Other lines UBP policy change

[NH Cruisers]

http://cruiseforums.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=2009778&page=7

 

Go to post #1

Could this happen on NCL?

 

I personally don't care. I don't indulge enough to be a big deal. I can see at some point it being included in ALL adult fares. Not really fair to the none drinkers.

Edited March 25, 2014 by NH Cruisers

[Beaver1975]

I doubt that NCL will changes their rules just because Princess decided to try removing that requirement. It is rife with the possibility of abuse to not require "room mates" to buy the UBP. It is probably being abused within groups already.

[sparks1093]

http://cruiseforums.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=2009778&page=7

 

Go to post #1

Could this happen on NCL?

 

I personally don't care. I don't indulge enough to be a big deal. I can see at some point it being included in ALL adult fares. Not really fair to the none drinkers.

 

Doubtful, Princess has a different demographic. What exactly can you see being included in all adult fares? A drink package? Again, that's doubtful because it increases the net cost of fares and NCL wants to attract customers, not chase them away.

[garycarla]

Here is the link the OP meant to post - goes to first page.

 

In any event, I would suspect they are giving it a try. It will go through adjustments, changes, etc. before it is all done. Then it will change again.

 

There are all-inclusive lines out there already and the price is same for all cruisers. Fair? Maybe not. Nor is it fair I pay the same to eat in the free restaurants as the over-eaters. You know, those people that think it is the last day to eat on earth and pile the plate so high....

 

As said above, I doubt NCL will go this route on food or drinks. That would entail a new pricing and marketing strategy. Someday? Maybe.

[miataman19]

Celebrity does this now. Sailed on Reflection last year and had the Beverage Package. My DW had the Soda package. We did not see or hear of any issues. NCL should not mandate that every person in the room MUST PURCHASE THE SAME PACKAGE. That just turns me off. If We both could purchase what we want they would have 2 packages purchased (1 UBP and 1 soda), as it is now I'm not buying anything. I'll pay as I go and cut back on my consumtion. Not very "FREESTYLE" IMHO.

[LrgPizza]

"includes all cocktails, spirits, beer and glasses of wine less than $10. Also, all nonalcoholic drinks served in cans or bottles, as well as mocktails and shakes are included, as are all coffee, tea, espresso and specialty drinks and any food items such as crepes and gelato included with the coffee card."

 

The best thing about their plan is that it includes so much more than NCL's plan. If NCL switches to include all beer, cocktails, etc under $10, that would be awesome.

[rvsullivan]

And the cost is what?

 

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[Alliezona09]

And the cost is what?

 

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I believe they are the same as NCL, $49 per day plus 15% ~

Edited March 25, 2014 by Alliezona09

[sparks1093]

Celebrity does this now. Sailed on Reflection last year and had the Beverage Package. My DW had the Soda package. We did not see or hear of any issues. NCL should not mandate that every person in the room MUST PURCHASE THE SAME PACKAGE. That just turns me off. If We both could purchase what we want they would have 2 packages purchased (1 UBP and 1 soda), as it is now I'm not buying anything. I'll pay as I go and cut back on my consumtion. Not very "FREESTYLE" IMHO.

 

NCL doesn't sell the package to save you money but rather to make money (although it is marketed as a way for you to save money). Freestyle is about choices and you do have a choice- you may participate or not. NCL may of course mandate what they wish, it's their ball;).

[Beaver1975]

deleted

Edited March 25, 2014 by Beaver1975

[Alliezona09]

NCL doesn't sell the package to save you money but rather to make money (although it is marketed as a way for you to save money). Freestyle is about choices and you do have a choice- you may participate or not. NCL may of course mandate what they wish, it's their ball;).

 

While I understand what you're saying, it still doesn't make sense (to me). My husband doesn't drink a lot, I could easily drink $50 worth of drinks a day~ we get the drinks card in the casino and he doesn't use it! So if NCL were to sell the package individually then they would make almost $400 off of me, but since they don't I just drink when I'm in the casino for free~! On my last NCL cruise, a 4 day cruise I bought ONE drink on embarkation day and it ended up being comped by the casino! So by NCL choosing to sell the package only to cabins, they lost out on getting my money~

 

We will be on 2 cruises in June and have the drinks card from the casino so again they will lose out on quite a bit of money that they could have gotten from me! :D

[sparks1093]

While I understand what you're saying, it still doesn't make sense (to me). My husband doesn't drink a lot, I could easily drink $50 worth of drinks a day~ we get the drinks card in the casino and he doesn't use it! So if NCL were to sell the package individually then they would make almost $400 off of me, but since they don't I just drink when I'm in the casino for free~! On my last NCL cruise, a 4 day cruise I bought ONE drink on embarkation day and it ended up being comped by the casino! So by NCL choosing to sell the package only to cabins, they lost out on getting my money~

 

We will be on 2 cruises in June and have the drinks card from the casino so again they will lose out on quite a bit of money that they could have gotten from me! :D

 

But for every couple like you there are several couples that would buy one package and share it with each other, thereby costing NCL in the long run. (Besides which if you are being comped drinks in the casino you are contributing to the profit margin in other ways ;).

