Cruise cancellation question

[Catgirl50]

We booked an Oceania Mediterranean cruise which was scheduled to leave Haifa on May 29, 2024 and end in Barcelona on June 11. Then the hostilities in the Middle East started and first the cruise line changed the itinerary to eliminate Israel and start in Trieste. I thought it was a bit soon to make the change 6 months before departure, but ok. Then last week, Oceania sent out an email saying they are cancelling the entire cruise, referencing the situation in the .Red Sea. Once again I was surprised because the revised itinerary would take us nowhere near the .Red Sea, But now I had booked flights which the airlines would not refund, only giving credit vouchers, and they charged cancellation fees besides. Our trip insurance carrier informed us that cancellation by a cruise line due to war is an exclusion under the policy. Oceania is promising 100% refunds for the cruise, plus up to $300 per person allowances for flight cancellation fees incurred , with proof. However, I don’t know if I will be able to use the vouchers in the next year, and I don’t know how long it will take for Oceania to issue the refunds. Is anyone else in this predicament with this particular cruise ?  

[leaveitallbehind]

As your question is specific to Oceania, I would suggest also posting this on that board to get responses from others who may be on that specific itinerary.  Here is that link:

https://boards.cruisecritic.com/forum/29-oceania-cruises/

 

 

Edited February 24 by leaveitallbehind

[CDNPolar]

6 hours ago, Catgirl50 said:

But now I had booked flights which the airlines would not refund, only giving credit vouchers, and they charged cancellation fees besides. 

 

Sorry that this is happening to you but unfortunately this is and may continue to be a reality in our world moving forward.  Conflict is happening or is possible just about anywhere.

 

When we book cruises, we book 12-18-24 months out.  We have cruises booked for 2024, 2025, and 2026.

 

We book our air about 300 days out and although we do pay higher fares, we book air that has a cancelation for a small cost.  A recent $7000.00 air fare for two of us had to be cancelled and we were only on the hook for $200 per person.  We got back $6,600.00 (Cash not voucher) from the airline.

 

What we have found in doing this is that the increase in airfare is roughly (sometimes) the equivalent to buying cancellation insurance.  But, in your case the insurance does not cover the reason, and in this case we could cancel for any reason.

 

We also do book air (sometimes) through our cruise line, and if the cruise line cancels the cruise, then the air is also refunded or added to the voucher.

 

We had friends recently have a very similar thing happen, and they turned around and found an alternate land destination that the airline flew to and booked the same dates on land.  Perhaps this could be what you could do?

Edited February 24 by CDNPolar

[Hlitner]

We have very little history with O, since they drastically changed the itinerary (less than 3 weeks prior to the cruise) and immediately had the position of no refunds (only a future cruise credit).  In our case the changes (including a big change in debarkation port) was partially blamed on COVID and the policies of Peru.  By using some leverage of our cruise agency (who is a member of a huge and influential consortium) and appealing all the way to the executive offices, we were able to get a refund.  As to air (which was an expensive business class flight) O was not at all helpful.  Fortunately, the airline (Delta) took pity on us (I guess they are familiar with O) and did make us whole.

 

I do have a couple of suggestions.  If you are using a travel/cruise agency, ask them to push the issue with O and also write your own e-mail/letter to their executive offices.   Failing that, try to get the help of a well-known travel ombudsman, Elliott.org.  Chistopher Elliott and his staff have helped many travelers navigate these kind of issues.

 

Hank

[Vertygo]

Is the voucher a Future Cruise Credit? If so, you may be required to book within 12 months, but chosen cruise can be a year or 2 after.

Check with your TA. 

[clo]

6 hours ago, CDNPolar said:

We had friends recently have a very similar thing happen, and they turned around and found an alternate land destination that the airline flew to and booked the same dates on land.  Perhaps this could be what you could do?

I think that's a superb suggestion.

[Hlitner]

1 hour ago, Vertygo said:

Is the voucher a Future Cruise Credit? If so, you may be required to book within 12 months, but chosen cruise can be a year or 2 after.

Check with your TA. 

The problem many of us have with cancelled/changed cruises is that we are often stuck with expensive air that is not eligible for any refund.  While many (not all) airlines will be willing to issue a voucher, they are airline-specific and generally good for only one year (often from the date of purchase of the original ticket).  As part of our own push for some consumer protection for cruisers, we think that cruise lines that cancel (or make major changes) to cruises within 330 days of the cruise should make customers "financially whole" unless the cancellation is clearly for reasons beyond the control of the cruise line (such as a war).  

