Tipping guides

[GUT2407]

Keith

I agree with your post, although personally, I would never tip more than 20%. Guess it's coming from the UK, where tipping, although prevalent is nothing like it is in the US.

We have friends in Australia and NZ who will never tip more than $10 (local ccy) in restaurants in their countries and nor is it expected. In UK restaurants 10% for good service is appreciated, but again not expected. The high-end establishments in cities, especially those in hotels or with celebrity chefs have tried to increase this by putting 'suggestions' on their bills, but most locals seem to ignore this (at least the ones I know!).

Depending on the length of a tour we'll typically tip the guide $10 and the driver $5, but will adjust for bad service or driving.

My tipping bugbear (in restaurants) is twofold (a) that anything less than 18% in the US is deemed an 'insult' and (b) - actually the thing that irritates me most - is that the tip % is expected on the wine too - IMHO UNLESS a bottle of wine needs decanting there is no additional "service" in pouring from a bottle that costs $40 or one that costs $140. I adjust my tip according to service and the cost of the house wine and accept the muttering - I am unlikely to visit again in most cases, or unlikely to be remembered if I do!

 

 

But what you say about wine applies to food as well.

 

No more work to take an order and deliver a plate of chips (French fries) at $5 than a plate of Caviar at $500.

[GUT2407]

Also more work to deliver a three course meal that costs $40, than one course at $100, but radically different tip, if you follow the % rule.

[Fletcher]

Tipping is degrading, for both the tipper and the tippee, so we never, ever, tip and that includes the rare occasions when we have to transit or overnight in the USA.

 

I'm talking here in First World, westernized countries. In a country like India or Cambodia or Burma then different standards apply.

 

In Australasia and right across the South Pacific tipping is regarded as an insult.

[Keith1010]

Tipping is degrading, for both the tipper and the tippee, so we never, ever, tip and that includes the rare occasions when we have to transit or overnight in the USA.

 

I'm talking here in First World, westernized countries. In a country like India or Cambodia or Burma then different standards apply.

 

In Australasia and right across the South Pacific tipping is regarded as an insult.

 

I am not being argumentative but please understand that in most USA restaurants that the server makes a very small fraction of their hourly income from the actual solar. Rather most of their income does come from tips.

 

It is very much different in the USA then in the UK or some of which we've discussed already). In most restaurants they keep most of their tips they receive with a small portion going to some of the other workers such as the wait staff who clean the tables. If there is a bar in the restaurant it's the same thing. This is another example where I recommend finding out what the local custom is similar to what I did the first time I visited the UK or when we travel to any area for the very first time.

 

In restaurants in the USA the recommended tip is 15 to 20 Percent before taxes. But that is just a recommendation. We will tip more for better service and less when service is not good.

 

In many USA restaurants for larger groups a tip is automatically added. Often that is 18% but varies by restaurant.

 

I realize that if you are not used to tipping that this appears to be degrading or just uncomfortable but for the vast majority of those working as servers and bartenders in restaurants that is how they are paid and how they earn a living.

 

Similarly, for those who are used to tipping when in a country where a tip is not the norm many of those people feel strange when they do not tip.

 

As they say, this is what makes the world go round.

 

As a traveller, I like that there are many differences when we visit places around the world such as the local customs, or the local cuisine, or even little things such as the difference between the electrical outlets in the UK versus the USA. I prefer this over everything being how we do it in our own country from customs to the restaurants.

 

Keith

[Keith1010]

TC, thank you for the nice comments in your earlier posts.

 

Keith

[GUT2407]

I try very hard not to get into the tipping debate here, because our customs are so very different from the majority here. However, I think Keith has hit the correct answer above with his suggestion of asking a local what's expected in a particular situation. There is no universally correct answer.

 

 

Funny you think asking a local is the answer, I presume and then following their advice, but did you read what Keith actually said?

 

We have sailed with good friends who spend half their time in New Zealand and half their time in Australia.

 

Yes, for excellent service in restaurants he said many locals will tip.