Edited March 25, 2014 by sparks1093

[Alliezona09]

But for every couple like you there are several couples that would buy one package and share it with each other, thereby costing NCL in the long run. (Besides which if you are being comped drinks in the casino you are contributing to the profit margin in other ways ;).

 

I agree, but I also wonder why Royal and Princess are allowing it to be sold per person? Oh and I only play penny slots and actually left with money from them~ DH lost but not the $400 they would have gotten from us had I been able to buy the UBP~

Edited March 25, 2014 by Alliezona09

[sparks1093]

I agree, but I also wonder why Royal and Princess are allowing it to be sold per person? Oh and I only play penny slots and actually left with money from them~ DH lost but not the $400 they would have gotten from us had I been able to buy the UBP~

 

If you watch "Cruise Inc" which is a documentary about NCL they rely heavily on bar sales to turn a profit on each cruise, the other cruise lines have different ways of measuring profit.

[NH Cruisers]

If you watch "Cruise Inc" which is a documentary about NCL they rely heavily on bar sales to turn a profit on each cruise, the other cruise lines have different ways of measuring profit.

Just as you state, they rely on bar sales to make a profit. Most of the folks that get the UBP claim they make out. That means NCL doesn't. Am I looking at this situation wrong?

 

About the other cruise lines measuring profit differently, do they? All the cruiselines I have been on, they were as pushy if not more to sell alcohol. I am pretty certain Princess does not rely on the poolside t-shirt sales or the spa specials.

Edited March 25, 2014 by NH Cruisers

[NH Cruisers]

I guess my first post was fuzzy.

 

RCCL is offering for $49 per day the drink package. Not everyone in the cabin needs get it. Is that something NCL may go to at some time to follow suit? As we have seen NCL has those specials every now and again offering complimentary UBP and so forth.

 

Wouldn't they do better profits it they just let individuals get the UBP than to just give them away? What profit do they make to sell a cabin cheap, then give away the UBP? Their profits come from more than just alcohol I'm thinking.

[KeithJenner]

Just as you state, they rely on bar sales to make a profit. Most of the folks that get the UBP claim they make out. That means NCL doesn't. Am I looking at this situation wrong?.

 

 

The thing about people stating that the UBP was worth it financially is that they are just looking at the drinks they actually had, and how much it would have cost. That isn't necessarily what they would have spent if they didn't have the UBP.

 

For example, if I had the UBP then I can guarantee that all the receipts I picked up during the cruise would total more than the cost of the UBP, but I have never once spent that much. Many people who do the comparison are ignoring the fact that they wouldn't have drunk as much, and may have used other deals.

 

It is a fact that a lot (I suspect the majority) of people who buy the UBP spend more money on drink than they would have without it.

 

As to the issue with sharing, it would undoubtedly happen if they allowed individuals in a room to buy the package. It certainly happens at the moment with groups in multiple rooms. As to whether that risk is outweighed by additional sales they would make, there is no way that we can tell from the info we have. The fact that NCL don't allow it suggests that they believe sharing would cost them. If they think otherwise then I'm sure they will change the policy.

 

 

 

 

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[KeithJenner]

Wouldn't they do better profits it they just let individuals get the UBP than to just give them away? What profit do they make to sell a cabin cheap, then give away the UBP? Their profits come from more than just alcohol I'm thinking.

 

 

I thought the UBP was only offered with Suites. That is the case in the UK. Was it offered for lower grade cabins elsewhere?

 

 

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[SteveH2508]

Doubtful, Princess has a different demographic. <snip>

 

I am inferring by this that you are saying that Princess has a 'more honourable' demographic. There is a thread on the Princess board at the moment discussing - inter alia - the problem of Elite cruisers abusing the free unlimited laundry by putting their friend's laundry through as Elite laundry (and other abuses e.g. free internet minutes).

 

Interesting that we don't seem to have many of these 'abuse of privilege' threads on the NCL board...:rolleyes:

 

I wonder if Princess/RCI are removing the 'all purchase the package' requirement as a pre-cursor to jacking up the price - just a theory mind.

[sparks1093]

Just as you state, they rely on bar sales to make a profit. Most of the folks that get the UBP claim they make out. That means NCL doesn't. Am I looking at this situation wrong?

 

About the other cruise lines measuring profit differently, do they? All the cruiselines I have been on, they were as pushy if not more to sell alcohol. I am pretty certain Princess does not rely on the poolside t-shirt sales or the spa specials.

 

If NCL wasn't making money with the UBP they would stop selling it;). By requiring all adults in a cabin to purchase the program NCL is probably hoping that with each couple one will drink more than the other and they will therefore make more profit off the light drinker. For most people to make UBP worthwhile they have to have 6 drinks every day to break even, and I am sure that NCL's bean counters have also determined how many drinks every passenger would have to have before they didn't make a profit and would guess it's much much higher than 6 drinks.

