Move to dock cruise liners at navy base welcomed

[Sandielle]

This was posted on P&O FB today.

 

Move to dock liners at navy base welcomed

 

Allowing large liners to dock at a Sydney naval base during the peak cruising season is an "obvious solution" to a shortage of wharves, a peak tourism body says.

 

Federal Defence Minister Stephen Smith on Thursday announced a review into greater access to Garden Island, also known as Fleet Base East.

 

Former defence department secretary Dr Alan Hawke will conduct the independent review, which could see large visiting cruisers sharing naval facilities during busy times.

 

Cruise operators and the tourism industry were quick to welcome the review, which aims to address a major shortage of appropriate port infrastructure in Sydney for large ocean liners.

 

The Tourism and Transport Forum (TFF)'s chief executive John Lee said the review was a "positive step for tourism" and allowing cruisers permanent access to Garden island would create certainty for the industry.

 

He said most ships under construction at the moment wouldn't be able to pass under the Sydney Harbour Bridge.

 

"It is crucial we have additional cruise terminal facilities east of the bridge and Garden Island is an obvious solution," Mr Lee said.

 

He said visiting cruise ships should be given "priority" docking rights at the naval base during peak season.

 

"Having arrangements in place to allow cruise ships permanent access to Garden Island will give operators certainty and help them plan for the future."

 

The most recent cruise season saw 150 ships visit Sydney, a hike of 26 per cent on the previous year, the TFF said.

 

The country's largest cruise operator Carnival Australia said the cruise industry was the "standout success" of national tourism and contributed $3 billion annually to the economy.

 

But a lack of infrastructure on the eastern side of the bridge, namely at the Overseas Passenger Terminal, was "the biggest constraint" to its future, Carnival Australia chief executive Ann Sherry said.

 

"There is insufficient capacity at the only cruise terminal on the eastern side of The Harbour Bridge ... to support the long-term growth of the industry as the world's cruise ships get bigger," she said.

 

"Carnival Australia commends the federal government for taking steps to address the serious infrastructure constraints faced by the cruise industry in Sydney Harbour."

 

http://news.ninemsn.com.au/national/8261959/move-to-dock-liners-at-navy-base-welcomed

[The_Big_M]

There's a fair case for availability at the old commercial wharving along Cowper Wharf Road as that was only integrated into the facility around 15 years back, and that's more able to be segregated from the rest of the Garden Island facility.

 

With the security lockdown since last decade, I'd doubt they'd have greater access to the facility than that; it's no longer possible for the public to walk unescorted through the facility.

 

As for the request for "priority" access (presumably it means ahead of the navy) that's a bit of a laugh!

[rugbypopsie]

So sharing a naval shipyard is the best we can do for "the standout success of the Australian tourism industry"....they should be ashamed.

 

We have been calling for better facilities for so long and the government has sat on their hands doing nothing.

 

One of the worlds most fascinating gateways and they are going to dock in a makeshift naval facility...what will our guests think?

 

It wont be too long before some smart WA politician catches on to the big opportunity to build a great facility over there in Fremantle and promote fly cruises that begin in WA and include a few days in Central Australia...all that NSW and Sydney will see is the back of tourists on their way to the airport.

 

I guess its better than nothing...but that is about all.

[MMDown Under]

I would hate to see our magnificent Sydney Harbour ruined with extensive facilities for mega ships in the Harbour.

 

We have already managed to spoil the harbour ourselves, with expanding marinas into the harbour which belongs to all the people.

 

I feel that they need to research facilities for mega cruise ships outside the harbour. Many worldwide ports are up to three hour commute to major cities.

 

Sydney will always be the number one port for overseas visitors to Australia.

[bobhsv]

Would this be a tender affair?

 

Jen

[thied]

I think that this move by the goverment to allow cruise ships to use the navy base a good one, if they put is a terminal like the one in Brisbane grain wharf, there is nothing wrong with that except there is nothing out at fishermans.