 

Crusiers that purchase air are acting in good faith based on a cruise reservation!  That reservation is actually a valid contract, but the cruise lines have contractual language that gives them nearly unlimited rights to do as they please!  When a cruise line cancels/changes a cruise inside the 330 day (airline ticketing period) for the simple reason that they can, they are not acting in good faith.  A good example would be any cruise line that decides to charter a cruise and does not make that decision until inside the 330 day period.  The line does this because it enhances its own finanical position, but they do not give a darn how much financial harm they do to their loyal customers who booked a cruise far in advance.

 

Hank

[1985rz1]

18 minutes ago, Hlitner said:

The problem many of us have with cancelled/changed cruises is that we are often stuck with expensive air that is not eligible for any refund.  While many (not all) airlines will be willing to issue a voucher, they are airline-specific and generally good for only one year (often from the date of purchase of the original ticket).  As part of our own push for some consumer protection for cruisers, we think that cruise lines that cancel (or make major changes) to cruises within 330 days of the cruise should make customers "financially whole" unless the cancellation is clearly for reasons beyond the control of the cruise line (such as a war).  

 

Crusiers that purchase air are acting in good faith based on a cruise reservation!  That reservation is actually a valid contract, but the cruise lines have contractual language that gives them nearly unlimited rights to do as they please!  When a cruise line cancels/changes a cruise inside the 330 day (airline ticketing period) for the simple reason that they can, they are not acting in good faith.  A good example would be any cruise line that decides to charter a cruise and does not make that decision until inside the 330 day period.  The line does this because it enhances its own finanical position, but they do not give a darn how much financial harm they do to their loyal customers who booked a cruise far in advance.

 

Hank

Aren't the airlines the ones that should be trageted, rather than the cruise line.  Shouldn't' they be forced to give a full refund if the reason for cancellation is not the whim of the passengers, but because the cruise is cancelled? I think the airlines feel they are entitled to keep your money even if you were forced by other trip circumstances.  

 

Wishful thinking🙄

Edited February 24 by 1985rz1

[Hlitner]

12 minutes ago, 1985rz1 said:

Aren't the airlines the ones that should be trageted, rather than the cruise line.  Shouldn't' they be forced to give a full refund if the reason for cancellation is not the whim of the passengers, but because the cruise is cancelled? I think the airlines feel they are entitled to keep your money even if you were forced by other trip circumstances.  

 

Wishful thinking🙄

Some airlines, do quietly make exceptions to their rules.  When we felt compelled to cancel our O Marina cruise (because O's last minute change of debarkation from Lima to Santiago was very problamatic) we were sitting on Delta Business Class tickets paid for with lots of miles and some fees/taxes.  When we explained the situation to Delta, they not only refunded all of our miles (they would have likely done this in any case) but also decided to refund all the fees/taxes to our credit card (they had no obligation to do this).  

 

But you need to realize that Delta has a pretty good reputation of doing this kind of thing, but they are the exception.  Other US airlines and most foreign operators are not as nice.  There are over 5000 airlines (around the world) and they each have their own rules, rules enforced by their own governments, international rules, and issues with their own alliances (i.e. code shares) which also complicate things.  Expecting them to take a hit because of various cruise lines is a nice thought, but not reasonable.  The airline can simply say, "you had to right to buy fully refundable tickets and made the choice not to do so."  Most folks do not even look at the cost of fully refundable airline tickets, but the cost can really be shocking when compared to non-refundable tickets (which is now the norm).  

 

Hank

[thebsinmiss]

When you buy a ticket you have the option of paying a premium for the ability to get a full refund. In effect you are buying "cancel for any reason" insurance from the airline.  They sell you a ticket to travel on a specific date and at a specific time (yeah right !).   They are willing to full fill the contract it is the traveler that decides (for good reasons that may have been at no fault of the traveler) to cancel.

 

We got snookered by O changing our debarkation port and I had to pay the airline 150.00 per passenger to change the flights to the new port city. My bad, I bought the "cheapest" type of ticket which unfortunately for us is now not the cheapest ticket.

 

Its unfortunate but I rolled the dice and lost. 

[Tranquility Base]

6 minutes ago, thebsinmiss said:

When you buy a ticket you have the option of paying a premium for the ability to get a full refund. In effect you are buying "cancel for any reason" insurance from the airline. 

Many of the airfares I purchase when flying to join / leave a cruise have a small fee for cancellation.

Usually less than 5%, certainly it's a small amount in relation to the overall cost of the entire trip.

As you say, it's an insurance policy.

It's a personal choice which I take.

 

[daydreamer62]

22 minutes ago, thebsinmiss said:

When you buy a ticket you have the option of paying a premium for the ability to get a full refund. In effect you are buying "cancel for any reason" insurance from the airline.  They sell you a ticket to travel on a specific date and at a specific time (yeah right !).   They are willing to full fill the contract it is the traveler that decides (for good reasons that may have been at no fault of the traveler) to cancel.

