Holland America Insurance FAIL

[cruz chic]

It has been many years since we stopped purchasing HAL insurance and I am curious about one of the reasons we stopped insuring for cancellation.

 

When you purchase HAL's Platinum, the premium is based upon the price of the cruise, correct?

 

If that is accurate, what do they use as the price of the cruise? The amount you are actually paying or the full brochure price?

 

When we first started cruising HAL, the insurance was very, very low and we added it for our first few cruises. We always booked "S" cabins as Neptune Suites were then called. At some point, they started charging premium based upon full brochure price of the cruise and we chose to start self-insuring given the price of our cabins was high and the premiums jumped considerably. In our case, it was a great choice as we never had to cancel during penalty phase for any of our many cruises and saved literally tens of thousands of dollars in unpaid premiums.

 

(We had other evacuation and medical coverage out of country.)

So they charged for more than you paid? If so, that is insane. Now, if you pay let's say $5k for cruise you'll pay insurance on the $5k, no more.

[Jade13]

You did not understand what you purchased. Until you are within 24 hours of departure it is NOT insurance, but travel protection covered by HAL. With the platinum policy you can cancel the cabin for any reason (no reason given) and get back 90% of what you paid. Within the 24 hour period it turns into actual insurance that is covered by an insurance company and would cover things such as medical evacuation, lost baggage and medical claims.

 

There have been numerous discussions here, but the cancel for any reason which is the platinum does not work well for unrelated people who would still travel without the other because it does not cover the single supplement. It has to be that way otherwise some whose only intention is to travel as a solo would book the cabin with someone else, pay for the platinum coverage and then cancel one person with intensions of saving the solo traveler thousands of dollars.

 

This was not the right policy for your situation. You needed travel insurance where your companion was canceling for a medical reason that did not affect you as a solo traveler.

 

I do not know if there have been changes to the policy recently but the workaround that someone mentioned is to have your friend cancel within 24 hours of departure but before departure. The insurance part of the policy should kick in at this point and your companion would actually be canceling and making a medical claim through the insurance company.

Edited November 27, 2015 by Jade13

[knittinggirl]

We just cancelled our Holland America cruise on the day of the cruise due to illness. By the time i got home a few days later, Holland America had already refunded my prepaid excursions. But when I booked and prepaid a shore excursion made through a roll call, I did not get my money back. But I knew what I was getting into when I put up the money.

 

TA is still putting together the insurance claim.

 

I'd call the hotel and ask for a refund. I made one of those advanced purchase nonrefundable reservations, then got the Marriiott loyalty to cancel the reservation for me. We've paid thousands of dollars to their chain over the years.

 

NOw we're very careful, because those annoying advanced purchase nonrefundables pop up at the top of the list when researching reservations.

Edited November 27, 2015 by knittinggirl

[jaxonboy]

Cruise line sells a cabin to two people. Both buy insurance. One can't go, so insurance company pays them for their covered loss. Cruise line still has the money for the two bookings. Cruise line then charges the remaining guest a single supplement. Why? It is not a single, it is a double occupancy.

 

Cruise line sells a cabin to two people. Nobody buys cancellation insurance. One guest decides not to go. Cruise line charges the guest that does go a single supplement. This is not what happens is it?

 

One way to look at it is that in both examples, the cruise line in reality already has the single supplement. Some might call this good business, I call it criminal.

[richstowe]

Like sail7seas, we self insure so I'm am foggy on the details . Can 2 independent travel companions "be a couple" for the purposes of travel insurance ?

[durangoscots]

The canceling party gets their money back, but now the OP has to pay double, that makes the insurance worthless. .

 

Not to the canceling party. OP - I had to deal with this a few years back when the friend traveling with me cancelled due to a family emergency. I wound up paying the single supplement .... or, I could have cancelled also and gotten my 90% back .... and it is pretty clear if you read the contract.

 

Susan

[dakrewser]

Cruise line sells a cabin to two people. Both buy insurance. One can't go, so insurance company pays them for their covered loss. Cruise line still has the money for the two bookings. Cruise line then charges the remaining guest a single supplement. Why? It is not a single, it is a double occupancy.