 

However, they told us there is absolutely no need to tip on a tour in either of these two countries.

 

Again, we don't overthink it and if for some reason even with this knowledge we care to tip we will. Could be because the tour guide was exceptional or maybe they are back in grade school and we just though a tip would be nice. You certainly won't go to "tourist jail" if you tip somewhere even if it is not part of the local custom.

 

Keith

 

 

 

 

Where he says he was advised not to tip, but says he will tip if he wants to.

 

 

Does someone from a non tipping culture get the same lee way if they say they won't tip in the USA?

 

 

Answer, no way!

[fizzy]

Tipping is degrading, for both the tipper and the tippee, so we never, ever, tip and that includes the rare occasions when we have to transit or overnight in the USA.

 

I'm talking here in First World, westernized countries. In a country like India or Cambodia or Burma then different standards apply.

 

In Australasia and right across the South Pacific tipping is regarded as an insult.

If, when you must travel through the US, you were to find that the restaurant you had chosen to dine in had an xx% service charge that was going to be attached to your bill, would you choose a different venue or would you adjust what you were going to order to reflect what you could afford to spend on that particular meal? Knowing in advance that America does have a tipping culture and with all the choices there are in the world, you might find it more budget friendly to your situation to avoid travel to or transit through the US.

[Gilly]

GUT2407 Yes, I did read Keith's answer. I have no intention of getting into this debate however.

[GUT2407]

If, when you must travel through the US, you were to find that the restaurant you had chosen to dine in had an xx% service charge that was going to be attached to your bill, would you choose a different venue or would you adjust what you were going to order to reflect what you could afford to spend on that particular meal? Knowing in advance that America does have a tipping culture and with all the choices there are in the world, you might find it more budget friendly to your situation to avoid travel to or transit through the US.

 

 

And the same advice might go out to those (mainly from USA) who insist on tipping in countries where it isn't normal to tip.

[Fletcher]

The last time I was in the States was last November, for just one night in Florida before a Seabourn cruise. We dined at the hotel's steakhouse, had a surprisingly good dinner, noted there was a service charge, didn't add any tips, and no one seemed to bother.

 

I think the USA needs to bring its employment laws up to date and get rid of this ghastly tipping culture. I speak as someone who had a real love affair with America in the 1980s and 1990s. Went there maybe three times a year on business and have done many long driving trips as well. Don't go there anymore unless absolutely necessary.

[fizzy]

And the same advice might go out to those (mainly from USA) who insist on tipping in countries where it isn't normal to tip.

You're probably right. Who does't like to save a penny or two?

[Travelcat2]

Keith, I still agree with you but want to point out one thing from your post ("........... but please understand that in most USA restaurants that the server makes a very small fraction of their hourly income from the actual solar. Rather most of their income does come from tips."

 

What you say is true is some states but not in all. While some states permit paying restaurant service workers (that receive tips) less than minimum wage, many are now paying minimum wage. So, in the state of Washington, "tipped" workers make the full $11.00/hour (plus tips).

 

The Federal minimum wage in the U.S. is $7.25/hour but the Federal Fair Standards Act for "tipped" workers has a minimum wage of $2.13/hour. So, while Washington state workers make full minimum wage, in Arkansas the same workers make $2.63/hour and in Delaware $2.23/hour (there is a long list on the web under the U. S. Department of Labor). What is most amazing to me is that Florida wants to drop the minimum wage for these workers from $4.65/hour to $2.13/hour.

 

My point for stating these numbers is to help non-U.S. residents understand that many of the people that serve you in restaurants in the U.S. depend upon tips as they do not make a "living wage" without them. And, if you ask a local, they will likely not know what the minimum wage is for "tipped" workers (unless they work in the industry). So, the next time you overnight in MIami before a cruise and you receive good service, this is food for thought.

[Keith1010]

Thanks TC. You are correct and as s they say you ( in this case me) learn something everyday. So this was good for me to know.

