking them.  An hour before sail Away should be last call for muster if you don't get to yours by 45 min before sail away, you get kicked off the ship, no refund.

 

[cruisingguy007]

1 hour ago, jedi bobs said:

IMHO, the reason DCL is going back to old scool muster is becuse people are not doing there muster drill.  The cruise lines need to make an example of the people who refuse t go to there muster by disebarking them.  An hour before sail Away should be last call for muster if you don't get to yours by 45 min before sail away, you get kicked off the ship, no refund.

 

 

Yeah it's strange this is still happening, on our last Carnival cruise they basically usher you to your muster station upon boarding, it's as easy as can be and there is no excuse for folks not doing it. That said, there were still folks that didn't ever go to muster and they did some announcement at the end of the procedure and then we took off. I don't really see how they can make it any easier than it is now, it's even on the stateroom tv as well. Some passengers are just knuckleheads and refuse to go with the program but I'm not sure returning to the old way would solve it as there were always passengers who didn't show up then too.   

[cruisequeen4ever]

It’s not Covid safe to crowd everyone for the muster, and I haven’t experienced the new muster to make an opinion of whether it’s sufficient or not. If it’s not safe enough to just do the current muster, then a hybrid is what I would recommend where crowds are not occurring but more information that’s important is being properly disseminated. Already, Carnival was behind times in having everyone crowd on the deck. No need to go way back in time.

[Tyro1]

4 hours ago, chengkp75 said:

It is not up to the cruise lines, but the maritime safety experts at the IMO.  The old system has been tried and tested for decades, but I am afraid it will take a disaster to point out the flaws in the new system.

Yes, but Royal Caribbean got their system approved by the IMO before covid was even a thing, so as long as everyone follows the system Royal has gotten approved there’s no reason to go back.