 

Cruise line sells a cabin to two people. Nobody buys cancellation insurance. One guest decides not to go. Cruise line charges the guest that does go a single supplement. This is not what happens is it?

 

One way to look at it is that in both examples, the cruise line in reality already has the single supplement. Some might call this good business, I call it criminal.

 

Go back and read what Jade13 posted 20 minutes before your post.

 

It's always best to read the entire thread before posting.

[sail7seas]

So they charged for more than you paid? If so, that is insane. Now, if you pay let's say $5k for cruise you'll pay insurance on the $5k, no more.

 

Thank you for understanding, cruz chic.

YES, if we wanted to buy their cancellation insurance, the premium was predicated upon the brochure price for the cruise.... NOT on what we paid. A very senior Management person from Seattle once asked me if we wrote their insurance (I suspect they knew the answer when asking) and if not, why not. I responded I did not wish to pay premiums for more insurance than I could ever collect. They stared blankly at me. I went on to add that if I had to pay premium on $10,000 for the cruise but we only paid $8,500 for that cruise, I was buying more insurance than they would ever pay out. That person agreed that was accurate.

 

I never thought to look again and price it and this thread got me wondering if the person with whom I was speaking had addressed that issue and things had changed.

 

Edited November 28, 2015 by sail7seas

[jaxonboy]

Go back and read what Jade13 posted 20 minutes before your post.

 

It's always best to read the entire thread before posting.

 

My post refers to insurance in the first paragraph. I have read the entire thread, i couldn't believe the number of cruisers that felt the OP was unreasonable.

[Dashwood100]

Tom O - is correct three fares for a single cabin is unfair. I will not purchase said insurance either.

[cruz chic]

Thank you for understanding, cruz chic.

YES, if we wanted to buy their cancellation insurance, the premium was predicated upon the brochure price for the cruise.... NOT on what we paid. A very senior Management person from Seattle once asked me if we wrote their insurance (I suspect they knew the answer when asking) and if not, why not. I responded I did not wish to pay premiums for more insurance than I could ever collect. They stared blankly at me. I went on to add that if I had to pay premium on $10,000 for the cruise but we only paid $8,500 for that cruise, I was buying more insurance than they would ever pay out. That person agreed that was accurate.

 

I never thought to look again and price it and this thread got me wondering if the person with whom I was speaking had addressed that issue and things had changed.

 

 

How strange. It is still expensive but I really like that you can cancel for any reason. The way my life has been for a few years now, I need that.

[Jade13]

Tom O - is correct three fares for a single cabin is unfair. I will not purchase said insurance either.

 

 

They are no three fares. HAL gives back 90% of the fare to the one person canceling and if the other wants to keep the cruise they need to pay the single supplement. This is only cancelations made prior to the 24 hours before departure. In most cases there is a couple canceling together.

Edited November 28, 2015 by Jade13

[TiogaCruiser]

Sail,

While it don't have an answer on the way HAL's is priced (brochure fee or actual fee), I can tell you that last cruise, I purchased an upsell. I had platinum. The agent asked me if I wanted to add the additional fare on to the policy, or leave it off. Adding it would cost me approximately 10% of the add on. Of course, if I chose not to add the upsell fee, the amount I would get back would not be calculated on the fare + upsell. So it appears it MAY have changed.

 

I have a cruise booked in a few weeks, which I bought platinum for. I will check and report back. I think it was about 10% to cover the trip.

 

In my situation in the past years it makes more financial and risk balancing sense for me to cover a cruise with HAL's policy. I am going solo, so my cancellation does not put another at risk of a SS, or having to cancel also. And the return is much better (for less cost) should I have to cancel or end the trip early. I just add some medical and evacuation coverage for less than $20.

[cruz chic]

Sail,

While it don't have an answer on the way HAL's is priced (brochure fee or actual fee), I can tell you that last cruise, I purchased an upsell. I had platinum. The agent asked me if I wanted to add the additional fare on to the policy, or leave it off. Adding it would cost me approximately 10% of the add on. Of course, if I chose not to add the upsell fee, the amount I would get back would not be calculated on the fare + upsell. So it appears it MAY have changed.

