Can prepaid gratuities be removed once you're on the ship?

[stuart2468]

On 3/2/2024 at 5:08 PM, tserface said:

We were in London... but that is England right 🙂

London is very much 'in' England, however London is not England, nor is it very representative of the rest of England/UK. 

 

So, making the comment about almost all restaurants add the service charge, and that it's obligatory, completely incorrect. 

 

I'd highly advise expanding the destinations within the UK, and visit places outside of London. Far nicer, far friendlier, far cheaper and better still, you decide what your service charge is. Win win 😜

[gavvy]

1 hour ago, d9704011 said:

Thanks for the unnecessary lecture.  

more pointing out the obvious- but you are very welcome

[d9704011]

7 minutes ago, gavvy said:

more pointing out the obvious- but you are very welcome

Why don't they include taxes and fees in the cost of the cruise rather than tack them on at the last?

[LittleJoefromKokomo]

17 hours ago, d9704011 said:

Why don't they include taxes and fees in the cost of the cruise rather than tack them on at the last?

This I also find funny and strange from a European perspective. To say you can get the drink package for $60 + 18% tax is strange, just as paying $9 for a beer+ 18% tax is strange IMHO when no one can get it for that price. All need to pay $70.8for the drink package or $10.62 for the beer. Why say a lesser price then when that is not the actual cost?

 

I see the point in knowing how much is tax and what is the price but when saying how much it costs or I paid for it it is pointless to point out the tax since tax is required and not volontary.

 

Same as in goin to a hotel in Las Vegas and saying that a the room cost $70 when it costs $70+ tax+ $50 resort fee + tax = lots more than $130 in total. It is actually a bit missleading IMO.

Now I am used to most discussions on Cruise or Vegas forums are US based but it doesn't really make sense to me.

[UNCFanatik]

On 3/2/2024 at 11:06 AM, S.A.M.J.R. said:

OK, when you tip at restaurants, you do so one of two ways...

Cash Leaving cash on the table, you have no idea what happens to it.  Maybe the server picks it up, maybe the bus boy picks it up, maybe the hostess does.  Even if you hand cash to the server, you have no idea what they do with it.  They may keep it all, or they may "share" with others.

Credit Card.  You REALLY have no idea how the company disperses it.  Just like on a cruise.  

 

Yes, servers tip out to different people in some restaurants. 

 

With Credit cards, a bill is presented, the server swipes the credit card in the POS system and then when the customer leaves the tip, the server pulls up the check on the POS system and enters the tip. The server gets a printout of their Credit card tips and the company pays them their tips. If the company doesnt pay them their tips then the servers can take legal action. Not "Just like on a Cruise"

[d9704011]

5 minutes ago, LittleJoefromKokomo said:

This I also find funny and strange from a European perspective. To say you can get the drink package for $60 + 18% tax is strange, just as paying $9 for a beer+ 18% tax is strange IMHO when no one can get it for that price. All need to pay $70.8for the drink package or $10.62 for the beer. Why say a lesser price then when that is not the actual cost?

 

I see the point in knowing how much is tax and what is the price but when saying how much it costs or I paid for it it is pointless to point out the tax since tax is required and not volontary.

 

Same as in goin to a hotel in Las Vegas and saying that a the room cost $70 when it costs $70+ tax+ $50 resort fee + tax = lots more than $130 in total. It is actually a bit missleading IMO.

Now I am used to most discussions on Cruise or Vegas forums are US based but it doesn't really make sense to me.

Let's not lose track of what the thread topic is though... removing pre-paid gratuities once onboard.  We sort of diverged from this once the idea of including gratuities in the base cost of the cruise was introduced; there are a host of opinions on that but it ignores the topic.  I didn't help keeping things on track by introducing taxes and fees... I just wanted to try and make a point about the visibility of all the additional charges a passenger will/may be subject to when booking.

[kirtihk]

3 hours ago, d9704011 said:

Let's not lose track of what the thread topic is though... removing pre-paid gratuities once onboard.  We sort of diverged from this once the idea of including gratuities in the base cost of the cruise was introduced; there are a host of opinions on that but it ignores the topic.  I didn't help keeping things on track by introducing taxes and fees... I just wanted to try and make a point about the visibility of all the additional charges a passenger will/may be subject to when booking.

It's still related to the topic, because if the price just a real total price (without multiple combined invoice accounting-like" items including gratuities/tips/service charge/crew appreciation charge/or whatever else name might be), there would be no threads like this topic.  There would be nothing to remove.  And if some people would complain about not having a choice to remove/adjust tips, eventually after couple years that mentality would fade away on its own, anyway (like no one asks anymore "why isn't food served in economy class tickets on domestic flights?").

