Queen Elizabeth Aus summer season cancelled from 2026

[Mareblu]

How incredibly myopic and subjective, to judge the culture of an entire population by one very personal experience on one voyage thirty-nine years ago.  My cultural studies units at university years ago reinforced the academic acceptance that nations the world over do indeed exhibit, to a degree, common traits and attitudes, and sadly in many cases, prejudicial observances of "other".  Fortunately, despite the terrible upheaval in our world at present, contemporary communication and awareness is hopefully moving our planet's population towards an acceptance that people are really the same, despite an immersion in tradition, history, and the resulting culture.  I wouldn't dream of labelling all Americans as loud, dressed in gaudy clothing and ignorant of any history, geography or traditions beyond their shores.  Many, sadly, do label Americans that way.  It's an example of the errors of embracing a sweeping view.  I'm sure most Americans would be horrified to realise that.  It is not correct.  With very few notable exceptions, the Americans I have met and bonded with on and beyond the many cruises we have enjoyed, are warm, intelligent and educated fellow humans, keenly interested in our life, as we are in theirs.  I reiterate:  sweeping statements are unwise.

[LittleFish1976]

11 hours ago, WantedOnVoyage said:

I've had the pleasure of sailing from Australia... on the incomparable original ORIANA (1960) from Sydney to Singapore via Melbourne, Adelaide, Fremantle, Indonesia etc back in 1984. Superb ship, delightful passengers (I think I was among six Americans aboard) but sorry, even in the more expensive forward restaurant, the manner of dress was... decidely if not resolutely informal. If you wore a dinner jacket, you were actually ridiculed. And that was.... 40 years ago!

 

I get it. Australia and New Zealand (and yes they are called the Antipodes to my certain knowledge without intent of insult) are very casual in mode of dress. That's fine. Your region, your culture.  But my point re. Cunard basing a ship out of there was it was putting a very dressy, formal product in a market that was not. And yes... it is not my imagination that Cunard's dress code was indeed diminished at precisely the same time. Because it was. 

 

Not that anyone is deluding themselved that  Florida cruising is overall one bit more dressy and traditional than out of Australia.  It's more a sign of the times than geography. 

 

Rather unwise to base one's assessment of sartorial elegance or lack thereof on a single experience of 40 years ago on a one-class P&O cruise ship (which the Oriana was by that stage)!

 

One would not be ridiculed at all for wearing a dinner jacket on a cruise ship in Australia. That's a fabrication, or generalisation, that is just incorrect. I have recent Cunard experience to support that. You personally may have been ridiculed for some reason in 1984 - I would not question your personal experience - but do not generalise that to being the norm.

 

To suggest that our tiny population and single short cruise season with one Cunard ship per year (on the whole) could have influenced - driven! - the company to alter their dress code is, well let's call it, silly.

 

You mention 'traditional' cruising or travelling by sea and also the Oriana (of 1960). That ship actually plied the waters between Southampton and Australia for years after her maiden voyage which was, in fact, that very route (with my family on board the maiden voyage from Southampton to Melbourne, ending a world tour and returning home). There is no lack of tradition here, of sailing long and elegant voyages. In general, the culture in Australia is a lot closer to that of the UK than you may realise.

 

Cunard, as I have said before, is shaping its product for the US market where there is a huge population that is willing to go on many short trips per year.

 

Antipodes just literally means the opposite so there are points in the northern hemisphere which are the antipodes of points in the southern hemisphere. It's often considered by those in the southern hemisphere to be a slightly derogatory term implying colonial inferiority depending on how and by whom it is used.

 

You wrote: 'Personally, I'd be more than content if they exiled QA to the Antipodes or fly cruises from the Med, put QV back where she belongs out of Southampton and had QE out of the US.' 

 

They won't be 'exiling' QA to the 'Antipodes'. They've spent an awful lot of money creating a product aimed at the US market (decor - less English club and more international hotel-style/more like the other huge cruise ships that service the US market; size - big market, big numbers on board).

 

[maggielou362]

Thank you, @LittleFish1976, indeed all locations on the planet have antipodes and using it in the sense that @WantedOnVoyage used is Eurocentric, dated and technically incorrect. When the same contributor mentioned QA being "exiled" to the Asia Pacific region I sense arrogance. Add the inference made by that contributor that dress standards have fallen as a result of passengers from that region being on board is, as @Mareblu stated, myopic, and in my opinion offensive. 

Edited November 6, 2023 by maggielou362

[Blackduck59]

On 11/3/2023 at 5:56 AM, ace2542 said:

You can't shore power? You can't charge up a ship that use 4 GIG a day like charging up car in the driveway? You would need a proper power plant no?

