Is Oceania too "lax-ed" about hand sanitization regime?

[Cahpek]

We enjoyed our cruise on the Riviera a couple a weeks ago from Venice to Piraeus, but we noticed that, although there were hand-sanitizers in various parts of the ship, relatively few passengers seemed to use it.

 

This was especially evident for passengers entering the restaurants. There was also no staff present to request or remind passengers to do so. One sanitizer was not working, and when we asked one of the waiters, she just said the container was empty, but she did not bother to arranged it to be filled.

 

This was even after Riviera had experienced three Norovirus incidences between November 2015and May 2016 . (Sorry to remind you folks about that, but

as you might agree, that was no laughing matter.)

 

We asked one of the head waiters about the lack of reminding passengers to use the sanitizers, and he just kind of shrugged his shoulders although he was very polite about it. It was as if he (and other staff) did not know what to do.

 

Is the reason for that is because staff were so keen about not offending passengers - and then getting being complained about and affecting their jobs - that they chose not to do too much to remind more passengers to use the sanitizers?

 

Can other Oceania cruisers here give us your opinions or views on whether Oceania should implement a slightly more "tighter" practice on reminding passengers to use hand sanitizers - and thus hopefully reduce any future incidences of Norovirus on board? Or should Oceania staff continue not to remind passengers so that they will not "offend" them?

 

Perhaps Oceania management needs to be given more encouragement and support in getting their staff to be a little more stringent in using the hand sanitizers?

 

PS: Some other cruise companies were so strict on the hand sanitizer regime that they would allocate staff standing outside the restaurant with the sanitizer guns, and they would practically "chase" at passengers with their guns if they did not use the hand sanitizer. This was not seen on the Riviera.

Edited September 27, 2016 by Cahpek

[bitob]

This issue has been raised before particularly during Noro season. Yes. O is lax. They don't want to offend. In contrast Celebrity posts a person or two outside the entrance to every dining venue.

 

You can offend me all you want to keep me and others healthy on board

 

 

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[LHT28]

If you are 5 yrs old or do not have any common sense by adulthood even having a crew member standing reminding you to wash your hands after using the loo is not going help

 

Maybe they are hoping most passengers are adults & do not need a minder to tell them to use the Gel but I guess some people are not competent enough to figure this out on their own

So maybe having some crew standing at the entrance to any venue with a gel bottle to squirt people is the answer

There are gel dispensers or washroom everywhere ...people need to be responsible for their own actions

 

we use the gel always

[ORV]

If you are 5 yrs old or do not have any common sense by adulthood even having a crew member standing reminding you to wash your hands after using the loo is not going help

 

Maybe they are hoping most passengers are adults & do not need a minder to tell them to use the Gel but I guess some people are not competent enough to figure this out on their own

So maybe having some crew standing at the entrance to any venue with a gel bottle to squirt people is the answer

There are gel dispensers or washroom everywhere ...people need to be responsible for their own actions

 

we use the gel always

 

Definitely agree, as the years go by I have come to the realization that I'm only in charge of myself, much to my chagrin.

 

If people haven't learned basic hygiene by the age they're on Oceania they're not going to.

[Paulchili]

A few points to consider:

1 As has been pointed out during the Noro epidemic, hand gels do NOT prevent the spread of Noro as they are NOT effective against Noro (though they are effective against many other "bugs").

2 Not cleansing your hands going into the restaurant will mostly effect only you as you will not be handling items that others will handle (generally speaking). In case of the Terrace Cafe, fortunately the food is served by staff thus minimizing "cross-contamination" (but not eliminating it altogether).

3 Even if you used the hand gel before entering the restaurant, you will be handling the chair, the menu, the utensils (handled by multiple staff) among others - so all your gel cleaning may be for nought.

In summary - keeping things really clean is a bit more complex than just simply using hand gel. In fact, that may give us a false sense of safety - much like staff at the grill using gloves, thinking they are "sterile" forever as long as they have gloves on, no matter what they touch with their gloved hands. In the mean time they handle everything else with their gloves on (kitchen doors,fridge doors, opening food containers, etc, etc) and then handle food WITH their gloved hands - thinking they are still "sterile" (or even clean). This happens to be my pet peeve - many of those food items can be handled with utensils and not gloved hands.

All that said, it is a very good idea indeed for everyone to use the gel before entering any dining venue as an added hygienic measure.

