What documentation? Non citizen

[specialagentheather]

Hello. I think I already know the answer to this but I figured someone here might be able to confirm. I am thinking about booking a cruise for my boyfriend and I. He is a US resident but not yet a citizen. His greencard expired recently, but he has his application submitted for citizenship (which can take up to 12 months to process.) Can he cruise without a passport AND without up to date greencard? Would he be able to use just a social security card and driver's license as documentation for the cruise?

[sparks1093]

19 minutes ago, specialagentheather said:

Hello. I think I already know the answer to this but I figured someone here might be able to confirm. I am thinking about booking a cruise for my boyfriend and I. He is a US resident but not yet a citizen. His greencard expired recently, but he has his application submitted for citizenship (which can take up to 12 months to process.) Can he cruise without a passport AND without up to date greencard? Would he be able to use just a social security card and driver's license as documentation for the cruise?

He can use the green card but I believe it must be non-expired. He might also need his passport from his native country for the ports and maybe a visa. I would read what the CBP website says about it and what Carnival says about it as well. It might be easier (and less worrisome) to wait until his citizenship is granted.

[sanger727]

Does he not have a passport for the country he is originally from? I wouldn't think he would have been able to enter the US without one. 

[sparks1093]

12 minutes ago, sanger727 said:

Does he not have a passport for the country he is originally from? I wouldn't think he would have been able to enter the US without one. 

As a permanent resident his green card is sufficient for re-entry, but he might need the passport from his original country for visiting some ports.

[sanger727]

Just now, sparks1093 said:

As a permanent resident his green card is sufficient for re-entry, but he might need the passport from his original country for visiting some ports.

 

No. I meant that if he is not a US citizen. Then the first time he came to the US, prior to becoming a resident and getting a green card; he must have had a passport from where he used to live. That passport may still be valid and if so, could be used on this cruise. 

[sparks1093]

3 minutes ago, sanger727 said:

 

No. I meant that if he is not a US citizen. Then the first time he came to the US, prior to becoming a resident and getting a green card; he must have had a passport from where he used to live. That passport may still be valid and if so, could be used on this cruise. 

Oh, got it. He can't use the original passport for re-entry to the US, he needs his green card for that because that is the document that shows his status (yes, the status is in the computer, but that isn't what they want at the port). I know that if it were me I wouldn't use the green card for cruising if it were expired but I do realize that it does cost money (and time) to renew them so it becomes a judgment call.

[ColeThornton]

The OP may find this article helpful regarding green cards/travel:

 

https://citizenpath.com/expired-green-card-problems/

[chengkp75]

Same thread posted by OP on RCI forum.  They will not allow him to board with an expired green card.  A social security card does not show citizenship, since your boyfriend, who is not a citizen, has one.  He is required to show a photo ID to ensure the face matches the name, and then a citizenship document to show where the name is a citizen.  As noted, he most likely needs his former country's passport (hopefully not expired) to show citizenship at many non-US ports.  Even if he makes it onboard, upon attempting to re-enter the US, the individual CBP officer can refuse entry, delay him for a significant time while they research his status, and/or fine him several thousand dollars.

[ProgRockCruiser]

42 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

Same thread posted by OP on RCI forum.  They will not allow him to board with an expired green card.  A social security card does not show citizenship, since your boyfriend, who is not a citizen, has one.  He is required to show a photo ID to ensure the face matches the name, and then a citizenship document to show where the name is a citizen.  As noted, he most likely needs his former country's passport (hopefully not expired) to show citizenship at many non-US ports.  Even if he makes it onboard, upon attempting to re-enter the US, the individual CBP officer can refuse entry, delay him for a significant time while they research his status, and/or fine him several thousand dollars.

This.

 

Renewing a green card is not cheap.  But failing to renew a green card is waaaay more expensive if something should trip up - like a change in jobs or having to travel outside the US.

[babygrljaz]

expired 

3 hours ago, specialagentheather said:

Hello. I think I already know the answer to this but I figured someone here might be able to confirm. I am thinking about booking a cruise for my boyfriend and I. He is a US resident but not yet a citizen. His greencard expired recently, but he has his application submitted for citizenship (which can take up to 12 months to process.) Can he cruise without a passport AND without up to date greencard? Would he be able to use just a social security card and driver's license as documentation for the cruise?

expired resident card is the same as an expired government id (dl or passport), not valid.

