Cuba offered

[Christine Frances]

Ah, so you agree they were voted into power instead of being a dictatorial regime? :rolleyes:

 

Apparently they are still socialists though, right?

[Who Cares?]

Well you can always float in circles around the Caribbean:) Just not for us.

 

Actually, I love the Caribbean and still have many new ports to visit without Cuba being one of them. Alaska was also fabulous and I can't wait to try South America, Hawaii, and The Mexican Riviera. Even if the only thing available was to "float in circles around the Caribbean" I'd pick that (or just not cruise at all) over sailing to and supporting Cuba (or Russia, China, Vietnam, and North Korea).

[Who Cares?]

Apparently they are still socialists though, right?

 

Well, you could say the same of America now with Obama in office, couldn't you. The difference is in DR, they have elections, in Cuba they don't. It is a dictator. If you can't or refuse to see the difference, then there is no hope in trying to explain it to you.

[Christine Frances]

Actually, I love the Caribbean and still have many new ports to visit without Cuba being one of them. Alaska was also fabulous and I can't wait to try South America, Hawaii, and The Mexican Riviera. Even if the only thing available was to "float in circles around the Caribbean" I'd pick that (or just not cruise at all) over sailing to and supporting Cuba (or Russia, China, Vietnam, and North Korea).

 

Too bad:( You don't have to agree with the politics of the country you visit to travel there. Otherwise we would never visit the US:) It is called travel, learning, experiencing but not judging.

[Big_G]

Besides jailing dissidents and other civil rights violations let's not forget Cuba:

 

• Stole millions from US companies doing business in their country
  
• Pointed nuclear missiles at the US
  
• Possibly conspired in the assassination of a US President
  
• Exported their revolution to three Central American countries
  
• Shot down two unarmed US civilian aircraft that were doing leaflet drops
  
• Emptied their prisons of some of their worst criminals and sent them to the US
  

Right or wrong, they're just a few reasons why some Americans have a different perspective on Cuba.

[Scrapnana]

I definitely want to go but as a tourist. Traveling solo, $3600 for a week on Carnival is way too much.

 

Last month on Liberty the captain was asked about RCI going to Cuba. He said he expected it to happen within a few years.

Edited November 11, 2015 by Scrapnana

[time4u2go]

In the minority ... but, but, but ... having a hard time wanting to go to a place where people are still risking their lives to escape.

 

LuLu

 

As opposed to, say, Mexico? :rolleyes:

Edited November 11, 2015 by time4u2go

[Christine Frances]

Besides jailing dissidents and other civil rights violations let's not forget Cuba:

 

• Stole millions from US companies doing business in their country
  
• Pointed nuclear missiles at the US
  
• Possibly conspired in the assassination of a US President
  
• Exported their revolution to three Central American countries
  
• Shot down two unarmed US civilian aircraft that were doing leaflet drops
  
• Emptied their prisons of some of their worst criminals and sent them to the US
  

Right or wrong, they're just a few reasons why some Americans have a different perspective on Cuba.

 

Let's not forget the reason Fidel Castro came to power or had a mad on for the US either.

 

Back in power, Batista suspended the 1940 Constitution and revoked most political liberties, including the right to strike. He then aligned with the wealthiest landowners who owned the largest sugar plantations, and presided over a stagnating economy that widened the gap between rich and poor Cubans.[5] Batista's increasingly corrupt and repressive government then began to systematically profit from the exploitation of Cuba's commercial interests, by negotiating lucrative relationships with the American mafia, who controlled the drug, gambling, and prostitution businesses in Havana, and with large US-based multinationals who were awarded lucrative contracts.[5][6] To quell the growing discontent amongst the populace—which was subsequently displayed through frequent student riots and demonstrations—Batista established tighter censorship of the media, while also utilizing his Bureau for the Repression of Communist Activities to carry out wide-scale violence, torture and public executions; ultimately killing anywhere from 1,000 to 20,000 people.[7][8][9] For several years until 1959, the Batista government received financial, military, and logistical support from the United States.[10]