Rant over :D

Edited September 27, 2016 by Paulchili

[JVilleGal]

I am allergic to the chemicals in gel hand sanitizers and avoid those stations always. What those criticizing others do not know is that I (and many) am obsessive about hand washing, not touching doors knobs, railings, elevator call buttons. My baggies of Clorox wipes get a work out upon arrival in my beautiful Oceania cabin.

Latest reports about hand sanitizer gel is not effective and good old fashion hot water and soap is the first line of defense.

 

Please wash your hands and do it often!

 

 

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[firsttimewithcunard]

There is a real issue here which can't always be thwarted by gels no matter the extent to which different cruise lines encourage passengers to use the gels provided. We've just returned from Greece - not cruising this time - but in Corfu one day we observed passengers from Costa, Silversea and Cunard ships. I had occasion to spend some time queueing for the bathroom when our cafe was swamped by some of the passengers, rushing into the first cafe next to the car park where their coaches had dropped them.

The men I shared a queue with were well dressed, apparently affluent, certainly courteous and amiable. But I saw that about half of them failed to wash their hands after using the toilet and some of those who did wash gave their hands no more than a cursory rinse.

I don't know if it's something about getting old. But many cruisers seem to believe that the rules of personal hygiene somehow don't apply to them. And not infrequently, they make many of us ill.

Companies need to be brave enough to confront this reality and using hand gels should be mandatory, but firm reminders about the necessity of personal hygiene need to be prominent in all bathrooms.

[Paulchili]

There is a real issue here which can't always be thwarted by gels no matter the extent to which different cruise lines encourage passengers to use the gels provided. We've just returned from Greece - not cruising this time - but in Corfu one day we observed passengers from Costa, Silversea and Cunard ships. I had occasion to spend some time queueing for the bathroom when our cafe was swamped by some of the passengers, rushing into the first cafe next to the car park where their coaches had dropped them.

The men I shared a queue with were well dressed, apparently affluent, certainly courteous and amiable. But I saw that about half of them failed to wash their hands after using the toilet and some of those who did wash gave their hands no more than a cursory rinse.

I don't know if it's something about getting old. But many cruisers seem to believe that the rules of personal hygiene somehow don't apply to them. And not infrequently, they make many of us ill.

Companies need to be brave enough to confront this reality and using hand gels should be mandatory, but firm reminders about the necessity of personal hygiene need to be prominent in all bathrooms.

 

Unfortunately very true. I have witnessed this many times in public bathrooms on the ship and everywhere else. Surprising how many men walk out from the BR without washing their hands (even from stalls!).

I am afraid that "firm reminders prominently displayed in the bathrooms" won't do it - they would be ignored by those that are prone to ignore such things. Short of a BR attendant enforcing the rule that everyone washes their hands - not a likely scenario - little will change even with reminders.

[LHT28]

Companies need to be brave enough to confront this reality and using hand gels should be mandatory, but firm reminders about the necessity of personal hygiene need to be prominent in all bathrooms.

 

I agree

They should have a crew member stationed at the exit of the W/C with an AK 47 & you are not allowed out until soap & water are vigorously applied to your hands :p:rolleyes:

[Cahpek]

In fact, that may give us a false sense of safety - much like staff at the grill using gloves, thinking they are "sterile" forever as long as they have gloves on, no matter what they touch with their gloved hands. In the mean time they handle everything else with their gloves on (kitchen doors,fridge doors, opening food containers, etc, etc) and then handle food WITH their gloved hands - thinking they are still "sterile" (or even clean). This happens to be my pet peeve - many of those food items can be handled with utensils and not gloved hands.

Rant over :D

 

HOW WELL TRAINED ABOUT FOOD-HYGIENE ARE OCEANIA FOOD-SERVING STAFF?

 

It was interesting you mentioned about staff's sense of being "sterile" as long as they have gloves on reminds me an "incident" on the last Riviera cruise relating to staff knowledge of food hygiene:

 

In the Terrace buffet, I was served a piece of chicken on the bone, and the chicken was half-cooked (and I mean the meat inside seemed somewhat raw, with raw meat/blood(?)). I went back to the waitress and I could see some of the other pieces of chicken she was serving to have similar degree of "rawness" showing through.

