Avalon disappointing

[Swannee50]

Booked a long-awaited Basel-Prague Christmas markets Avalon cruise for November-Dec 2018. Due to drought, we learnt 11 days prior to departure, that  due to low water level, itinerary might have to be concluded by bus & hotel. Offered full refund if desired, but we were happy with the bus/ hotel option so decided to continue on that understanding. We were happy that we would still see all the towns & Christmas markets in Germany, as per our original plan.  

4 days prior, told there would be no bus/ hotel option, instead we would sail only to Strasbourg where we would dock for 5 days, then sail back to Basel. Again, refund offered but in the 4 days, we were unable to find an alternative tour that would also fit in with our non-refundable air fares, which were not part of the tour package, therefore not covered by travel insurance. Under Avalon’s terms & conditions, we had to accept that this change was also allowed.

However, the tour we received bore no resemblance to the one booked, in either places visited or value for money. Why is Avalon/ Globus, or any company for that matter, allowed to substitute inferior tours when a change has to occur? We can accept the changes but not being short-changed after paying a lot of money for what ended up being a budget tour. Being docked for 5 days in a poor area of town with no nice outlook, wasn’t our idea of a river cruise! 

We received a refund for not being able to have the same sized room on the substitute vessel & a refund of the one night we didn’t spend on board. These were refunds of money already paid , not compensation for any inconvenience, disappointment & stress caused by Avalon/ Globus. They were also paid by cheque, in spite of the assurance they would be paid in the manner we had used when booking, which was direct deposit. And 1 of our party had her cheque dishonoured, for which she had to pay the bank fee! Repeated appeals to Avalon through Circuit Travel in  Sydney, have been dismissed out of hand. 

Our first trip with Avalon will be our last. Never again. 

 

[pully8]

Sorry to hear of your experience. perhaps give them another go albeit I know its a long and expensive way to travel if disappointed.

We have cruised with Avalon and other European river cruise operators their product is quite good.

We liked the cabin sizes and layout and generally their staff and cruise directors perform well.

We have had so called interruptions, low/high water and lock strikes on some cruises.

Last Christmas we sailed after all the low water issues with APT/AMA who we have travelled with before.

That trip had other issues some were disappointed about the lack of Christmas dinner on Christmas day, among other things.

We were  contacted by APT/AMA on return and were compensated.

Agree that some of the issues need to be dealt with on your behalf with a good travel agent in Australia, if there are concerns, particularly if they value your repeat business.

 

[Swannee50]

Thanks Pully8, pleased you’ve had positive river cruising experiences compared to ours. With what I know now, I actually wouldn’t choose a river cruise to see Christmas Markets. Because they spend the days ashore & cruise from late afternoon, you see no scenery at all due to night falling so early in winter. My advice would be to choose a bus tour instead & keep river cruising for summer months. 

Live & learn. 

Unfortunately, our travel agency, who finished each letter assuring us of their best service at all times, just seem to blame us for not cancelling. They were polite but didn’t ever address our complaint that we didn’t get value for money. Just quoted terms & conditions every time. I don’t think they’re at all interested in repeat business from us. Couldn’t recommend that agency or Avalon/ Globus, but I’m sure other people have very different experiences. It’s just very disappointing when expectations fall so far short of reality. 

Happy future travelling.

[Coral]

I highly recommend a river cruise for the Christmas Markets and went last year with Crystal. We did have full days in ports (which I loved) but did have 2 days out fo 10 where we did have day time sailing through the Wachau Valley and it was beautiful (they were morning until about 2 pm). I also enjoyed being in ports late and overnight to experience the Christmas Markets and Christmas lights and decor. I am considering going again this year. It was that good.

 

We also did have Thanksgiving dinner onboard.

 

I did luck out as my itinerary was not affected as others were.

Sorry about Avalon and your TA for not sticking up for you.