[d9704011]

1 hour ago, kirtihk said:

It's still related to the topic, because if the price just a real total price (without multiple combined invoice accounting-like" items including gratuities/tips/service charge/crew appreciation charge/or whatever else name might be), there would be no threads like this topic.  There would be nothing to remove.  And if some people would complain about not having a choice to remove/adjust tips, eventually after couple years that mentality would fade away on its own, anyway (like no one asks anymore "why isn't food served in economy class tickets on domestic flights?").

OK....

[S.A.M.J.R.]

6 hours ago, UNCFanatik said:

 

Yes, servers tip out to different people in some restaurants. 

 

With Credit cards, a bill is presented, the server swipes the credit card in the POS system and then when the customer leaves the tip, the server pulls up the check on the POS system and enters the tip. The server gets a printout of their Credit card tips and the company pays them their tips. If the company doesnt pay them their tips then the servers can take legal action. Not "Just like on a Cruise"

The point is the customer doesn't know what happens after the money has left their pocket.  The server can keep it all, they can share it with others.  The folks who say "I want to give cash so I know who gets it" are just fooling themselves. 

[Ocean Boy]

3 hours ago, S.A.M.J.R. said:

The point is the customer doesn't know what happens after the money has left their pocket.  The server can keep it all, they can share it with others.  The folks who say "I want to give cash so I know who gets it" are just fooling themselves. 

Those folks are not fooling anyone as you claim, especially themselves. The guest hands the money to whom they want to have it. It then becomes that person's money. What they keep, who they tip out, or how they spend it is their business and none of mine or anyone else's.

[cruiseguy1016]

I'm Diamond and I leave a tip for all of my Diamond drinks. I don't know, nor do I care where that money ends up. It could stay with the server that delivered it. It could go to the bartender that poured it (sometimes they're the same person). It could go to the person that washes the glass it was poured in. It could go to the person that schedules the staff hours. Like I said, I don't know and I don't care and quite frankly it's none of my business. I leave the tip, it's not my responsibility to figure out how/if it's divided up.

[QTBabyNurse]

I have been cruising since I was a travel agent in the 1980s. What has happened to cruise passengers in that period of time that we have gone from appreciating the hard work of those cruise staff who "serve us" to...how can I "stiff" those who work very hard to help us enjoy our cruise vacation??

So many on this thread seem to have an air of "elitism" about them. What happened to kindness and generosity and thinking of others and showing appreciation for their hard work? 

 

It's rather disturbing the shift of attitude over the years. 
 

[UNCFanatik]

8 minutes ago, QTBabyNurse said:

I have been cruising since I was a travel agent in the 1980s. What has happened to cruise passengers in that period of time that we have gone from appreciating the hard work of those cruise staff who "serve us" to...how can I "stiff" those who work very hard to help us enjoy our cruise vacation??

So many on this thread seem to have an air of "elitism" about them. What happened to kindness and generosity and thinking of others and showing appreciation for their hard work? 

 

It's rather disturbing the shift of attitude over the years. 
 

 

When I cruise, I typically purchase the drink package in cruise planner before I sail. Of course, Royal deems it necessary to add a mandatory 18% "gratuity" on top of that purchase months before service is ever delivered. And what happens to this 18%? Who gets it? Do they track every where I get a drink and distribute that "gratuity" to those bartenders? What happens when I am at Coco Cay using drink package with 2 ships in port the bartenders are from different ships? Who gets that money? 

 

What has happened to Cruise Lines that charge you a mandatory fee before service is delivered? 

 

Used to be the Cruise lines delivered more service, like cleaning room twice a day. What has happened to the cruise lines where they cut service and raise the daily auto gratuity?

 

There is no air of elitism here. Cruise passengers work hard as well in order to afford to cruise. Demand for cruising is at an all time high. Royal keeps raising pricing in response. Choosing to cruise over another form of vacation is showing my kindness and generosity. No one is "stiffing" anyone. Again, take that up with the cruise lines. Petition them to change their business model and do away with auto gratuities and just bake them into the cost of a cruise and let the free market sort it out

[not-enough-cruising]

1 hour ago, UNCFanatik said:

 

When I cruise, I typically purchase the drink package in cruise planner before I sail. Of course, Royal deems it necessary to add a mandatory 18% "gratuity" on top of that purchase months before service is ever delivered. And what happens to this 18%? Who gets it? Do they track every where I get a drink and distribute that "gratuity" to those bartenders? What happens when I am at Coco Cay using drink package with 2 ships in port the bartenders are from different ships? Who gets that money? 

 

What has happened to Cruise Lines that charge you a mandatory fee before service is delivered? 

 

Used to be the Cruise lines delivered more service, like cleaning room twice a day. What has happened to the cruise lines where they cut service and raise the daily auto gratuity?