 

I informed her about the state of the chicken and said to her to stop serving the chicken as serving raw chicken could cause salmonella , etc, and I asked her to inform with the chef. She just ignored me and she continued serving the chicken. I was quite concerned about this.

(To give her the benefit of the doubt, I did not believe she ignored me out of rudeness, but it was outside her "comfort zone" and she did not know how to react when I asked her to stop serving the dish. She was probably just trained to be nice , and to serve the food - perhaps she was not trained to stop serving the dish if she was informed of some potential risk with food hygiene by a passenger. Perhaps the poor girl could not think out of the box, no offence intended.).

 

I had to inform one of the chefs myself who was around who instantly realised the risks, and only then chicken was removed. Obviously , the chef knew about food hygiene but what about the female server? By then, the female server might have probably served more pieces of those chicken to other passengers (it was a busy evening)!

 

It brought me to ask, how much does Oceania teach the staff who serve food, about Food Hygiene and practices of Food Hygiene? If they are so well trained and well informed, how come that female staff at the buffet continued to serve the chicken in question even AFTER I had informed her about the state of the chicken and the risk involved, and that she should not continue to serve it? Also, as PAULCHILI had observed, their complacent sense of hygiene amongst some staff just because they wore gloves, might not be good enough as far as food hygiene practices is concerned.

Edited September 27, 2016 by Cahpek

[xmarksx]

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?p=49824788#post49824788

[MOTB]

But the chef should have made sure the chicken was cooked through properly before expecting the waitress to serve it.

[Mura]

And I would also like to think that other passengers cutting into obviously uncooked chicken would have sent it back ...

 

Is that asking too much???? Maybe! Because if they had, Cahpek shouldn't have needed to speak to a chef about the problem. They would have known about it already ...

 

Mura

[Cahpek]

And I would also like to think that other passengers cutting into obviously uncooked chicken would have sent it back ...

 

Is that asking too much???? Maybe! Because if they had, Cahpek shouldn't have needed to speak to a chef about the problem. They would have known about it already ...

 

Mura

 

 

I think you are right what you said, Mura.

[sammiedawg]

Cruise employees most definitely receive training in safe food handling practices but that does not guarantee a low level employee on the buffet line will be able to problem solve.

 

As previously stated vigorous hand washing with soap and water is the gold standard.

I use the gels when I see them because it makes my hands feel clearer. My healthcare training and consumer awareness help me to understand the limited efficacy of said gels. The US government is also issuing advisories dispelling the efficacy of antibacterial bar soap.

 

We did a seven day Disney cruise and the casual observer may feel they are more vigilant about disease prevention. An employee stands by the door at every eatery and hands out wet wipes to everyone. Of course I asked to read the dispenser label and learned the wipes do not even have anti bacterial properties, much less antiviral properties. Their wipes only assist with removal of bacteria because you rub the cloth against your hands.

[Classiccruiser777]

Unfortunately very true. I have witnessed this many times in public bathrooms on the ship and everywhere else. Surprising how many men walk out from the BR without washing their hands (even from stalls!).

I am afraid that "firm reminders prominently displayed in the bathrooms" won't do it - they would be ignored by those that are prone to ignore such things. Short of a BR attendant enforcing the rule that everyone washes their hands - not a likely scenario - little will change even with reminders.

I agree on all counts. I suspect that the noro culprit is, by far, caused by passengers that don't practice basic hygiene.

[janecambridge]

On Riviera,weeks cruise,we saw one person,once,use the sanitation gel.

Maybe no good in preventing norovirus,but must help with bacteria some of the time.....

[Cahpek]

I agree on all counts. I suspect that the noro culprit is, by far, caused by passengers that don't practice basic hygiene.

 

 

I think most would agree that even if hand sanitizers is not effective in eradicating Norovirus, frequent and effective ways of washing hands can be quite an effective way to reduce Norovirus outbreaks.

 

Perhaps, at the beginning of the cruise, just like emergency drill for passengers, all cruise lines (not just Oceania) should "hammer " into the minds of passengers the importance of hand-washing, and the very real risks of Norovirus on ANY cruise.

 

Just as passengers are informed and shown how to use the life-jackets, perhaps there ought to be a demonstration before each cruise begins, on how to wash hands properly.

 

I found on You-tube some hand-washing techniques, and only then did I realize that I was not washing my hands properly or thoroughly enough. However, the procedure to effective hand-washing , I discovered, was quite simple and easy to follow. It's not rocket science by any means!

