Production Shows - Why So Loud?

[feathersandnananose]

In a discussion with friends about restaurants that are deliberately noisy vs. quiet ones, someone mentioned that sound level is a marketing decision:

 

noisy space, people leave sooner and the tables turn faster

 

quiet and comfortable, people stay longer and tables do not turn as fast.

 

I, too, grieve over the preponderance of noisy (open ceiling, etc.) restaurants. I actually LIKE conversation with my meals......

 

Barb in so cal

[durangoscots]

In a discussion with friends about restaurants that are deliberately noisy vs. quiet ones, someone mentioned that sound level is a marketing decision:

 

noisy space, people leave sooner and the tables turn faster

 

 

 

Now that is really a stupid marketing decision because when most of us leave, we won't be back.

 

Susan

[POA1]

If you compare music from the last decade, and the last 5 or 6 years in particular to music from the 1970s through 2000, you'll notice that there is a lot more compression applied during production. This is done to compensate for the fact that most music is played through low quality headphones like the ones that come with the iPod. Unfortunately, that type of production and processing leads to music that sounds louder and whose component sounds are much less distinguishable. Add in the fact that our ability to separate sounds and frequencies degrades as we age, and you have a recipe for some noisy music.

 

If want to know what compression is like, think Phil Spector and "the wall of sound." It's not exactly that, but it's close enough - and it was used in the early 60s, so it should be familiar.

Edited May 12, 2014 by POA1

[SargassoPirate]

I think it is a trend now that is perceived as "being exciting". At least that is how one of the young people I work with says it. And many of the restaurants here have been set up in such a way as to apparently maximize the noise. The last time we went to Lucille's it was so loud we could not hold a conversation at a small bistro (24") table. (And I do mean LAST time).

 

That is just too loud. Normally American English is spoken at approx 50 dB for a normal conversation at 3 feet apart. whisper can be around 30 dB. At around 80/85 dB one is at risk for a noise induced hearing loss. (A type of Sensory Neural hearing loss that is permanent and affects the higher frequency sounds more. Incidentally, the higher frequency sounds are the consonants - which give meaning to speech. Thus, the person may hear the voice create vowel sounds (lower frequency) but the higher frequency consonants are not there and they perceive the speech as unclear mumbles. The word "consonants" would loose the "c", "s" and "t" with a 4000 Hrtz and greater loss)).

 

I guess it would not be surprising that many musicians use custom ear mold ear plugs..... And I did notice on the kitchen tour that there headsets for hearing protection in the dish washing station.

 

I have a sound level meter app on my smart phone (not ANSI-certified of course, but it does give you an idea of how much noise there is). After sitting with our fingers in our ears for one show, I brought my phone to the next show and was getting readings of 110-115 decibels. We just stopped going to the production shows after that, even though She Who Must Be Obeyed hates to miss anything.

 

There was one entertainer on the cruise who was a concert violinist with a violin that dated back to the 1700s. Someone wired up her violin for sound and then they cranked up the volume to where the violin was making a screeching sound instead of the fine quality sound one would associate with a fine instrument and a fine performer.

[Viesczy]

 

<snip>

was getting readings of 110-115 decibels. We just stopped going to the production shows after that, even though She Who Must Be Obeyed hates to miss anything.

 

<snip>

 

 

YEESH! That is nearly double normal convo levels!

 

Derek

[POA1]

I have a sound level meter app on my smart phone (not ANSI-certified of course, but it does give you an idea of how much noise there is). After sitting with our fingers in our ears for one show, I brought my phone to the next show and was getting readings of 110-115 decibels.

 

That's car horn territory!

[SargassoPirate]

And yet, according to the ship's staff, the volume was not too loud and I was the only one to complain.

 

At least I did my part and complained. If more people did so, HAL might get a clue and lower the volume on the production shows.

[Lady Chew]

I think that many people do complain about the sound levels of production shows ... but they don't want to have to reset them. And they could easily do so, all of the vocals are prerecorded and a great deal of the music is, so the sound tech has absolute control over the levels. Now, what their instructions are or what the contract requires, is another matter!

[Lady Chew]

oops! didn't mean to SHOUT !!

[RuthC]

I couldn't agree more that the sounds in the shows are much too loud. I may an emphatic point of that in the cruise review that I completed yesterday.

 

However, that awful noise isn't limited to the shows! The overhead piped-in "music" (for wont of a better term) was everywhere. On my just completed cruise, I couldn't enjoy my morning coffee without hearing that jumpy sound. The volume of the overhead sounds when going through the shops (unavoidable on Promenade Deck on the Vista/Signature ships) was unbearable. I don't know why they would expect people to actually stop and shop when then had to listen to that constantly.