Edited April 13, 2019 by Coral

[Swannee50]

Great to hear that your experience of Christmas Markets river cruising is so positive.  It sounds as though the tour you did was the one we imagined we would have, although I would still like more than 2 days out of 10 to enjoy scenery from the river. We know that Mother Nature has the final say in any travel experiences & you can’t fight that. It’s just the way it’s handled by the different companies that’s important. We were unlucky to have chosen Avalon who handled it very poorly in many ways. Happy future cruising.

 

 

[gnome12]

45 minutes ago, Swannee50 said:

Great to hear that your experience of Christmas Markets river cruising is so positive.  It sounds as though the tour you did was the one we imagined we would have, although I would still like more than 2 days out of 10 to enjoy scenery from the river.

Very few river cruises have much daytime cruising. Generally, they only cruise particularly scenic sections in daylight (like the castles on the Rhine, or the Wachau Valley on the Danube). River cruises are port intensive; most people want to spend as much time in port as possible.

[Got2Cruise]

I’m sorry you experienced low river conditions. But you were offered a refund. How can you blame Avalon because of river conditions? 

[Swannee50]

I think that if you read my previous posts carefully you will understand we weren’t blaming Avalon for low water levels. I acknowledged that Mother Nature has the final say. My complaint was in how poorly Avalon handled our situation, not that they were to blame for the drought. 

I also pointed out that a refund differs from compensation. Even after the refund, we were still a long way out of pocket from what we paid for our tour to the sub-standard one we received. I also pointed out that had we cancelled our trip before leaving, & taken the refund offered by Avalon, we would have lost our air fares. We couldn’t afford to do that. With only 4 days notice, we tried very hard to find another tour but there was simply not enough time, as those 4 days covered a weekend when travel agents in Europe & here in Australia were closed. Unfortunately, the situation is far from one as simple as your reply would suggest. 

 We were only asking for fair treatment from Avalon. 

[pully8]

Yes agree the air fares are a lot to potentially lose if travelling from Australia.

Sadly the nature of river cruising mean interruptions are a risk and needs to be known prior to booking.

Last year was particularly bad with low water but record floods also impact and have done in prior years.

Some operators handle the situation better than others, pre/post and on board.

It is a great way to travel when all goes well but certainly standards differ between operators, even with the same brand, so much depends on the on board staff and cruise director.

We are always mindful of the risks and terms/conditions, sorry to hear of your experience. 

 

[Coral]

6 hours ago, Swannee50 said:

Great to hear that your experience of Christmas Markets river cruising is so positive.  It sounds as though the tour you did was the one we imagined we would have, although I would still like more than 2 days out of 10 to enjoy scenery from the river. We know that Mother Nature has the final say in any travel experiences & you can’t fight that. It’s just the way it’s handled by the different companies that’s important. We were unlucky to have chosen Avalon who handled it very poorly in many ways. Happy future cruising.

 

There were plenty of people on this board last year who was complaining about how they were treated by their river cruise company. You are not the only one. One of my good friends had half of his cruise as a bus ride. There was a hilarious video recently (in a sad way) about a guy taking a 2 week cruise and how his trip turned into a bus ride also. Thankfully he had a good sense of humor about everything.

 

[Host Jazzbeau]

For your next river cruise, if you want all daytime cruising choose the Douro.  By law all cruising must be done in daylight (for safety reasons, since the river is so twisty).

[Swannee50]

Thank you Host Jazzbeau. I’ve been trying to think of other options where I could satisfy my desire to see more scenery & it sounds as though the Douro would be just what I’m after. I’ll certainly look into that. Appreciate you taking the time to give me the heads-up. 👍🏻

[pully8]

That was a good suggestion.Friends are sending positive reports of their cruise on the Douro with Scenic. Good luck with your choices there are many options.

[MikeBR]

On 4/13/2019 at 12:11 AM, Swannee50 said:

Booked a long-awaited Basel-Prague Christmas markets Avalon cruise for November-Dec 2018. Due to drought, we learnt 11 days prior to departure, that  due to low water level, itinerary might have to be concluded by bus & hotel. Offered full refund if desired, but we were happy with the bus/ hotel option so decided to continue on that understanding. We were happy that we would still see all the towns & Christmas markets in Germany, as per our original plan.  