 

We got snookered by O changing our debarkation port and I had to pay the airline 150.00 per passenger to change the flights to the new port city. My bad, I bought the "cheapest" type of ticket which unfortunately for us is now not the cheapest ticket.

 

Its unfortunate but I rolled the dice and lost. 

This is the reality of the situation. It's buyer beware really. We also were affected by the cancellation of a cruise because the ship could not make it to the embarkation point due to having to reroute. When I had originally booked my fares I could have saved a hundred dollars by buying non refundable non changeable fares but I chose the next fare class up which allowed changes with a fee. Oceania offered $300ppUS toward flight changes. The replacement cruise I chose had an earlier start date andv end date and different locations completely. We decided to keep our return flight as it was and change the initial flight which cost us just under that$300. We could have cancelled totally and rebooked for under the $300 . 

I've been bitten before with a large fee  with a non cruise holiday where an event we were going to in the UK  had a date change after we had booked flights so I never choose non refundable flights. Even if travel insurance might cover it, if just less hassle to be prepared for all eventualities.

[Snaefell3]

14 hours ago, Catgirl50 said:

Once again I was surprised because the revised itinerary would take us nowhere near the .Red Sea,

If it's the cruise I'm thinking of, it's not because it's going to the Houthi-interdicted area, it's because the ship can't get to you in time without transiting Bab el Mandab.

[Catgirl50]

Unfortunately, we were not interested in the itineraries of the alternate cruises O offered. Besides, they were all within a couple of months of our cruise and their rep told me there’s no guarantee those won’t be cancelled as well. So we decided to vacation in the Caribbean instead, where the airlines we’re getting vouchers for don’t fly. I’m hoping we can use our vouchers in Europe before next June. Next time I’ll take the advice to pay a premium for cancellation for any reason, or get trip insurance with that coverage.

[Tranquility Base]

1 hour ago, 1985rz1 said:

Aren't the airlines the ones that should be trageted, rather than the cruise line.  Shouldn't' they be forced to give a full refund if the reason for cancellation is not the whim of the passengers, but because the cruise is cancelled?

That's why they provide the option of refundable or changeable fare options for the passenger to purchase if they wish.

[Catgirl50]

El Al readily refunded our airfare less $270 per ticket, which I was able to get reimbursed by Oceania, but TAP Portugal and Vueling Airlines so far are only giving us vouchers, plus a cancellation fee. I agree the airlines should give refunds for cancellations not caused by the passengers .

[Snaefell3]

The quiet CLIA policy is "If it's the cruise line's fault, it's the cruise line's business to make good.  If it's not the cruise line's fault (weather, war, civil unrest, etc) it's for the pax to have their own insurance."

 

You'll hear the folks from the UK bemoaning the higher-than-the-rest-of-the-world prices they pay on that same exact sailing.  That's because Brit fares are required to include BATA insurance to cover weather, war, etc.

[cruiserchuck]

1 hour ago, Hlitner said:

Delta, they not only refunded all of our miles (they would have likely done this in any case) but also decided to refund all the fees/taxes to our credit card (they had no obligation to do this).  

 

We just booked economy award travel with American, and they allow you to cancel the tickets at any time prior to departure, and with no charge will reinstate the miles and refund the fees/taxes.  I believe Delta's policy is similar for flights departing from the US.

[clo]

1 hour ago, Hlitner said:

Some airlines, do quietly make exceptions to their rules.  When we felt compelled to cancel our O Marina cruise (because O's last minute change of debarkation from Lima to Santiago was very problamatic) we were sitting on Delta Business Class tickets paid for with lots of miles and some fees/taxes.  When we explained the situation to Delta, they not only refunded all of our miles (they would have likely done this in any case) but also decided to refund all the fees/taxes to our credit card (they had no obligation to do this).  

 

But you need to realize that Delta has a pretty good reputation of doing this kind of thing, but they are the exception.  Other US airlines and most foreign operators are not as nice.  There are over 5000 airlines (around the world) and they each have their own rules, rules enforced by their own governments, international rules, and issues with their own alliances (i.e. code shares) which also complicate things.  Expecting them to take a hit because of various cruise lines is a nice thought, but not reasonable.  The airline can simply say, "you had to right to buy fully refundable tickets and made the choice not to do so."  Most folks do not even look at the cost of fully refundable airline tickets, but the cost can really be shocking when compared to non-refundable tickets (which is now the norm).  

 

Hank

We didn't travel intl for three years due to covid so our 'award miles' got nice and big. So a flight 5/23 and the one coming up 7/24 are 'letting us have' Polaris J class to Europe. When we have to start buying such things it's going to be something else to think about. I do like the idea of planning a land trip to the same area(s).

[clo]

1 hour ago, thebsinmiss said:

When you buy a ticket you have the option of paying a premium for the ability to get a full refund. In effect you are buying "cancel for any reason" insurance from the airline.  They sell you a ticket to travel on a specific date and at a specific time (yeah right !).   They are willing to full fill the contract it is the traveler that decides (for good reasons that may have been at no fault of the traveler) to cancel.

