Turkey - anyone worried?

[sfaaa]

It does not appear anyone is targeting tourists in Istanbul. The places attacked are not places were cruise tourists generally go, nor are they particularly close to the ship.

 

l.

 

Come again? ISIS is targeting all infidels and non believers wherever they are. There is no exclusion or exception on their target list. That means all westerners and fellow muslims who don't submit to their radical religious beliefs. At least that's what Jihadi John said.

[hawkeyetlse]

ISIS is targeting all infidels and non believers wherever they are.

One must distinguish what ISIS would like to do, and what they are realistically able to do. Up to now, as far as I know, they have not carried out a single attack in Istanbul. (In fact, Turkey has even been accused of being on ISIS's side.) Yesterday's attacks were the work of the DHKP-C and the PKK, which are both enemies of ISIS. Yes, things are complicated in Turkey, and terrorist activity will certainly continue. But for now there is no indication that tourists in Istanbul face a specific threat from any of these groups.

[cruisemom42]

Come again? ISIS is targeting all infidels and non believers wherever they are. There is no exclusion or exception on their target list. That means all westerners and fellow muslims who don't submit to their radical religious beliefs. At least that's what Jihadi John said.

 

I thought it was clear that I was speaking within the context of the attacks recently carried out in Istanbul.

 

If you want to get all meta on us, then no one is safe anywhere, not even in one's own home, so you might as well get out and see the world.

[Evangaline]

It already said that before yesterday's attacks. That exact text has been there since at least 2012. Things have been like this in Istanbul for a long time. The attacks are not "now in Istanbul"; there were much worse terrorist bombings in 1999, 2003, 2004, 2008, 2010, …

 

The update includes specific reference to the attacks in Istanbul on August 10, 2015. The title reads" Last updated August 11, 2015 10:18 ET. The update is under the security tab, paragraph three under the title, "terrorism".

[hawkeyetlse]

The update includes specific reference to the attacks in Istanbul on August 10, 2015. The title reads" Last updated August 11, 2015 10:18 ET. The update is under the security tab, paragraph three under the title, "terrorism".

Yes, they added two sentences about August 10. But that is all they added; they did not add any travel advisories or strengthen the existing warnings. I was referring in particular to this statement of yours:

It now warns that targets frequented by foreigners are vulnerable and are targets for terrorism. It goes on to say there are heightened security measures throughout the country, but to be especially vigilant in areas "where foreigners congregate". Specific examples included hotels, public transit stations and open bazaars.

That paragraph was not added yesterday. It has been there for years.

 

It sounds to me like you are looking for someone to confirm to you that the most recent attacks were a big deal and that Istanbul is significantly more dangerous today than it was two days ago. The unfortunate reality is that terrorist attacks are nothing new in Istanbul, and residents and regular visitors have learned to live with this risk in the background.

[Wiltonian]

Compare the number of homicides in the U.S. with numbers killed by terrorists or others in Istanbul and Western Turkey, and if you were logical, you'd avoid any cruises that visit the U.S., and NYC in particular. People in glasshouses shouldn't throw stones.

 

Stuart

[4774Papa]

Compare the number of homicides in the U.S. with numbers killed by terrorists or others in Istanbul and Western Turkey, and if you were logical, you'd avoid any cruises that visit the U.S., and NYC in particular. People in glasshouses shouldn't throw stones.

 

Stuart

Stuart,

Good point. The key difference about visiting the USA is WHERE in the USA you go.

 

Violent crime is extremely low in the places that foreign tourists will visit.

There are areas of major American cities that the local people know to avoid. Even in the daytime, you don't go there.

 

For example, if you visit Washington, D.C., and go to the Mall, Washington Monument, Smithsonian, White House, and Georgetown, etc, the crime statistics are very low. However, if you are foolish enough to visit the Anacostia area a few miles across the Anacostia river, you could be in trouble.

 

Some years ago there was an incident of a German tourist couple that took the wrong exit off the Interstate in Miami and wound up in Liberty City. They didn't make it out of Liberty City. A sad case, but important one to remember.

[Wiltonian]

Stuart,

Good point. The key difference about visiting the USA is WHERE in the USA you go.

 

Violent crime is extremely low in the places that foreign tourists will visit.

There are areas of major American cities that the local people know to avoid. Even in the daytime, you don't go there.

 

I know, having visited many of them. But that's the point about Turkey; it depends where you go. Istanbul remains a possible target, but still you're statistically unlikely to be affected. Kusadasi is even safer. Going 1000km west, and the picture is different.

 

Stuart

[Andym]

Just got back from Kusadassi and we had an attempted robbery on us. Two guys got one in front and one behind and tried to get my camera off of us. Pleased to say that they didn't get anywhere with it and ran off. We have always felt safe there , but this time we were hassled to death on every street. I know you get hassled but this time it was just over the top.