4 days prior, told there would be no bus/ hotel option, instead we would sail only to Strasbourg where we would dock for 5 days, then sail back to Basel. Again, refund offered but in the 4 days, we were unable to find an alternative tour that would also fit in with our non-refundable air fares, which were not part of the tour package, therefore not covered by travel insurance. Under Avalon’s terms & conditions, we had to accept that this change was also allowed.

However, the tour we received bore no resemblance to the one booked, in either places visited or value for money. Why is Avalon/ Globus, or any company for that matter, allowed to substitute inferior tours when a change has to occur? We can accept the changes but not being short-changed after paying a lot of money for what ended up being a budget tour. Being docked for 5 days in a poor area of town with no nice outlook, wasn’t our idea of a river cruise! 

We received a refund for not being able to have the same sized room on the substitute vessel & a refund of the one night we didn’t spend on board. These were refunds of money already paid , not compensation for any inconvenience, disappointment & stress caused by Avalon/ Globus. They were also paid by cheque, in spite of the assurance they would be paid in the manner we had used when booking, which was direct deposit. And 1 of our party had her cheque dishonoured, for which she had to pay the bank fee! Repeated appeals to Avalon through Circuit Travel in  Sydney, have been dismissed out of hand. 

Our first trip with Avalon will be our last. Never again. 

 

2018 was a terrible year for all rivers in Europe because of low water. We managed our June cruise with Emerald on the Rhone, But our October cruise with Viking on the Danube was ultimately completely changed to a bus trip at the last minute. Having experienced water problems way back in 2012 we knew the consequences of such changes and took the offer of a complete refund.  We always book direct with the cruise company no matter where we go and because of this within 7 days we had the full cost of the cruise refunded back into our bank, but within 14 days we had all our other expenses of flights, airport lounge, and airport parking all refunded as well

[Coral]

1 hour ago, MikeBR said:

 We always book direct with the cruise company no matter where we go and because of this within 7 days we had the full cost of the cruise refunded back into our bank, but within 14 days we had all our other expenses of flights, airport lounge, and airport parking all refunded as well

I book through a TA - but the charge goes through the cruise line so if there are any refunds, it would be processed just as quickly.

[Roz]

6 hours ago, Host Jazzbeau said:

For your next river cruise, if you want all daytime cruising choose the Douro.  By law all cruising must be done in daylight (for safety reasons, since the river is so twisty).

 

I think all those Viking cruise commercials on TV do people a disservice by implying that the majority of a river cruise is spent sightseeing from the ship, and that you'll have beautiful scenery on both sides the whole way.  

 

Roz

[Swannee50]

1 hour ago, pully8 said:

That was a good suggestion.Friends are sending positive reports of their cruise on the Douro with Scenic. Good luck with your choices there are many options.

 

1 hour ago, pully8 said:

That was a good suggestion.Friends are sending positive reports of their cruise on the Douro with Scenic. Good luck with your choices there are many options.

Thanks for the encouragement to still try river cruising but now with more informed decision making. 👍🏻

[Roz]

8 minutes ago, Coral said:

I book through a TA - but the charge goes through the cruise line so if there are any refunds, it would be processed just as quickly.

 

I do the same, Coral.  Last year Uniworld offered me an incentive to move my cruise to a different date.  Because I booked my airfare with them, they took care of the change fees and additional fare, and I was able to take advantage of the upgrade.  Knowing how river cruises work (I've taken 3), I will continue to book airfare thru the cruise line.  I don't do that with ocean cruises.