 

The big question is how much time does any one want to spend at a cruise terminal, a cruise ship on a world cruise pulls into sydney for the day most people will be doing tours and would be in the treminal for about an half an hour before the tours and on the completion of the tours.

 

Does any one realy think over sea cruises would be excited about a flash cruise terminal when they arrive in Sydney, mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

[MMDown Under]

Would this be a tender affair?

 

Jen

 

No.

 

I was thinking of somewhere on the Coast, with train access to Sydney, like Newcastle.

[bobhsv]

No.

 

I was thinking of somewhere on the Coast, with train access to Sydney, like Newcastle.

 

Yes, I agree. The train trip down to Sydney is also nice through the Hawkesbury River area. It is a pity that Newcastle airport is smallish...would make a good destination if they had international facilities there too, but doubt that would ever happen as the airforce base is nextdoor, hence perhaps too much air traffic.

 

Re my previous question....I meant, is Garden Island a tender....lol...sorry to confuse you.

 

Jen

[Kiwi Kruzer]

I think that this move by the government to allow cruise ships to use the navy base a good one, if they put is a terminal like the one in Brisbane grain wharf, there is nothing wrong with that except there is nothing out at fisherman's.The big question is how much time does any one want to spend at a cruise terminal, a cruise ship on a world cruise pulls into Sydney for the day most people will be doing tours and would be in the terminal for about an half an hour before the tours and on the completion of the tours.Does any one really think over sea cruises would be excited about a flash cruise terminal when they arrive in Sydney, mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

 

 

I fully agree with you on this one Thied.

 

Its great to see that common sense , from those in authority , is coming to the fore at last .

 

There is heaps of room at Garden Island, and with only minor reshuffling, in the cruise season , a separate cruise dock could easily be operated without any adverse effect on Naval operations.

We boarded QM2 there. It was a bit overkill as we were processed at White Bay and then taken by catamaran to board the ship. We overnighted there and the next day were free to come and go from the ship. I took the opportunity to check out what was there and was very impressed. Woolloommoolloo(sp?) is a delightful area and Sydneysiders can be very proud of how it has all come up.

I was also very amazed at just how much space there is to dock ships.

 

Here a couple of pics from showing the street scene, and up to where we were docked.

 

 

 

[RD MULLET]

 

The country's largest cruise operator Carnival Australia said the cruise industry was the "standout success" of national tourism and contributed $3 billion annually to the economy.

 

But a lack of infrastructure on the eastern side of the bridge, namely at the Overseas Passenger Terminal, was "the biggest constraint" to its future, Carnival Australia chief executive Ann Sherry said.

 

"There is insufficient capacity at the only cruise terminal on the eastern side of The Harbour Bridge ... to support the long-term growth of the industry as the world's cruise ships get bigger," she said.

 

"Carnival Australia commends the federal government for taking steps to address the serious infrastructure constraints faced by the cruise industry in Sydney Harbour."

 

 

I get so sick of everyone wanting "the government" (you and me as taxpayers) to provide everything for them to make a profit off.

 

If Carnival Australia is contributing so much to the Australian economy, and therefore skimming so much profit off the economy, why can't Carnival Australia provide some sort of infastructure for their cruise ships to dock at.

 

Not an easy solution I know, property is expensive, but I'm sick of Anne Sherry winging that everyone else should provide facilities for Carnivals ships to dock at. If they had bought Wharf 8 they could still be there couldn't they!

 

Use some of your own profit !

[The_Big_M]

I would hate to see our magnificent Sydney Harbour ruined with extensive facilities for mega ships in the Harbour.

 

We have already managed to spoil the harbour ourselves, with expanding marinas into the harbour which belongs to all the people.

 

I feel that they need to research facilities for mega cruise ships outside the harbour. Many worldwide ports are up to three hour commute to major cities.

 

Sydney will always be the number one port for overseas visitors to Australia.

 

Agreed, MM.

