Bystander CPR on the Island Princess

[PescadoAmarillo]

As regards 911 going to the PSD, I am pretty sure it goes to the bridge, not PSD. The bridge is the only point on the ship guaranteed to have a security or similar officer always manned and with no other customer responsibilities. I know one time my wife accidentally pulled the panic cord in the shower and the bridge called immediately to check. While there is an on-call medical team at all times, they are NOT necessarily in the medical office (unless a patient is in there or it's open hours, there may only be a single nurse on duty in the med facility itself.) The bridge is kept advised of where the on call responders are and how to reach them. This is why in a medical emergency you may see responders coming from different directions, one may be coming with the staged gear from the med bay, while another may be coming from lunch or their cabin.

Loonbeam, the 911 calls go to the PSD. I was standing there being helped when one came in. I was so surprised that I even asked the question, and was told all 911 calls ring at the PSD. Maybe an alarm goes to the bridge, but I was at the PSD when the rep picked up the phone, listened and then repeated the issue- the lady's husband had passed out in their cabin- and then called the Medical Center and relayed the information.

[Loonbeam]

Huh. That strikes me as an odd protocol given they can't always answer the phone. They showed us the cabin alert display on the bridge, I would have assumed other emergencies go to the same station.

 

Loonbeam, the 911 calls go to the PSD. I was standing there being helped when one came in. I was so surprised that I even asked the question, and was told all 911 calls ring at the PSD. Maybe an alarm goes to the bridge, but I was at the PSD when the rep picked up the phone, listened and then repeated the issue- the lady's husband had passed out in their cabin- and then called the Medical Center and relayed the information.

[pcl2001]

Huh. That strikes me as an odd protocol given they can't always answer the phone. They showed us the cabin alert display on the bridge, I would have assumed other emergencies go to the same station.

 

They must answer within a certain number of rings. If they don't, it will rollover to the bridge and then someone will be in trouble.

[Coral]

They must answer within a certain number of rings. If they don't, it will rollover to the bridge and then someone will be in trouble.

 

This is probably why they answer the phone while helping people at the desk. It seems somewhat rude but I guess it makes sense.

[pablo222]

Loonbeam, the 911 calls go to the PSD. I was standing there being helped when one came in.

 

I have had the same situation -- where the JAP abruptly stopped

helping me and said 'Sorry, 911 call'.

[Loonbeam]

I'm trying to confirm, but there also may be different emergency numbers available - which may explain my confusion. It's possible 'routine' 911s go to the desk, but 'critical' emergencies have a different line to the bridge (for a fire, or mass injury situation perhaps).

 

Another thing I thought of regarding medical response time could simply be how its reported. If there are multiple incidents in progress, a response to 'someone fell' may be prioritized lower than 'someone passed out and is not breathing'.

 

They must answer within a certain number of rings. If they don't, it will rollover to the bridge and then someone will be in trouble.

[pcl2001]

I'm trying to confirm, but there also may be different emergency numbers available - which may explain my confusion. It's possible 'routine' 911s go to the desk, but 'critical' emergencies have a different line to the bridge (for a fire, or mass injury situation perhaps).

 

Another thing I thought of regarding medical response time could simply be how its reported. If there are multiple incidents in progress, a response to 'someone fell' may be prioritized lower than 'someone passed out and is not breathing'.

 

Yes, there are other emergency numbers, but they are not for passengers.

[Coral]

Yes, there are other emergency numbers, but they are not for passengers.

 

If you pull a fire alarm, it does alarm the bridge, right? At least that is what the muster drill said or used to say.

[pcl2001]

If you pull a fire alarm, it does alarm the bridge, right? At least that is what the muster drill said or used to say.

 

Yes

[JEH]

Thank you for your life saving response and thank you to all our fellow passengers who respond to fellow passengers needs and questions during a cruise. There are many wonderful people who do get innvolved in helping others.

