Jones Act - Very Confused for Initintity Sept 26 sailing

[bigwalt0176]

So we are on the Infinity sailing from Seattle making it's first stop in San Fran. It is a great itinerary through the Canal. What I am confused about is that all that I have read here is that the Jones Act would prevent the Infinity from starting at Seattle and making it's first stop in San Francisco. Is there some penalty that Celebrity will be paying or is there something more that I don't know about.

 

Input would be appreciated.

[Essiesmom]

The itinerary is perfectly legal...There is nothing in the Passenger Vessel Services Act that prohibits a ship from sailing from Seattle to SF as first port of call, as long as noone gets off in SF. EM

[bigwalt0176]

I think I a expect to get off in SF as we are overnighting there. It is a port listed on the itinerary. Are you suggesting that we won't be able to get off the ship?

[bigwalt0176]

Sorry double post.

[wazzucruiser]

We are also on this sailing. Our first stop is SF and it is even overnight. I would think there is no problem with it or they wouldn't be doing it in the first place. We certainly can get off the ship, as Celebrity is selling excursions. I believe the PVSA just requires that if a ship begin and ends in the US, it must stop at least once at a 'distant' foreign port. This voyage certainly meets that requirment.

 

I think all is good.

[cruisestitch]

You can get off but you cannot disembark -- that is, you cannot use the ship as a means of passage between Seattle and San Francisco. Getting off for excursions is fine but you must come back to the ship and continue the voyage.

[dmwnc1959]

I thnk that they meant you can't permanently disembark in SF and then go home and not come back. Getting off and on the ship for sightseeing etc is fine.

[bigwalt0176]

one of the large corner aft fv verandas if anyone is interested. We are on the corner on the other side. I have always salivated over these balconies.

[Wine-O]

one of the large corner aft fv verandas if anyone is interested. We are on the corner on the other side. I have always salivated over these balconies.

 

You should announce this on your Roll Call. It will get more attention.

[bigwalt0176]

Perhaps someone not yet on the cruise would be interested but your point is well taken.

[Cruise Junky]

As pointed out, it's the PVSA, not the Jones Act. There is nothing wrong with sailing from one US port to another, it's the embarking and disembarking in two US ports that starts the issues. So as long as the cruise is Seattle to I'm assuming Ft. Lauderdale or Miami and the ship stops at a Foreign Distant port...ie..somewhere along the canal..ie Columbia, you're fine.

[Gonzo70]

The Jones Act has nothing to do with cruising; it has to do with restricting foreign flagged vessels from transporting cargo from one U.S. port to another. It is the Passenger Vessel Services Act (PVSA) that impact cruise ships.

 

The PVSA does not allow a foreign flagged ship (which all major cruise ships are aside from NCL's Pride of America) from transporting passengers from one U.S. port to another without stopping at a Distant Foreign Port at some point during the voyage. Mexico, Canada and most Caribbean islands are not deemed distant foreign ports (there are a few exceptions in the Caribbean), but South America is a Distant Foreign Port (so a stop in Cartagena, Colombia would qualify). The PVSA does not restrict passengers from getting of the ship at a port call, it only restricts them from permanently leaving the ship (i.e. ending the voyage) in one U.S. port when the cruise started in a different U.S. port and no distant foreign port was visited. Likewise you can start a cruise late in one U.S. port on a cruise that is going to be ending in a different U.S. port unless a Distant Foreign Port is called upon while you are on the ship.

 

For round trip cruises that start in a U.S. port (i.e. start and end in Miami, FL) the PVSA just requires that the ship stop at any foreign port. For one way cruises that start in one U.S. port (i.e. Miami, FL) but end in a different U.S. port (i.e. San Diego, CA) then a distant foreign port must be visited at some point in between Miami and San Diego.

[TomMMD]

The Jones Act has nothing to do with cruising; it has to do with restricting foreign flagged vessels from transporting cargo from one U.S. port to another. It is the Passenger Vessel Services Act (PVSA) that impact cruise ships.

 

The PVSA does not allow a foreign flagged ship (which all major cruise ships are aside from NCL's Pride of America) from transporting passengers from one U.S. port to another without stopping at a Distant Foreign Port at some point during the voyage. Mexico, Canada and most Caribbean islands are not deemed distant foreign ports (there are a few exceptions in the Caribbean), but South America is a Distant Foreign Port (so a stop in Cartagena, Colombia would qualify). The PVSA does not restrict passengers from getting of the ship at a port call, it only restricts them from permanently leaving the ship (i.e. ending the voyage) in one U.S. port when the cruise started in a different U.S. port and no distant foreign port was visited. Likewise you can start a cruise late in one U.S. port on a cruise that is going to be ending in a different U.S. port unless a Distant Foreign Port is called upon while you are on the ship.