 

I really liked Royal Caribbean's proposal of Botany Bay, which has a lot more access/availability, has some nice areas, and is probably the closest alternative to the Harbour proper. Depending where, a coach ride to the CBD could be 15-20 minutes.

 

Sure, the current convenience we have is excellent, but as a compromise where lots of space appears to be available, this looks a good match.

[cruisin-m]

I get so sick of everyone wanting "the government" (you and me as taxpayers) to provide everything for them to make a profit off.

 

If Carnival Australia is contributing so much to the Australian economy, and therefore skimming so much profit off the economy, why can't Carnival Australia provide some sort of infastructure for their cruise ships to dock at.

 

Not an easy solution I know, property is expensive, but I'm sick of Anne Sherry winging that everyone else should provide facilities for Carnivals ships to dock at. If they had bought Wharf 8 they could still be there couldn't they!

 

Use some of your own profit !

 

I think we need to consider what it would do to the price of cruises, Carnival or RCL won't just cop in on the chin and lose out on profits for no reason, it would be passed straight on to us.

 

Carnival do pay docking fees which I assume would be quite expensive etc so I guess what they are saying is that they should be getting decent facilities. Australia also invests a ridiculous amount into the travel industry for land based holidays and they don't have to pay for it.

 

I can see the point you are making though and agree that if they really want it to just do it themselves and stop whinging for someone else to do it.

 

On the topic of getting a new dock, I think Garden Island will suffice, I mean a dock is a dock as long as it gets people on and off, I don't think they care about the bells and whistles

[johndon]

In today's press Botany Bay and Port Kembla also get mentions as alternatives for cruise ship docking. Botany Bay may be ok but I dont see that Port Kembla has much going for it.

 

John

[rugbypopsie]

I would not be against the facility being in Newcastle or Botany Bay either but it is short sighted not to be planning it now. However there is nothing to beat sailing up Sydney Harbour on a bright afternoon or as the sun comes up!!!

 

What ever it costs can be recouped in the millions of dollars spent by the tourists..I don't think enough effort is made to make cruise visitors aware of the attractions of a stay in the city for a few days. You only need to read these boards to see just what little knowledge our guests have about Sydney and what to see and do here.

[bazzaw]

When thinking about using the Naval Base - there is also a big difference between a large ship just visiting Sydney - and a large ship doing a regular turnaround cycle. In the recent case of QM2 , although several hundred got on in Sydney - the ship was really only "visiting". If it was to have been leaving and then coming back in another week/10 days to start all over again , it would cause considerable disruption to the Navy base and that was just one ship. How many will now be basing themselves out of Sydney ?

 

I wouldn't get too excited about this announcement at this stage.

 

 

Barry

[thied]

I get so sick of everyone wanting "the government" (you and me as taxpayers) to provide everything for them to make a profit off.

 

If Carnival Australia is contributing so much to the Australian economy, and therefore skimming so much profit off the economy, why can't Carnival Australia provide some sort of infastructure for their cruise ships to dock at.

 

Not an easy solution I know, property is expensive, but I'm sick of Anne Sherry winging that everyone else should provide facilities for Carnivals ships to dock at. If they had bought Wharf 8 they could still be there couldn't they!

 

Use some of your own profit !

I agree and that what P&O/ carnival did at port side They put some of the money up to build port side.

[thied]

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/sydney-nsw/ships-cruisin-for-a-port-bruisin-in-sydney-harbour/story-e6freuzi-1226076680141

[thied]

Ahoy there, move that destroyer a little

 

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/ahoy-there-move-that-destroyer-a-little-20110616-1g62c.html

[MMDown Under]

Most interesting article in Seatrade Insider re Med congestion strains port-cruise line.

 

Australia is fortunate in that we can learn from the mistakes made by other countries.

[Debsta]

Botany Bay would suit me :D Less drive time :p

 

Even Kurnell, after all, it's Captain Cooks landing place :).....then they can drive past the oil refinery and our "you beaut but rather defunked desalinisation plant" on the way to the big city :p

[NSWP]

Batemans Bay no good, sand bar no good for tendering and no cruise ship berth. 'The World' was here last year, worked as a 'meeter & greeter for that. Volendam was supposed to come, but cancelled out, due to 'tendering issues.' So that is us out of the picture.

