voljeep Posted July 15 #51 Share Posted July 15 8 minutes ago, Thunderbird19 said: Yep. Being “woke” is not a bad thing , more about an awareness level when the word was used years ago. Sadly, the word has been twisted and used by extremists in recent years to be pejorative and a negative thing… far from the original intent. Word meaning typically shouldn’t dramatically change, that’s why we have dictionaries 😂 Meet the Flintstones ... Deck the Halls words stay the same - meanings different @Globaler you can request this thread to be locked if you are satisfied with the responses, just report a post and ask Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crawford Posted July 15 #52 Share Posted July 15 5 hours ago, Globaler said: The Carnival Corporation owns Carnival (family/kids), Holland America (older cruisers), Seabourn (luxury), Costa (budget), Aida and P&O (not sure) and then Princess (middle age, semi upscale, value). Given this line up; why is the Carnival Corporation messing with Princess by trying to appeal to everyone? These are my thoughts what do you think? My thoughts are that Princess is transitioning away from the older “loyalists”, because we are dying off and they have our business for the most part. As a result, Princess is trying to attract a younger crowd. The prices are going up (along with the sizes of their ships) and the benefits and quality are going down; just like every other major cruise line. With the glut of new ships coming to market and no more shut-downs (hopefully), the supply and demand will adjust and with that, pricing. I still appreciate the ability to shop around for the best price. As I look for deals, along with itineraries, I couldn’t touch a Viking Ocean for the prices I can get on a Princess cruise. 5 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCX22 Posted July 15 #53 Share Posted July 15 Princess no doubt has changed/is trying to change it's image. IMO, Princess has too big of a fleet of ships and too great of cabin inventory to cater to only a small segment of the population. They are still after all mass market. They are losing old blood cruisers due to age and mortality and are after new cruisers. According to CLIA's 2024 State of the Cruise Industry Report, Baby Boomers, Gen X, and Millennials make up the largest segment of the cruise industry. Too add, they are in ALMOST equal proportion. For those that think that Millennials have no money, think again. If that were the case, where are they getting the money to cruise? 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thunderbird19 Posted July 15 #54 Share Posted July 15 (edited) Update: False alarm - just redid it and it shows $60 I was just looking at a cruise for 2025 and the Princess Plus price shows at $67 per day not $60. Did Princess just raise the price or is this a system error? Edited July 15 by Thunderbird19 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRLD Posted July 15 #55 Share Posted July 15 6 hours ago, Globaler said: The Carnival Corporation owns Carnival (family/kids), Holland America (older cruisers), Seabourn (luxury), Costa (budget), Aida and P&O (not sure) and then Princess (middle age, semi upscale, value). Given this line up; why is the Carnival Corporation messing with Princess by trying to appeal to everyone? These are my thoughts what do you think? Most likely because Princess demographics have gotten rather old, not middle age. If you look at their competition in the NA adult focused market, Celebrity moved to get their age demographics down about 10 years ago, HAL has been successful in getting theirs down when they launched music walk. Princess on the other hand has just gone on and has its age demographics continuing to get older as it's passengers age. Now they are trying to appeal to more multigenerational family cruises while still keeping primarily in the NA adult focused market. Attracting some families, but not going fully into the family focused market. It also creates a little more separation between HAL and Princess since they are both CCL owned lines. HALs niche is smallest avg ship size of the adult mass market lines along with the most diverse number of destination ports and the longest avg itinerary lengths. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crawford Posted July 15 #56 Share Posted July 15 32 minutes ago, SCX22 said: Princess no doubt has changed/is trying to change it's image. IMO, Princess has too big of a fleet of ships and too great of cabin inventory to cater to only a small segment of the population. They are still after all mass market. They are losing old blood cruisers due to age and mortality and are after new cruisers. According to CLIA's 2024 State of the Cruise Industry Report, Baby Boomers, Gen X, and Millennials make up the largest segment of the cruise industry. Too add, they are in ALMOST equal proportion. For those that think that Millennials have no money, think again. If that were the case, where are they getting the money to cruise? Question: If that were the case, where are they getting the money to cruise? Answer: Credit cards, parents and grandparents. 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paddingtonbear Posted July 15 #57 Share Posted July 15 Friends recently did a Viking cruise and we’re not impressed and will go back to other $$$ cruises. Viking food was pretty good. Supposedly, tips were included in everything (you pay for them in the fare) but they kept asking for tips on excursions and onboard. Staff were not as attentive as other lines. The smaller ships (900 passengers) really move around in high seas. They want a more stable ship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kay S Posted July 15 #58 Share Posted July 15 40 minutes ago, crawford said: My thoughts are that Princess is transitioning away from the older “loyalists”, because we are dying off and they have our business for the most part. Well, I'm not dead yet and other cruise lines are happy to take my money.