 

For round trip cruises that start in a U.S. port (i.e. start and end in Miami, FL) the PVSA just requires that the ship stop at any foreign port. For one way cruises that start in one U.S. port (i.e. Miami, FL) but end in a different U.S. port (i.e. San Diego, CA) then a distant foreign port must be visited at some point in between Miami and San Diego.

 

Good answer but it's not just foreign-flagged. Other than the Pride of America, the ships have to be U.S.-built.

[Gonzo70]

Good answer but it's not just foreign-flagged. Other than the Pride of America, the ships have to be U.S.-built.

 

True.

[bob brown]

And the Pride of America's hull was constructed in Mississippi, although the rest of the ship was finished in Europe.

[Denny01]

And Distant Ports do include some Mexican ports since the Hawaiian roundtrips out of LA (on Princess) called in Ensenada prior to returning to LA. and Ensenada being called a distant port is a real stretch so maybe they (whoever 'they' are) designated as such.

 

Den

[bob brown]

And Distant Ports do include some Mexican ports since the Hawaiian roundtrips out of LA (on Princess) called in Ensenada prior to returning to LA. and Ensenada being called a distant port is a real stretch so maybe they (whoever 'they' are) designated as such.

 

Den

Roundtrips from LA to Hawaii don't need to call at 'distant' foreign ports. Ensenada, a 'near' foreign port is good enough. If it was a one way crossing from Hawaii to the mainland, then all passengers would have to disembark at Ensenada (and use buses to reach LA).

The rules do get confusing. In addition to the other correct replies listed in earlier posts, there is another legal cruise, that being the roundtrip "cruise to nowhere", that doesn't make any stops. If it doesn't make any stops, at doesn't even have to visit a 'near' foreign port.

[Cruise Junky]

And Distant Ports do include some Mexican ports since the Hawaiian roundtrips out of LA (on Princess) called in Ensenada prior to returning to LA. and Ensenada being called a distant port is a real stretch so maybe they (whoever 'they' are) designated as such.

 

Den

 

As Bob pointed out, whole different set of rules between a closed loop cruise..LA - LA than a one way..Honolulu - LA.

[bob brown]

Another 'legal' example is the annual repositioning cruises that go from San Diego or Los Angeles to Hawaian islands, then on to Vancouver, BC. They are okay, as they're transporting passengers from one US Port to a near foreign port. They could make a port of call at Seattle along the way, but could not end the cruise there. Or, if the cruise started at Ensenada, then to Hawaii, it could end at Seattle.

[tomcruiser1234]

We are on the Sept26 2011 Canal cruise also. Question is: If we were to have to leave the ship in SF due to family Illnes ( bought INS. for this reason ) What will be the consequences?

[Cruise Junky]

We are on the Sept26 2011 Canal cruise also. Question is: If we were to have to leave the ship in SF due to family Illnes ( bought INS. for this reason ) What will be the consequences?

 

I think the fine is around $300 pp. This would be charged to the cruise line who in turn would more than likely charge you. I don't know if that's covered under insurance or not.

[cruisestitch]

The cruise line pays the fine. They generally pass the fine on to the passenger. Since it was a result of having broken a law, it's unlikely that the fine would be covered by any insurance. Check your policy carefully and call the carrier for confirmation.

[miched]

What about all those Alaska cruises that start in Whittier? They stop at all US ports before they stop in a foreign port and the passengers get off and leave the dock area.

 

 

The same with the east coast cruises they will leave NY and stop in Boston, Port Caneral, and etc before any foreign port.

 

 

.

[Cruise Junky]

What about all those Alaska cruises that start in Whittier? They stop at all US ports before they stop in a foreign port and the passengers get off and leave the dock area.

 

 

 

 

.

 

As mentioned above, it's not about where you stop, it's where you start and end. You don't find cruises that go from Whittier to Seattle, they all start or end in Vancouver. PVSA doesn't come into play because it's not cruising starting and ending in two US ports.

[cruisestitch]

The key is, do they come back aboard? Of course you can get off at the ports, but you cannot use the cruise ship as a means of transport between one US port and another. Last summer the Summit had an itinerary from Bayonne to Newport, RI, to Bermuda. Passengers could not use the cruise ship as a means of travel from Bayonne to Newport. All had to re-board the ship and continue on to Bermuda. This is the same situation as your Alaska itineraries -- you cannot turn the cruise ship into a "ferry".:)