Do you really know anything? Shore power is so the ship can be alongside in a port and not run their generators. Perhaps in future with hybrid technology they could also charge their batteries with shore power. Of course this would only be effective if the shore power is clean energy like hydro-electric power.

[ClipperinSFO]

5 hours ago, ClipperinSFO said:

 

Is QE Panamax, i.e. able to fit through the original locks?

 

Excellent.  I know QE has done Canal transits before, now it looks like there will be more in her future. Count me in, especially since she fits through the old locks!

[bluemarble]

Not meaning to cause more controversy concerning regional stereotypes about dress codes, but I will provide some context about one aspect of the dress code which has changed in recent years. That's the change in the Cunard dress code making it "jacket optional" for gentlemen on Smart Attire evenings.

 

From at least 2017 and perhaps earlier, back when the dress code was called Informal rather than Smart Attire, Cunard provided this dress code definition.

 

"Informal (Jacket Optional):

The Informal (Jacket Optional) dress code amendment applies to Queen Victoria's summer fly Mediterranean season on embarkation days only, in Athens, Barcelona, Rome and Venice. Queen Mary 2 and Queen Elizabeth will continue to have the standard Formal and Informal (Jacket Required) dress codes. The ship's newspaper will confirm the dress code of the day.

 

Guests who have Athens, Barcelona, Rome and Venice as a port during their voyage and are already settled in on board are encouraged to wear a jacket."

 

Then when Cunard began QE's Alaska seasons in 2019, they implemented the same "jacket optional" dress code on embarkations days for QE's Alaskan cruises.

 

Then, perhaps of the most relevance to the current discussion, in December 2019 Cunard changed the dress code to be "jacket optional" across all Smart Attire evenings on QE's Australian cruises. Here's a partial quote from Cunard's communication about that change.

 

"As part of Queen Elizabeth's deployment to Australia, we will be making a number of changes to the on board experience that reflect the Australian region, guests feedback and operational considerations.

 

Dress Code:

 

Effective from 6 December [2019], and in keeping with some of our voyages in warmer climates, the dress code for Australian voyages has been revised to now include jacket optional on Smart Attire evenings, to allow guests to be comfortable during the warmer evenings. Gala Evenings dress code has not changed and guests will still be required to wear a dinner jacket, tuxedo or dark suit for men with a regular tie or bow tie."

 

Finally, with the resumption of service in 2021, Cunard changed the Smart Attire dress code to be "jacket optional" on all itineraries across the fleet.

 

Now I'll leave it for others to conclude what the main driver was for Cunard to first make it "jacket optional" across all Smart Attire evenings on their Australian itineraries and how much that drove the subsequent decision to extend "jacket optional" to all other itineraries. I won't presume to offer an informed opinion about that.

[Blackduck59]

I think Cunard's revised dress code has more to do with the changing norms of society in general. On cruise ships in general with no access to an iron or steamer to make that expensive suit you packed in your grip presentable, you're just going to look like a rumpled fraud. I haven't worn my tux in 10 years and don't know if I ever will again.

I would suggest the slackened dress code has nothing to do with Australia or any other region, it reflects society today. I also think the dress code (or lack thereof) has little to do with the redeployment of the QE, it more represents the perceived future sales for the ship in Australia.

[LittleFish1976]

1 hour ago, bluemarble said:

Effective from 6 December [2019], and in keeping with some of our voyages in warmer climates, the dress code for Australian voyages has been revised to now include jacket optional on Smart Attire evenings, to allow guests to be comfortable during the warmer evenings. Gala Evenings dress code has not changed and guests will still be required to wear a dinner jacket, tuxedo or dark suit for men with a regular tie or bow tie."

 

 

Before you move on John @bluemarble can I draw to your attention some passages from the dress code you quoted. 'In keeping with some of our voyages' would indicate that this practice was already in place elsewhere and not newly instigated for the later-mentioned 'Australia voyages'.

 

Also, please note Cunard's justification of temperature and passenger comfort for the changes. Whatever nationality one is, one is not responsible for the weather. Neither is Australia the hottest nor most humid of places to which Cunard sail.

 

It's all very silly trying to tie Cunard's cruising in Australia/New Zealand with the changes in dress code.

 

However, we will all look forward, with great anticipation, to reports of the blossoming of sartorial enhancements once the QE is sailing regularly from Fort Lauderdale. 😉

 

 

[Victoria2]

12 minutes ago, LittleFish1976 said:

 

Before you move on John @bluemarble can I draw to your attention some passages from the dress code you quoted. 'In keeping with some of our voyages' would indicate that this practice was already in place elsewhere and not newly instigated for the later-mentioned 'Australia voyages'.

 

Also, please note Cunard's justification of temperature and passenger comfort for the changes. Whatever nationality one is, one is not responsible for the weather. Neither is Australia the hottest nor most humid of places to which Cunard sail.