 

There is no air of elitism here. Cruise passengers work hard as well in order to afford to cruise. Demand for cruising is at an all time high. Royal keeps raising pricing in response. Choosing to cruise over another form of vacation is showing my kindness and generosity. No one is "stiffing" anyone. Again, take that up with the cruise lines. Petition them to change their business model and do away with auto gratuities and just bake them into the cost of a cruise and let the free market sort it out

Excellently articulated. 
 

Side note: interesting AMA on Reddit addressing some of these tip distribution questions. 
 

 

[S.A.M.J.R.]

13 hours ago, Ocean Boy said:

Those folks are not fooling anyone as you claim, especially themselves. The guest hands the money to whom they want to have it. It then becomes that person's money. What they keep, who they tip out, or how they spend it is their business and none of mine or anyone else's.

As you indicated, the customer doesn't know what happens to the money and it's really none of their business.  Glad you agree with me! 👍

[Ocean Boy]

1 minute ago, S.A.M.J.R. said:

As you indicated, the customer doesn't know what happens to the money and it's really none of their business.  Glad you agree with me! 👍

Spin things however you want as it makes little difference to me.

[QTBabyNurse]

7 hours ago, UNCFanatik said:

There is no air of elitism here. Cruise passengers work hard as well in order to afford to cruise. Demand for cruising is at an all time high. Petition them to change their business model and do away with auto gratuities and just bake them into the cost of a cruise and let the free market sort it out

Thank you for proving my point about the "air of elitism" I spoke of. 

It is not up to the cruise lines to change their business model. You either accept how the cruise lines conduct their business or you find another form of vacation. Who are YOU to decide how the cruise lines need to conduct their operation? Imagine.....SMH.

[Engineroom Snipe]

I feel another thread is going to be locked or deleted once again.

[UNCFanatik]

25 minutes ago, QTBabyNurse said:

Thank you for proving my point about the "air of elitism" I spoke of. 

It is not up to the cruise lines to change their business model. You either accept how the cruise lines conduct their business or you find another form of vacation. Who are YOU to decide how the cruise lines need to conduct their operation? Imagine.....SMH.

 

Weird but the last I checked Cruise Lines, like any other customer forward companies would do well to listen to their customer base. There are several examples out there where companies have ignored their customer base much to their financial peril. 

 

Do this little mental math exercise: Would it be better for the cruise lines and their employees for:

 

A. People to remove their auto-gratuities and still choose to go on a cruise

B. People who remove their auto gratuities just stop cruising and choose to spend their vacation dollars elsewhere

 

You can accept reduced service and increased gratuities, but I dont have to. Nothing Elitist about that. Lord knows if I was an Elitist, i surely wouldnt be taking cruises with the unwashed masses....🤣

Edited March 5 by UNCFanatik

[not-enough-cruising]

1 hour ago, QTBabyNurse said:

Thank you for proving my point about the "air of elitism" I spoke of. 

It is not up to the cruise lines to change their business model. You either accept how the cruise lines conduct their business or you find another form of vacation. Who are YOU to decide how the cruise lines need to conduct their operation? Imagine.....SMH.

Exactly right, Royal can run their operations any way they wish. Their procedures permit me to remove my automatic gratuity; o am simply respecting their business model 

[Ocean Boy]

33 minutes ago, not-enough-cruising said:

Exactly right, Royal can run their operations any way they wish. Their procedures permit me to remove my automatic gratuity; o am simply respecting their business model 

Exactly right. It used to be that you could opt into auto gratuities then it changed to you can opt out. I have no idea why people overlook the "opt" part.

[d9704011]

44 minutes ago, not-enough-cruising said:

Exactly right, Royal can run their operations any way they wish. Their procedures permit me to remove my automatic gratuity; o am simply respecting their business model 

While I understand your argument, I think the business model has more to do with how certain employees end up getting paid rather than passengers can 'opting out' of paying them.

[UNCFanatik]

3 minutes ago, d9704011 said:

While I understand your argument, I think the business model has more to do with how certain employees end up getting paid rather than passengers can 'opting out' of paying them.

 

Yup, Its about how can the cruise lines pay the least for labor and expect the passengers to add to the overall crew compensation. 

[d9704011]

5 minutes ago, UNCFanatik said:

 

Yup, Its about how can the cruise lines pay the least for labor and expect the passengers to add to the overall crew compensation. 

There you go.... the business model.

Edited March 5 by d9704011

[not-enough-cruising]

1 hour ago, d9704011 said:

While I understand your argument, I think the business model has more to do with how certain employees end up getting paid rather than passengers can 'opting out' of paying them.

Not my problem. 
 

I am not opting out of PAYING anyone. I am opting out of providing a pre set gratuity before I have received services. 

Don’t sign a contract if you aren’t happy with the terms.