BookDragon Posted February 20, 2018 #551 Share Posted February 20, 2018 Seen reports about that comment. Seems more fair to respond to what is on video and not alleged verbal comments from the Captain. I disagree. I’m sure the suits at Carnival also disagree. If we believe the eye witness accounts regarding the family’s actions, and the eye witness accounts regarding security’s actions, then you logically cannot discount a witness’s account regarding the Captain’s response. We may not like it, but we cannot pick & choose what best fits our narrative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E-burgGrammy Posted February 20, 2018 #552 Share Posted February 20, 2018 Why didn't they remove the 2 groups from the ships asap? the article says the fights had been going on for 5 days! At the very least they should have been locked in their cabins if unable to put them off the ship. Drinking does have a lot to do with this when a bar tender sees someone very obviously drunk they should be trained not to serve them any more drinks. We were on a ship and this guy was very very drunk. So drunk he broke the elevator doors trying to open them when the elevator wasn't even available for him to get on. How he got back to his cabin, who knows but if someone got in an elevator with the person depending on the type of drunk he was anything could have happened and in my opinion the cruise lines fault they should be trained to stop serving when someone can no longer handle themselves. I saw a family put off a ship at the first stop of a cruise because they refused to change their behavior while drinking and they weren't even fighting just being totally stupid and rude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
declansdad Posted February 20, 2018 #553 Share Posted February 20, 2018 http://www.news.com.au/travel/travel-updates/incidents/bloodbath-as-violence-erupts-on-carnival-legend-cruise-ship-passengers-say/news-story/6447a7650227e67c79de3c7f7d5962f5 https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/dr-gridlock/wp/2018/02/17/a-10-day-carnival-cruise-in-the-south-pacific-descended-into-violent-anarchy/?utm_term=.4c64a78231a7 https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2018/feb/17/cruise-ship-on-which-big-brawl-broke-out-to-dock-in-melbourne Thanks for the links but that was just a quote from one person. That was never confirmed that the captain actually said that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BookDragon Posted February 20, 2018 #554 Share Posted February 20, 2018 Thanks for the links but that was just a quote from one person. That was never confirmed that the captain actually said that. Ok...whatever makes you feel better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coaster Posted February 20, 2018 #555 Share Posted February 20, 2018 I disagree. I’m sure the suits at Carnival also disagree. If we believe the eye witness accounts regarding the family’s actions, and the eye witness accounts regarding security’s actions, then you logically cannot discount a witness’s account regarding the Captain’s response. We may not like it, but we cannot pick & choose what best fits our narrative. News conference. Captain and Carnival executives side by side to respond to all of this. Only way to move on past all of this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BookDragon Posted February 20, 2018 #556 Share Posted February 20, 2018 News conference. Captain and Carnival executives side by side to respond to all of this. Only way to move on past all of this. I agree Coaster, because it all looks really bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ano Posted February 20, 2018 #557 Share Posted February 20, 2018 I am sure I missed it but WHERE is this family from? I saw they "targeted" Australian passengers for their drunken attacks. Why? As for Security being under-trained, cruise lines don't normally have groups of 20+ roving drunken thugs looking for trouble. Yes, they probably weren't trained to handle such a situation but these situations just DON'T happen on cruise ships. This family was reportedly out for trouble from the moment they boarded (of course you can argue that crew SHOULD have been alerted then and given the option of cooling down or getting off the ship before sailaway!). Sadly the world is becoming angrier and I guess it was only a matter of time before that carried over onto the seas. I did like that at least the security folks locked several members in their cabins overnight. In this day and age, a group of terrorists boarding a cruise ship should not be something that is out of the question. Yes they should be trained for such a possibility. If a bunch of teenagers can cause this trouble, just imagine what an organized group could do? If not cause injuries, it certainly has the possibility to disrupt the cruise industry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