 

There was no where to go during the day, except the cabin, to just sit and read indoors without the overhead, either. Even the Explorers Lounge had too-loud classical music playing during the day most days.

I had a hard time getting to the only place where I could listen to silence---Promenade Deck outdoors, as there was no way to get my scooter out there easily, and when I walked out the loungers were a long-ish walk (for me).

 

HAL---this ever-present noise is not necessary, and not desirable. Turn off the overhead players, at least in some areas, and lower the volume where it is left playing.

[doublebzz]

all of the vocals are prerecorded and a great deal of the music is, so the sound tech has absolute control over the levels.

 

I never realized this; so I'm not listening to"live" vocals?

[RuthC]

I never realized this; so I'm not listening to"live" vocals?

 

Look to see how many people on the stage have a mic. Do you hear more voices than that?

Watch how the singers move around. Do you hear any heavy breathing? I would expect to hear some heavy breathing along with all the dancing that even the singers do.

 

I fully expect that at least some of the singing is pre-recorded.

[taxmantoo]

Have to wonder if the levels have really gone up that much or if HAL's aging guest population's tolerance to high levels has diminished. I think it is probably a combination of both factors ... A population that grew up with the Beatles and the Rolling Stones used to withstand high levels quite well.

Edited May 13, 2014 by taxmantoo

[runnergirl71]

I think that many people do complain about the sound levels of production shows ... but they don't want to have to reset them. And they could easily do so, all of the vocals are prerecorded and a great deal of the music is, so the sound tech has absolute control over the levels. Now, what their instructions are or what the contract requires, is another matter!

 

Wait, so they're not even singing??

 

Just reinforces my decision to avoid the shows at all costs!!

[sail7seas]

Now that is really a stupid marketing decision because when most of us leave, we won't be back.

 

Susan

 

 

Exactly.

If we find a restaurant too loud, we have either left or finished that dinner and put that place on our list of placed to which we will not return.

 

My girlfriend and her DH eat out constantly in the best places as well as the casual and the list of places they have eliminated is becoming extensive. They are not the only ones.

 

The key is to let the restaurant know.

 

 

[mamaofami]

I've been successful in a few restaurants in having them lower the music but only a few.

[TiogaCruiser]

YEESH! That is nearly double normal convo levels!

 

Derek

 

Ummmm, much worse. Decibels are a logarithmic scale.

[Lady Chew]

Very rarely is there live singing in the production shows ...

 

You can see the dancers singing in the chorus without any mikes, while they're dancing around like crazy ... and sometimes you can hear them singing but there are no lips moving! Sometimes the singers forget to come in on cue.

 

Occasionally they can even switch parts! That's how we first learned about the taping ... one night (Statendam, back in 2011) there were only three singers (instead of the usual four) and one of the dancers was singing the missing singer's part - with the missing singer's voice. We waited until after the show and approached the sound tech and he just stared at us a few minutes, then he hemmed & hawed, then admitted that all of the voices were taped for just such an emergency (the singer had a death in the family & had to leave). Then we spoke with the male singers ... they were kind of flippant about it "yeah, doesn't everybody tape?" ...

[SargassoPirate]

That's good info. I never realized the voices were taped. Guess I won't feel so bad about skipping the shows when they are too loud.

 

Since the shows are not really "live", maybe I'll just send "Flat Stanley" to sit in my seat!

[pharmom5]

Very rarely is there live singing in the production shows ...

 

You can see the dancers singing in the chorus without any mikes, while they're dancing around like crazy ... and sometimes you can hear them singing but there are no lips moving! Sometimes the singers forget to come in on cue.

 

Occasionally they can even switch parts! That's how we first learned about the taping ... one night (Statendam, back in 2011) there were only three singers (instead of the usual four) and one of the dancers was singing the missing singer's part - with the missing singer's voice. We waited until after the show and approached the sound tech and he just stared at us a few minutes, then he hemmed & hawed, then admitted that all of the voices were taped for just such an emergency (the singer had a death in the family & had to leave). Then we spoke with the male singers ... they were kind of flippant about it "yeah, doesn't everybody tape?" ...

 

Just have to reply that the singers do most definitely sing live, because my daughter is a singer/dancer on the Westerdam right now. On a show day, they do the show 3 times, singing at all of them. I'm sure there are backup tapes for emergency situations such as a death in the family of a performer, in which case someone who is usually a dancer would probably lip sync to the tape of one of the singers. Even in that case, I'm sure that all the other singers are still live.

[HatRez]

My DH and I went to a concert that was so loud and distorted we could barely hear the lyrics. It was migraine-inducing. We asked the security guard for earplugs and they do carry them. With the earplugs in we could hear the music, the singing and none of the bass or distortion. Other than that it was unbearable. So maybe on a cruise, pack a pair of earplugs.