[LondonTowner]

Andym

Sorry you had an attempted robbery. However, the couple of times I have been to Kusadasi on a land holiday I have found the hassling from vendors the worst I have ever encountered in Arab/Middle Eastern countries.

[cruisemom42]

Andym

Sorry you had an attempted robbery. However, the couple of times I have been to Kusadasi on a land holiday I have found the hassling from vendors the worst I have ever encountered in Arab/Middle Eastern countries.

 

It is pretty bad, but I've experienced worse (or at least just as bad) in Egypt and also in a couple of places in the Caribbean.

[trvlgirlmq]

I'm choosing to be optimistic that any issues will at the least not get worse in the next 10 months. Not only do we have a port stop at Izmir next June we are flying Turkish Airlines with changes at Ataturk in both directions (coming and going to the US).

 

We've got thousands of dollars in airfare, cruise fare and other bookings that are non-refundable and not being able to access Turkey would be devastating financially for this trip as well as the fact that we booked our particular cruise so we could visit Ephesus.

[cruisemom42]

I'm choosing to be optimistic that any issues will at the least not get worse in the next 10 months. Not only do we have a port stop at Izmir next June we are flying Turkish Airlines with changes at Ataturk in both directions (coming and going to the US).

 

We've got thousands of dollars in airfare, cruise fare and other bookings that are non-refundable and not being able to access Turkey would be devastating financially for this trip as well as the fact that we booked our particular cruise so we could visit Ephesus.

 

Do you not purchase travel insurance?

[trvlgirlmq]

Do you not purchase travel insurance?

 

 

Never have. I looked into it but the cheapest was over $700 and had to be bought within 3 weeks of our initial deposit. After putting down almost $2000 there was nothing left until we saved more.

[HLGW60]

Costa Cruises is suspending port calls in Istanbul and Izmir for the remainder of 2015. We have a cruise with a port stop in Izmir for May 2016 with Carnival. Can't help but wonder if the itinerary might be changed for the new Carnival VISTA.http://www.usatoday.com/story/travel/cruises/cruiselog/2015/08/19/costa-cruises-cancels-port-calls-turkey/31984881/

[Mercruiser]

Do you not purchase travel insurance?

 

I've bought travel insurance on several occasions. But looking at the fine print, it is not apparent that travel insurance would cover this kind of event. You buy non refundable air fare, then the cruise line cancels the Turkish port calls. You are then stuck with airplane tickets for a cruise you no longer want to go on. I don't see this as a covered condition for any travel insurance I've ever bought. You would probably get all of your money back from the cruise line if they changed the embarkation port. Not sure if they would allow you to cancel if they just dropped a port call.

 

Sent from my Nexus 7

Edited August 20, 2015 by Mercruiser

[dabear]

I've bought travel insurance on several occasions. But looking at the fine print, it is not apparent that travel insurance would cover this kind of event. You buy non refundable air fare, then the cruise line cancels the Turkish port calls. You are then stuck with airplane tickets for a cruise you no longer want to go on. I don't see this as a covered condition for any travel insurance I've ever bought. You would probably get all of your money back from the cruise line if they changed the embarkation port. Not sure if they would allow you to cancel if they just dropped a port call.

 

Sent from my Nexus 7

 

If you buy travel insurance from a third party and choose the insurance that pays for any reason for cancellation (very expensive option), I believe all costs, including air, are covered. in addition, I know when you book a cruise that includes air in the price (not the same as choice air),eg Regent, and use third party insurer, air is included.

 

Unfortunately in the cruise lines contract, they always have the right to change itineraries. Changing port stops happens far more than changing embarkation ports since logistics is far more difficult.

Edited August 20, 2015 by dabear

[cruisemom42]

If you buy travel insurance from a third party and choose the insurance that pays for any reason for cancellation (very expensive option), I believe all costs, including air, are covered. in addition, I know when you book a cruise that includes air in the price (not the same as choice air),eg Regent, and use third party insurer, air is included.

 

Unfortunately in the cruise lines contract, they always have the right to change itineraries. Changing port stops happens far more than changing embarkation ports since logistics is far more difficult.

 

Yes -- I have purchased "cancel for any reason" insurance from a 3rd party provider -- you can cover the cost of the cruise + airfare or any other costs.

 

It is not cheap. I generally have purchased that type if I am planning travel to an area that is somewhat higher in risk (e.g., I took a cruise a few years ago that started in Egypt then visited Syria and Lebanon!).

 

I sympathize with the other poster in that you cannot always know about new risks that pop up. On the other hand, sometimes if you opt to take a cruise you have to be willing to go with the flow, at least somewhat. Cruiselines can and often do change a port. The prevailing wisdom regarding cruises is that if a particular port of call or country are overwhelmingly important to you, you are better off with a land trip.

Edited August 20, 2015 by cruisemom42

[tring]

A cruise is somewhat better than land holidays in some respects as they are still going to take a ship somewhere, so there would be a holiday available and if it is a substantial change they would have to offer a refund or allow a change of booking with our law, (I do not know about US obviously).