[quattrohead]

You can apply to renew the green card and then have an extension added to his current card. Cost and time you will have to contact that gov dept. Good luck.

I had a green card extended twice years back. It was taking them that long to process them even back then.

[specialagentheather]

Thank you. So everything I'm reading says he needs to update his green card before he can cruise. But it's also saying a passport is REQUIRED for non citizens, is that correct? He does not have a passport. I know he went on a. Cruise several years ago... is the passport requirement a new rule?

 

[He was born in Spain, but moved to the US as an infant. He has never been out of the country since and has no passport]

[chengkp75]

6 minutes ago, specialagentheather said:

Thank you. So everything I'm reading says he needs to update his green card before he can cruise. But it's also saying a passport is REQUIRED for non citizens, is that correct? He does not have a passport. I know he went on a. Cruise several years ago... is the passport requirement a new rule?

 

[He was born in Spain, but moved to the US as an infant. He has never been out of the country since and has no passport]

As he is not a US citizen, he is a Spanish citizen, and needs a Spanish passport, which his parents should have taken out for him long ago.

[Ferry_Watcher]

If this situation was presented for an Alaskan cruise, I am sure that your boyfriend with an expired Green card would be denied boarding.  If he presented documentation that his Green Card was in the process of being extended it would be seriously looked at by check-in supervisors and the ship's documentation officer.  Even then they may tell him, that while technically he may be cleared for the cruise, he may be doing so at his own risk.  The Custom and Border Protection Officers that cruise passengers see just as they disembark may have a different take on the situation.  It may not be worth the risk to take a cruise at this time.

 

The Green Card trumps the foreign national's passport.  When checking in a passenger with  a Green Card, the Green Card is swiped, not the foreign passport.  This is why having an unexpired Green Card is so important.

Edited November 22, 2021 by Ferry_Watcher

[chengkp75]

1 minute ago, Ferry_Watcher said:

If this situation was presented for an Alaskan cruise, I am sure that your boyfriend with an expired Green card would be denied boarding.  If he presented documentation that his Green Card was in the process of being extended it would be seriously looked at by check-in supervisors and the ship's documentation officer.  Even then they may tell him, that while technically he may be cleared for the cruise, he may be doing so at his own risk.  The Custom and Border Protection Officers that cruise passengers see just as they disembark may have a different take on the situation.  It may not be worth the risk to take a cruise at this time.

 

The Green Card trumps the foreign national's passport.  When checking in a passenger with  a Green Card, the Green Card is swiped, not the foreign passport.  This is way having an unexpired Green Card is so important.

The green card trumps the foreign passport, for the US.  Other countries may or may not require his passport to show citizenship, since the green card only shows residency.

[Ferry_Watcher]

3 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

The green card trumps the foreign passport, for the US.  Other countries may or may not require his passport to show citizenship, since the green card only shows residency.

Since I am 'boots on the ground' in Seattle I limit my answers/insight to the Alaskan cruises.  Our Canadian neighbors accept US Green Cards as travel ID.  I personally have checked in passengers traveling with current Green Cards whose country of birth included Embargoed and Sanctioned countries such as Cuba and Iran (and the passengers either had expired passports, or no passport).  Of course when we have this type of scenario, a supervisor is called and approves it.   The Green Card was all they needed.   

 

Ideally, we would want passengers to have both their Green Card, and their foreign passport,  but with some Green Card holders it isn't always possible. 

[sanger727]

Just out of curiosity. I guess I haven’t ever cruised without a passport. But just about ever trip that I have taken that was ‘international’ (along with every job and loan application I’ve filled out) has asked about both residency and citizenship. I take it he would list US residency and Spanish citizenship?? That is the only place he could run into an issue with no passport. If another country requires it of non-us citizens. Other countries don’t have a need to accept a US green card.