 

We got snookered by O changing our debarkation port and I had to pay the airline 150.00 per passenger to change the flights to the new port city. My bad, I bought the "cheapest" type of ticket which unfortunately for us is now not the cheapest ticket.

 

Its unfortunate but I rolled the dice and lost. 

Excellent point. Thanks.

[daydreamer62]

2 hours ago, Catgirl50 said:

Unfortunately, we were not interested in the itineraries of the alternate cruises O offered. Besides, they were all within a couple of months of our cruise and their rep told me there’s no guarantee those won’t be cancelled as well. So we decided to vacation in the Caribbean instead, where the airlines we’re getting vouchers for don’t fly. I’m hoping we can use our vouchers in Europe before next June. Next time I’ll take the advice to pay a premium for cancellation for any reason, or get trip insurance with that coverage.

It's pretty easy to tell which may be cancelled. Those where the ship is on the Asian side of the red sea. The ships that come across the Atlantic aren't affected. But if the itineraries of those  aren't your cup of tea then that's a moot point . We were lucky that our 2nd choice if itinerary after the one that was cancelled was actually on sale so we'll nabbed that

[osandomir]

8 hours ago, Hlitner said:

Some airlines, do quietly make exceptions to their rules.  When we felt compelled to cancel our O Marina cruise (because O's last minute change of debarkation from Lima to Santiago was very problamatic) we were sitting on Delta Business Class tickets paid for with lots of miles and some fees/taxes.  When we explained the situation to Delta, they not only refunded all of our miles (they would have likely done this in any case) but also decided to refund all the fees/taxes to our credit card (they had no obligation to do this).  

 

But you need to realize that Delta has a pretty good reputation of doing this kind of thing, but they are the exception.  Other US airlines and most foreign operators are not as nice.  There are over 5000 airlines (around the world) and they each have their own rules, rules enforced by their own governments, international rules, and issues with their own alliances (i.e. code shares) which also complicate things.  Expecting them to take a hit because of various cruise lines is a nice thought, but not reasonable.  The airline can simply say, "you had to right to buy fully refundable tickets and made the choice not to do so."  Most folks do not even look at the cost of fully refundable airline tickets, but the cost can really be shocking when compared to non-refundable tickets (which is now the norm).  

 

Hank

When we book with miles and then cancel both United and American always return all taxes paid for reservation after airline miles are redeposited.

[1985rz1]

2 minutes ago, osandomir said:

When we book with miles and then cancel both United and American always return all taxes paid for reservation after airline miles are redeposited.

I don't think the issue is with tickets bought on miles.  Generally, the mileS and taxes have been refunded.

 

The issue is with ticket bought with $.  In this case, the airlines bulk at refunds for any reason, unless you have purchased a refundable ticket.  Airlines are upfront about it (and there are rare examples of when special exceptions can be made , and refunds are not permitted.  The more insidious rule, is that any credit for future use must be used within one year of the purchase date, not one one year from the cancelled flight date.  This rule really hits folks who purchase early To get a good fare.

[osandomir]

20 minutes ago, 1985rz1 said:

I don't think the issue is with tickets bought on miles.  Generally, the mileS and taxes have been refunded.

 

The issue is with ticket bought with $.  In this case, the airlines bulk at refunds for any reason, unless you have purchased a refundable ticket.  Airlines are upfront about it (and there are rare examples of when special exceptions can be made , and refunds are not permitted.  The more insidious rule, is that any credit for future use must be used within one year of the purchase date, not one one year from the cancelled flight date.  This rule really hits folks who purchase early To get a good fare.

Definitely, cancelling the revenue tickets is a much more complicated matter. The post I was replying to was about the air tickets booked with miles. I was just saying that Delta probably didn’t do much of a favour to the poster on the award tickets return compared to the other major airlines that I mentioned.

[Catgirl50]

29 minutes ago, 1985rz1 said:

I don't think the issue is with tickets bought on miles.  Generally, the mileS and taxes have been refunded.

 

The issue is with ticket bought with $.  In this case, the airlines bulk at refunds for any reason, unless you have purchased a refundable ticket.  Airlines are upfront about it (and there are rare examples of when special exceptions can be made , and refunds are not permitted.  The more insidious rule, is that any credit for future use must be used within one year of the purchase date, not one one year from the cancelled flight date.  This rule really hits folks who purchase early To get a good fare.

 When I contacted Vueling, the Portuguese airline we were to return to NY from Barcelona , I was put in touch with a person who mediates disputes for the airline, and he arranged the credit voucher and the one year is from the date of our flight,  not the purchase date, so I suppose I should be grateful.