 

I have a cruise booked in a few weeks, which I bought platinum for. I will check and report back. I think it was about 10% to cover the trip.

 

In my situation in the past years it makes more financial and risk balancing sense for me to cover a cruise with HAL's policy. I am going solo, so my cancellation does not put another at risk of a SS, or having to cancel also. And the return is much better (for less cost) should I have to cancel or end the trip early. I just add some medical and evacuation coverage for less than $20.

 

I thought it was around 10% as well so we're both right or both wrong.

[Hlitner]

My problem with the HAL (and most other cruise lines) policy is the Medical Limit of only $10,000. Without insurance one can only lose the cost of a cruise, air, perhaps a hotel which is money you were going to spend anyway. But a major medical problem that happens out of the country can cost 10s of thousands or even 6 figures. Many HAL cruisers are on Medicare and rely only on the HAL insurance....and we think this is crazy. These folks are worrying about losing the cost of a cruise (which is a limited liability) while willing to gamble on the unlimited liability related to a serious medical problem. Go figure.

 

Hank

[dakrewser]

My post refers to insurance in the first paragraph. I have read the entire thread, i couldn't believe the number of cruisers that felt the OP was unreasonable.

 

I don't think anyone said the OP was unreasonable, just that the OP misunderstood what the refund and single supplement were.

 

The bottom line is that the cancelling passenger gets teir monery back (90% of it) and the OP can continue on the cruise by pating the single supplement. By waiting until less than 24 hours before the cruise, the insurance (as opposed to refund) kicks in and there's no longer a need to pay the single supplement.

[OVgirl]

Here is the waiver information regarding being charged the single supplement.

 

SECTION I

Cancel for Any Reason Waiver

Provided by Holland America Line

You may cancel for any reason prior to the start of your scheduled travel (sea, land and/or air) arrangements made by Holland America Line and receive reimbursement equal to 90% of the eligible amounts paid to Holland America Line. Note: CPP Platinum does not protect double-triple-quad occupancy rates should one or more members of your party cancel prior to departure.

 

http://www.hollandamerica.com/cruise-vacation-planning/PlanningAndAdvice.action?tabName=Cruise+Preparation&contentMenu=Changes+%26+Cancellations&contentSubMenu=Do+You+Offer+A+Cancellation+Protection+Plan%3F

[sail7seas]

Here is the waiver information regarding being charged the single supplement.

 

SECTION I

Cancel for Any Reason Waiver

Provided by Holland America Line

You may cancel for any reason prior to the start of your scheduled travel (sea, land and/or air) arrangements made by Holland America Line and receive reimbursement equal to 90% of the eligible amounts paid to Holland America Line. Note: CPP Platinum does not protect double-triple-quad occupancy rates should one or more members of your party cancel prior to departure.

 

http://www.hollandamerica.com/cruise-vacation-planning/PlanningAndAdvice.action?tabName=Cruise+Preparation&contentMenu=Changes+%26+Cancellations&contentSubMenu=Do+You+Offer+A+Cancellation+Protection+Plan%3F

 

I'd say that is pretty clear.

 

[sail7seas]

My problem with the HAL (and most other cruise lines) policy is the Medical Limit of only $10,000. Without insurance one can only lose the cost of a cruise, air, perhaps a hotel which is money you were going to spend anyway. But a major medical problem that happens out of the country can cost 10s of thousands or even 6 figures. Many HAL cruisers are on Medicare and rely only on the HAL insurance....and we think this is crazy. These folks are worrying about losing the cost of a cruise (which is a limited liability) while willing to gamble on the unlimited liability related to a serious medical problem. Go figure.

 

Hank

 

I have made that point here in CC so many times as I agree that many might not be aware HAL is not selling travel insurance. They are selling cancellation coverage and that is very different.

 

Anyone who does not have regular insurance that pays outside the country is taking a huge risk not having medical and evacuation coverage. Policies can be bought for quite low prices as the premium is highest for the cancellation feature........ Please everyone be aware the best of HAL's policy only pays $10,000 medical. That's a pittance of what an accident or illness could cost yu.