Edited November 23, 2021 by sanger727

[specialagentheather]

On 11/22/2021 at 4:09 PM, chengkp75 said:

As he is not a US citizen, he is a Spanish citizen, and needs a Spanish passport, which his parents should have taken out for him long ago.

 

 

Funny enough...after some research...he is not a Spanish citizen either as neither of his parents were Spanish citizens when he was born (Mom from El Salvador and Dad from Italy (he thinks)) Apparently Spanish citizenship is not a birthright

[chengkp75]

17 minutes ago, specialagentheather said:

 

 

Funny enough...after some research...he is not a Spanish citizen either as neither of his parents were Spanish citizens when he was born (Mom from El Salvador and Dad from Italy (he thinks)) Apparently Spanish citizenship is not a birthright

He has to have some citizenship based on birth, whether location or parentage.  His green card lists his country of birth.  Does he not know his parents' nationality?  Obviously, he has not traveled outside the US after the age of 16, since he does not have a passport.  Even traveling to Mexico, he would need a green card and a non-expired passport.  This likely needs to be dealt with by an immigration lawyer, unless he is planning on applying for US citizenship soon.  Even to apply for citizenship, he needs to provide his passport, whether current or expired.

Edited November 26, 2021 by chengkp75

[sanger727]

59 minutes ago, specialagentheather said:

 

 

Funny enough...after some research...he is not a Spanish citizen either as neither of his parents were Spanish citizens when he was born (Mom from El Salvador and Dad from Italy (he thinks)) Apparently Spanish citizenship is not a birthright

 

Ok. citizenship is a birthright. You have to be a citizen of somewhere. If he gets denied American citizenship and deported; he would have to be deported to somewhere. 

 

Just my 2 cents. Whether the cruise line allows him to book or not. With no passport, expired green card, and unknown nationality status - if I were him I wouldn't leave the US under any circumstances until he talks to a lawyer. 

Edited November 26, 2021 by sanger727

[Essiesmom]

Just a point here:  just because his green card has expired does not mean he is illegally in the country and can be deported.  He is still a legal resident, just no ID card.  I went through this with a friend several years ago.  Immigration lawyers are expensive.  You can apply online for the green card/extension.  Likely he will have to go for an interview.  It isn’t quick.  EM

Edited November 26, 2021 by Essiesmom

[Ferry_Watcher]

Wow, the situation becomes a bit more complicated.  

Thankfully, he already has his Green Card.  Like our other CC friends, I would also urge him not to travel outside the US until he has his Green Card renewed and extended.  Not worth the risk.

 

With the new mystery surrounding his parental side of the family tree, it sounds like he maybe embarking on a personal journey to figure out his biological family.  You might get him one of the DNA ancestry  test kits that are on sale this weekend (assuming his wouldn't be offended by such a gift).  Good luck with all this.

[specialagentheather]

So, just a little backstory as to why I made the post. My boyfriend and I have airline vouchers we can use to take a trip. Yay! Free trip! But as I started looking at the cost of hotel, food, and transportation and suddenly the free trip is starting to add up. I had this idea that maybe we could fly somewhere and take a cruise instead. I can find a cruise for less than I'm finding for JUST hotel. Unfortunately, as I have found out....that's not going to work with his residency/citizenship status :(. 

So now I'm trying to plan a non cruise vacation and I'm overwhelmed. Some options are Puerto Rico, St. Thomas (seems like that one might be expensive)  or Miami. 

[ISHCruising]

Just a plug to get him to apply for naturalization.  My husband was a legal resident/green card holder for 10 years, and just received his citizenship.  It will make things more straight forward when you travel.  He can also then apply for an American passport and you won't need to worry about any travel restrictions (well, except for Cuba...stupid embargo!).  

[Bgcruising]

On 11/22/2021 at 10:01 PM, specialagentheather said:

Thank you. So everything I'm reading says he needs to update his green card before he can cruise. But it's also saying a passport is REQUIRED for non citizens, is that correct? He does not have a passport. I know he went on a. Cruise several years ago... is the passport requirement a new rule?

 

[He was born in Spain, but moved to the US as an infant. He has never been out of the country since and has no passport]

An unexpired green card is sufficient, just as easy with it as it is for a US passport.