[sparks1093]

I am inferring by this that you are saying that Princess has a 'more honourable' demographic. There is a thread on the Princess board at the moment discussing - inter alia - the problem of Elite cruisers abusing the free unlimited laundry by putting their friend's laundry through as Elite laundry (and other abuses e.g. free internet minutes).

 

Interesting that we don't seem to have many of these 'abuse of privilege' threads on the NCL board...:rolleyes:

 

I wonder if Princess/RCI are removing the 'all purchase the package' requirement as a pre-cursor to jacking up the price - just a theory mind.

 

I have read plenty of threads on NCL about how to get around the rules and have only one person buy the package so it could be shared. As far as sharing laundry, how is it an abuse if one is filling a bag even if it is with a friend's clothes? One is entitled to it and it shouldn't matter to the cruise line whose clothes are in the bag. Sounds like it's more of a sour grapes attitude on the part of other cruisers to me (but that's probably a topic for a different thread and those questions are really rhetorical). (And we do see similar threads when someone is booked into a suite and asks if others in their party, booked in other categories, may enjoy some of the suite privileges such as priority boarding.)

 

CCL and NCL seem to be the two cruise lines that have the lowest fares and they both require all adults in a cabin to purchase the drink program. The cruise lines that charge more for their cruises do not. The cruise lines that charge more for the cruise tend to target people in a different income bracket. For whatever reason this means that NCL and CCL care enough about possible sharing of the drink package to require all adults to purchase it and the other cruise lines to not care enough to impose such restrictions. There is insufficient data to determine exactly why this is so, which leads me to say "they have a different demographic" and leave it at that.:)

[Demonyte]

... I am sure that NCL's bean counters have also determined how many drinks every passenger would have to have before they didn't make a profit and would guess it's much much higher than 6 drinks.

 

Since I'm a rum drinker, I use basic well rum in my example: A bottle of Bacardi Superior retails usually for $9.99-$15 onboard. One bottle usually makes 20 or more drinks, the fountain soda used as a mixer costs only cents per drink making the total for one mixed drink less than a dollar. So even at rum's retail price they make five-fold profit with list prices in bars.

 

When a passenger pays them $49 a day, the passenger would have to order more alcohol than they can physically consume in order to make the deal not worth it for NCL. Even if passenger could get over the profitability limit of NCL on one day, nobody can keep drinking like that for several days in a row. So when people say that they have barely benefited from the package, NCL has only given them a very small discount at that point and one would have to drink a lot, lot more in order to actually make a difference with NCL's profit what comes to bar revenues and UBP revenue.

[sparks1093]

Since I'm a rum drinker, I use basic well rum in my example: A bottle of Bacardi Superior retails usually for $9.99-$15 onboard. One bottle usually makes 20 or more drinks, the fountain soda used as a mixer costs only cents per drink making the total for one mixed drink less than a dollar. So even at rum's retail price they make five-fold profit with list prices in bars.

 

When a passenger pays them $49 a day, the passenger would have to order more alcohol than they can physically consume in order to make the deal not worth it for NCL. Even if passenger could get over the profitability limit of NCL on one day, nobody can keep drinking like that for several days in a row. So when people say that they have barely benefited from the package, NCL has only given them a very small discount at that point and one would have to drink a lot, lot more in order to actually make a difference with NCL's profit what comes to bar revenues and UBP revenue.

 

And if NCL can sell two packages per cabin they make even more;). (And I have no knowledge of what NCL is able to buy it's liquor for, but the stuff they sell in the store is duty free and cannot be sold to someone that is going to resell it at retail. That said they may be able to leverage their buying power to obtain liquor at close to those prices.)

[sparks1093]

I am inferring by this that you are saying that Princess has a 'more honourable' demographic. There is a thread on the Princess board at the moment discussing - inter alia - the problem of Elite cruisers abusing the free unlimited laundry by putting their friend's laundry through as Elite laundry (and other abuses e.g. free internet minutes).

 

Interesting that we don't seem to have many of these 'abuse of privilege' threads on the NCL board...:rolleyes:

 

I wonder if Princess/RCI are removing the 'all purchase the package' requirement as a pre-cursor to jacking up the price - just a theory mind.

 

Here's an un-scientific experiment- I went to the Princess, NCL and CCL boards on cruise critic and input the phrase "rum runner". On the Princess board it returned 251 results, NCL 431 and CCL 439.

[SteveH2508]

Here's an un-scientific experiment- I went to the Princess, NCL and CCL boards on cruise critic and input the phrase "rum runner". On the Princess board it returned 251 results, NCL 431 and CCL 439.

 

All cruiselines will have a proportion of pax who try to 'beat the system' (RRs, laundry for all, buying rounds of drinks on a UBP etc..)

 

For those of us who are honourable and follow the rules this can potentially lead to the removal or diminution of a desirable facility or loyalty perk for us.

 

Speculating what proportion are doing this on each line is rather derailing this thread however. I am not Princess bashing - I enjoyed my cruise on Princess and would sail again with them - but NCL's prices are better.