 

The cruiseships still come into Eden, further down the coast, not many though, 3 or 4 a year, max.

 

I reckon Newcastle is the go.

[Cruise ship fan]

Batemans Bay no good, sand bar no good for tendering and no cruise ship berth. 'The World' was here last year, worked as a 'meeter & greeter for that. Volendam was supposed to come, but cancelled out, due to 'tendering issues.' So that is us out of the picture.

 

The cruiseships still come into Eden, further down the coast, not many though, 3 or 4 a year, max.

 

I reckon Newcastle is the go.

 

Newcastle would be the worst place to put a large cruise ship terminal. The city is basiclly a dump (not as bad as Noumea but still), it also a bit far out of Sydney and it couldn't handle the traffic.

 

The best idea in all this is to completely remove the Navy out of Garden Island, as they will have trouble fitting there soon anyway and put them on the other side of the bridge as the ship can easily fit over there in white bay.

 

Then rebuild a world class cruise ship terminal in garden island.

 

It would be an expensive move but would pay off in the long run and the Navy will have to move from Garden Island soon anyway because they are getting too crowded. For example when they get the new helicopter carriers they will need to be rafted side by side to fit.

[The_Big_M]

Newcastle would be the worst place to put a large cruise ship terminal. The city is basiclly a dump (not as bad as Noumea but still), it also a bit far out of Sydney and it couldn't handle the traffic.

Except Newcastle has a cruise ship terminal, which has been successfully used the past few years.

 

The best idea in all this is to completely remove the Navy out of Garden Island, as they will have trouble fitting there soon anyway and put them on the other side of the bridge as the ship can easily fit over there in white bay.

 

That's an unrealistic idea.

 

The dockyards there are still used frequently - including by cruise ships when they break down! :eek: There's a massive facility there, so not sure where you think that can go, plus the cost would be enormous. Moreover, I'm not sure how you think aircraft carriers and the like will get past the harbour bridge, and where will that number go?

 

If you're going to displace anyone, it'd be simpler and likely cheaper to buy back the Woolloomooloo wharves that were sold off. An even better location for cruise ships, and an appropriate capacity, without trying to push a necessary working facility out.

 

Then rebuild a world class cruise ship terminal in garden island.

 

So who's paying for all this?

 

The Navy will have to move from Garden Island soon anyway because they are getting too crowded. For example when they get the new helicopter carriers they will need to be rafted side by side to fit.

 

That's something that's been done fairly often over time; capacity overall isn't too much of an issue - a fair number of ships have also been decommissioned.

[NSWP]

Cruise Ship Fan..read your post, but I beg to differ, with all due respect..I think Newcastle is a nice place, also good transport links to Sydney, coaches via F3 or trains. And as MMDownunder says, already a cruise terminal there. Better than Port Botany anyway.

 

As for the RAN leaving Garden Island, I doubt it will ever happen.

[shieldsboy]

I agree with Cruise Ship Fan, the idea that the Navy has one of the most prime position on one of the beautiful harbours in the world is ridiculous.

 

I have sailed in and out of Sydney Harbour on a number of overseas cruise liners and it is the Harbour, especially around the Opera House and Bridge, that really thrills the overseas visitors. At night it is magical from a cruise liner.

 

Moving cruise ships to Botany Bay, Newcastle etc will not be at all attractive to them.

 

Just this year we sailed through Hong Kong and it was a real pain not be docked at the Overseas Terminal (as we have in previous cruises) - instead we docked at a container port about 15 kilometres out and had a 30 minute bus ride into the city.

 

Unfortunately I don't think this proposal will ever get to fruition as none of the political parties will stand up to the "flack" that the proposal to move the Navy will receive from the powerful interest groups (and shock jocks).