Catalyzing the resistance to such tactics, for two years (December 1956 – December 1958) Fidel Castro's July 26 Movement and other nationalist rebelling elements led an urban and rural-based guerrilla uprising against Batista's government, which culminated in his eventual defeat by rebels under the command of Che Guevara at the Battle of Santa Clara on New Year's Day 1959. Batista immediately fled the island with an amassed personal fortune to the Dominican Republic, where strongman and previous military ally Rafael Trujillo held power. Batista eventually found political asylum in Oliveira Salazar's Portugal, where he lived until dying of a heart attack on August 6, 1973, near Marbella, Spain.[11]

 

Sorry, not much sympathy here.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fulgencio_Batista

Edited November 11, 2015 by Christine Frances

[John&LaLa]

Actually, I love the Caribbean and still have many new ports to visit without Cuba being one of them. Alaska was also fabulous and I can't wait to try South America, Hawaii, and The Mexican Riviera. Even if the only thing available was to "float in circles around the Caribbean" I'd pick that (or just not cruise at all) over sailing to and supporting Cuba (or Russia, China, Vietnam, and North Korea).

 

I take it you don't shop much. I would bet the device you are typing on came from China

[John&LaLa]

Well, you could say the same of America now with Obama in office, couldn't you. The difference is in DR, they have elections, in Cuba they don't. It is a dictator. If you can't or refuse to see the difference, then there is no hope in trying to explain it to you.

 

But as you say, who cares

[Big_G]

 

Sorry, not much sympathy here.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fulgencio_Batista

 

No one wants your sympathy but how about a little empathy for those Americans who don't have short memories.

[BeachChik]

There have been several Cuba threads over the last few months. It always amuses me how those that want to go feel the need to poke at those that say they won't or don't want to go to Cuba. It's as if they feel the need to justify their choice for some reason.

 

There are several places I won't go for various reasons. My choice just as it is others choice to go. There is no right or wrong answer, only personal preference.

[SteelMagnolia9]

If a U.S. citizen wishes to travel to Cuba, there are a number of land-based tour companies who will take you there, including Tauck and Globus. Even our local university is sponsoring a trip to Cuba next year.

 

Pearl Seas Cruises is offering cruises from Miami to Cuba in 2016, http://www.pearlseascruises.com

 

If one is truly interested in visiting the country of Cuba, there are many opportunities to do so right now - one does not need to wait for a cruiseline to make it a port of call.

[Diplomacy]

No one wants your sympathy but how about a little empathy for those Americans who don't have short memories.

 

Holding onto the cold war like a security blanket isn't about the length of one's memory, its about American exceptionalism, jingoism and perpetuating bigotry and it is a flawed theme in a lot of American's belief systems. I never found frank burns to be the kind of character that you should, or would empathize with, and I don't think I ever will.

 

There have been several Cuba threads over the last few months. It always amuses me how those that want to go feel the need to poke at those that say they won't or don't want to go to Cuba.

This thread wasn't derailed by someone who said they wouldn't go. I said I wouldn't go also. What they said was "I would never go to any communist or socialist country" which is both a foolish attitude and an impractical one. I'm not surprised that comment got the temperature to rise. It would be like refusing to come to America because of our education system. It's a little silly.

Edited November 11, 2015 by Diplomacy

[Big_G]

Holding onto the cold war like a security blanket isn't about the length of one's memory, its about American exceptionalism, jingoism and perpetuating bigotry and it is a flawed theme in a lot of American's belief systems. I never found frank burns to be the kind of character that you should, or would empathize with, and I don't think I ever will.

 

Nice gobbledygook but it's just that, liberal gobbledygook.

[Big_G]

 

Sorry, not much sympathy here.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fulgencio_Batista

 

No one wants your sympathy but how about a little empathy for those Americans who don't have short memories.

 

Just to be clear Christine, I'm not criticizing anyone that wants to go. Just pointing out the other side of it. I don't think people should be criticized for standing on their principles.