declansdad Posted February 20, 2018 #558 Share Posted February 20, 2018 Ok...whatever makes you feel better. It's got nothing to do with how I feel. There are videos of the incidents that back up what people have said. There is only one person that says the captain made that statement. Maybe he did, maybe he didn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sailor_Sally Posted February 20, 2018 #559 Share Posted February 20, 2018 Sorry Sally, you'll have to do the leg work for yourself, I'm retired!;p I am also retired and betting there are none ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingofcool1947 Posted February 20, 2018 #560 Share Posted February 20, 2018 (edited) .I agree with almost all thats been said. So I won't repeat the comments. One question I ask is: do the cruise lines wake up in the morning and say to the waiter...ok today you put on this security shirt? What is their training to be "security"? This escalated over many days, who is in charge of security? did Carnival give their "security personal" any fast tracked training on tactics to take down or subdue a passenger? as the problem was sure to get worse. They could assume that it wasn't over. Kicking, and grabbing cell phones? ya that'll do it. Notice the officers in whites? just babbling in foreign tongue. What's the captain doing? All this over somebody stepping on a flip flop? seriously... There's nowhere on the ship that these unruly passengers could be held until they could be taken off? Zero tolerance..ya right...Lets remember..this could happen on ANY line....its the people, not the ship...Carnival is the Walmart of cruising....you get what you pay for...but you do pay for a safe and enjoyable experience, all would agree... CARNIVAL...give all these passengers a full refund...not a chance to pay you another 75% to cruise with you again....Just saying....I may not agree with you...but I'll defend your right to your opinion cruzinroxyroller , You made some very good observations. :) BTW, I think your Cap key and/or your period key [ . ] might be stuck or sticking? Enjoy your cruise. Edited February 20, 2018 by Kingofcool1947 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BookDragon Posted February 20, 2018 #561 Share Posted February 20, 2018 It's got nothing to do with how I feel. There are videos of the incidents that back up what people have said. There is only one person that says the captain made that statement. Maybe he did, maybe he didn't. You asked me for links. I provided a few from reliable sources. You’ve chosen to believe only what is seen on the video...discounting all the eye witness accounts regarding this family and security’s actions. I got it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haboob Posted February 20, 2018 #562 Share Posted February 20, 2018 When the Captain was made aware of the situation, his response was, “What do you want me to do about — throw them overboard?”. Huge red flag. I suspect you can de-"spin" that paraphrase if you realize Legend was two days from land at the time. Also, I'm not sure just how they "lock miscreants in their cabins". I'd really not like to hear ships can actually lock cabin doors from the outside (lest I get forgotten in case of fire or whatnot). With this group, I suspect it would mean assigning enough crew 24/day outside each cabin to ensure they stayed inside. That's a lot of crew. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimlineman Posted February 20, 2018 #563 Share Posted February 20, 2018 Interesting theory. Do you mean like an act of terrorism? Yes that’s my concern. With what’s happened in the past with other large passenger transportation being taken over I would have thought some protocols would be in place. But the video proves not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimlineman Posted February 20, 2018 #564 Share Posted February 20, 2018 Yes that’s my concern. With what’s happened in the past with other large passenger transportation being taken over I would have thought some protocols would be in place.But the video proves not. Granted with a cruise close to the states I’m sure Th U.S. cost guard would helicopter in and take care of the threat If it was something of that scale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beerman2 Posted February 20, 2018 #565 Share Posted February 20, 2018 Memo to Carnival Corporate: There is something that is non-lethal that has been used for years to quell these situations. It’s called a Taser! Get smart CCL. There has been a situation here in Ohio where a Taser has been lethal. It caused a suspect to have a heart attack, caused directly by him being tased. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madcitymaven Posted February 20, 2018 #566 Share Posted February 20, 2018 Time for a rebrand. I would suggest splitting off the existing ships to create two different name brands. Keep a few for the younger folks and the ones who want to party until they die under one brand. Create a second brand more upscale than Carnival, but not as formal as Princess. Right now they have too many ships under one brand where the reputation of it has been tarnished over the past few years. Realistically, it can't be fixed without a major restructuring going forward. Great advice! Are you listening, Carnival senior executives? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coaster Posted February 20, 2018 #567 Share Posted February 20, 2018 I mentioned much earlier that Royal Caribbean outfits their security staff with body cams. Any folks here with law enforcement experience think this would help Carnival? I don't pretend to know if this would of helped in this situation. Just throwing it out there for the experts. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnBoy 51 Posted February 20, 2018 #568 Share Posted February 20, 2018 News conference. Captain and Carnival executives side by side to respond to all of this. Only way to move on past all of this. Would it be possible to post a link to this news conference? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coaster Posted February 20, 2018 #569 Share Posted February 20, 2018 Would it be possible to post a link to this news conference? A suggestion on my part. I don't work for Carnival corporate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spookyfudge Posted February 20, 2018 #570 Share Posted February 20, 2018 This is terrible that the captain let it occur over several days and didnt kick the trouble makers off the ship earlier. His inaction will cause carnival to give discounts to everyone on the ship. I think the captain should be removed from his duties, and if he didnt know this was occurring over several days, then the security cheif should be canned! Those poor people who had their vacation hijacked by these trouble makers! Nuff Said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aquahound Posted February 20, 2018 #571 Share Posted February 20, 2018 I mentioned much earlier that Royal Caribbean outfits their security staff with body cams. Any folks here with law enforcement experience think this would help Carnival? I don't pretend to know if this would of helped in this situation. Just throwing it out there for the experts. I agree with them 100%. We're in an era where young people are raised to believe they are always right and they can do no wrong. Body cams protect enforcement officers and their employers from false claims and from liability. Body cam footage, from beginning to end, tell a great story through the eyes of the people who are confronting adversity. I know there was controversy when they first came out, but I supported them from day 1. Besides, everyone else has video cameras on their phones, and when do those videos start? Too late. Body cam videos start at the true beginning and combat the spectator videos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coaster Posted February 20, 2018 #572 Share Posted February 20, 2018 I agree with them 100%. We're in an era where young people are raised to believe they are always right and they can do no wrong. Body cams protect enforcement officers and their employers from false claims and from liability. Body cam footage, from beginning to end, tell a great story through the eyes of the people who are confronting adversity. I know there was controversy when they first came out, but I supported them from day 1. Thank you again Aquahound. Your are a great resource here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnBoy 51 Posted February 20, 2018 #573 Share Posted February 20, 2018 A suggestion on my part. I don't work for Carnival corporate. Sorry, misunderstood. I thought that you were referring to a news conference that had actually happened. Carnival are in a no win situation here, if they close ranks and say nothing threads like this one will just keep going until the next cruise line finds themselves in the news. If they come out and even hint that the captain, or any staff member did the wrong thing they will be hit with so many law suits for %100 refund, not credit on future cruise, it will make their collective heads spin. My opinion only, and I've been wrong before :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coaster Posted February 20, 2018 #574 Share Posted February 20, 2018 Sorry, misunderstood. I thought that you were referring to a news conference that had actually happened. Carnival are in a no win situation here, if they close ranks and say nothing threads like this one will just keep going until the next cruise line finds themselves in the news. If they come out and even hint that the captain, or any staff member did the wrong thing they will be hit with so many law suits for %100 refund, not credit on future cruise, it will make their collective heads spin. My opinion only, and I've been wrong before :D No problem JohnBoy, I was glad to clarify my comment and should of been more precise earlier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BookDragon Posted February 20, 2018 #575 Share Posted February 20, 2018 If they come out and even hint that the captain, or any staff member did the wrong thing they will be hit with so many law suits for %100 refund, not credit on future cruise, it will make their collective heads spin. My opinion only, and I've been wrong before :D They chose option B...Carnival stated security did not follow policy and that they were investigating further. But, like Coastal, I don’t think this goes far enough. I also believe that a press conference addressing the security issues or at the very least an email to those of us who have a cruise currently booked would be very helpful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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