Just got an email outlining the "NEW" offerings

[SCX22]

32 minutes ago, caribill said:

 

You can 100% book your cruise online. But you need to know what you want: Itinerary, ship, type of cabin, optional packages, etc.

 

Quite different than knowing you want to book a flight from NYC to San Francisco on United. Even a novice flyer can figure that out online,

 

YouTube.   There are so many vlogs about the cruising that are more informative than what a TA has to say.  Many are first hand experiences and show the actual ship and experience behind them.  The cruise lines endorse them since some are given free cruises to make video content.  You can't say it's biased information since the TAs make commission off of their bookings as well and some will sell the newbies stuff they don't need in order to boost their commission.

[caribill]

6 hours ago, startedwithamouse said:

Most of our bookings are drop and go rates. 

 

It's the older generation of cruisers who care where their cabin is. We'd much rather have the dirt cheap fare where we can use the money saved in ports or on Plus. 

 

You must live near a cruise port and not have to deal with last minute air fares.

[caribill]

1 hour ago, SCX22 said:

Forget talking to a live agent or being assisted by a human.   Make cruise bookings like the airline bookings where nearly all functions can be done online or through the app.  I’ve bypassed a few long rebooking lines by rebooking myself on other flights through the airline’s website.

 

Self assistance is the trend with travel, and cruise reservations have a long way to go.

 

Yes, when I book a flight, I almost always do it via the Internet.

 

But if I have to make changes to that flight, I get a human on the phone to make sure it goes the way I want it to.

[startedwithamouse]

4 minutes ago, caribill said:

 

You must live near a cruise port and not have to deal with last minute air fares.

We do, but we fly a lot too by scouting the cheap airfares. 

[TheMichael]

11 minutes ago, SCX22 said:

YouTube.   There are so many vlogs about the cruising that are more informative than what a TA has to say.  Many are first hand experiences and show the actual ship and experience behind them.  The cruise lines endorse them since some are given free cruises to make video content.  You can't say it's biased information since the TAs make commission off of their bookings as well and some will sell the newbies stuff they don't need in order to boost their commission.

The secret of many of the popular cruise YouTubers is that they use a TA. A couple of them are or are married to TAs!

 

I wouldn't say the cruise lines "endorse" them, so much as they get an occasional "influencer" trip (usually with a whole bunch of others at the same time, on a new ship for instance) and run up so many sailings that they get status. Like other travel vloggers/bloggers, they normally pay their own way and expense it. As someone who used to do blogging myself, as long as you're making a profit when all is said and done and you keep proper books, all is fair with the IRS.

 

That said, YouTube is a great resource.

[LouCoop]

3 hours ago, villauk said:

Sky. Ours is the first cruise with the new implementations. Look back at the others who have commented on this thread, and are on the same sailing, and have said that they’ve not received ‘the’ email. I have received another half a dozen others this week - even a free subscription to the Telegraph and  one telling me to book my arrival time 🙄 - but nothing about the changes!

We are cruising on Sky at end of October, we also have not received this email. If it weren't for CC would not know about these changes.

[Steelers36]

2 hours ago, Russ Lomas said:

May have been mentioned here, but that was a lot of pages to read and catch up on.

 

Michael Bayley formally posted today that RCCL will NOT make Sorrento's pizza an extra cost.  He mentioned 80% of guests would not pay extra for pizza and 25% would consider switching to other cruise lines if they did this.  Part of me wonders if RCCL did this as a marketing ploy after Princess' announcement...Look, we asked on a survey and guests said no.  We listen to our customers (other cruise lines do not).

 

Quote below:

"Pizza ! Pizza ! Everywhere ! A couple of weeks ago we conducted one of frequent small group guest surveys. As usual we asked questions on this n that ! Including customer thoughts on $ charges for Pizza ! The question was posted with the result that many emails and comments were sent !

The survey said 80 per cent of guests were opposed, 20 per cent of guests said they would still go for Pizza with a charge, 25 per cent of guests surveyed said they would consider other cruise lines. To calm all our Pizza lovers don’t worry we are not charging for Pizza."

PCL does offer free pizza on the ships.  And from what I have read here, it is better than what RCCL offers and so we have not even addressed Alfredo's/Gigi's.

[Steelers36]

1 hour ago, Russ Lomas said:

I do not disagree with you.  I usually eat maybe 1 slice of Sorrento's pizza per cruise, if that.  Tastes about as good as a frozen one you buy from the store to me.  Just saying that RCCL is announcing that they will not change their free pizza to a paid pizza joint.