😝 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thunderbird19 Posted July 15 #59 Share Posted July 15 (edited) Regarding my post #55 above, I again found a Princess Plus fare of $67. Isn’t Princess Plus $60 per person per day or does it now vary by cruises? As part of their identity crisis are they increasing prices again? Edited July 15 by Thunderbird19 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCX22 Posted July 15 #60 Share Posted July 15 14 minutes ago, crawford said: Question: If that were the case, where are they getting the money to cruise? Answer: Credit cards, parents and grandparents. Hardly. I'm from California so many of these Millennials work in tech making six figure salaries. It's why our housing market is out of control. Also, many Millennials are choosing to forgo having children leaving more money for themselves. I'm a Millennial that doesn't work in tech, but made a combination of good decisions and luck have afforded me the opportunity to cruise more than the average person. I consider myself very fortunate. No doubt, there are variances in income. Not all old people have tons money to spend. There are countless stories of people in their golden years that are barely scraping by. Unless you saved enough for retirement or have a pension plan from your employer, Social Security is hardly enough to survive on. Compound that with the rate of inflation in the past few years and it makes the problem worse. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare Itchy&Scratchy Posted July 15 #61 Share Posted July 15 24 minutes ago, Thunderbird19 said: Regarding my post #55 above, I again found a Princess Plus fare of $67. Isn’t Princess Plus $60 per person per day or does it now vary by cruises? As part of their identity crisis are they increasing prices again? yea, it glitches periodically. About a month ago it was $70/90, so I asked on CC if the price went up. An hour later it was back to normal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare startedwithamouse Posted July 15 #62 Share Posted July 15 52 minutes ago, crawford said: Question: If that were the case, where are they getting the money to cruise? Answer: Credit cards, parents and grandparents. They have jobs to pay for vacations. We and everyone we know pays for their own vacations. Who is living off parents? 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTfan Posted July 15 #63 Share Posted July 15 I would love to just watch the branding meetings at Carnival Corp.. I would also love to see the marketing stats.. I think the direction of Princess would be more focus on the strengths of what people leave Princess for. If people are leaving for Virgin or an Edge Class ship..then expect more modern touches. If people are leaving for Cunard, then more traditional themes..If people are leaving for Royal, then the focus on kids while trying not to alienate the others (that would be a feat!). Carnival Corp needs to have some cross loyalty benefits like Royal recently did.. Better to lose a customer to HAL vs Celebrity..and dangling loyalty perks might make the win. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
memoak Posted July 15 #64 Share Posted July 15 6 minutes ago, startedwithamouse said: They have jobs to pay for vacations. We and everyone we know pays for their own vacations. Who is living off parents? We always paid for our cruises from our work wages. We cruised for 33 years before we retired. Heck I retired after they cut back my vacation benefits to give them to the younger workers who were already making $60K 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRLD Posted July 15 #65 Share Posted July 15 1 hour ago, SCX22 said: Hardly. I'm from California so many of these Millennials work in tech making six figure salaries. It's why our housing market is out of control. Also, many Millennials are choosing to forgo having children leaving more money for themselves. I'm a Millennial that doesn't work in tech, but made a combination of good decisions and luck have afforded me the opportunity to cruise more than the average person. I consider myself very fortunate. No doubt, there are variances in income. Not all old people have tons money to spend. There are countless stories of people in their golden years that are barely scraping by. Unless you saved enough for retirement or have a pension plan from your employer, Social Security is hardly enough to survive on. Compound that with the rate of inflation in the past few years and it makes the problem worse. Probably due more to how much it costs and how long it takes to get new housing developments approved to build new housing in CA. Prices are very high even far away from the tech industry. Too many people wanting to buy, too few houses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRLD Posted July 15 #66 Share Posted July 15 54 minutes ago, BTfan said: I would love to just watch the branding meetings at Carnival Corp.. I would also love to see the marketing stats.. I think the direction of Princess would be more focus on the strengths of what people leave Princess for. If people are leaving for Virgin or an Edge Class ship..then expect more modern touches. If people are leaving for Cunard, then more traditional themes..If people are leaving for Royal, then the focus on kids while trying not to alienate the others (that would be a feat!). Carnival Corp needs to have some cross loyalty benefits like Royal recently did.. Better to lose a customer to HAL vs Celebrity..and dangling loyalty perks might make the win. The one thing you can be certain of is that they have far far more data about their customer base, both returning and not then we will ever have. I suspect that some of here on CC are not exactly the desired customer for Princess depending upon our spending habits, or lack of. In spite of how many cruises we have been on. 