[boone2]

I have been reading this with interest. The expected response time to am emergency call is 3-5 mins. However that depends on being given the right directions in the first place. Not sure about princess but all 911 calls go through the PSD, on the line I work for there is an AED at the PSD and guest relations are trained how to use them. They are sometimes there before we are. There is an emergency number for the bridge for crew to use. There is a standard response for all the medical department depending on the emergency. Each person had a different role to play. A stretcher is brought by a stretcher team. Cannot be managed by one nurse with equipment and sometimes depending on the ship there may be only one elevator that a stretcher can be loaded onto

Well done to the OP for your response. Don't know why the response time was so long. We weren't there so don't know all the different factors playing into this, there is usually some type of debrief after an incident so it won't be just ignored especially if brought to light by a passenger

Terry

[doug52]

Just to add to the OP's observations, I was also sitting approximately 15 feet from the Lido bar when this event happened. The OP did exactly as she described and the time estimation of 18 minutes has to be pretty close to being accurate. It was a very long time, and I am very concerned about Princess policies as I viewed several Princess employees including Supervisors standing around watching as the OP did all the CPR work.

 

I viewed the medical person that responded walking to the scene with the wheelchair, not even close to running.

 

I viewed the challenge that the medical person had in getting the victim to first sit up and then struggled to get her into the wheelchair.

 

I viewed the bartender come up to the OP approximately 2 minutes after she was relieved from the CPR efforts to sign for drinks that had been sitting in the hot sun for probably 20 minutes.

 

We loved this cruise, but this event gives me reason to pause as I decide on future vacations. I plan today to report my concerns on the Princess feedback email.

 

Doug

[BigTimeCruiser]

Does anyone have a photo of an AED on board any ship? I would be interested, since I have never seen one.

[antsp]

I have seen very slow response time myself in the past when an elderly person fell on the open deck, not 18 mins and not life threatening but still at least 10 mins. Another time a fight broke out on the lido deck over chair hogging of all things, someone rang security 911 and they took so long to get there the2 involved where long gone.

[iceleven]

Just to add to the OP's observations, I was also sitting approximately 15 feet from the Lido bar when this event happened. The OP did exactly as she described and the time estimation of 18 minutes has to be pretty close to being accurate. It was a very long time, and I am very concerned about Princess policies as I viewed several Princess employees including Supervisors standing around watching as the OP did all the CPR work.

 

I viewed the medical person that responded walking to the scene with the wheelchair, not even close to running.

 

I viewed the challenge that the medical person had in getting the victim to first sit up and then struggled to get her into the wheelchair.

 

I viewed the bartender come up to the OP approximately 2 minutes after she was relieved from the CPR efforts to sign for drinks that had been sitting in the hot sun for probably 20 minutes.

 

We loved this cruise, but this event gives me reason to pause as I decide on future vacations. I plan today to report my concerns on the Princess feedback email.

 

Doug

 

I've read through this thread and have only one thing to add that I don't think was mentioned. I've highlighted and enlarged the text I wish to address.

 

Regarding those Princess employees who were standing around and who were possibly also trained, I am sure could see that the OP was performing more than an adequate job and their interruption would not have improved the outcome.

 

Many years ago I was EMT trained as a first responder and the protocol may have changed since then, but once CPR has been initiated, it is not interrupted unless an extended period of time has elapsed and exhaustion becomes an issue. With the changes in the patient's condition, the CPR was interrupted and then resumed by the same person. I am curious if the OP, at any time, made an announcement that she needed assistance if the situation would have remained the same.

 

I think we all agree, at this point, that the 18 minutes had to have been a lack of effective communication between the person who called in the event and the service desk who then called the medical service. That was evident by the wheelchair arrival instead of a gurney.

 

The lady was very fortunate to have had this caring and talented woman there to attend her and save her life.

[automagrt]

I'm sure everyone read their Passage Contract, but just in case you didn't, you may want to familiarize yourself with this section :

 

12. HEALTH, MEDICAL CARE AND OTHER PERSONAL SERVICES.

Due to the nature of travel by sea and the ports visited, the availability of medical care may be limited or delayed and emergency medical evacuation may not be possible from every location to which the ship sails. All health, medical or other personal services in connection with Your Cruise are provided solely for the convenience and benefit of Passengers who may be charged for such services. You accept and use medicine, medical treatment and other personal services available on the ship or elsewhere at Your sole risk and expense without liability or responsibility of Carrier whatsoever, and agree to indemnify the Carrier for all medical or evacuation costs or expenses incurred on Your behalf. Doctors, nurses or other medical or service personnel work directly for Passenger and shall not be considered to be acting under the control or supervision of Carrier, since Carrier is not a medical provider. Similarly, and without limitation, all spa personnel, photographers, instructors, guest lecturers and entertainers and other service personnel shall be considered independent contractors who work directly for the Passenger.