And neither did Princess.

[mcship]

2 hours ago, ldtr said:

Just to be clear did everyone  that purchased the FAS program prior to the change get the old term honored.  Basically they got the terms that were in place for the FAS at the time when they purchased it.

 

Or did everyone  that had booked a cruise prior to the change get to purchase the FAS after the change and get the pre change terms and prices?

 

FAS is done at time of booking.  Not really an ad-on.  You either book "sail away" or FAS.  (FAS premium was not out yet).

old FAS had - among other things - 3 specialty dining.  new FAS dropped that to 2.

People with old FAS got 3.

They did not lose a dinner just because the terms changed.

The wifi package changed too, and the old FAS got the old package.  Old was 250 minutes (yea, minutes are stupid, but that is what they had) per booking.  New was 150 per person.   If on the old, you had the 250 total.

[mcship]

3 hours ago, startedwithamouse said:

This isn't real estate.  They can change things as stated in their T&C that YOU, the guest, agrees to in your cruise contract. 

 

These are cruise ships which sail under flag of convenience. 

 

 

Yes, that would be the "billion words" part I referenced.

[mcship]

3 hours ago, SCX22 said:

I’m going to throw out a very unpopular opinion…

 

I would like to see all cruise lines, not just Princess, go to direct booking only. Cruising is the last travel segments to not adapt to this.  The airlines deal with many more passengers and are able to handle it.  The airlines did this a long time ago when UX/UI was developed enough for bookings to be manipulated 100% by passengers online and allowed for and it decreased airfare prices because they no longer had to go through a middleman, the TA, who had to get paid commission.  It helped that IATA made electronic tickets compulsory so the airlines were able get rid of physical airline offices and the manpower required to run them.

 

Getting rid of the TAs means no more commission to be paid and would trickle down to lower cruise fares.  It would take a larger initial IT investment, but would pay off in the long run.

 

Only stating this because many are giving opinions on how they don’t want to pay more, but aren’t offering suggestions to cut costs.

It will happen.  I use a TA for NCL, and did for my upcoming Princess, because free grats on the Princess.  NCL it is cheaper thru TA, and free grats.  Carnival on the other hand, cheaper (by just a touch) to use their system.  Since Princess IS Carnival, I would expect that to carry over, but may also be dependent on the PAX.  If most Princess book via TA, they would be careful in yanking that out from under the TA.  But, cutting fare by 50 bucks vs TA, would drive many to the web site.

 

[Guest ldtr]

1 hour ago, mcship said:

FAS is done at time of booking.  Not really an ad-on.  You either book "sail away" or FAS.  (FAS premium was not out yet).

old FAS had - among other things - 3 specialty dining.  new FAS dropped that to 2.

People with old FAS got 3.

They did not lose a dinner just because the terms changed.

The wifi package changed too, and the old FAS got the old package.  Old was 250 minutes (yea, minutes are stupid, but that is what they had) per booking.  New was 150 per person.   If on the old, you had the 250 total.

No but as you said it was selected and paid for at time of booking, just as with Princess any thing selected and paid for before the implementation of change remained the same. When they raised internet prices anyone purchased before the change got the old price, when they raised gratuities anyone that prepaid got the old price, with packages before the price increase got the old price and the same terms that they purchased even though they sailed after the increase..

 

No different then Princess.

 

If someone  booked before the change and didn't buy internet when they booked could they buy it on board and get the old minutes and price.  if not then it is exactly the same as Princess.

Edited August 18, 2023 by ldtr

[CruizinSusan70]

4 hours ago, Russ Lomas said:

I do not disagree with you.  I usually eat maybe 1 slice of Sorrento's pizza per cruise, if that.  Tastes about as good as a frozen one you buy from the store to me.  Just saying that RCCL is announcing that they will not change their free pizza to a paid pizza joint.

They wanted to see if the Loyal Royals were dumb enough to fork over extra coinage for the cardboard they serve as pizza.  Princess (Gigi's/Alfredo's), MSC, Carnival, NCL, Celebrity all have better pizza than RCI, in that order since I've cruised or will cruise on each of those lines this year.

[CruizinSusan70]

4 hours ago, ldtr said:

What is surprising is that anyone in a survey said they would still go there.

They don't call them Loyal Royals for nothing.

[CruizinSusan70]

1 hour ago, mcship said:

FAS is done at time of booking.  Not really an ad-on.  You either book "sail away" or FAS.  (FAS premium was not out yet).

old FAS had - among other things - 3 specialty dining.  new FAS dropped that to 2.