 

[sapper1]

I seem to recall reading on CC a while back that the cancellation protection you buy from HAL isn't really a third party insurance policy. It was said that you are simply buying the right to have your money refunded by HAL less a 10% fee. If this is true then HAL is not being paid twice for one fare should the remaining party choose to pay the single supplement as HAL is not being reimbursed by an insurance company.

 

 

 

Edited to say I wrote this on the Cruise Critic forum app and did not see that the previous poster had raised the same issue. I had not used that app before and was not comfortable using it so I replied and left. Then when I returned to my familiar CC format I saw I had duplicated a reply.

Edited November 28, 2015 by sapper1

[3rdGenCunarder]

My problem with the HAL (and most other cruise lines) policy is the Medical Limit of only $10,000. Without insurance one can only lose the cost of a cruise, air, perhaps a hotel which is money you were going to spend anyway. But a major medical problem that happens out of the country can cost 10s of thousands or even 6 figures. Many HAL cruisers are on Medicare and rely only on the HAL insurance....and we think this is crazy. These folks are worrying about losing the cost of a cruise (which is a limited liability) while willing to gamble on the unlimited liability related to a serious medical problem. Go figure.

 

Hank

 

I think a lot of people forget that Medicare doesn't cover them outside the US. That can be an unpleasant surprise.

 

We never buy crusieline insurance. We buy separate insurance so we can adjust and get the coverage we want. Plus, we book our own air or train to get to the ship, and I don't think HAL lets you expand the coverage to those "extras."

[TiogaCruiser]

I have made that point here in CC so many times as I agree that many might not be aware HAL is not selling travel insurance. They are selling cancellation coverage and that is very different.

 

 

Yep. I think it was your reply to the thread about solo lady whose roomie cancelled that prompted me to read the HAL policy and coverage explanation with open eyes. It's easy to believe it's travel insurance and "the best" will cover anything- (but it does not.). The gaps become apparent when you are aware of the SS situation. (And off topic, how many people who do not cruise solo are aware of the single supplement?)

 

I know someone who is booked for a long cruise (sharing a cabin with a friend and her TA was apparently pushing the HAL product as good insurance.:eek: The TA works for a large insurance cum travel company we all know. The TA told her a (more comprehensive) policy through their Dept would be much more expensive. We ran through the scenarios (medical evacuation, SS) and she made a decision for HAL policy. Her plan is to cancel if her roomie has to, and substitution of roomies isn't available.)

 

Adding: am hoping the 24 hour rule works for OP.

[RMLincoln]

I'm looking at traveling with a girlfriend at some time in the future. I'm wondering about a scenario that if she were to cancel (having the HAL insurance) would it be possible for me to cruise with someone else in her place? If figure if I have to pay the single supplement anyway maybe I could get someone else to join me. Thanks, m--

[dakrewser]

I'm looking at traveling with a girlfriend at some time in the future. I'm wondering about a scenario that if she were to cancel (having the HAL insurance) would it be possible for me to cruise with someone else in her place? If figure if I have to pay the single supplement anyway maybe I could get someone else to join me. Thanks, m--

 

Generally, no. Cruise docs, like plane tickets, don't allow "substitutions". Exceptions have been known, however. Suggest you get real travel insurance in any case.

[mhb1757]

This still adds up to HAL getting 3 fares for one cabin.

The companion pays her fare. Then she gets a refund from the insurance. HAL still has the money she originally paid. Now HAL wants a single traveler supplement too? Since the supplement is double the regular fare, that means HAL gets 3 fares for that cabin. The OP double fare plus the amount they received from her companion.

That can't be right.

If my wife is sick on my next cruise and simply doesn't show up at embarkation, I would end up in the room by myself. So, I would then have to pay a single traveler supplement even though we already paid for double occupancy?

 

The very reason it makes no sense to buy your insurance from the cruise line!! Buy it from a third party and if you meet the cancellation criteria (which the OP certainly does) she gets her refund directly from the insurance carrier and HAL still has her fare paid in full and the OP is on her cruise with no supplement. Whether anyone chooses to notify HAL in advance or not.