[Coral]

Does anyone have a photo of an AED on board any ship? I would be interested, since I have never seen one.

 

I don't think I have ever seen one either on a ship. It may be handy to know where they are located (every floor, midship?).

 

I remember when they first became "popular". I heard that they were so easy, flight attendants could do them and that they were going to be on every plane. It wasn't until I went through CPR/AED training that I realized how easy they are. You put them on the person and the one I worked on, had voice instructions on what to do next. Impressive to whoever made these "easy for people like me".

Edited May 6, 2014 by Coral

[pcl2001]

I don't think I have ever seen one either on a ship. It may be handy to know where they are located (every floor, midship?).

 

I remember when they first became "popular". I heard that they were so easy, flight attendants could do them and that they were going to be on every plane. It wasn't until I went through CPR/AED training that I realized how easy they are. You put them on the person and the one I worked on, had voice instructions on what to do next. Impressive to whoever made these "easy for people like me".

 

There aren't any for passenger use.

[Baatman]

18 minutes seems like a very long time to respond to that situation. I would have thought the AED's should have been in place and staff trained on use, too. On one of our trips to Hawaii, can't recall which ship there were 2 nurses with back packs who responded to emergencies on the ship quickly. We watched them running through the ship several times on that 15 day cruise.

 

I agree - 18 minutes is a very long time for emergency help to arrive. I wonder if the bartender adequately explained the situation to the medical staff?

[Coral]

There aren't any for passenger use.

 

That is too bad. My college campus has them in every building and they are there for anyone to grab, if necessary. We have never had any one take them un-necessarily.

[medicalma'am]

As Americans, we have expectations of medical standards that may not be met on foreign flagged ships. I cannot say that I have seen any AEDs on any ship, and I have been on some behind the scenes tours and seen crew corridors on these tours.

 

It gives us all notice that we must give clear direction to staff to convey that CPR is ongoing so that they can respond appropriately.

 

Thank you, OP, for your efforts in saving a life! I hope you do take your concerns to corporate.

[JimAOk1945]

I don't know where you're getting your information but it's not true, not on Princess. I work there, so I think I would know. There is no first aid certificate or CPR training required for non-medical crew.

 

Wow! This is very scary information since we are scheduled to sail on the Island Princess in December! By the way, does anyone have a picture of one of these devices? If so, can you please post it?

Edited May 6, 2014 by JimAOk1945

[Cruzin-K]

An 18 minute response time is completely unacceptable! :confused::eek:

 

Agreed!

 

I saw someone fall on the Ruby Princess - fell down the Atrium steps and landed head first. It took several minutes for medical personnel to show up with a wheelchair :rolleyes: I didn't time it, but it had to be at least 8 or 9 minutes and that was just one deck away from the medical center. I could have run down there in under a minute.

[BroncoLvrs]

On our Panama Canal transit we were all gathered in the Atrium for the Balloon Drop and Dance Party. My husband and I were on Deck 7 looking at the festivities below on Deck 5. We were at the railing just to the left of where the band was playing. The CD was doing his CD thing and we were throwing streamers and having a great time. Suddenly a man collapsed in front of the band. The CD asked everyone to move away to give the man room. We were wondering why no one was helping the man and suddenly he began to turn blue. A passenger rushed to him and began CPR. My husband and I left and went back to our room sure that the man had died. Neither of us got much sleep...it really was an awful experience. The next day the CD made an announcement that the man had survived (the man actually apologized for ruining the balloon drop :D) and that evening the crew would be recognizing the passenger who had performed CPR as he had saved the man's life. Remarkable!

 

OP, thanks for your quick response...I can only hope if I am in the same situation someone like you is around.

[mammajamma2013]

"Many years ago I was EMT trained as a first responder and the protocol may have changed since then, but once CPR has been initiated, it is not interrupted unless an extended period of time has elapsed and exhaustion becomes an issue. "

 

We re-certified this past February and there have been some changes. We have been taught to do a 2-person "tag-team", relieving each other after the 30 compressions, to take over breaths/manage the AED, then switch again after 30 compressions or when the instructions from the AED warrant a change. If the supervisor was CPR trained, he *should* have taken turns with the OP, rather than leaving her to do it all herself.