People with old FAS got 3.

They did not lose a dinner just because the terms changed.

The wifi package changed too, and the old FAS got the old package.  Old was 250 minutes (yea, minutes are stupid, but that is what they had) per booking.  New was 150 per person.   If on the old, you had the 250 total.

New FAS is down to 1 and has been for a while if you book a studio, inside or OV room.  And this is up to an 11 night cruise.

[caribill]

5 hours ago, CruizinSusan70 said:

How about you walk to a bar and get your drink or walk to the IC and get a snack? This way, you don't have to wait and you know what you're getting.

 

Not always that easy.

 

Was on a Princess cruise in a very crowded Explorers Lounge. A waiter would come around and take drink orders, but the time from wanting a waiter to appear and when the waiter could actually deliver the beverage was close to an hour.

 

Yes, you could walk up to the bar, but they were servicing all of the multiple waiters' orders before a walk up customer could order, so walking to the bar was not an option.

 

But, if you ordered with the app, the drink came from a different area of the ship and arrived much faster than using a waiter in that lounge or walking up to the bar yourself.

[cr8tiv1]

My opinion.  The app is/was over-rated and promised miracles.  Now that it can’t perform to its optimum, the enhanced it to make it even more appealing. 
 

Princess needs to through the baby (JP) out with the bath water.

 

Princess…NOT Loving This.

 

Page 33 and 551 posts.  I have not read all of them, but my general consensus is that many are not happy with this change.  Any chance of it being retracted?

Edited August 18, 2023 by cr8tiv1

[villauk]

6 hours ago, B_A_H said:

21 pages in 4 days - impressive.

 

I haven't sailed on Princess in ages but just booked the Sky out of Port Everglades for 1/27.  Yes, even after the horror of Princess's changes that have everyone's panties in a bunch.

 

Looking at the forest through the trees, you have to research cruises now based on total value.  Meaning, add everything (including the package upcharges) together and compare them.

 

In my case, Princess was the cheapest between the Sky and Celebrity Apex and surprising close to the MSC Seashore for near identical cruises sailing the same day out of South Florida.  I don't do RCI, I'm not partial to HAL, and I'd rather chew off an arm then sail Carnival so those were my choices for a 7 day Caribbean.

 

An inside cabin on the Sky with Premier for two people including port tax is $2,967.  The Apex with Always Included would have cost $3,409 and the Seascape with drinks and Wi-Fi would be $2,038.

 

Let's compare.  On the Sky, the drink package is at the highest level.  On Celebrity and especially MSC you'd have to buy up to get the higher tier.  On Celebrity that would be $420 and on MSC it would be $336.  MSC is actually higher than it seems because their premium level only covers 75% of what Princess and Celebrity consider premium so you're likely to have to pay the difference plus gratuity for better wines and liquor brands.

 

Premium Wi-Fi on Princess includes 4 devices per person at the highest level of bandwidth.  Celebrity and MSC include one per person at the lowest level.  The buy up on Celebrity is $210.00 and it's $70.00 on MSC but on MSC it's per device and once a device is activated it can't be switched to another device forcing people to pay double for two devices.

 

Gratuities aren't included on MSC and that's $196 additional.  

 

Premier includes two specialty dining meals which adds $216 on Celebrity and $180 on MSC.

 

Final tally apples to apples = Princess $2,967, Celebrity $4,255, and MSC $2,820.  And that doesn't factor in some of the other Premier benefits not available on the other two lines.  

 

Before everyone attacks me, I know this is far from scientific; it's meant as a single example. But for better or worse, it's what is necessary now to compare different cruises.  Maybe that's the point. 😉

 

I also know that people most impacted by Princess's changes are those that sail bare bones and buy what they consume on board a'la carte.  But as discussed throughout this thread, the cruise lines don't care about you anymore.  With demand as high as it is there's plenty of new blood willing to pay big bucks for an all inclusive experience.  On that, all inclusive is the hottest segment in the hotel industry with the three big brands falling all over themselves to buy or build all inclusive properties.  So for you bare bones folks it's only going to get worse.  The times they are a changing. 

 

 

That’s exactly what I did but Princess has now changed the goal posts since I paid, in full, for my cruise. So, no, it doesn’t make any difference what you envisage your cruise will cost as it can be totally different by the time you sail.