 

It's all very silly trying to tie Cunard's cruising in Australia/New Zealand with the changes in dress code.

 

However, we will all look forward, with great anticipation, to reports of the blossoming of sartorial enhancements once the QE is sailing regularly from Fort Lauderdale. 😉

 

 

I have mentioned in the past, how chaps were actively encouraged to remove jackets in QG when the air con couldn’t cope. I was 'shouted down'  by one or two members, saying it couldn’t happen. Well it did and that was nowhere near Australian waters.

[bluemarble]

4 minutes ago, LittleFish1976 said:

Before you move on John @bluemarble can I draw to your attention some passages from the dress code you quoted. 'In keeping with some of our voyages' would indicate that this practice was already in place elsewhere and not newly instigated for the later-mentioned 'Australia voyages'.

 

Also, please note Cunard's justification of temperature and passenger comfort for the changes. Whatever nationality one is, one is not responsible for the weather. Neither is Australia the hottest nor most humid of places to which Cunard sail.

 

It's all very silly trying to tie Cunard's cruising in Australia/New Zealand with the changes in dress code.

 

However, we will all look forward, with great anticipation, to reports of the blossoming of sartorial enhancements once the QE is sailing regularly from Fort Lauderdale. 😉

 

OK, you've drawn me back in, if only to comment on a couple of the points you've mentioned as I see them. Again my intention is not to cause any more controversy.

 

That quote "In keeping with some of our voyages in warmer climates" is inaccurate in my view. To my knowledge, the only warmer climates where they intoduced a jacket optional dress code was in connection with the previously mentioned policy, only on embarkation days, for those joining Mediterranean fly cruises on Queen Victoria. Now perhaps there were other warm weather cruises where a jacket optional policy was introduced on an ad-hoc basis, but as far as I know, that was not previously stated as the standard policy anywhere.

 

Cunard's explanation that the jacket optional change was being made for Australian cruises because of the warm weather was met with some skepticism on this forum at the time. The ship is air-conditioned and as you say, Australia is not the hottest or most humid of Cunard's destinations.

[Victoria2]

2 minutes ago, bluemarble said:

 

OK, you've drawn me back in, if only to comment on a couple of the points you've mentioned as I see them. Again my intention is not to cause any more controversy.

 

That quote "In keeping with some of our voyages in warmer climates" is inaccurate in my view. To my knowledge, the only warmer climates where they intoduced a jacket optional dress code was in connection with the previously mentioned policy, only on embarkation days, for those joining Mediterranean fly cruises on Queen Victoria. Now perhaps there were other warm weather cruises where a jacket optional policy was introduced on an ad-hoc basis, but as far as I know, that was not previously stated as the standard policy anywhere.

 

Cunard's explanation that the jacket optional change was being made for Australian cruises because of the warm weather was met with some skepticism on this forum at the time. The ship is air-conditioned and as you say, Australia is not the hottest or most humid of Cunard's destinations.

The ship is air-conditioned

 

The ships are, as you say, air-conditioned. Unfortunately, there are occasions when the air-con isn't sufficient to create a pleasant temperature and jacket removal was encouraged or at least tacit approval was given to those whose chairs became jacket wearers, pre 'Jacket Optional'.

[maggielou362]

 🤣classy and tasteful chairs looking smart in their jackets!

[Victoria2]

12 minutes ago, maggielou362 said:

 🤣classy and tasteful chairs looking smart in their jackets!

Of course. This IS Cunard, after all!🙂

[foodsvcmgr]

With the regional temperature justification/excuse, clearly the Caribbean will be a lax dress code on casual nights.

What the passengers actually wear will remain to be seen.

I suspect it won’t be much different in reality, with so much competition in the Caribbean market hopefully those choosing Cunard will be fully informed about its traditions and interested in maintaining them.

[57eric]

1 hour ago, foodsvcmgr said:

With the regional temperature justification/excuse, clearly the Caribbean will be a lax dress code on casual nights.

What the passengers actually wear will remain to be seen.

I suspect it won’t be much different in reality, with so much competition in the Caribbean market hopefully those choosing Cunard will be fully informed about its traditions and interested in maintaining them.

I thoroughly disagree.  It does not "remain to be seen".  Cunard operates in the Caribbean today, and dress standards are at least very good, if not better.

[NE John]

34 minutes ago, 57eric said:

I thoroughly disagree.  It does not "remain to be seen".  Cunard operates in the Caribbean today, and dress standards are at least very good, if not better.

I agree with you about how the Cunard dress code operates today, however what works with a proper QM2 Caribbean dress code may take on a different vibe with QA. My concern centers on Cunard trying to carve out QA as a more relaxed ship, dress code wise - - Especially in Caribbean. 
For the record, I have sported my white DJ on a Caribbean cruise and I loved it!