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCX22 Posted July 15 #67 Share Posted July 15 2 hours ago, TRLD said: Most likely because Princess demographics have gotten rather old, not middle age. If you look at their competition in the NA adult focused market, Celebrity moved to get their age demographics down about 10 years ago, HAL has been successful in getting theirs down when they launched music walk. Princess on the other hand has just gone on and has its age demographics continuing to get older as it's passengers age. More often than not, Princess ships feel like floating retirement homes, now a days. This is coming from a Millennial that has visited relatives in retirement homes with frequency. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare Globaler Posted July 15 Author #68 Share Posted July 15 I would love to know what Carnival Corp strategy is cause they have many lines that could/should cover almost all market segments. Given that I would also love to know what is the Princess target segment. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacMadame Posted July 15 #69 Share Posted July 15 7 hours ago, memoak said: I don’t of any popular singer these days who don’t have some suggestive lyrics. Unless the kids are under 10 I am sure they have heard these things before I was going to say under 6! 🤣 6 hours ago, BlerkOne said: My thoughts? Not very original, but... The only constant is change. Everything adapts or dies, including cruise lines. You can't live in the past. You can run (to another cruise line) but not hide. You lost me at "woke". I have a general policy that if anyone uses woke unironically, I stop reading the post. 😉 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare BlerkOne Posted July 15 #70 Share Posted July 15 5 hours ago, Wishing on a star said: And, please do NOT portray and sell me something and then deliver something that it definitely is not. All cruise lines sell illusions. Every last one. Camelot is dead. If they still hand out brochures, how many passengers look like the brochures? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wishing on a star Posted July 15 #71 Share Posted July 15 I would try to ignore that tern, no matter what the intended meaning, or whether it is being used in a positive or negative way. Just as I did when I saw it used here. Is this board the place for such a discussion? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wishing on a star Posted July 15 #72 Share Posted July 15 (edited) Blerk, Slick glossy images... Basic PR is expected.... No problem. A multigeneration cruise/vacation experience that is expected, and promoted, to have an adult area and a kids area, but has neither, is a problem. Edited July 15 by Wishing on a star Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare BlerkOne Posted July 15 #73 Share Posted July 15 Middle age is hard to define, but say broadly 45-60. Princess Cruise Line is almost 60. That puts early customers at 105-120 years old. Is Princess still trying to cater to them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRLD Posted July 15 #74 Share Posted July 15 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Globaler said: I would love to know what Carnival Corp strategy is cause they have many lines that could/should cover almost all market segments. Given that I would also love to know what is the Princess target segment. Pretty clear. First look at the national/regional focus. Carnival, Princess, HAL north America focus P&O UK is UK focused Aida is German line that is EU focused Costa is an Italian line that is EU focused Then you can take the 3 NA focused line and split them into 2 groups Carnival is family focused competing against NCL and Royal Caribbean. HAL and Princess is adult focused competing against Celebrity. The CCL owned NA lines tend to focus a bit more on value, the RCL lines tend to be a bit more feature focused. Since NCL lacks an adult focused mass market line it trys to cover both. Though NCLH is the only one of the 3 major holding companies to have a small ship Premium option in Oceania since RCL sold Azamara. Because CCL has 2 adult focused lines there is some competition between HAL and Princess. Recent changes with Princess is putting a bit more space between them. Princess is adding some of the features that Celebrity put in place years ago, but they seem to not be sure how they want to really implement. Might be a cultural issue. In addition Princess really needs to bring it's average age demographics down or it will become a serious problem like it was with HAL 10 years or so back. Especially with the ship size Princess is building. Edited July 15 by TRLD 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare Paula_MacFan Posted July 15 #75 Share Posted July 15 1 hour ago, startedwithamouse said: They have jobs to pay for vacations. We and everyone we know pays for their own vacations. Who is living off parents? I think some people still think of Millennials as young 20-somethings, not people who are mostly in their 30s and early 40s now. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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