 

I found how it works on the following web site:

 

https://www.dol.gov/whd/state/tipped.htm

 

The state that I am most familiar with (Texas) is one the states that pays the $2.17 minimum.

 

As you noted Washington is one of the states (seven in total) that pay the state's minimum wage.

 

Just a reminder that tipping does vary.

 

With all respect to our friends in Europe many countries are of similar size to the states in the USA and several of them have their own customs and ways of doing things.

 

Oh well. This is what makes the world go round.

 

Keith

[rallydave]

Thanks Keith for that by state link. It does bring another problem with tipping in the US as with different pay scales in different states and some of those states with further ridiculous increases on the horizon makes the 15 to 18% recommendations not valid with some states now paying 5 times more than other states and that disparity only increasing.

 

And even more difficult for people from outside the US. Perhaps as others previously stated the tip shoul be based on the amount of work expended by the server and not the amount of the bill. Seems ridiculous to tip the same amount in Washington State then in Texas where the server is currently paid 5X more!

 

 

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[Travelcat2]

IMO, there needs to be a "basis" for how much you are going to tip. In the U.S., that basis has long been the amount of the bill (in many cases people do discount wine due to the incredible mark-up). The general rule of thumb still is 15-20% of the bill.

 

Many of these issues would be solved if research was done prior to visiting a country. In the case of the U.S., the only states that pay minimum wage to servers that has cruise ports is Washington, Oregon and California so if someone wants to tip less in those states, it is fairly easy to remember as they are the only three states on West Coast that border the Pacific Ocean. While those of us living in these states do tip as we do in the rest of the country, I can see where a tourist may not want to do so. OTOH, if tourists become known as non-tippers (or low tippers), it may not be a good thing.

 

I do not believe in tipping in countries where it is not the custom.

[ronrick1943]

IMO, there needs to be a "basis" for how much you are going to tip. In the U.S., that basis has long been the amount of the bill (in many cases people do discount wine due to the incredible mark-up). The general rule of thumb still is 15-20% of the bill.

Many of these issues would be solved if research was done prior to visiting a country. In the case of the U.S., the only states that pay minimum wage to servers that has cruise ports is Washington, Oregon and California so if someone wants to tip less in those states, it is fairly easy to remember as they are the only three states on West Coast that border the Pacific Ocean. While those of us living in these states do tip as we do in the rest of the country, I can see where a tourist may not want to do so. OTOH, if tourists become known as non-tippers (or low tippers), it may not be a good thing.

I do not believe in tipping in countries where it is not the custom.

 

Have to agree with this, good post. Rick

[UUNetBill]

I'm not a big fan of tipping. At all. Never have been.

 

I usually tip well when I'm out in restaurants, bars, etc - but the entire custom has gotten out of hand, I think. Not only is the question of who to tip, or how much, but now it varies by state. I used to go to Vegas quite a bit and every time I went, I'd go to the bank and get a stack of $5s and $10s because everyone - and I mean EVERYONE - had their hand out. Waiters, bartenders, skycaps, bellhops, taxi drivers, bus drivers, doormen, etc. And don't even get me started on the seasonal tips - mail carriers, newspaper delivery folks, anyone else who's even looked at you the previous year. Where does it stop??

 

I always try and at least learn the basic tipping etiquette in whatever country I'm visiting, but it's getting tougher to stay on top of it. Frankly I'd like to just see everyone earn a decent wage and just do away with the entire custom.

 

But it's like my biannual rant against DST - nothing will change and it just raises my blood pressure. <sigh>

[Travelcat2]

I understand how you feel -- it is getting a bit out of control - especially for states (like WA state) that have a high minimum wage (that will end up at $15/hour in the not too distant future) and the tips are on top of that. It makes you feel badly for people earning so little and depend upon tips to live. IMO, all workers should make the federal minimum wage (at least) -- it is hard to believe that some people in this country earn less than $3/hour. It does seem that people in the U.S. will tip wherever they are in the world - whether it is customary or not and will argue to the death that they have the right to do so. I don't think that anyone argues a person's rights but doing the right thing should also play into the equation.