[exlondoner]

5 minutes ago, NE John said:

I agree with you about how the Cunard dress code operates today, however what works with a proper QM2 Caribbean dress code may take on a different vibe with QA. My concern centers on Cunard trying to carve out QA as a more relaxed ship, dress code wise - - Especially in Caribbean. 
For the record, I have sported my white DJ on a Caribbean cruise and I loved it!

I thought QE was the one going to the Caribbean, not QA?

[NE John]

13 minutes ago, exlondoner said:

I thought QE was the one going to the Caribbean, not QA?

Stand corrected. I may be worried about too many ships!

[foodsvcmgr]

As I stated, I am not really expecting that much change in actual evening dress regardless of Cunard loosening the code for the Caribbean or not.

Hopefully the mix of experienced and new passengers are all interested in and respectful of Cunard traditions.

Travel agents need to be proactive and be sure new cruisers understand the product.

[Victoria2]

I think too many people are worrying about something which hasn't happened.

 

The sky was about to fall in once 'smart attire/no jacket required' was introduced.

 

Result? On my QV cruises so far, the majority of passengers looked pretty smart and the Gala evenings were almost all black tie in QG. I say QG as that was my dining experience but I have no reason to think the other restaurants weren't just as glamorous.

 

 

[foodsvcmgr]

Victoria - on the QV - British Isles - 20 August this year Britannia was also almost completely black tie on formal nights, so pretty much universal compliance.

Merely speculating about QE, not worried as I will be booking as soon as schedules are released.

The next speculation is cruise lengths, departure port(s), and itineraries……

[NE John]

5 hours ago, Victoria2 said:

I think too many people are worrying about something which hasn't happened.

 

The sky was about to fall in once 'smart attire/no jacket required' was introduced.

 

Result? On my QV cruises so far, the majority of passengers looked pretty smart and the Gala evenings were almost all black tie in QG. I say QG as that was my dining experience but I have no reason to think the other restaurants weren't just as glamorous.

 

 

You always “right” things properly when I get caught up in speculation. 

[maggielou362]

So now I have heard it straight from the horse's mouth.

I have just received an email from Cunard stating that:

"...However, in 2025/2026, Queen Elizabeth will explore new shores as part of an exciting programme across our four Queens we will be launching next year. Rest assured, Australia and New Zealand will continue being important destinations for Cunard on our World Voyages offering close to home sailings on a Cunard Queen."

I was hoping it wasn't so!

Looks like we will only be able to join in as "add-ons" to part of any World Tours, which might head to our region, probably relatively infrequently.

So disappointed!

[LittleFish1976]

38 minutes ago, maggielou362 said:

So now I have heard it straight from the horse's mouth.

I have just received an email from Cunard stating that:

"...However, in 2025/2026, Queen Elizabeth will explore new shores as part of an exciting programme across our four Queens we will be launching next year. Rest assured, Australia and New Zealand will continue being important destinations for Cunard on our World Voyages offering close to home sailings on a Cunard Queen."

I was hoping it wasn't so!

Looks like we will only be able to join in as "add-ons" to part of any World Tours, which might head to our region, probably relatively infrequently.

So disappointed!

 

More horse's mouth in below link to Cruise Weekly. About page two or three from the start of the link. Lots of use of the word 'exciting'. I have yet to speak to anyone local who is 'excited' by the new developments. (yes I know there are people on this board in North America who are happy but I am referring to the people adversely affected by the changes).

 

 

https://issues.cruiseweekly.com.au/2023/Nov23/cw061123.pdf?_gl=1*18czub9*_ga*MTkwNjYxMDY2My4xNjk5MzIzMzM4*_ga_WL0T2ZPBQN*MTY5OTMyMzMzOC4xLjEuMTY5OTMyMzMzOC42MC4wLjA.&_ga=2.42852261.1436909725.1699323338-1906610663.1699323338

[ace2542]

8 hours ago, maggielou362 said:

So now I have heard it straight from the horse's mouth.

I have just received an email from Cunard stating that:

"...However, in 2025/2026, Queen Elizabeth will explore new shores as part of an exciting programme across our four Queens we will be launching next year. Rest assured, Australia and New Zealand will continue being important destinations for Cunard on our World Voyages offering close to home sailings on a Cunard Queen."

I was hoping it wasn't so!

Looks like we will only be able to join in as "add-ons" to part of any World Tours, which might head to our region, probably relatively infrequently.

So disappointed!

If it is not because of emissions issues - which very few ships would meet if QE doesn't I am sure - then you have to wonder why they are doing it. If it is a demand issue then the question and I think an honest question is there demand for 3 -4 queens in Western Europe/Eastern Med/East Coast of the USA?