[JG&Lcruisingnewbies]

9 minutes ago, villauk said:

 

That’s exactly what I did but Princess has now changed the goal posts since I paid, in full, for my cruise. So, no, it doesn’t make any difference what you envisage your cruise will cost as it can be totally different by the time you sail.

Exactly

 

if I was buying now I would grumble  But at least I can plan accordingly. I can make informed choices. We have an old package. Was give option to upgrade months ago but I didn’t want the extras . Now I have to upgrade just to get the same. or PAYG for the same.

 

 what’s next for next year? Perhaps suddenly & all at once IC & slice pizza is not included, but it’s only a ‘nominal charge’. ‘Nominal fee’ for afternoon teas. Activating your Ocean now service is public areas only Or pay $5.

if you don’t read blogs/CC etc you’ll only discover it when you step on board.

 

Princess says it’s only a ‘nominal charge’ but with so many of them it adds up to a figure no longer ‘nominal’

never mind say Princess,  you can go buy a ‘newly enhanced package’ to get it instead.

Princess say that’s good value for you if you pay more to not get less. Must be true 😏

yes, I know Princess are not the only company treating people like they are idiots with their rubbish marketing spin. I don’t have to like it though. (apologies to those in marketing. I do know not all companies are like this!)

 

if they can behave like this they could suddenly decide the package is $13.50 max for your drinks. You paid for $15? Tough. But not to worry, you can pay that upgrade fee for ‘extra value’

 

this is more than the money. It’s the Principle too

[villauk]

26 minutes ago, JG&Lcruisingnewbies said:

this is more than the money. It’s the Principle too

Definitely.

 

Have you received ‘the’ email yet?

[EDVM96]

10 hours ago, startedwithamouse said:

This isn't real estate.  They can change things as stated in their T&C that YOU, the guest, agrees to in your cruise contract. 

I'm sorry, but you are totally wrong. 

[gah_cruise]

2 hours ago, JG&Lcruisingnewbies said:

 

if they can behave like this they could suddenly decide the package is $13.50 max for your drinks. You paid for $15? Tough. But not to worry, you can pay that upgrade fee for ‘extra value’

 

Agree 100%..... I no longer have any faith in Princess to be honorable and fair......this recent episode clearly demonstrates they don't give a damn ...rest assured that this is the first of many more "tweaks" akin to this in the future.

[Guest ldtr]

6 hours ago, villauk said:

 

That’s exactly what I did but Princess has now changed the goal posts since I paid, in full, for my cruise. So, no, it doesn’t make any difference what you envisage your cruise will cost as it can be totally different by the time you sail.

The question is what is core to the booking and what is incidental.

 

If you buy an airline ticket and between the time you book and the time you fly the airline  changes  what is provided free on the plane, removes a service, or changes prices do you get equally as upset?

 

If you book a hotel and the restaurant raises prices, or stops doing room service.

 

What if the cruise line decided to replace all of the Alfredos with a different specialty venue.

 

Just as with those other examples the recent changes deal with items that are not core to the booking  They are optional incidentals that one may chose to use or not use at the prices.

 

[B_A_H]

5 hours ago, villauk said:

 

That’s exactly what I did but Princess has now changed the goal posts since I paid, in full, for my cruise. So, no, it doesn’t make any difference what you envisage your cruise will cost as it can be totally different by the time you sail.

That's a separate issue actually.  And one that was self-created by Princess.  They could have easily just grandfathered in all those on previous packages.  It would have been easier technically and a ton easier on the onboard staff.  

 

Why they did it is pretty clear. $$$.  I guess goodwill took a back seat to more revenue.  But that in itself should put to bed the discussions about what loyalty is really worth today.  At least to Princess.

 

Looking more broadly, all the mainstream cruise lines are charging for what used to be included, reducing what's provided in quality and/or quantity, jiggering packages to generate more revenue, and charging more for everything.  With the exception of MSC, all the big cruise lines are public companies and their financials are shared and measured broadly.  Those that aren't doing what I shared will have to just so that their profit margins remain competitive.

 

Surrender Dorothy.  The witch won. 😉

 

[gah_cruise]

2 minutes ago, ldtr said:

 

Just as with those other examples the recent changes deal with items that are not core to the booking  They are optional incidentals that one may chose to use or not use at the prices.

 

so...at the moment I have a cruise booked for Sep 2034... I have a Plus package which provides 15 alco drinks per 24-hour period....if in 11 mths' time, after I have paid in full, Princess changes the Plus package to 10 alco drinks per 24 hrs...do you think I have the right to be aggrieved....over to you @ldtr