 

For land holidays over here the insurance will pay out if our Foriegn and Commonwealth Office advise against travel, (as they have now done for Tunisia, for instance), but not otherwise. In fact the holiday companies usually allow changes to holiday plans in that case, (I think there is some requirement on them under ABTA rules).

 

By far the main reason for taking holiday insurance is in case medical problems prevent travel, or if you are ill abroad - bills for Med treatment and other costs if a serious illness happens will leave many people without their home as that is their only way to raise that of that sort of money.

Edited August 20, 2015 by tring

[cruisemom42]

A cruise is somewhat better than land holidays in some respects as they are still going to take a ship somewhere, so there would be a holiday available and if it is a substantial change they would have to offer a refund or allow a change of booking with our law, (I do not know about US obviously).

 

For land holidays over here the insurance will pay out if our Foriegn and Commonwealth Office advise against travel, (as they have now done for Tunisia, for instance), but not otherwise. In fact the holiday companies usually allow changes to holiday plans in that case, (I think there is some requirement on them under ABTA rules).

 

By far the main reason for taking holiday insurance is in case medical problems prevent travel, or if you are ill abroad - bills for Med treatment and other costs if a serious illness happens will leave many people without their home as that is their only way to raise that of that sort of money.

 

I'm not sure in the US whether it is mandatory to offer a refund or opportunity to rebook unless the cruise is either canceled or the complete geography is changed(e.g., Eastern Med vs. Western Med). However, many lines do offer some credit as a goodwill gesture if there are itinerary changes.

 

I have several times taken insurance against the risk of having to cancel a trip for reasons of work (e.g., not being allowed to take a vacation due to inability to leave work at that time), and also for risk of travel delays (e.g., when the Iceland volcano was acting up and causing flight cancellations between US and Europe). And, as previously mentioned, due to planned travel in areas where there is some risk of actions that would make travel undesirable. So while medical cost is certainly one reason for getting insurance, it's not the only reason.

Edited August 20, 2015 by cruisemom42

[HLGW60]

I've bought travel insurance on several occasions. But looking at the fine print, it is not apparent that travel insurance would cover this kind of event. You buy non refundable air fare, then the cruise line cancels the Turkish port calls. You are then stuck with airplane tickets for a cruise you no longer want to go on. I don't see this as a covered condition for any travel insurance I've ever bought. You would probably get all of your money back from the cruise line if they changed the embarkation port. Not sure if they would allow you to cancel if they just dropped a port call.

 

Sent from my Nexus 7

 

I want to preface my remarks by saying it depends on the policy you bought. For my insurance.....they would pay the reissue fee for airplane fare. if the cruise line cancels the whole cruise or changes the cruise itinerary before departure, then the cruise line would refund your money or give you credit for another cruise. If there is just a change in itinerary after the cruise begins with different ports then there would be no refund.

 

When you are visiting a foreign country it is extremely important to buy travel insurance for the medical coverage and medical evacuation. Your health insurance at home in most cases will not cover you abroad. Most people can absorb the cost of the cruise/airfare but not the hundred thousands of dollars for medical care if one should have a heart attack, surgery, or anything that would require an extended stay in a hospital.

Edited August 20, 2015 by HLGW60

[Evangaline]

My cruise next month with Celebrity starts in Istanbul. I have booked my air with Choice Air. If, theoretically, Celebrity decided to change the embarkation port, would I be covered for the cost of changing to get to the new embarkation point because I booked through Choice Air?

[cruisemom42]

My cruise next month with Celebrity starts in Istanbul. I have booked my air with Choice Air. If, theoretically, Celebrity decided to change the embarkation port, would I be covered for the cost of changing to get to the new embarkation point because I booked through Choice Air?

 

You're more likely to get an answer to this on the Celebrity board, but I would think that since it is Celebrity's air program, you would be covered.

[nordski]

My cruise next month with Celebrity starts in Istanbul. I have booked my air with Choice Air. If, theoretically, Celebrity decided to change the embarkation port, would I be covered for the cost of changing to get to the new embarkation point because I booked through Choice Air?

 

 

My guess would be that, since this is an embarkation port, it would be very unlikely that that port would be changed unless there is a significant increase in violence or travel advisories are amended to warn that consular aid will be limited.

 

The logistical issues raised would be significant.

[Evangaline]

My guess would be that, since this is an embarkation port, it would be very unlikely that that port would be changed unless there is a significant increase in violence or travel advisories are amended to warn that consular aid will be limited.

 

The logistical issues raised would be significant.

 

Istanbul was the embarkation port for some of the Costa cruises when the Turkey ports were cancelled. If you go on the Costa forums, there were posters trying to figure out how to change their airfare from Istanbul to Athens. One whose cruise is in November just decided to just go to Istanbul as planned, then add a flight to Athens to board the ship.