 

Roz

[Swannee50]

1 hour ago, MikeBR said:

2018 was a terrible year for all rivers in Europe because of low water. We managed our June cruise with Emerald on the Rhone, But our October cruise with Viking on the Danube was ultimately completely changed to a bus trip at the last minute. Having experienced water problems way back in 2012 we knew the consequences of such changes and took the offer of a complete refund.  We always book direct with the cruise company no matter where we go and because of this within 7 days we had the full cost of the cruise refunded back into our bank, but within 14 days we had all our other expenses of flights, airport lounge, and airport parking all refunded as well

I think part of the problem is being so far away down here in Australia. We had heard of cruises being affected by floods but had no idea drought was also a factor. The situation simply wasn’t reported down here. We’re so busy worrying about our own droughts that we don’t focus on anywhere else! We should have done a lot more homework. Lesson learnt there. 

[Coral]

6 minutes ago, Swannee50 said:

I think part of the problem is being so far away down here in Australia. We had heard of cruises being affected by floods but had no idea drought was also a factor. The situation simply wasn’t reported down here. We’re so busy worrying about our own droughts that we don’t focus on anywhere else! We should have done a lot more homework. Lesson learnt there. 

It is not common talk in the US either unless one follows cruise boards that cover river cruises. I had several friends who booked river cruises last year after the droughts started and they and their TA had no idea.

 

Sort of like I doubt those in Europe or Australia know near where I live, we are dealing with severe flooding where many people have lost everything and it will be a very long time before their lives are back to normal.

Edited April 14, 2019 by Coral

[Swannee50]

1 minute ago, Roz said:

 

I do the same, Coral.  Last year Uniworld offered me an incentive to move my cruise to a different date.  Because I booked my airfare with them, they took care of the change fees and additional fare, and I was able to take advantage of the upgrade.  Knowing how river cruises work (I've taken 3), I will continue to book airfare thru the cruise line.  I don't do that with ocean cruises.

 

Roz

This is all very helpful advice. Being our first river cruise, we went into it rather blindly, assuming it would all be well-planned. So much to consider if you’re a first time river cruiser. I hope my experience, & all the helpful tips I’ve received here, will help anyone else about to book their first river cruise. 

[Swannee50]

1 minute ago, Coral said:

It is not common talk in the US either unless one follows cruise boards that cover river cruises. I had several friends who booked river cruises last year after the droughts started and they and their TA had no idea.

Thanks, Coral. We all have similar problems. I would like to think the many companies who offer cruises, not just Avalon, would keep TAs & guests better informed. Once we had boarded our ship, a crew member let slip that they’d known for 3 months that the low water levels would mean we wouldn’t get through. I’m sure he wasn’t supposed to tell us that! 

 

[gnome12]

In terms of reading European cruise descriptions unless the itinerary says "cruise [some area]" or "spend the morning or afternoon cruising xxx" all of your cruising will likely be done from dinner time onwards.

[Swannee50]

26 minutes ago, Roz said:

 

I think all those Viking cruise commercials on TV do people a disservice by implying that the majority of a river cruise is spent sightseeing from the ship, and that you'll have beautiful scenery on both sides the whole way.  

 

Roz

Exactly Ros. Truth in advertising would be a fine thing! 

[Coral]

8 minutes ago, Swannee50 said:

Thanks, Coral. We all have similar problems. I would like to think the many companies who offer cruises, not just Avalon, would keep TAs & guests better informed. Once we had boarded our ship, a crew member let slip that they’d known for 3 months that the low water levels would mean we wouldn’t get through. I’m sure he wasn’t supposed to tell us that! 

 

I think everyone hoped that it would rain and conditions would improve. For example - the trip before mine went to Budapest and they had to be bused and Crystal put them up at the Ritz. We had some rain on our trip and the next one and apparently - even minimal rain can improve conditions so that future cruises could sail to Budapest.

 

We didn't know until the day before if we were going to sail or be bused to Bratislava. We had some rain and didn't know if it was going to be enough - we were eventually bused. We were told at the beginning of the week that it would be a last minute call.

 

So for cruise lines to let one know 3 months in advance is not something that is going to happen because conditions can easily change due to some rain. They can probably predict a drought may continue but we all know what predicting weather is like.

 

I am not defending Avalon by any means - if you look at other posts from this time period, they were not the only ones.

Edited April 14, 2019 by Coral