[Diplomacy]

Nice gobbledygook but it's just that, liberal gobbledygook.

 

Reality has a liberal bias.

[Who Cares?]

I take it you don't shop much. I would bet the device you are typing on came from China

 

I shop plenty. The device I'm typing on was purchased from Japanese company. How or where they procured it from really isn't my concern nor is it my concern how they spent my money after I gave it to them.

[Who Cares?]

Too bad:( You don't have to agree with the politics of the country you visit to travel there. Otherwise we would never visit the US:) It is called travel, learning, experiencing but not judging.

 

I have traveled to 29 countries in my life (with your country being one of them). I have learned plenty. And that is why I'm allowed to judge for myself. There isn't a single person on this site (yourself included) that doesn't judge in one way or another, we just all use different aspects to judge by.

Edited November 11, 2015 by Who Cares?

[Who Cares?]

This thread wasn't derailed by someone who said they wouldn't go. I said I wouldn't go also. What they said was "I would never go to any communist or socialist country" which is both a foolish attitude and an impractical one. I'm not surprised that comment got the temperature to rise. It would be like refusing to come to America because of our education system. It's a little silly.

 

How is it any sillier than someone who claims they won't sail a cruise line because they got rid of lobster tail in the MDR? :rolleyes:

 

Everyone has standards. ;) I don't care what your standards are just as you don't care what my standards are. As long as LAWS are not being violated, we are each free to do as we please, silly or not.

[Who Cares?]

Reality has a liberal bias.

 

To a liberal. :rolleyes:

[alfaeric]

Besides jailing dissidents and other civil rights violations let's not forget Cuba:

 

• Stole millions from US companies doing business in their country
  
• Pointed nuclear missiles at the US
  
• Possibly conspired in the assassination of a US President
  
• Exported their revolution to three Central American countries
  
• Shot down two unarmed US civilian aircraft that were doing leaflet drops
  
• Emptied their prisons of some of their worst criminals and sent them to the US
  

Right or wrong, they're just a few reasons why some Americans have a different perspective on Cuba.

 

Interesting that you try to point out that people forget or ignore that.

 

As we, the US, have conspired and attempted to assassinate Castro. Lots of crazy ways to come up with how. Until congress outlawed that.

 

While Cuba sponsored Russia for pointing nukes at us, we did point them back. Neither is right.

 

The CIA sponsored and backed an attempted revolution of Cuba. Remember the Bay of Pigs?

 

We also had countless illegal fly overs of the country, spying on them.

 

And who knows the realistic economic impact on Cuba for the embargo- which has changed nothing.

 

I'm not saying that one should support Cuba, but if one is going to point out that that Cuba has done wrong, and implying that people forgot their history. One should also remember that the US was not sitting back and doing nothing all of this time, too.

 

If you don't want to go, great. But if you are going to bring up history, well...

[Aquahound]

This thread wasn't derailed by someone who said they wouldn't go. I said I wouldn't go also. What they said was "I would never go to any communist or socialist country" which is both a foolish attitude and an impractical one. I'm not surprised that comment got the temperature to rise. It would be like refusing to come to America because of our education system. It's a little silly.

 

I really don't care if people want to go to Cuba or not but for those who don't, citing communism and socialism is about the best reason I can think of. Just because it doesn't fit your line of thinking doesn't mean they are foolish or impractical. I think that reason makes the most sense considering the infringement on human rights created by communism.

[alfaeric]

I really don't care if people want to go to Cuba or not but for those who don't, citing communism and socialism is about the best reason I can think of. Just because it doesn't fit your line of thinking doesn't mean they are foolish or impractical. I think that reason makes the most sense considering the infringement on human rights created by communism.

 

Conversely, it also does not allow for those who don't want to go due to their beliefs to label people who do want to go as flaming liberals.

 

I'm interested in meeting Cuban people, not their government.

[Aquahound]

Conversely, it also does not allow for those who don't want to go due to their beliefs to label people who do want to go as flaming liberals.

 

I'm not the one who said that. I was trying to be sensible, not name calling.