 

Also, on one of the on-board ship TV channels, there could be a demonstration on hand-washing and a bit about food hygiene. Printed instructions as part of the information booklet in the state-rooms might also help.

 

I realise not everyone would adhere to that practice of keeping their hands clean - of course, the inconsiderate ones would probably continue to ignore this - but at least, by highlighting that, that would at least encourage the more considerate passengers to cooperate.

 

At the moment, even after the three relatively recent Norovirus outbreaks on Riviera, I could be wrong, but one could almost sense the impression that the ship's crew has gone back to its own ways and keeping the "N" word hushed from passengers. (I was on Riviera several months before the Norovirus outbreaks started, and was on board again several months after that.)

 

Sure, some people would not like this (highlighting the dangers of Norovirus and reminding of keeping hands clean) . It may be BORING but like the EMERGENCY DRILL, it is still very IMPORTANT. The risk of Norovirus on cruise ships should not be played down, because when it happens on a cruise, it could cause a lot of inconvenience and discomfort to a lot of people. It could also SPOIL the CRUISE HOLIDAYS for a lot of people, and which they saved up for.

 

In any case, I still think hand-sanitizers usage should still be encouraged to be used on entering the ship, or entering restaurants. It may not eradicate Norovirus, but it can help fight other bacterias.

 

I wonder what other cruisers here think about that suggestion? Perhaps you might not agree?

Edited September 28, 2016 by Cahpek

[LHT28]

on our recent & not so recent O cruises when you enter the cabin there is a video on showing about how to wash your hands

when you enter the gangway coming from shore excursion there is a large sign to use the gel & wash with soap & water

In the daily Currents they have a note about washing your hands

There are gel dispensers all over the ship The gel in them is NOT like what you buy at Walmart

On our cruise in April they provided small size spray hand sanitizer to the cabins

How much responsibility does the passenger take ?

 

 

As my SIL says "you cannot fix stupid "

[JimandStan]

Just as passengers are informed and shown how to use the life-jackets, perhaps there ought to be a demonstration before each cruise begins, on how to wash hands properly.

 

Why stop there? Let's have a full day on personal hygiene!

Particularly.....in the unseen places :rolleyes:

[LHT28]

Just as passengers are informed and shown how to use the life-jackets, perhaps there ought to be a demonstration before each cruise begins, on how to wash hands properly.

:confused::confused: I guess you did not watch the video on the tv when you entered your cabin

 

People do not read the T & C so I guess why would they read something printed in the Currents or watch a video playing on the TV on day one :eek:

[Cahpek]

I agree on all counts. I suspect that the noro culprit is, by far, caused by passengers that don't practice basic hygiene.

 

....if I may also add, as a suggestion, to encourage a hand-washing culture, Oceania could even make hand-washing FUN !!!

 

Perhaps, every day, there could be a competition where passengers can take part - their hands could be tested, and the passenger with the "cleanest" hands of the day would win a prize!

[Cahpek]

:confused::confused: I guess you did not watch the video on the tv when you entered your cabin

 

People do not read the T & C so I guess why would they read something printed in the Currents or watch a video playing on the TV on day one :eek:

 

No doubt you have. One thing I have to take my hat off for you is you seem to be quite informative about Oceania from top to bottom - almost to the smallest detail, am I right?

Edited September 28, 2016 by Cahpek

[Cahpek]

Why stop there? Let's have a full day on personal hygiene!

Particularly.....in the unseen places :rolleyes:

 

...if you know how some of the passengers looked like, I would rather leave those places , ahem, unseen!

Edited September 28, 2016 by Cahpek

[Cahpek]

on our recent & not so recent O cruises when you enter the cabin there is a video on showing about how to wash your hands

when you enter the gangway coming from shore excursion there is a large sign to use the gel & wash with soap & water

In the daily Currents they have a note about washing your hands

There are gel dispensers all over the ship The gel in them is NOT like what you buy at Walmart

On our cruise in April they provided small size spray hand sanitizer to the cabins

How much responsibility does the passenger take ?

 

 

As my SIL says "you cannot fix stupid "

 

 

 

Is there such a video. I switched the TV on and did not remember seeing one. Thanks for the info. I know you are right because I know you seem to know those little details about Oceania. Won't surprise me that you could be quite well-connected to those people at the top of Oceania!